cc  >> Well good afternoon and  welcome to another edition of  History Sandwiched In.  You know, it seems that  everybody I know who has a  mid-19th century farmhouse is  convinced that it was part of  the Underground Railroad.  However, our speaker today is  from the Milton House, which  most assuredly is part of the  Underground Railroad and she's  gonna tell you why and how and  all about that.  She's the director of the Milton  House museum, Cori Olson.  Please welcome her to History  Sandwiched In.  (Applause)  >> Thank you.  How many of you have actually  been to the Milton House?  Oh, we have a few.  Okay.    I hope you all understand that  we are the only documented spot  in the state of Wisconsin as  part of the Underground  Railroad.  We are going to show you a brief  video that is about seven  minutes long, the video is going  to show you about Joseph  Goodrich, the man who started  Milton, our founder. 

 The video is also going to show  you some brief history about the  Milton House and then I'm gonna  talk a little more about one  slave that has gotten us our  recommendation that we are  today, Andrew Pratt.  So I'm going to go in on that  documentation.  So as soon as they get  everything ready that we can  start the video.  Ready?  Okay, go ahead and push play.  >>(Music)  >> Joseph Goodrich was  born in -- Massachusetts in  1800, and went to live with an  uncle in -- New York around  1812.  He relocated again in 1819,  settling in Alfred, in western  New York's -- district.  So named because the area had  been scorched by the flames of  religious revivalism.  In the 1830s, reformers in the  -- district began to call for  the immediate emancipation of  slaves.  The presence of a Seventh-Day  Baptist church in Alfred may  have drawn them to the area.  In 1821 Goodrich married Nancy  Nasson, a member of a prominent  Seventh-Day Baptist family. 

 In 1824, Goodrich built a house  in Alfred.  There the Goodriches operated a  temperance inn, kept a store,  and held religious services and  town meetings.  Their children Ezra and Jane  were both born in Alfred.  In 1838 Joseph Goodrich decided  to head west again.  He, his friend, Henry Crandall  and a hired man, James Pierce,  traveled by steamship through  the Great Lakes to Milwaukee,  Wisconsin.  From Milwaukee the three walked  southwest, coming eventually to  Rock County.  Goodrich filed a claim for the  area that would become Milton.  The military road running north  from Janesville to Fort  Atkinson, now Highway 26, ran  through Goodrich's property.  Goodrich is said to have drawn a  line from Chicago to Madison on  a territorial map and  anticipating a road would cross  the existing military road on  his claim, built a frame house  near the crossing.  When the second road was built  the following year, it did  indeed cross the other near his  home. 

 Goodrich opened a small store in  the upstairs of the frame house  and, leaving Mr. Pierce in  charge, returned to New York for  his family.  In addition to his wife and two  children, Goodrich brought many  other friends and relatives back  with him to Wisconsin.  They arrived at their new home  on March 4th of 1839.  Shortly thereafter, Goodrich  brought a cabin to the site from  Lima township and attached it to  the frame house, then built  another frame structure.  This complex was the first  Milton House Hotel.  IN 1839 Goodrich also founded  the village of Milton, surveying  and laying out the town with  James Pierce.  Goodrich set aside a large  public square and land for a  church, a public school, and a  cemetery.  He also served as the first  postmaster of Milton.  The first school of the  community was taught in his home  beginning on March -- 1839.  The Goodriches held religious  meetings in their home from  March 1839 until 1841. 

 Goodrich founded the Du Lac  Academy in 1844, and erected a  grout building to house the  school.  Grout was an early form of  concrete that Joseph developed,  a mixture of sand and water,  gravel, and slate limestone.  Goodrich donated the land for  the school and maintained the  academy at his own expense until  1854.  In 1867 it was renamed Milton  College.  Also in 1844, Goodrich built a  grout blacksmith shop, and began  constructing Milton House, a  hexagonal hotel and -- of the  same grout construction that he  used in the academy.  Milton House was completed in  1845.  While Goodrich publicly  indicated political  participation in the  abolitionist cause, and his  leadership in the Milton  Seventh-Day Baptist church, he  also acted discretely in  supporting radical abolitionists  and sheltering fugitive slaves  at Milton House.  Several oral accounts relate the  Joseph Goodrich and his family  operated a station on the  Underground Railroad and used  the Milton House and Goodrich  Cabin to hide fugitives.  Hiding fugitive slaves would  have been necessary, because  despite the fact that there were  many abolitionists in the  vicinity of Milton, the Milton  House was a public hotel, and  the Goodriches could not safely  trust their customers.  It is believed runaways would be  brought to the door of the cabin  behind the Milton House. 

 Upon entry they were told to go  through a trapdoor in the middle  of the floor, climb down a  ladder, and begin crawling to  the opposite end of a low, dark.  -- tunnel to the Milton House  cellar.  Runaways did not know if the  Goodriches could be trusted, or  what was waiting for them at the  other end.  Some people would offer to help  runaways and then turn them in  for reward money.  The cellar was safe.  At that time the cellar was used  to store perishable food items,  such as eggs, milk, butter, and  cheese, and preserved meat for  the Goodrich family and dinner  guests at the Milton House's  dining room, so the cellar was a  good place to hide.  Runaways would hide until the  way was safe to be taken to the  next stop.  That may have been overnight or  longer.  From Milton runaways would be  guided east or north where they  would eventually arrive at the  Lake Michigan shore.  They would then wait until  certain ships with captains that  could be trusted arrived. 

 Once on those ships, they were  taken to Canada, by way of Lake  Michigan and Lake Huron.  Canada abolished slavery in  1834, when the British  Parliament's Slavery Abolition  Act finally abolished slavery in  all parts of the British empire.  We will never know the number of  runaways that were hidden at the  Milton House.  The number must have been  significant, though, as a  45-foot-long tunnel was dug  between the cabin and the  cellar.  In 1998 the Milton House was  designated a national historic  landmark, for the role it played  in the Underground Railroad.  >> I need to take this time to  thank Sue Schliter, she's my  partner in crime back there, she  put together the video for us  today.  So our program today is  entitled, "Our Freedom Journey  to the Milton House," and being  that it's Black History Month,  I'd like to take this time to  talk about that journey for one  particular freedom seeker on the  Underground Railroad.  And that would be Andrew Pratt.  In 1861, Andrew Pratt came to  the village of Milton.  Pratt was a fugitive slave who  had fled Missouri to the free  state of Illinois, only to be  imprisoned for the crime of  being black and unemployed. 

 Somehow he managed to get out of  jail, we really don't know how  he did that, but he ended up in  the care of William Anson  Goodrich.  Now William Anson Goodrich was  the brother of Joseph Goodrich,  the founder of Milton and the  creator of the Milton House.  William brought Andrew Pratt to  Joseph Goodrich for safekeeping.  There Pratt hid in the tunnel,  which ran between the Milton  House and the log cabin that we  saw in the video, in the rear  until it was safe for him to  come out.  Joseph Goodrich was a station  manager on the Underground  Railroad, a loosely-knit network  of people willing to provide  safe houses and assistance to  fugitives fleeing slavery in the  American South.  No actual trains were involved  and I'm not referring to the  Underground Railroad as a subway  system and, Sue can vouch for  this, we do have a lot of people  that show up on a yearly basis  that are a little upset that we  don't have tiny trains in the  basement.  So, just to clarify that now.  Eventually Pratt settled in  Milton and became a resident  member of the community.  He joined the Seventh-Day  Baptist church and worked as a  farmhand.  Even joined the Milton Lodge of  Good Templars, a temperance  organization. 

 And this was in 1861 that he had  come to Milton.  In 1865 he was forced out of the  Templars, explicitly because of  his race.  Ezra Goodrich, who was Joseph  Goodrich's son, wrote an  impassioned defense of Pratt,  entitled "The Negro Embarglio in  the Milton Lodge of Good  Templars."  And for Ezra's troubles, he  was also kicked out of the  group.  Perhaps because of this, Pratt  eventually left Milton and  became a homesteader elsewhere  in the state of Wisconsin,  improving government land and  making his own, and thus passing  from Milton's history.  Andrew Pratt's story is unusual  for Underground Railroad stories  in the state of Wisconsin.  First, it's unusual that he  stayed in Milton.  Most freedom seekers stayed in  Wisconsin for just a few weeks  or a few days.  Most kept moving east to  Kenosha, Racine, Milwaukee,  areas where they could head onto  a steamship and head to Canada.  Both of the most thoroughly  documented fugitives who have  passed through the state of  Wisconsin are those of Caroline  Corals and Joshua Glover.  They both ended up in Canada,  they didn't stay here. 

 Canada was a British dominion at  the time, and thus the reach of  the fugitive slave law of 1850.  The Fugitive Slave Act of 1850  made it legal for Southern  bounty hunters to recapture  fugitives anywhere in the United  States, even in the free states  such as Wisconsin.  But Pratt did not stay, and he  became a respected community  member.  In part he could do this because  of the Civil War, which began  shortly after Pratt arrived in  Milton.  One thing secession meant was  that Northerners no longer  needed to enforce the Fugitive  Slave Act of 1850.  Second, it is unusual that he  came to Milton at all.  The Underground Railroad was  very much an Eastern phenomenon.  Most Underground Railroad    activity took place in Ohio,  Pennsylvania, and New York.  The western Underground Railroad  in Wisconsin was not heavily  traveled, and for on thing,  there were simply fewer slaves  to begin with.  Most of the fugitives heading  into Wisconsin would have come  from Missouri, where slavery was  established in 1820. 

 For another, Wisconsin was the  most northern state, was  abolitionist without being  particularly tolerant.  Racism was alive and well.  It is one thing to dislike  slavery, it is another to  entirely like the enslaved.  Third, it is unusual that we  know anything about Andrew Pratt  at all, considering the fact  that he was a fugitive slave, we  know a tremendous amount about  him.  We know his name, we know where  he came from, in proximity, we  know he was from Missouri, we  know how he got to Wisconsin,  who assisted him, and kind of  know where he ended up.  He stayed in Milton for a while,  we don't know where he  ultimately went on to.  Most fugitives were anonymous,  noted if at all, only by their  name or a vague reference to a  date, a place, or maybe simply  by a number.  Part of this is because the  fugitives themselves rarely were  literate enough to leave  records.  Teaching slaves to read and  write was a crime, and part of  the consequence of the Fugitive  Slave Act of 1850, a very  differing law, penalties for  assisting a fugitive included  fines of up to 1,000 dollars.  Now, when Joseph Goodrich built  the Milton House, it cost him  1,000 dollars. 

 He weighed the difference of how  much it would cost for brick,  which was 6,000, and for wood it  would've cost him 4,000, so he  put a lot on the line to go  about being an abolitionist.  Very little, therefore, written  down or even discussed.  And what was discussed often was  not brought up until years after  the fact.  Joseph Goodrich's only role in  the Underground Railroad was  kept hidden until the 1890s,  when Ezra, his son, showed his  young niece the tunnel and began  to talk about what went on  there.  The Underground Railroad and  everything associated with it  was a very well-kept secret.  These limits on what we know  hold true to the entire Milton  House Underground Railroad  experience.  There are a lot of things we  simply don't know.  We don't know when Joseph  Goodrich began the Underground  Railroad activity.  We know it was after 1844,  because that's when he built the  Milton House.  We believe it was after the  Fugitive Slave Act of 1850. 

 The Fugitive Slave Act of 1850  was vehemently oppressed by  Northerners, and inspired a  tremendous upsurge in  Underground Railroad activity.  We believe that this is about  when the tunnel was dug.  The tunnel was originally 3 feet  to 5 five feet in sections, when  we saw it in the video it was  concrete.  It was earth-lined.  It's a 45-foot-long tunnel  system that connects the cabin  to the cellar of the Milton  House.  When this was built it was  hand-dug.  It was mud.  As you can imagine, it was  completely dark for any slave  that would have gone down into  there.  Wet mud at time, we have one man  still with us today who helped  to dig out the tunnel in order  to reinforce it in concrete in  the 1950s, and he said it stunk.  It was the worst-smelling odor  he said he had ever smelled  going down there. 

 So if you can imagine, there  would've been bugs, rodents,  just nasty and atrocious and  being able to trust the Goodrich  family that when you go down the  hole in that cabin and climb  through that 45-feet into that  cellar, that there isn't going  to be something there to catch  you.  In the 1950s they did reinforce  the tunnel with concrete, so  that we can accommodate tourists  today.  Now it was a tunnel, not a  trench, more of a secret that  way.  We don't know how many fugitives  came through Milton.  Probably not many, given  Milton's location, but how many  is not many.  5, 10, 20, we don't know.  Other than Pratt, we don't know  anything about the fugitives  except the most general sense.  We would assume that most of  them were young men, and  occasionally young women, people  fit and healthy enough to  survive the journey that they  were traveling upon.  People without families to weigh  them down.  Few children or older people  attempted such a journey or  would even survive it if they  did. 

 Most of them came in small  groups or as individuals, so as  to remain as inconspicuous as  possible.  Most would have stayed only as  long as they had to before  moving on, maybe a night,  perhaps two or three, but rarely  more.  We don't know where they came  from before coming to Milton.  Logically, they would have  passed through Beloit or  Janesville.  Underground Railroad sites  tended to be 8 to 10 miles  apart.  Far enough apart that they could  walk at night without being   seen.  Both cities of Janesville and  Beloit were known as  abolitionist towns, and both  today have sites rumored to be  part of the Underground  Railroad, but they don't have  the documentation or anything to  prove such.  And except for the final  destination, we don't know where  they went after Milton, though  we do have one story about Will  Davis, a man from Milton who was  once told to take a wagonload of  hay to Elkhorn, have a good meal  at a tavern, and come home.  Many years later, he wrote that  he knew there were people in the  wagon when he went into the  tavern, and when he came back,  he knew that they were gone.  This Elkhorn story is typical of  the Underground Railroad  stories. 

 It was written down many years  after the fact, with very few  specifics, and there's no  information whatsoever about the  fugitives themselves.  So that's what we don't know.  What do we know, then?  Perhaps one thing that we do  know is absolutely certain, is  that Joseph Goodrich did in fact  everything he owned to serve as  a station manager on the  Underground Railroad.  And this raises a number of  interesting questions.  First of all, why would he do  this?  What was it about Joseph  Goodrich that made him take a  risk so much to be part of the  Underground Railroad, which was,  after all, illegal?  We do not have a diary of Joseph  Goodrich, which is surprising  for a man of his era and  background.  Most people kept a diary or some  type of a journal.  We do know Joseph had very  strong moral beliefs.  He did not believe in tobacco  use, or alcohol, and most of  all, he did not believe that  anyone had the right to own  another human being.  Joseph was a religious man, a  devout member of the Seventh-Day  Baptist church.  The largest congregation of the  Seventh-Day Baptist is still in  Milton today. 

 Joseph was a very strong  believer in education as well.  The Seventh-Day Baptists took a  strong stand against slavery.  The only church to make aiding a  fugitive slave a positive duty.  The church also stated, "We  regard the Fugitive Slave Law as  an atrocious violation of the  rights of humanity, and that to  aid its execution would be  treason to Jesus Christ."  Those were fighting words for  the congregation of the  Seventh-Day Baptist.  Joseph Goodrich had the wide  community support.  He was a commanding figure in  Milton.  After all, he was the creator  that had come and set forth the  plan for the whole entire  community.  The village of Milton was  overwhelmingly Seventh-Day  Baptist members, and those who  weren't were Congregationalists.  Rock County in particular was a  hotbed of anti-Southern  political sentiments, and likely  to support Underground Railroad  activity on that basis.  Wisconsin in general was known  as the most radical abolitionist  state in the West. 

 Noted that they had tried to  nullify the Fugitive Slave Act  of 1850, the state of Wisconsin  had tried to nullify that.  The state of Illinois had some  severe black laws in order at  that time.  So for political and religious  reasons, Joseph Goodrich could  count on his neighbors.  But Joseph Goodrich ran an inn,  lots of strangers came, and they  could have been anyone,  sympathetic or unsympathetic.  We do know this, that Joseph  Goodrich was never caught.  If he would have been, under the  Fugitive Slave Act of 1850, he  would have had to pay that  $1,000 fine, a lengthy prison  sentence, and the slavemaster  could also come back and sue  Joseph for another 1,000  dollars.  So 2,000 dollars was a  substantial amount of money at  this time period.  That's a huge risk for him to  take, but I think he had faith  to know in his heart that he was  doing something right for  others.  I invite all of you to come  visit the Milton Historical  Society and Milton House museum  and see firsthand what Joseph  Goodrich has done for the  community of Milton and the  network of freedom.  We are in the process of trying  to save the Goodrich Cabin, you  saw the cabin on the video  today. 

 This is going to be an extensive  project to save our 1837 cabin.  The National Parks Service knows  its importance, and they have  granted us money for this  project.  We still have plenty of money to  raise for our efforts.  We cannot afford to lose a vital  part of our history or the  history of the Underground  Railroad in Wisconsin.  If something should happen to  the Goodrich Cabin, that would  kind of be the end of us!  We welcome any donations,  visitors, or questions.  And thank you for letting me  present to you today, I'm sorry  I probably rambled through this  really quickly.  But I do open it up to  questions, so if anyone has any  questions.  Yes?  >> Do you have, for the video  that you showed, do you have a  DVD or anything?  >> No we don't, that one is for  our sole purposes at the museum  only.  We do have a video.  We do have books. 

 I don't know if Julia's book is  sold here.  >> We also have the National  Parks Service landmark book,  when we put together--  >> What is the  name of the book you're  referring to, you said Julia's  book?  >> Yeah, it's called-  >> Freedom  Train North is one, and we  mentioned in there, and then the  other one is the Caroline  Corals.  >> That one we have, let me see  if we have Freedom Train North.  >> I've forgotten her name,  Julia-- Pferdehirt.  No, the Freedom Train North she  has done a about the Milton  House and our significance, so  we do have that.  And I guess I didn't think about  bringing any of the other  National Parks Service guides  that we're also involved in.  You guys have any other  questions or anything?  Yes?  >> Is the tunnel on the same  level as the cellar, I mean is  it the same depth in the ground?  >> It is, I'm trying to remember  how tall the tunnel is on the  inside of it.  It has to be close to six feet,  yeah close to six feet, and it's  about two to three feet wide in  sections, it kind of moves.  Yes?  >> Once the slaves actually were  fortunate or lucky enough in  time to gain their freedom, what  was the percentile of people who  had enslaved them or relatives  or this of that who would come  back later and try to lay blame  to them and say, he gave her to  me.  Once they were free, do you have  any idea what that percent was?  >> I don't know what the  percentage was. 

 We do know, Sue had brought  something to my attention this  morning about the different laws  in the state of Illinois, the  black laws, that they would  actually, I believe it was, was  it the sheriff's department,  Sue?  That put the ad in the paper and  stated that they had found a  black man that claimed that he  was a free slave, but if anyone  could come forth and state claim  to him.  So virtually any white man could  come into the police department  and say, he's mine.  And leave with him, so that was  a sad aspect to the state of  Illinois at the time.   Yes?  >> We do have Caroline Coral's  book here.  We are out of the Freedom Train  book, which we usually have.  My apologies.  (Inaudible)  >> Sorry.  Yes?  >> I was going to ask something,  when the Civil War started,  essentially the Underground  Railroad was a moot point.  Were there still slaves coming  across, if they didn't need  help, for example, from slave  catching, weren't threatened by  that, were they still moving  north to Canada?  >> I believe they still were.  Go ahead. 

 >> Actually, the slaves, the  Emancipation Proclamation in  1863 actually freed the slaves  that were --.  So you still had slaves in the  border states that could  technically come, seeking  freedom, so I guess to answer  your question, is that, even  after the Civil War, there was  still a certain amount of  activity, but certainly not the  amount there was before.  There was one story during the  Civil War, a doctor from  Edgerton was in Mississippi, and  was approached by somebody, a  woman, to bring her North when  he came.  So you had people still going to  the army and asking for  assistance to safe passage.  >> Yes?  >> Why is the building a--?  >> Oh, the hexagon shape of the  building, you mean?  We're not exactly sure why  Joseph chose the hexagon shape.  But inside it is kind of an  engineering genius.  The one picture of the room  didn't really show it very well,  but in each room, so there's six  rooms on each floor, so there  were 12 hotel rooms, the way  that the corner of the rooms  are, every room has two windows  in a room.  So there's a cross-ventilation  of air and above every door,  there was a rectangular cutout,  a transom, above the door.  So you constantly had the flow  of fresh air through the hexagon  shape of the building.  Plus each hotel room also had a  fireplace or a stove in it. 

 So you had that constant  fluctuation of heat and fresh  air all year round, by having  that transom above the door.  So it was kind of an engineering  genius.  But we don't know, I wish he  would have written more down  about it, but Joseph didn't  write much.  Yes?  >> Do you know of any other  houses that were Underground  Railroad stations in Wisconsin?  Were there any other houses?  >> Well, Mr. Dunner's house, but  I don't know if it's actually a  house anymore, in the Kenosha  area?  Is it Dunner?  No, in Kenosha.  Dutton!  Thank you, Dutton.  >> There was a man by the name  of Dutton that was actually in  Kenosha or Racine, and he had a  tunnel where everybody would  file into that spot in various  areas in Wisconsin and  supposedly he kept track of the  number of slaves that went  through, and from him it was  getting onto one of those ships  and into Canada.  So he kept a record and he sent  100 people off through his stop,  so it's a significant amount.  The proximity to Lake Michigan.  >> Yep, Lake Michigan.  The steamboat captains on Lake  Michigan. 

 Yep.  Not exactly sure of any, I know  there are a lot of homes, a lot  of areas around the state that  are trying to state claim that  they're part of the Underground  Railroad, and it's very  difficult to do.  It was difficult for us to do.  Our slip of paper was only about  that big that talked about  Andrew Pratt.  Yes?  >> There's a very large family  in Milwaukee, a Pratt family,  and one of the Pratts was a  mayor of Milwaukee, has any  exploration been done as to  whether this gentleman might  have been their family?  >> I'm not exactly sure of all  the research that's been done on  Andrew Pratt.  I know our past two directors  have tried to do more research.  Speaking with the last director,  he said they weren't sure if  maybe even he changed his name,  after he left Milton.  May have been a slavemaster's  name, and he gave himself a new  name.  That could be a possibility.  But we really have nothing,  documentation. 

 The documentation that we do  have about Andrew Pratt is  because of Ezra Goodrich.  He became very good friends with  Ezra, so Ezra is kind of our  saving grace that he actually  wrote things when his father  didn't.  So that's how we were able to  get enough information about  Andrew to begin with.  Did you have a question?  >> Back to the purpose of the  tunnel, they had access then to  Milton House through the cellar,  but they're still fugitives, and  they can't exactly blend in with  the locals, how would they  proceed from there, was this a  place where they could get some  food, and hide during the  daytime, or what was the purpose  of getting them into the cellar?  >> I would say, getting them  into the cellar area was the  only way that they did come  through the tunnel.  We don't exactly know where the  door was, or how we could get  down from the Milton House into  the cellar, because, was that  during the collapse or does  nobody really know?  There's been so many renovations  to the building.  We do know that there was a  little bit of a door from  upstairs down that was more of a  little laundry chute, a hole in  the floor, that they could have  dropped things down, whether it  be food or laundry or something.  Not exactly sure how the workers  in the Milton House came down  into the cellar at that time.  It would've been quite a hub.  There were six trains a day and  26 stagecoaches a day that came  into the Milton House, so above  them, that was a hub of people.  Joseph really did take a leap of  faith in trusting to hide  someone in that basement without  being caught. 

 Somebody had to have seen  something.  >> -- At night, it would've been  harder to be seen.  >> Hopefully it was at night.  Yes?  >> A little while ago, I can't  remember exactly, but it's been  several years ago, they  supposedly had found an  underground site in the Marinac  area, and it's under a barn.  In the barn was an underground  cellar where people hid, and I'm  just trying to, because it was  supposedly part of the Methodist  movement that were doing that,  they were also involved, like  the Southern Baptists, but the  Methodist movement, what they  called it then, came out of the  same exact area that the  Southern Baptists came out of  and also the LD'S church came  out of, that's why it was called  a religious hub area, was that  they all rose at the same time  out of New York.  I guess it was something in the  water.  But the Methodist movement  there, and supposedly they would  come up the Wisconsin River and  going on up through to Canada  that way.  >> Really, I've never heard  about that.  I don't know if Sue is familiar  with that?  That's neat, that's something to  research.  You're working on it. 

 Well, let me know if you find  anything out!  Yes?  >> So you have the Underground  Railroads at these houses and  passages, and then how about all  of the other people who were  sympathetic who had a place  where they'd say, you can stay  in my barn, or you can stay  here, is that also considered an  offshoot of the Railroad?  >> Oh sure, that's all part of  the Underground Railroad.  We're actually very unique.  It wasn't usually an underground  passage, and we have an  underground, truly underground  railroad.  But yes, the Underground  Railroad was hiding spots,  primarily.  So that would have been  someone's barn, or a corner of  someone's house, or something of  that nature.  We just happen to be pretty  unique in that we have a tunnel  system that somebody wanted to  dig.  >> My mother used to say, she  died a couple of years ago, and  she was from Danville, or --  Illinois area, and the family,  or her father, was a tenant  farmer, and had a very very old  house and barn, had a tin roof  and everything like that, and  anyhow, as kids, she told me  only once or twice, and never  really explained what she meant.  But they had the dumbwaiters in  the house and this and that, but  then there was like a big, kind  of like a closet, but wasn't, it  was where they did their wash.  It was outside, it was inside of  a building.  But I remember she said, when I  was a little girl one time, that  it was one of the stops on the  Underground Railroad, so I found  that really fascinating that  maybe, when they thought they  were so racist all of these  years, that there was someone  who was helpful. 

 That would be wonderful.  >> Well, as we said, racism was  alive and well at the time, too.  I think people had that  understanding that they wanted  to help.  Andrew Pratt found it in the  community of Milton.  Ezra got himself into some  trouble, Ezra was very good at  getting himself into trouble,  but he was very upset at the  amount of people in the  community that weren't willing  to assimilate and let Andrew  Pratt into all of their groups,  so Ezra named names in town of  all the hypocrites and got  himself into trouble.  So there were people that were  willing to help but not willing  to like the enslaved.  Yeah.  It's still a difference.  Yeah?  >> Well, we seem to forget that  during that time, there were  very, very few people who were  abolitionists for the purpose of  race.  The major abolitionists like  Abraham Lincoln, through his  friend Cassius Clay, who was a  Kentucky newspaperman, they  wrote about the economic problem  of slavery, because economic  problem, I mean slavery  eliminated competition among the  small farmers. 

 That's what they were worried  about, the economic problem of  slavery.  I mean, Lincoln was not anything  but racist, that's been proven  many, many times, but he wrote  this law because if was  destroying America's economy.  >> That's true.  You're right.  Did you have a question, sir?  >> Come to think of it, you  mentioned other sites, but I  understand that the restaurant  which is now Quivey's Grove,  here in Madison, was another  station on the Underground  Railroad.  >> That could be.  It's very hard to have it  designated.  Sue, if you know where we found  that slip of paper.  I mean, we knew about Andrew  Pratt from what Ezra had  written, they don't - you can  correct me - they don't take  family documentation as being  deemed truthful.  >> They do to a certain extent,  but they like to have a hard  copy of things, so having the  booklet that Ezra wrote -- that  helped, having some things that  were written shortly after  Joseph's death, that helped, and  then of course, having that slip  of paper that mentions Andrew  Pratt, that certainly did help  also. 

 >> So it is hard for families to  prove, and it's only going to  get harder the farther we go  out.  >> I don't know how authentic it  was, but it was told, and it was  certainly believable, and it's  been told enough.  I think there was a tunnel or  something between the barn and  the main house, and maybe just  folklore.  >> One of the things, I think  there are a lot of places that  probably were stops on the  Underground Railroad.  At the time, it wasn't  particularly fashionable or safe  to say that, so I think a lot of  places probably were and anyone  who knew about it, concealed  that, didn't say anything.  It's not like anyone would brag  about it.  >> And why write anything down?  To have that $1,000 fine and  substantial jail time.  That's why there isn't  documentation.  Yes.  >> And as a biographer, I can  tell you when you're  interviewing people who are  alive now, trying to get what  happened 80 years ago, is not  exactly based on truth  sometimes, so you come and the  mix up is tremendous. 

 We have a lot of trouble trying  to take stories and make sure  they're historically  documentable because they're not  always.  Because they take things from  their childhood that weren't  from their childhood, a story  they once heard or a picture  they saw, and they swear that  they were there.  So, when we get some of this  stuff it is real hard to prove.  >> And what we know about Joseph  we didn't learn until the 1890s  when Ezra decided to start  telling, and Ezra did make it  his whole purpose to educate the  family about what had happened.  He wanted all the grandchildren,  the nieces and nephews to know.  But yeah, that was the 1890s,  and Joseph died in 1867, so  there is a substantial amount of  time lost in coming forward and  getting specifics and  credibility.  Yes?  >> Is there any documentation  that it worked as a two-way  street with the military?  Somebody mentioned that they  might seek safe harbor with the  military on their routes to the  North.  My grandmother was trying to  document her family history.  And her father-in-law, my  great-grandfather, was a Yankee,  and they were on a line,  according to this account, where  they were advancing and  retreating, and he became  extremely ill and he was too  weak to move.  And when they retreated to the  North, they apparently, the  military left him, in rough  quotes, with a Negro family. 

 And this peaked our interest  because, how would this have  occurred?  Did they deliberately know, did  they have knowledge of safe  places for soldiers when they  had to retreat and they couldn't  take them with them?  >> I don't know any specifics of  that, but you'd think they  probably do.  >> Well if the slaves were  confident enough to get in touch  with the military in the North,  you'd think maybe the military  would know who to contact to  leave their soldiers with.  And he apparently was retrieved  later, because he continued on  in the war, they must have found  him and he was reunited with his  fellow soldiers.  I wondered if you knew anything  about that?  >> No, I don't.  Sue, do you?  Sue's my Yoda, she tells me  everything I don't know.  I'm so glad she came today.  Anybody else have any questions  on anything?  No?  Well, I hope to see you all come  to the Milton House sometime  soon, there's a lot to see.  We have a new building, it's  beautiful, a new addition, which  was where the blocks used to be  for a strip mall, in the state  of Wisconsin at one time.  Very cool.  So, yes, I'm sorry. 

 >> Has anybody done a real  serious dig around there?  >> Artifacts?  Yep, we actually, in order to  build our new building, they had  to hire an archeologist to come  in and, what was it, Sue, about  200 items they thought they were  going to find, and 22,000 items  later.  Nothing of substantial,  wonderful things, though, not  what you'd think.  When the building collapsed in  1840, sorry, 1948, is when the  building collapsed, at that  time, they didn't pay to fill in  the buildings, people just  brought in their trash and  filled it up first before they  put anything else in there.  So the items that they found are  not of any great - Sue and I  want to get rid of some of them  and we can't.  We are going to be doing another  dig.  Now with the cabin restoration  that we're going to be doing, or  renovation of the cabin, we have  to hire an archeologist to come  back.  So the same man, Bob Fay, will  be coming back to dig around in  order to put in, we're going to  try to put in a kind of  bio-soil, or a French drain  system to get water away from  the cabin.  Right now we have runoff issues  into the cabin, and this winter  hasn't been too bad, but last  winter we could ice skate around  on the cabin floor, it was  really neat.  But the cabin is in dire need of  fix, so yeah, we'll be looking  forward to that dig.  You want me to call you when we  start it?  You can come out and see?  We had quite a few people that  came out the last time, yeah. 

 >> Is that the cabin they first  lived in?  >> It's the cabin they lived in.  That was moved out in the summer  of 1839 to where it sits today.  The cabin was originally built  in 1837.  From what we know the  floorboards in the upstairs and  some of the rafters are still  original, from 1837.  The cabin did have an extensive  renovation in the early 1980s,  so there was some new work done  at that time, but it was in  serious need of repair.  Now, if I get this right, 12 or  13 people lived in that cabin  for two years?  I think that's what the video  told us.  >> 13 people moved into the  frame house, and then they  brought the cabin in and spread  out a little bit.  But I'm not certain about the  wiggle time.  >> Plus it was the first hotel,  and Joseph never turned anybody  away, all he did was throw the  furniture outside.  That's what every parent does to  accommodate more people. 

 So, he never turned anybody  away.  The cabin has had some  substantial use over the years.  >> You said it's been moved from  it's original site?  >> It was originally built in  Lima Center in 1837, and it was  moved to where it sits in Milton  in 1839.  >> (Inaudible)  >> Yes.  170 years.  No, 170 years ago it was moved  to its present location.  >> (Inaudible)  >> That's true.  That's why we're hoping we can  save this cabin, and get the  work done to it that it really  needs.  Anybody else have any other  questions?  Oh yes.  >> Do we know, were there enough  places like the Milton House and  other lodgings along the way,  operating with a lantern system?  >> You know, that's a good  question. 

 In the Toman House, in  Janesville, has always had this  story of the lantern in the  window, and the color.  And they have a beautiful  stained glass window that faces  in a very odd direction, and  they can no longer tell that  story when they do their tours,  what color was safe passage and  what was not, because they  haven't been able to get that  documentation that they were  actually a stop.  >> (Inaudible)  >> Yes, they did  talk about it, and we have heard  other stories about the lanterns  in the windows as well.  I don't think Milton House had  something like that.  We don't have anything in our  history like that.  Yes?  >> I'm not sure, I don't know  very much about the theory about  how the quilts that women made,  like the log cabin quilt --.  >> (Laughs) I knew that was  going to come up!  Okay, where we stand about the  quilts.  Quilts are a hard subject  because, from what we've known,  there isn't any real documented  history about the freedom  quilts.  I don't know if anybody knows  what those are.  >> There was a speaker we had  maybe two years ago who  addressed that, he was an expert  on this very thing. 

 And he said, zero evidence.  >> Zero evidence.  Yes, it was a folklore story, a  children's story.  It would be wonderful if it was  a true story that they were  northward bound, and the  different directionals, but we  can't say that there's any  evidence in that.  Sorry.  >> Well, I mean, anything is  possible.  >> Yeah, anything is possible.  If you got documentation.  I knew that was gonna come up.  Children's folklore, a  children's story that has become  larger than life. 

 And it's really hard because we  have a lot of schoolteachers  that teach that to the kids  before coming in to visit us.  And our bread and butter is the  school districts, and doing  school tours all year, and it's  very hard to explain to kids,  because they're looking for,  where did you hang the quilt?  Where are the quilts at?  So, any other questions?  Well, thank you guys!  (Applause)