>> LAST YEAR GOVERNOR EVERS
APPOINTED JUDGE JOSEPH DONALD TO
THE STATE COURT OF APPEALS.
AT THAT TIME, DONALD WAS ONLY
THE SECOND AFRICAN-AMERICAN TO
SERVE AT THAT LEVEL.
THIS WEEK, HE JOINED LIBERALS ON
THE STATE SUPREME COURT AND
OTHER WISCONSIN APPEALS COURT
JUDGES IN CALLING FOR MAKING THE
BENCH MORE DIVERSE AND
ACKNOWLEDGING RACIAL BIAS WITHIN
THE LEGAL SYSTEM.
WE ASKED JUDGE DONALD TO JOIN US
EARLIER THIS WEEK AND WE THANK
YOU VERY MUCH FOR BEING HERE,
JUDGE.
>> I AM DELIGHTED TO BE HERE AND
THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.
>> SO THE OPEN LETTER THAT YOU
SIGNED ON TO SAYS, QUOTE, "WE
NEED TO RECOGNIZE THE ONGOING
INJUSTICES IN OUR LEGAL SYSTEM
AND THE BARRIERS THAT STAND IN
THE WAY OF JUSTICE."
WHAT ARE THE ONGOING INJUSTICES?
>> WELL, FIRST LET ME SAY THIS,
WITH RESPECT TO THE OTHER
COSIGNERS OF THAT LETTER.
I AM JUST DELIGHTED AND VERY
PROUD OF THEIR WILLINGNESS TO
STEP FORWARD AND TO RECOGNIZE
THAT WE DO HAVE A PROBLEM IN OUR
JUSTICE SYSTEM.
THE MAIN ISSUE IS TO ENSURE THAT
WE TREAT PEOPLE WITH FAIRNESS
AND EQUALITY.
AND ANYONE THAT HAS SPENT ANY
TIME IN THE SYSTEM UNDERSTANDS
THAT THERE ARE AREAS THAT REALLY
NEED IMPROVEMENT.
YOU KNOW, IT'S MY BELIEF THAT WE
HAVE WAY TOO MANY PEOPLE LOCKED
UP AND LOCKED UP FOR WAY TOO
LONG.
BUT WE HAVE TO TRY AND FIGURE
OUT WHAT ARE THOSE SORT OF
SYSTEMIC BARRIERS AND PROCESSES
THAT ARE CREATING THIS INEQUITY.
>> SO WHAT ARE SOME EXAMPLES OF
THE BARRIERS?
>> WELL, I WOULD SAY THE BIGGEST
BARRIER, IF I HAD TO PUT THEM IN
SORT OF BROAD TERMS, IGNORANCE
IS A BARRIER, DENIAL, AND
SILENCE.
YOU KNOW, I THINK THERE IS A
NEED FOR THOSE WHO WORK OR WHO
ARE LEADERS WITHIN THE CRIMINAL
JUSTICE SYSTEM AND JUSTICE
SYSTEM TO SPEAK OUT.
AND I THINK THAT THIS LETTER
GOES A LONG WAY TO AT LEAST
ENGAGE AND START THE
CONVERSATION.
THERE WAS A TIME WHEN JUDGES
TYPICALLY SORT OF JUST LAID BACK
IN THE BACKGROUND AND NEVER
REALLY ASSERTED THEMSELVES INTO
THE PUBLIC DISCOURSE.
BUT I THINK THAT WE ARE NOW IN A
NEW ENVIRONMENT, PARTICULARLY
GIVEN ALL OF THE ANGER AND GRIEF
AND FRUSTRATION THAT THE PEOPLE
FEEL.
AND SO I THINK THERE IS A NEED
FOR JUDGES TO STEP FORWARD AND
TO SPEAK TO THESE ISSUES.
>> YOU TALK ABOUT IGNORANCE AND
DENIAL.
ON WHOSE PART?
>> WELL, SORT OF THOSE WHO JUST
SAY THAT THERE ISN'T A PROBLEM.
YOU KNOW, OFTENTIMES PEOPLE WILL
TAKE THE POSITION, WELL, I
DIDN'T CREATE THIS PROBLEM.
I DON'T GO OUT AND ARREST PEOPLE
AND BRING THEM TO COURT.
YOU KNOW, THEY'RE BROUGHT TO MY
COURT.
BUT TO SAY THAT YOU'RE NOT PART
OF THE SYSTEM AND TO NOT ASK
QUESTIONS AS TO HOW SOMEONE
COMES INTO THE SYSTEM, WHY THEY
COME INTO THE SYSTEM.
YOU KNOW, I HAVE TO SAY THAT AS
-- WHEN I WAS A TRIAL COURT
JUDGE, I WOULD SIT THERE AND
ROUTINELY SEE, YOU KNOW, BLACK
DEFENDANT AFTER BLACK DEFENDANT,
AND THE QUESTION ULTIMATELY
COMES, WHY ARE WE DOING THIS AND
WHAT IS GOING TO BE DONE ABOUT
IT?
IT ISN'T ENOUGH TO JUST SAY,
WELL, YOU KNOW, IF PEOPLE JUST
STOPPED COMMITTING CRIMES, THEY
WOULDN'T END UP IN THE CRIMINAL
JUSTICE SYSTEM.
BUT AS YOU LOOK AT SORT OF WHAT
ARE THE ROOT CAUSES, TRAUMA,
MENTAL HEALTH, ECONOMIC.
YOU KNOW, SO THOSE ARE THE
THINGS THAT SORT OF BRING PEOPLE
-- THE ROOT CAUSES THAT BRING
PEOPLE INTO THE SYSTEM.
I RECOGNIZED THAT AS A TRIAL
COURT JUDGE WHEN I CREATED THE
DRUG TREATMENT COURT TO TRY AND
FIGURE OUT WAYS TO DIVERT PEOPLE
FROM THE CRIMINAL JUSTICE
SYSTEM.
IT ISN'T ALL ABOUT RETRIBUTION
AND PUNISHMENT.
AND SO I THINK THAT THERE IS --
THERE IS -- WE ARE IN A NEW
ENVIRONMENT NOW, AND I THINK
PEOPLE ARE DEMANDING THAT WE
TAKE A MORE ACTIVE ROLE IN
ENSURING THAT THERE IS FAIRNESS.
>> WE NEED TO LEAVE IT THERE.
THERE'S SO MUCH MORE TO TALK
ABOUT, AND WE APPRECIATE YOU
JOINING ON THIS.
JUDGE DONALD, THANKS.
>> WELL, THANK YOU, FREDERICA.
I'M DELIGHTED TO BE ON AND I
LOOK FORWARD TO CONTINUING THE
CONVERSATION.