PBS Wisconsin original production.
>> Yes, the federal government will officially
reopen with the House vote today.
>> The longest shutdown in history is ended.
[MUSIC] >> Democrats are going to
continue fighting every single day for people's
health care and food benefits, and we're going
to be on you day after day until we get it done. Vote
no. disagreement over how that
end was reached. [MUSIC]
I'm Frederica Freyberg. Tonight on "Here& Now"
Republican Congressman Scott Fitzgerald on the
shutdown deal. And what happens next. What to
expect with energy assistance as rates
increase and temperatures outside drop. A burgeoning
but unregulated market is taking hold in Wisconsin.
Building data centers. A new bill seeks transparency
in the process. And in an act of reconciliation,
Catholic sisters transfer land back to the original
tribal owners. It's "Here& Now" for November 14th.
>> Funding for here and Now is provided by the Focus
Fund for Journalism and Friends of PBS Wisconsin.
>> The continuing resolution passed with
eight Senate Democrats joining Republicans.
Senator Tammy Baldwin was not among them voting
against the measure, as it did not include extension
of the ACA enhanced tax credits, saying it was the
shutdown trade off. >> I knew that our our best
chance of successfully fighting for our
afford their health care, especially those who buy it
through healthcare.gov, was to tie it to the continuing
resolution. Go back to the past summer and what the
president calls his one big, beautiful bill, which took
away Medicaid. To the tune of nearly $1 trillion and
cut SNAP to the tune of nearly half $1 trillion in
order to pay for tax breaks that disproportionately
impact billionaires and profitable corporations.
That tells you who this president is, who the
Republican Party is behind. And we showed you just now
who we're fighting for. And we'll continue to fight for.
>> Senator Baldwin is on a statewide swing denouncing
Republicans for blocking attempts to extend
Affordable Care Act, enhanced subsidies for the
GOP put this shutdown vote in the win column for his
reaction. We turn to Republican U.S.
Representative Scott Fitzgerald of the state's
fifth Congressional District. And thanks very
much for being here. Thank you.
to the successful vote to >> I mean, I go back to
September when I voted on the continuing resolution
and and actually left for the airport. By the time
the jet hit the ground back in Wisconsin, the Senate
had already voted it down. That that was a message to
me that we were on a different track than what
we had seen before, with previous continuing
resolutions. But the thing that that was confusing to
me is that the Democrats picked one of the most
difficult and comprehensive issues to kind of hang
their hat on, and that is health care. So we all know
everyone in D.C. knows that the health care markets,
that the programs and that those individual policies
are a complete mess right now. And this is going to
take a long, long time to kind of straighten out. But,
you know, like you said, Senator Baldwin's out there
kind of using it as a wedge issue right now, but you're
not going to get anything done with blaming one party
or the other. We need to come together on that. But
but it can't be done in the in the environment created
by shutting down the government. So it was a it
was a huge mistake. I did predict publicly and almost
3 or 4 days after that, that there's only one way
this is going to going to end, and it's going to be
for the US Senate to capitulate and and cave in.
And ultimately, that's what they had to do.
>> Do you support a vote in the House on the enhanced
ACA tax credits, as it's promised in the Senate?
>> I don't know that we're going to get there. I think
with a two seat majority and with Speaker Johnson
already sending a message that we don't have the
support for that, I certainly couldn't support
it right now. The way it's been framed up, it's it's
just more money to the health insurance companies.
I think we need to continue to look at health savings
accounts. Just this week, Wall Street Journal
editorialized on something that goes back to 2017
where individuals have control over their own
health accounts. I think that's another pathway we
could we could take. But the idea that we're just
going to keep throwing that was dreamed up at the
last second makes absolutely no sense to me.
And and I couldn't support it right now.
>> What is your message to your constituents in your
district who may see their ACA premiums more than
double when these enhanced credits expire?
>> Yeah, I think the first thing I do is disagree with
the premise that they're going to double. There's a
couple of independent think tanks that have done some
analysis since the whole shutdown, and there are
some instances where you could see a significant
increase, but there's others where it will be far
less. And and as a result of that, I think, again,
something we don't have a handle on, Congress doesn't
have a handle on. And for us to somehow dream up some
new policy without doing the legwork makes no sense
to me at this point. So again, I mean, I take issue
with what Senator Baldwin has been saying and
continues to say, because I think it's misleading that
there's a simple fix to this and it's simply to put
more tax money in. >> Would you like to see a
wholesale alternative to the ACA, apart from kind of
direct cash payments for health savings accounts, a
wholesale alternative to it, and if so, what would that
look like? >> It has to start with
portability. I mean, this isn't something that's new.
This has been around for a long time. The idea that
individuals go from insurance company to
insurance company every
time they change jobs or every time they get a new
HSA. I joke about it because there's a lot of
young adults who have switched careers maybe 2 or
3 times early on in their, in their careers. And, and
each one has a different health plan. So what you
end up with are these accounts that have been
created, but yet they never grow. And they're never
sizable, sizable enough to have an impact. I mean,
that's first and foremost. And that goes back to 2017
again, where there were some reforms put in place
that, you know, no one's really tapped into because
they haven't had to because the government keeps
throwing money at these subsidies. And it's it's
just unsustainable at this point.
>> So you were describing how, you know, the issue
that Democrats were kind of hanging their hat on was
this very complicated health care product. The
continuing resolution runs through January. Are we
going to be right back here to these same kind of
shutdown talks at that point?
>> You know, so let me back up a little bit and make a
point on that, which is it's another reason many of
us were kind of perplexed by the idea that Chuck
Schumer and the Democrats in the Senate couldn't come
up with a handshake agreement behind closed
doors to just say, listen, we'll go out there, we'll
vote for this CR. We won't shut down the government
because guess what? We got to do it all again. And at
that point we were looking at November 21st. So there
was a backstop there. And here we go again. There's
another backstop. So I'm not sure why they thought
that that shutting down the government was a good idea.
And I think if, if they attempt that again, if they
go back there again in January, there would be
some huge political fallout for them. So I think I
think right now their best option is to try and sit
down and craft something with Senator Thune that can
make it out of the Senate, and then the speaker would
see if he could pull the votes together. I mean,
he's he's pulled a few rabbits out of his hat
along the way here. I'm not sure what that would look
like, and I can't even commit to supporting it,
but that might be the best option if if we find
ourselves back in the same position again.
>> We'll see what that looks like then.
Congressman Scott much.
>> Thank you so much. Good to be with you.
>> As the weather turns colder, we all push up the
thermostat to heat our homes, families who need
financial help to pay their utility bills may have to
wait because of the government shutdown,
despite it being over last year, nearly 190,000
Wisconsin households received nearly $137
million in assistance, an average of about $315 per
household. The Wisconsin Energy Assistance Program
receives both state and federal funding. Now, the
state funding is secure, but the federal funds
aren't expected to be released until December or
January. Here with more information on this, we are
joined by Assistant Deputy Secretary Diana moss from
the Wisconsin Department of Administration. And thanks
very much for being here. >> Yeah, thanks for having
me. ended the shutdown fully
fund the low income Home energy assistance program?
>> Not yet. It reopened the government, which is great.
And now, as we understand it, our LIHEAP folks in the
federal government can get to work in trying to
calculate what the allocations will be to each
state. And that's what we expect is still going to
take some time. >> And so how much delayed
is this from a usual year when states would get that
allocation. >> Yeah. At this point you
know I would say we're predicting a month or more
delayed from a typical year. It's typical that we don't
yet have our dollars at the beginning of the heating
season, but we would normally know our award
allocation and we don't yet know that. And so part of
that is because of the federal government shutdown.
But now that the government's open again, we
expect they're going to take a few weeks to work
that out. >> And how will it affect
the people who are trying to apply for that kind of
assistance? Will that also be delayed to them?
>> So they absolutely should apply now. They
should continue applying. Applications are open and
our providers are taking those applications and
available to assist in that way so they can find out if
they're eligible or ineligible. And that helps
us so that once we receive the dollars, we're able to
administer those benefits. But the good news is folks
should continue to apply throughout the season
because if they're eligible today, but a circumstance
changes, we will continue to recalculate that
eligibility throughout the season.
based on income I trust. >> That's right.
>> So does Governor Evers emergency order this week
relating to housing or an energy crisis relate to
this? supplemental support to
help those folks in need. We know that these
assistance programs support and serve the same
communities that lie. He continues to serve in the
state. >> So if President Trump, I
understand that President Trump laid off the entire
staff that administers this LIHEAP, this federal
assistance Program for energy, how do you suspect
that will affect payments to states?
>> Yeah, it may continue to factor into the delay. It's
you know, we can assume with less folks dedicated
to working in this space, it might take longer to do
the work. So that's again, I think another factor that
we anticipate will contribute to the delay.
>> So what happens. We're back to shutdown talk now.
But what happens when the federal funding continuing
resolution expires on January 30th? Should the
energy assistance funds already have been made
available? >> We anticipate. So, yeah,
if they were not you know, we're having a different
conversation. The good news is state law in Wisconsin
prohibits disconnection April 15th. So we know that
folks will be safe in terms of their heat. You know,
utility companies won't be turning off their heat, but
we will absolutely have to figure out the funding if
we got to a future date where those dollars weren't
yet administered. >> How do people apply?
>> Yeah, they need to go to energy benefit.gov. And
that will give them all the information about where to
find their local provider. And they have options to
apply by phone, in person, mail or right online.
>> So should people expect the same amount of
assistance this year as they got last year?
>> We don't yet know because we don't yet have
our dollar amount for program year 26. We
anticipate it will be very similar to last year, but
we don't know until we get the award.
>> And the way it works is that if you apply for
assistance, you are eligible and you are given
assistance you that goes directly to your utility or
to yourself? the utility provider on
their behalf. And then we also the same program
supports if their furnace goes out and it's a crisis
situation, we would then support repair or
replacement of that furnace. But typically the most part
of these benefits go directly to the utility
company. keep people warm. Diana
of Administration, thanks very much.
>> Thank you. >> With more than 45 data
centers in Wisconsin and more planned and announced
in what feels like every day, local communities
already grapple with zoning issues and public pushback.
But now comes a state legislative bill to
regulate the centers built by tech giants like
Microsoft and Meta to process artificial
intelligence data. Democratic state Senator
Jodi Habush Sinykin of Whitefish Bay is author of
the bill. And Senator, thanks very much for being
here. >> Thank you. I appreciate
the invitation. >> Why does Wisconsin need
a law regulating these data centers?
>> Wisconsin currently has no laws on the book books
that provide any regulatory oversight with regard to
transparency, accountability for water
usage, for energy rates, for those community impacts
that people are very concerned about. So this
legislation is intended to provide that overarching
regulatory framework to fill that current vacuum.
>> How much does the proliferation of these
centers feel like? The wild, wild West?
>> A lot, very much so. As I have been hearing from my
constituents and others around the state, there is
this recognition that in the absence of information
there. It creates worry and distrust and uncertainty
about the impacts, not just on themselves and their
families and communities, but for our futures.
>> How does your bill protect utility ratepayers
or consumers? >> It's a great question
because we really wanted to focus on that in terms of
the transparency and accountability. Again,
too high in Wisconsin, and with winter coming on, it's
very much front and center on people's minds,
especially in these uncertain economic times.
So what this bill does is it establishes a very large
customer class, which these big data and data centers
would fall into, and that class would be responsible
for the extremely high energy production needs
that they call upon, not individuals or families
separate from them. >> How does it track water
usage and to what end? >> That's also a question
that people have in a very legitimate concern. People
are very curious about how much water will be used,
particularly from the Great Lakes, is what I hear a lot
of. And again, this bill is very focused on
accountability and transparency, which is very
much part of Wisconsin's values. And rather than
allowing the water use to be hidden with some of
these non-disclosure and the like, it requires
the disclosure of how much water will be used and in
what fashion. >> In the face of a state
law addressing data centers, how important in your mind
is local control? >> Local control is where
it all begins. People don't always understand that. So
I'm really glad you asked about that. The idea of
where these data centers developments proceed happen
at the local level by local city officials and
governments. For the state legislators like myself, I
feel we need to show up at the table from the state
level to provide some kind of uniformity and a
regulatory framework, again, that helps hold these big
data centers and big tech accountable to Wisconsin.
>> What kind of bipartisan support do you have for
this regulatory bill? >> Well, we were just
introduced it last week, but I'm again, glad you
glad that you asked this, because I am very much
hoping for bipartisan support for this bill
myself. I'm a Democrat, but my Republican colleagues
are hearing from the same constituents with the same
concerns about property value impacts, water usage.
As we've already discussed, energy rates, climate
change concerns with regard for hopes for renewable
energy, all of that. But because the legislature is
very much still controlled by the Republican in both
the Senate, Republicans, in both the Senate and the
Assembly, we need them to lean into this, an interest
in providing a regulatory framework for our state,
because they decide where to what committee, and
whether or not there will be a hearing held. And I
really want to underscore because that's when the
public comes in and shares their thoughts, their
concerns, their asks. And that's how bills across the
board become better. That's the iterative process that
is so important here. But we need Republicans to
important next step. >> All right. Well, we
Habush Sinykin, thank you so much.
>> Thank you very much. >> In the Northwoods land
owned by the Franciscan Sisters of Perpetual
Adoration was given back to its original landowners,
"Here& Now". Reporter Erica Ayisi traveled to Arbor
Vitae, where the Lac du Flambeau Band of Lake
Superior Chippewa Indians reclaimed a part of their
indigenous lands from Catholic sisters who
operated an Indian boarding school.
>> Signed, sealed and delivered.
officially concludes the transfer of the property to
the Lac du Flambeau tribe. >> The Franciscan Sisters
of Perpetual Adoration are the first known Catholic
orders of sisters to transfer land to its
original Native American owners in an act of
reparations for colonization during the
federal Indian boarding school era.
>> We fspa have been exploring what it means to
unveil our white privilege, including the
responsibility that comes with the privilege.
>> Sue Ernster, president of the Fspa, says. His
sisters acknowledge their dark legacy of colonialism
through truth, healing and a land transfer of their
Marywood Franciscan Lac du Flambeau Band of
Lake Superior Chippewa Indians.
how we've been complicit and have benefited from the
systems that have kept others out, such as the Lac
du Flambeau. >> Lac du Flambeau children
attended the Saint Mary's Indian Boarding School in
Odanah, which the Fspa operated for 86 years,
during a period when the US government removed Native
American children from assimilated them into
Euro-American Catholic culture. Does giving land
back to Native Americans reconcile the past?
>> It's a step it does not fully reconcile. There's
nothing I believe that can fully reconcile for the
trauma that has been inflicted over these years.
>> Ernster says. When the sisters realized that they
no longer needed their center, they collaborated
with Brittany Koteles of Land Justice Futures to
learn how to incorporate land justice into their
reckoning. >> We knew that it was the
time to reignite the relationship with the Lac
du Flambeau and see if they would be interested in
purchasing the property. This is not a market rate
transaction, it's a land Bakke. The tribe is paying
$30,000 for the property. >> The Fspa purchased the
property for $30,000 in 1966. John Johnson,
president of the Lac du Flambeau, says his
counteroffer was a dollar. >> I had just asked him. I
said, how did you get our land? And I don't mean mine,
per se, or my tribe, but every Ojibwe person in the
state of Wisconsin. >> The Lac du Flambeau,
ceded or gave up their land to the federal government
in the 1854 Treaty of La Pointe. Johnson says the
tribe's business department felt $30,000 was fair
considering the property's current market value.
>> When I first heard, it was like $2.6 million, and
then I heard it was, you know, they had to offer a
$3 million. And, you know, the price could have kept
going up and up and up. >> Marywood is nearly two
acres, including an office, lodge and cabins situated
along Trout Lake. >> And as you look out onto
these islands out here, those were once inhabited
by all of our relatives here. And there are
families in Lac du Flambeau that were raised on the
islands. >> Giving this land back to
its original Native American owners presents
challenges. It's situated just outside the Lac du
Flambeau reservation, subjecting it to taxation.
>> There's also processes that tribes can place that
land into trust and protect it from taxation.
>> Philomena Kebec, tribal attorney and enrolled
member of the Bad River tribe, says the process can
be complex. >> The fee to trust
application can be opposed by municipalities.
>> We're looking at this for midterm potential
opportunities for work in the tribe.
>> For now, Larry Turner of the Lac du Flambeau
Business Development not expecting to make a
profit from the land transfer and will use the
property for professional housing.
>> We have such a huge shortage of professionals
in the tribe, including traveling nurses, doctors
for the clinic, management for the Business
Development Corp, and there's no rentals up here.
>> Xia Johnson says he also wants to use their
reclaimed land to sustain their Ojibwe culture to
future generations. >> Hold on a lake here in
the wintertime, we're going to probably set up a tent
or something, you know, and do some spearing here in
the winter for muskellunge and stuff like that.
>> The PFAS former Indian boarding school was
demolished and is now Saint Mary's Parish on the bad
River Tribal Reservation. In documents acquired by
the Catholic Church, was given at least 10,000 acres
of land by the federal government to operate
Indian boarding schools across the country,
including three schools in Wisconsin. Although the
Catholic Diocese of Superior says all of its
land is currently in use and unavailable for land
transfers to tribes, the Fspa says their land
transfer is about reckoning. >> What is it? We can learn
from this so that we can move forward.
>> And reclamation for the tribe.
>> All this land that you see around here should be
rightfully ours anyway. >> In Arbor Vitae I'm Eric
Ayisi for "Here& Now" and ICT.
>> For more on this and other issues facing
Wisconsin, visit our website at PBS Wisconsin.
Org and then click on the news tab. That's our
program for tonight I'm Frederica Freyberg. Have a
good weekend. >> Funding for "Here& Now"
is provided by the Focus Fund for Journalism and
Friends of PBS Wisconsin.