The following program is a PBS Wisconsin Original
production. >> April showers bring
destruction as storm damage from hail, flooding and
tornadoes wreaked havoc across the state this week.
I'm Frederica Freyberg. Tonight on "Here& Now" we
check in with the National Weather Service on what's
been hit. Then Senator Ron Johnson gives his position
on the war in Iran and a PhD student back home in
Iran provides an inside point of view of what it's
like to live inside the warfare.
And groups, again, bring a legal challenge to the
Enbridge oil pipeline. It's "Here& Now" for April 17th.
>> Funding for "Here& Now" is provided by the Focus
Fund for Journalism and Friends of PBS Wisconsin.
>> Governor Tony Evers this week called a state of
emergency due to storms in Wisconsin. More than 20
counties are under flood warnings and it just keeps
storming. Hardest hit Milwaukee and southeast
Wisconsin and farther north toward green Bay and into
central parts of the state. Roads and highways have
closed, with sandbagging underway and more sopping
messes in areas hard hit last August. How unusual is
this string of wet weather and storms? We turn to Kurt
Kotenberg, a meteorologist in charge with the National
Weather Service, joining us from green Bay. And thanks
a lot for being here. >> Yeah, thank you for
having us. >> So what's been happening
over the past several days in your region?
>> Yeah, it's just been one round after the other.
Pretty much everywhere across Wisconsin. So not
only the La Crosse area in southwestern Wisconsin,
they issued over 55 severe weather warnings this week.
The Milwaukee area has issued over 79 severe
weather warnings this week. So it's just been statewide.
And of course, we have the terrible flooding up in
east central and northeastern Wisconsin.
Long story short, so far in the month of April, so this
is through the 16th of April. This doesn't even
count the severe weather happening Friday. The the
National Weather Service offices have issued 172
severe thunderstorm warnings, tornado warnings
or flash flood warnings. And to put that number in
perspective, we average about 22 statewide for the
entire month of April. And that number that we've had
so far halfway through April is more severe
weather tornado or severe thunderstorm, tornado
warning, and more flash flood warnings than we've
issued in the past eight years combined. So we are
just way outside the box of anything that we typically
deal with here, not only in April in Wisconsin, but
almost just Wisconsin in general, even during the
peak summer months. >> Boy, those those numbers
you were sharing about the number of, of weather
alerts and storm warnings and stuff that is stunning.
>> It's wild. So, so this past Tuesday, the 14th
statewide, we issued 78 of those severe warnings,
tornado warnings, flash flood warnings. That's the
fifth most active day in state history period for us
issuing warnings. So that includes, you know, June,
July, May, like the fifth most active day happened
here in the middle of April. And then yeah, the, the
flooding, especially the Wolfe River in New London,
those are record highs. So going back to 1922 was the
previous record. So in any of our lifetimes, we have
not seen this type of flooding across east
central Wisconsin. And, you know, I was working with
someone or talking with what the emergency managers
there, and they said that the Wolfe River is so high.
There's lots of sturgeon in the Wolfe River that
there's actually sturgeon in people's front yards.
And so we're going to have to coordinate with the DNR.
Once this is all done and the water starts receding,
like there's going to be sturgeon that need to be
netted out of people's front yards. Like, you know,
just unprecedented things in any of our lifetimes. So
yeah, just yeah, terrible, terrible flooding and
terrible weather here across Wisconsin. And again,
just very, very much looking forward to this
upcoming week with it stopping and being dry.
Finally. >> With the ground already
saturated, what kind of flooding could result from
Friday's and storms into this evening?
>> Right. So, you know, certainly in east central
Wisconsin, you know, we're talking about the Wolfe
River in particular. You know, they've had hundreds
and hundreds of people evacuating across towns
such as New London and Shiocton. So they don't
need a single Moore drop or additional drop of rain. So
the Friday event is the one positive. If there even if
there is not really positive. But the one good
thing is that it's going to be a very fast moving
system. So once it's through here Friday evening,
you know, it's probably going to be through
Wisconsin eight, 9:00, the worst of it, you know,
hopefully then it should be quiet for at least the next
five days. So that'll be a little different this
moving, whereas the past couple days has been a lot
slower moving. But after that, the the kind of the
light at the end of the tunnel is that we're not
expecting rainfall here the next five days. So this
goes through probably until Thursday of next week. So
hopefully that'll give us a time to dry off and really
start the cleanup and restoration process across
Wisconsin. >> And on the Wolf River.
Do you know what its current flood stage is or
where it's at? >> Yeah. So it's in major
flood stage. It New London and Shiocton. And this is
record. It's over over 19ft. Okay, so both of those
locations have set record heights. Again, this is
going back to the 1900s. So in any of our lifetimes.
>> Do you know how many people have been evacuated
from various locales? >> As of Thursday, it was
close to 2000, and I believe that it is exceeded
2000 as of Friday morning. And again, we'll see what
happens with the Friday once the Friday evening,
severe weather and heavy rain is done, what that
number turns to on Saturday. >> For people like you
monitoring this and putting out the warnings and seeing
what's happening and seeing what's coming, how
frightening is that? >> So after the tornado by
Union Center on Tuesday, the National Weather
Service and La Crosse went out Wednesday morning and
damaged the damage survey. And, you know, seeing the
homes and the damage, you know, these are our fellow
Wisconsinites. And, you know, just seeing, you know,
some people like they've lost everything. And so
it's, it weighs on us a lot too. And it also helps
motivate us to really, you know, this is why we do
this is to, to try to help help keep these people safe
and protected the best that we can. And then just
seeing the impacts on the community, you know, just,
just reaffirms that what we're doing is important.
And we're, we're operating 24 over seven, 365 so, you
know, whatever we can do to help people stay safe
weather wise is what we're doing around the clock.
>> Kurt Kotenberg out of green Bay. Thanks so much.
>> Thank you for having us. >> There is a new ten day
ceasefire between Israel and Lebanon, and we're into
week two of a ceasefire with Iran and new today,
Iran announces the Strait of Hormuz is open. The
temporary détente in the war with Iran comes in the
midst of a build up of U.S. forces having steamed into
the region. Last week, we interviewed Democratic U.S.
Second District Representative Mark Pocan,
who called the U.S. Israel War with Iran. Chaos piled
on top of chaos. Tonight, we turn to Republican U.S.
Senator Ron Johnson. And Senator, thanks very much
for being here. >> Well, Fredricka, thanks
for having me on. >> So it seems to be
welcome news that Iran has declared the Strait of
Hormuz open. But what about Representative Pocan
comment that this war is chaos on top of chaos? Are
you satisfied with the war planning that went into
this and the move? >> Since last weekend? I
was on one of the Sunday morning shows and the host
started the interview by saying that I was
supportive of the war in Iran, and I pushed back
immediately by saying, no, I am absolutely opposed to
the war. The Iranian ayatollahs declared on
America 47 years ago. The fact that they have
hundreds, probably thousands of Americans,
blood on their hands and obviously tens of thousands
of their own citizens, blood on their hands. So
what I'm supportive of is ending that war once and
for all, ending the threat, ending the menace, and
ending the there any possibility that they could
obtain a nuclear weapon weapon which could be
existential to America. So yeah, it is war. Messy. Is
it chaotic? Sure. You know, I don't like war, but we
had to act before we weren't able to act before
they became a nuclear power, before they had so many
missiles and so many drones that taking this action
would have devastated the region. It's been
destructive enough. But again, so I support
President Trump's very difficult decision. This is
good news. I think, you know, we have dramatically
degraded Iran's capability to be a state sponsor of
terror, to develop a nuclear weapon, to hold the
Strait of Hormuz hostage. And I think this latest
blockade is certainly showing. It's proving its
worth in bringing Iran to the negotiating table and
forcing to force them into what should be as close to,
you know, unilateral disarmament and just, you
know, unconditional surrender as possible.
>> And so you think it's a diplomatic course at this
point, not a bombing course, to quote, finish the job,
as you've said you want to do.
>> Yeah. When President Trump met with the families
of the fallen at Dover, the dignified return, he
reported in his speech that the family is almost to a
person said, okay, we've sacrificed now finish the
job. And I think it'd be, you know, not good if we
left a regime in place, continue to be dedicated to
enrich uranium, not give up those uranium stockpiles,
continue to build up their missile and drone
stockpiles, to continue to threaten the region and
threaten world peace. So I want to finish the job. We
have obviously decimated their leadership. We've
decimated their their missiles, their drones,
their nuclear program. But we haven't finished the job.
But we need to do that. >> You took exception last
week to the president threatening to wipe out an
entire civilization in Iran. It was a newsworthy rebuke
from a high ranking Republican. What did you
think when you saw that threat?
>> I guess I wouldn't call it a rebuke. I was asked a
question. I gave an honest answer. We're not at war
with Iranian people. In fact, we are trying to do
everything we can to support them. We want to
liberate the Iranian people, not not impoverish them. So
again, President Trump has a certain negotiating style.
I mean, I, for one, am hoping and praying it works.
I mean, Frederica, just think of how if all these
things are successful, it looks like Venezuela is on
the road to success. If we can tame Iran, if we can
remove that regime and get more responsible leadership
in there, who are going to be more interested in
governing Iran for the benefit of its people as
opposed to their ideology being a state sponsor of
terror? I mean, just understand how positively
that could reset global politics or the
geopolitical situation throughout the world. If
Cuba could reclaim if Cubans could reclaim their
liberty, their freedom. I mean, these are, you know,
Iran should be incredibly successful and prosperous
nation, as should Venezuela, as should Cuba. And it's
only it's only through American leadership that
those things can happen. >> As to not being at war
with the Iranian people and Iranian U.A.W. student that
is now there says it very much feels to her like the
U.S. is at war with the people. How do you respond
to that? >> That's one person's
opinion. Again, we're not doing polls. I mean,
they've obviously canceled the internet, so we don't
know exactly what's happening inside Iran. I
think one of the reasons the Iranian regime is so
brutal to its people, I mean, they executed 30 to
40,000 of their own citizens in a couple of
days. Okay. My guess is a large majority of Iranians
would like to see the ayatollahs gone on the
dustbin of history. The sooner the better. Again, I
don't there are certainly people within Iran who
support the mullahs and the ayatollahs, but I just have
to believe when you take a look at the long history of
Iran, the Persian people and stuff, I mean, this has
been a prosperous land. The ayatollahs have just
devastated what could be incredibly prosperous and
freedom loving type of country.
>> How, in your mind, can ordinary Iranian citizens
like that U.A.W. student of whom we spoke rise up and
take over the regime? >> Well, it's very
difficult. I pointed this out in the past. You know,
for those who just want to keep pushing nationwide gun
control and those who want to disarm America, this is
what it looks like when a population disarmed, when
the only people that have bullets and rifles and
weapons are our brutal regime, it leads to tyranny.
And we had some pretty interesting testimony in
the Senate this this past week, Congressman Thomas
Massie went through the list of regime after regime
after regime, brutal dictatorial regimes leading
to the deaths of millions of their citizens. The
first action was always disarming the population.
So it's difficult. I think we've certainly weakened
the regime. It's as weak as it's ever been. In his 47
years. We may have to do some assistance. We may
have to to provide some. I'll call it, assistance to
the Iranian people so they can. Finally, on top of
that regime. >> Senator Ron Johnson, we
leave it there. Thanks very much for joining us again.
>> Have a good day. >> A UW-Madison School of
Journalism PhD student is back home living just
outside Tehran. Each day brings fear and uncertainty
for Tahereh Rahimi, who does not support the war,
nor does she support the regime. She sees her
country and people living there being destroyed.
Communications are mostly down in the country, so we
sent her questions to learn firsthand what it's like
right now. Here's a sampling of what she said.
>> I used to think that I am, that I was brave. I
think that's not true anymore. About about me. I
know that it's totally fine to be scared, but I think
we're really changes you depending on what type of
missiles they are using, you can feel the shake.
That part is the scariest part. If I want to describe
it to you. You know, in the spring when the lightning
hits and it sounds like the sky is being ripped apart,
when you lay down on the ground, you can feel it
like the same, you know, ripping apart, feeling
inside there. I remember one night, the middle of
the war, it was 830 or 9 p.m. and it was raining,
and we heard the sound of the fighter jets. And it
was not just one, it was a group of them just passing
over our head. And at the same time, we could hear
the the explosions and also the shake. I remember like
I was thinking, why doesn't finish? Why when, when the
end is gonna come. It is like constant torture. You.
You are literally just waiting for something to
happen to you or your loved ones. You know you are
waiting for the bomb to hit or the roof comes down or
the windows to shatter. After the jets pass over.
Obviously you feel happy that okay, I I'm safe. My
family is safe, I am safe. But at the same time, you
know that the heat they hit somewhere else, they killed
other people. You know, you feel happy at the same time
that you feel guilty. Why you are happy? The eighth
night of the attack, when Israel bombed three oil
depots in Tehran and 1 in Karaj, close to where I
live. Tehran was covered under Black smoke for hours.
And then it was Black rain coming down. It was. It was
raining Black. You can just imagine how this can
influence impact people's health, especially older
people, and how it's gonna leave, you know, lasting
damage and people's health and water and so on. Us and
Israeli have already destroyed my country. More
than 2000 people are killed. I don't like just to
mention numbers, but the numbers are real. These
people are blood and flesh and they are. They are not
just characters in a computer game. More than
2000 people are killed. Over 26,000 people are
wounded. They are literally changing my country to
another Gaza where people are deeply suffering. If
they. They have not gone already dead already. What
do you think about how this war is being covered in the
media? As you know, the internet is still down
after almost 50 days. Netanyahu was the one
dragged us in this war, but I didn't see a lot of
coverage. The part that the the Israeli has done is
sort of whitewashed or softened in the news media,
and people just don't talk about this. It might be the
result of what I saw in how they were represented in,
in domestic news media. But it was very disappointing
that like, what they were talking was just about the
oil price. Oh, the Brant oil is like now it's $0.50
higher than yesterday. As if like it was the war was
reduced to just the oil price, you know, deleting
the human side of the war. So my biggest fear is that
they don't like Iranian government. And the US
don't come to an agreement. My biggest fear is that
that like somehow the ceasefire ends and they
resume the war. So it means all this nightmare is gonna
happen again. I hope that this war ends forever and
never happen again. >> The latest hearing
challenging the Enbridge Line five oil and gas
pipeline in northern Wisconsin unfolded late
this week. The bad River Band of Lake Superior,
Chippewa and environmental groups want state permits
already approved to be reversed and to halt any
pipeline construction. The circuit court judge in the
case isn't expected to rule until the end of this month
at the earliest, even though line five
construction is being rerouted around the
reservation, the band worries about damage to
Upstream and Lake Superior water. For more on this, we
turn to Band River Band Chairwoman Elizabeth
Arbuckle. And thanks very much for being here.
>> Thanks for having me. >> So fundamentally, I've
had people ask why the concerns, if the pipeline
has been rerouted to skirt reservation lands?
>> There's lots of reasons to be worried or concerned,
and one of them is when they do the construction,
they are going to be stirring up mercury
deposits of from acid rain from decades past, and
those have settled. So when they come through to do
that, that's going to stir up these deposits, which
are then going to go directly into our waterways.
You know, they are just hugging our reservation.
It's not like they went miles and miles away. It's
literally a stone's throw from from our land
reservation boundaries. And that is going to stir up
these mercury deposits that have been in our wetlands
and go into our water and go into Lake Superior. You
know, we've already got we already have mercury
deposit warnings and can only eat one walleye a week
or a month, depending on on your age and gender. And,
and that's, that's problematic. So if we get
more mercury, that's going to affect our fishing
industry. It's certainly affecting our Ojibwe
culture because like walleye, for example, is a
major part of our culture. So that's what we worry
about the mercury upsets. We also worry about the
blasting they're going to do in the reroute, which is
in the mountains, just off the reservation. That's
another thing that we don't know what we don't know.
They say, oh, it's safe, it's fine. The other one is
our treaty rights. And this is key because the way they
want to do the reroute is so we'll say this is the
reservation. And they're going to go like that with
this being Lake Superior. So on all three sides
they're going to surround us and encircle us. And
that's problematic because they're still in our ceded
territory, right? That's still we still have rights
to hunt, fish and gather in this land. And we're not
going to be able to cross into our reservation
without asking their permission. You know,
that's that's not what we signed up for. That's not
the spirit of the law. That's not been the
interpretations in the and the understanding of our
treaty rights. So cutting that off, cutting us off
from from our land, from our own homeland, from
accessing the, the, our treaty rights that we're
allowed to use, which have been upheld. That's
problematic. >> What is your response to
the DNR and Enbridge saying that environmental issues
have been exhaustively researched and addressed?
>> I say I don't think so, right? I mean, everyone
like I said, everyone's been ignoring this Mercury
problem. And the problem with the heavy metals that
are going to be released by the land. So I don't think
they have been exhaustively researched. And yet there
seems to be no concern about this sleeping mercury
that we have in the wetlands area on and near
our reservation. >> Why the protracted fight?
>> I don't think anybody wants a protracted fight,
but it's the outcome that's important, not not the
battle. So we have to protect our homeland. We
have to protect Lake Superior. We have to
protect our treaty rights. And those that you know
that that our fellow other Ojibwe bands in northern
Wisconsin exercise and hold with us as well.
>> Do you feel as though you will prevail?
>> Yes. I have to believe we will prevail in the end.
We have to. The stakes are too high, right? I can't, I
can't imagine not. We need to. We need to preserve
Wisconsin, Northern Wisconsin, Lake Superior.
And we're on the front lines for that. And so
we're willing to do that. It's like I said, it's it's
it's even bigger than our reservation, right? It's
even bigger than that because those waterways
lead right to Lake Superior. So it's really important we
all think and study and, and look and see what
they're saying and work toward, you know, stopping
it. >> All right. Chairwoman
Elizabeth Arbuckle, we leave it there. Thank you
so much for your time. >> Thank you. Appreciate
you having me. >> For more on this and
other issues facing Wisconsin, visit our
website at PBS Wisconsin. Org and then click on the
news tab. That's our program for tonight. I'm
Frederica Freyberg. Have a good weekend.
>> Funding for "Here& Now" is provided by the fund for
Journalism and Friends of
PBS Wisconsin.