PBS Wisconsin original production.
>> Injustice anywhere is Injustice Everywhere.
>> Wisconsin congressional members respond to ICE's
clash with protesters in Minneapolis, and speculate
if that fight could move closer to home.
[MUSIC] I'm Frederica Freyberg
tonight on "Here& Now". Wisconsin's U.S. senators
address health care premiums and the ACA
enhanced tax credits, cost of living and ICE use of
force in Minnesota. Governor Evers lays out his
roadmap for his final year in office, and Zac Schultz
reports on the legislative priorities from the
candidates vying to be the next governor. It's "Here&
Now" for January 16th. >> Funding for here and Now
is provided by the Focus Fund for Journalism and
Friends of PBS Wisconsin. >> Fallout from federal
immigration enforcement in Minneapolis continues this
week with six federal prosecutors. They're
resigning over the assignment to investigate
the widow of the 37 year old mother shot and killed
by an Ice agent. And Thursday was the last day
of open enrollment for marketplace Affordable Care
Act plans, with early indications showing 1.4
million fewer enrollees than last year. But the
U.S. House last week voted to extend those credits,
with 17 Republicans joining, including Wisconsin third
Congressional Representative Derrick Van
Orden. To check where that measure goes in the Senate,
we turn to Wisconsin's U.S. senators, Democrat Tammy
Baldwin and Republican Ron Johnson, who joins us now.
Senator, thanks very much for being here.
>> Thanks for having me on. >> So what do you know
about any compromise to be had on the extension of
these ACA enhanced credits? >> Well, I appreciate you
reporting it accurately. We're talking about the
enhanced credits for the supposedly 24 million
people on the exchanges. More than 22 million will
still get the Obamacare subsidies, which were very
generous. The only people losing subsidies are people
making over 400% of the poverty line. That's about
1.6 million people. And I'm actually working with the
couple Democrat senators to address those individuals
because they are facing unbelievably high premiums
because of Obamacare. It is so destroyed. The
individual market. Some of these folks close to
retirement are facing premiums of 36, $38,000 a
year. So I'd like to help them. But again, I really
have there's no reason to extend the enhanced
temporary pandemic subsidies for people who
still will retain the Obamacare subsidies.
>> What kind of traction is that? Getting your proposal
to maintain credits for those at 400% above poverty?
>> Well, what I've been told is there are enough
Democrats who will co-sponsor that. But right
now, I think they're still holding out hope that they
can extend all the subsidies. I just believe
that's dead on arrival here in the Senate. We voted
that down multiple times during the shutdown. That's
that's just not going to happen.
>> Were you surprised by the 17 Republicans in the
House who voted to extend those enhanced credits?
>> No, I think the issue has been so misreported.
It's been so misrepresented that I think there are
people in very close districts were concerned
about that misrepresentation. They
constituents that, no, they want to help them handle
the extremely high premiums. But but remember, the
reason premiums are so high is because Obamacare is
just flawed. It's it's it's an awful structure. It
forced a very small percentage of the American
population. Those 24 million people on the
individuals change to completely bear the cost of
covering people with preexisting conditions. So
that's the reason why premiums, since the
implementation of Obamacare have increased four times
rate inflation. So again, it's completely failed. And
the only thing the subsidy is doing right now is
they're masking that. It's certainly helping people.
ought to fix Obamacare. We repair the damage done and
transition to a system that would actually work like.
Well, the root cause of our health care financing
system is the third party payer system. Somebody else
is going to pay the the. Provider, the, you know,
the costs of, of the procedures and, and the
medical services. All we pay for is insurance. It's
way too high or we pay our taxes. So until you
actually reintroduce consumerism, where
consumers know what things cost and they're concerned
about what things cost. Right now, doctors don't
know. Nurses don't know, patients don't know. The
only people know are the bean counters. So that's a
completely flawed system. You've removed all the
benefits of a free market, competitive system out of
health care. So you don't have lower costs, you don't
have better quality, you don't have better service.
So again, return consumerism, free market
competition in there. Now providers aren't going to
incentive in our current health care system is to
increase prices because everybody is taking a
percentage cut off it. They'd rather take a
percent cut off something cost $10,000 rather than
five. So it's about consumerism. That's the
>> On immigration enforcement. Minneapolis
obviously continues to be a powder keg. How does the
president, invoking the Insurrection Act, bringing
in U.S. military help or hurt? What's going on there
in your mind? >> Well, what you ought to
do is take a look at different states, those
cooperating with Ice as we try and administration
tries to clean up this enormous mess left behind
by Biden and Democrats, who opened up our borders
versus those states that are resisting where local
law enforcement actually holds illegal immigrants
that have committed crimes so that Ice can pick them
up peacefully at the jails. You're not seeing a problem.
Where you're seeing a problem is where you have
insurgents like Governor Walz and the mayor inciting
people to resist and obstruct justice. And that
led to the tragedy of that one woman's death.
>> Do you have concerns that Wisconsin will be
similarly embroiled? >> I would hope that
Wisconsin county sheriffs and local officials would
cooperate with Ice. I think generally they do. We don't
we do not have, you know, pockets of large illegal
immigration, immigrants in the state of Wisconsin. So
it's not as big an issue here as it is with the
Somali population and others in Minnesota and
some of these other big cities.
>> Do you feel like public benefits fraud in Minnesota
justifies the Trump administration to surge ice
there? >> That's not why they're
doing it. They're two totally separate issues.
>> And yet that has been something that the
president has spoken to. >> Well, again, you have a,
you know, large Somali population that now we are
seeing evidence of how much they are defrauding the
federal government on a host of government programs,
you know, flying $700 million of cash out of the
Minneapolis airport. Again, there's some real problems
there, but that's separate from the illegal immigrants.
And quite honestly, the sanctuary cities, sanctuary
states like Minneapolis and Minnesota, where you don't
have local officials working with Ice to
peacefully turn over people they've detained, have
committed crimes. Other states that do it. You
don't have these problems. >> You stated this week
that you do not want to see immigration enforcement
action on farmers. Do you have any assurances on that?
>> Just that, you know, for example, President Trump
was not happy with the raid, I think the Hyundai plant.
So people here that are working, contributing, that
is not the people that Ice is, is primarily going
after right now. They're going after the criminals.
Now, if you're associating yourself with people who
have committed crimes, if you get caught up in those
enforcement actions, I mean, if you've come to this
country illegally, you've committed a crime as well.
But that's not who the Trump administration is
>> Do you support on the kind of world stage do you
support the administration's actions in
Venezuela, or threats against Iran, or even
looking at Greenland? Do you support that kind of
foreign policy. >> Is undeniably good, that
Maduro is no longer the illegitimate leader and
destroying Venezuela. Now, what comes next? I don't
know if the mullahs could be replaced by the Iranian
people. That would be a good thing for the world.
They are a menace. Greenland. From my
standpoint, I'm not worried about a military invasion
there. I think it's appropriate for President
Trump to understand and point out what a strategic
how strategically, strategically important
Greenland is. And I think there's probably more and
more intelligence coming out, exactly what Russia
and China may be doing there. And we need to make
sure that Greenland is protected for NATO and for
for America and for our own national security.
>> What do you think average Wisconsinites care
most about right now? Do you think it's the cost of
living? >> Sure. Always has been,
always will be. And it's difficult to, you know,
once you've devalued the dollar to the extent we
have over the over the decades, a dollar held in
1998 is only worth $0.51 as recently as 2019, that
dollar's worth $0.80. And so the 40 year high
inflation incurred during the Biden administration
that permanently devalued the dollar. So, you know,
those a lot of those prices, they're not going to go
back down. Now there are certain commodities like
energy gasoline you noticing because we
actually are encouraging drilling and energy
production. Gasoline prices are going down. You know, I
think a more rational approach to bird flu is is
probably bring down the price of eggs. So there are
certain things we can address. President Trump
right now is and I had a briefing in terms of what
he's doing to make sure that European countries or
other developed countries pay the same price we pay
for drugs. So they don't free, free, free load off
of our innovation. That will also help things, you
know, in terms of pharmaceutical pricing.
>> All right. Senator Ron Johnson, we'll leave it
there. Thanks very much for your time.
>> Have a good day. >> Democratic U.S. Senator
Tammy Baldwin was on the Senate floor this week to,
in her words, rail against Republicans repeated
attacks on the Affordable Care Act. Senator Baldwin
joins us now. Thanks very much for being here.
>> It's a pleasure. Thanks for having me.
>> So you say that, but Congressman Van Orden and
16 other Republicans in that body voted in favor of
extending the enhanced tax credits. Does that
represent some movement toward that in the Senate?
>> You know, it was it. We had a moment in the Senate
to take up the bill that was passed in the House of
Representatives that would have extended the tax
credits for three years, and my Republican
colleagues blocked it, pure and simple. We have known
for well over a year that these tax credits would
expire at the end of 2025, and I have worked
tirelessly to try to extend these tax credits so that
working families can afford their health care premiums
if they buy through the Affordable Care Act. But
we're seeing the numbers start to come in. Thousands
of Wisconsinites have dropped health care
coverage, and we expected only to get worse, as some
who were automatically enrolled get their premium
bills and figure out that it's just not in their
budget to continue health care. And so while I will
never throw in the towel on fighting for affordable
health care for all, I can tell you that for some it
is too late. In this particular year to repair
the damage that has been done. And as to my
colleague from Wisconsin in the House, he has railed
against the Affordable Care Act, supported repeal of it
in its entirety for for years now. And this at the
last minute, in my mind, does not recover, does not,
does not make him now a fan of the program.
>> So we just spoke with Senator Johnson and and he
is proposing maintaining the tax credits for people
at 400% above poverty. Is that something that you
would support? >> Look, I believe that
there is a lot of room for negotiation on the
extension of the Affordable Care Act tax credits, and
there is no reason in my mind that we can't have
reasonable income cap, or to have a provision that
says that you can't be expected to pay more than a
certain percentage of your income on health care. I
just want to relate a story that I shared on the Senate
floor. I have a constituent who is paying 40% of their
income on their health insurance premium. That's
how much it's gone up. In the absence of these
Affordable Care Act tax credits. And so I think we
have to be reasonable here, capping the percentage of
people's income that should be contributed towards
health insurance. But I think we can look at a
reasonable limit for higher wage earners to have that
tax credit taper off. >> On immigration
enforcement. Do you think the president, invoking the
Insurrection Act to bring in the military helps or
hurts what's going on right now in Minneapolis?
>> You know, when you see this president surge, what
is now close to 3000 armed masked Ice agents into
neighborhoods, schools, residential areas, I think
that makes our communities less safe, not more safe.
And the chaos that is going on in in Minnesota by these
unaccountable actions taken by these Ice agents, is the
part that is causing tensions to rise. And I
think that the Trump effort to change the narrative and
blame residents who are peacefully protesting this
presence is wrongheaded. He's been talking about
reckoning and retribution. That's what I think this is
all about. And it is very, very disconcerting to see
this surge. Right now, Ice agents outnumber local law
enforcement 3 to 1. >> What do you think about
invoking the Insurrection Act?
>> I think it's entirely wrongheaded and is about
the retribution campaign that this president is on
and inappropriate. >> Do you think this kind
of powder keg comes to Wisconsin?
>> You know, I think we need to be watching and
vigilant about what's happening in our
neighboring state of Minnesota and be ready. I
think it is very responsible for our local
leaders and state leaders to be talking actively
about what this would look like in Wisconsin.
>> On foreign policy, US threats against Iran, the
incursion into Venezuela and the play on Greenland.
In your mind, where does all this leave the US in
the world? >> You know, first of all,
it's so clear that the president is distracted and
trying to distract the attention of the American
public. When he ran for president, he said on day
one, I will bring costs down, and on day one, I
will end our international conflicts, our endless wars.
And instead, he has promoted policies that have
increased prices of everything from groceries
and consumer goods to energy, housing. And he has,
instead of bringing an end to conflict, he has
proposed or actually engaged in more. This
president is totally distracted from what he
promised he would do for the American people.
>> Because what do you think Wisconsinites care
most about right now? Is it the cost of everything,
including housing. >> Including housing,
including health care? As we just discussed, many are
making facing these impossible choices and
actually dropping something as essential as health care
coverage because they can no longer afford it.
Because of policies that Donald Trump has promoted,
the economy is by far the number one concern that I
hear from my constituents. And it's, you know, the
cost of things feels just impossible to them right
now. Housing costs have skyrocketed, and we have
seen grocery prices accelerate in terms of
inflation in recent months. And the president's energy
policies are going to create a significant price
price hike for people. And so, again, this president
is distracted and he is not focusing on the very things
that Wisconsinites who voted for him would like
him to. >> Are there fixes to this
that you may be working on across the aisle?
>> There are certainly there are fixes to
everything. As I said, I won't throw in the towel on
health care costs. I continue to work with my
Republican colleagues on ways in which we can bring
down the cost of prescription medication,
ways in which we can reform the health care system,
which is terribly broken right now on housing. I
certainly reach out to my Republican colleagues to
join with me and others to to make sure that private
equity firms and large corporations aren't
gobbling up all the single family homes that make them
take them off the market and make homeownership so
more, so much more difficult for first time
homebuyers. You know, the average age of the first
homebuyer is now 40 years old. Imagine that. And the
price in the last decade or so of of housing has nearly
doubled in our state. And so we have to squarely
focus on these issues of affordability, so that
being in the middle class means something, means
you're getting ahead. >> We leave it there.
Senator Tammy Baldwin, thanks very much.
>> Thank you for having me. >> Governor Tony Evers this
week laid out a list of his priorities for his final
year in office, as the state legislature has a
matter of weeks left in its schedule to advance any
unfinished business to the floor. It's unclear how
much of the governor's affordability agenda will
make it through. >> Whether it's
prescriptions for insulin or other daily
out-of-pocket costs, or the skyrocketing price of
health care coverage. Things are simply not
affordable, and paychecks aren't going as far as they
used to. I'm asking the legislature to approve $1.3
billion in property tax relief to prevent property
tax increases for average Wisconsin homeowners and
help lower property taxes for working families,
veterans and seniors across our state. Under this
proposal, we can make sure the average homeowner will
not see the property property tax increase.
Period. >> With so many candidates
running for governor, it can be hard to remember all
the names, much less where everyone stands on each
issue. Last month "Here& Now", senior political
reporter Zac Schultz sat down with nine of the
leading candidates. You can find those interviews on
PBS Wisconsin Organic Valley. In addition, over
the next few months, you'll hear from the candidates on
individual issues everything from school
funding to data centers to creating more affordable
housing. Tonight, we kick things off with their
highest priorities what each candidate would work
on first as governor. >> For the first time in 16
years, you can legitimately say control of the
Wisconsin legislature is up for grabs in the next
election, which means the incoming governor could
actually pass their agenda. So we asked each candidate
what the first bill would be that they want to sign
into law. The most common answer had to do with
dealing with the rising costs of everything.
>> So the things that I want to make sure that I'm
signing into law are things that are going to reduce
costs for Wisconsinites, and that's going to be
health care costs primarily. But also looking at child
care, we've got other states that we can look at
for examples where they've been able to subsidize
child care. For folks, treating that as
infrastructure is going to be something that's going
to be a priority for me. >> Well, the first thing I
want to sign is about, you know, how do we really
tackle this affordability crisis? You know, I would
love for us to focus on affordable and attainable
housing in every corner of of the state of Wisconsin.
I would like for us to focus on fully funding our
public schools, making sure that there are good paying
jobs, no matter where they are in our state, and
making sure that our young people are ready for the
jobs of today and tomorrow. >> No matter what we do,
the first thing we need to do is work on affordability.
I think there are any number of ways in which we
need to ensure, whether it's on the issues of
stable housing around the state, or whether it's on
the issues of health care, Medicaid expansion, which
the governor has tried to do over the course of his
eight years, hasn't been able to do. Those are the
types of things that can be done under with a
Democratic majority, and those are the types of
things that I'd be eager to do right away.
>> Well, I think there's a laundry list, and that's
part of our challenge. But one of the things that I
want to see first is things that are focused on
affordability, property taxes and income taxes in
particular. It's embarrassing to me that our
top bracket of income tax is almost double what
Illinois's is. I'd like to see it flattened out and
then slowly eliminated, and then property taxes. I'd
like to see us go from 4 or 5 entities on property tax
bills down to 2 or 3. The goal of cutting them by 50%.
You make a moonshot, and if you hit the stratosphere,
you've won. >> Well, the first thing
that the governor comes in and does in at any time
when there's a new governor is write the budget. And so
I will be working closely with whoever's in the
legislature to make sure that we have a budget that
is immediately addressing challenges that
Wisconsinites are facing, things like healthcare and
child care costs. But also we have a real challenge
around public education. We need to reinvest in our
teachers and our schools, and we need to make sure
that our university and our tech colleges are funded in
a way that helps them move forward. It's all about
investment. BadgerCare expansion right
away. Day one special session if necessary. I
refuse to sign a state budget that does not
include BadgerCare expansion. If we have not
already gotten to that point. We're one of nine
states. We are one of nine states that has yet to
expand our Medicaid program under the Affordable Care
Act. It's it's a travesty that that is not the case.
Republicans and legislature have denied people the care
that they deserve. >> Boy, you know, I don't
think we have any choice at this point, but we got to
deal with education. I just saw some data this week
where almost half of first graders cannot read at
grade level. We have fallen behind Mississippi and
education. That is unacceptable. I don't care
if you're Republican, Democrat or whatever
political persuasion. We have always had a long,
proud tradition of educating children well,
and we've got to get that back. Otherwise our state
cannot succeed. But I think next is the cost of living,
and it is getting the cost of energy down, reducing
taxes, things like that that make Wisconsin more
affordable. budget that raises wages
for people, restores people's rights, lowers
costs on the biggest ticket items like health care and
funds our public school system. Our kids have been
getting shortchanged for a generation, and it's not
fair. And it's actually terrible for our economy.
Big signature policy items that I'm interested in
passing is opening up the state health insurance and
the state pension systems to any person to be able to
buy in. >> Red flag laws and
background checks and safe storage. I think gun safety
is a universal issue, and we have to meet we have to
ensure that we're protecting our kids. Then
public education and universal child care. I
think when we put our kids first, working class
families all win. >> Reporting from Madison.
I'm Zac Schultz for "Here& Now".
>> For more on this and other issues facing
Wisconsin, visit our website at PBS Wisconsin
and then click on the news tab. That's our program for
tonight I'm Frederica Freyberg.
[MUSIC]
>> Funding for "Here& Now" is provided by the Focus
Fund for Journalism and