>> SHUT IT DOWN. THAT'S WHAT THE VILLAGE OF
ALLOUEZ IS SAYING ABOUT THE MAXIMUM SECURITY GREEN BAY GREEY
CORRECTIONAL INSTITUTION. THE MORE THAN 100-YEAR OLD
PRISON IS MORE THAN 200 INMATES OVER CAPACITY AND HAD BEEN ON
EXTENDED LOCKDOWN DUE TO STAFF SHORTAGES.
THE CRUMBLING CONDITION OF THE FACILITY IS DESCRIBED AS
DEPLORABLE. SAYS THE TIME IS NOW WITH THE
SEARCH ON FOR A NEW CORRECTIONS SECRETARY, TO DEAL WITH THE
CLOSURE. HE SAYS, QUOTE, ANYTHING SHORT
OF THAT STEP WOULD BE NOTHING MORE THAN REARRANGING THE DECK
CHAIRS ON THE TITANIC. HE JOINS US NOW.
THANKS VERY MUCH FOR BEING HERE. >> THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME,
FREDERICA. ALTOGETHER RATHER THAN FIX IT?
>> GREAT QUESTION. FIRST OF ALL, IT'S 125 YEARS OLD
AND IN -- THERE HAVE BEEN TWO STUDIES IN THE CORRECTIONS
SYSTEM, SPECIFICALLY GBCI. IN 2009, A STUDY WENT THROUGH
THE FACILITY AND RECOMMENDED ITS CLOSURE BECAUSE IT NEEDED
HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS OF DOLLARS IN UPGRADES JUST TO GET UP TO
CODE. IT'S SURELY NOT DESIGNED BY
TODAY'S STANDARDS FOR PRISON TO HELP WITH REFORM AND TO PROVIDE
THE SERVICES AND PROGRAMS NEEDED TO HELP THESE FOLKS GET BACK
ONTO THE STREET. IN 2018, THE STATE COMMISSIONED
ANOTHER STUDY AND THAT WAS BY BWBR.
IT SAID THE EXACT SAME THING EXCEPT THERE WAS A LOT MORE
MONEY NEEDED BECAUSE OF THE DOLLARS.
>> SO DESCRIBE WHAT YOU KNOW CONDITIONS TO BE LIKE INSIDE
BECAUSE OF THE NATURE OF THIS PRISON IT AND ITS AGE.
>> WELL, ACCORDING TO THE DESIG, TODAY, YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO HAVE
SUNLIGHT. YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO BE ABLE TO
LIVE IN PODS WHERE THE -- THOSE WHO ARE INCARCERATED CAN GET TO
THE OUTSIDE TO GET TO SCHOOL, GET TO THE LIBRARY, AND LIVE
MORE IN A COMMUNAL ENVIRONMENT VERSUS A CELL.
THE CELLS, THE PRISON WAS DESIGNED FOR APPROXIMATELY 750
INMATES AND TODAY IT HOUSES ALMOST A THOUSAND.
THEY ARE IN CELLS THAT WERE DESIGNED FOR ONE PERSON BUT NOW
THERE ARE TWO PEOPLE IN THEM, AND THE CELLS, YOU CAN REACH
ACROSS AND LAY DOWN AND TOUCH ALL THE WALLS.
SO IT'S NOT DESIGNED FOR THE PEOPLE THAT ARE THERE.
IT IS DARK AND DINGY. IT HAS MICE INFESTATIONS, WHICH
THE STATE HAS BEEN DEALING WITH FOR OVER A YEAR.
THE ATTITUDE OR THE ANXIETY LEVEL WITHIN THE FACILITY DUE TO
BEING ON LOCKDOWN, AS YOU MENTIONED, SINCE JUNE OF 2023,
IT'S CREATING AN AWFUL LOT OF ANXIETY AND A LOT OF I'LL SAY
VIOLENCE. IN 2023, THE NUMBER OF
INVESTIGATIONS FOR VIOLENT OFFENSES THAT TAKE PLACE IN GBCI
EQUAL THAT -- ALMOST EQUAL THAT OF 2021 AND 2022 COMBINED AND
THEY'RE ON LOCKDOWN FOR HALF THE YEAR.
>> SO -- >> SO -- SORRY.
>> HAVDO YOU BELIEVE CALLS FOR CLOSURE HAVE FALLEN ON DEAF
EARS? >> NO.
WE HAVE GAINED BIPARTISAN SUPPORT FROM STATE LEGISLATORS,
COUNTY-ELECED LEADERS, LOCAL MUNICIPALITY LEADERS ACROSS
NORTHEAST WISCONSIN. I'VE NEVER HEARD ANYONE SAY NO,
THEY DON'T WANT TO CLOSE IT. THE CHALLENGES AGREEING ON WHAT
TO DO AFTER THEY CLOSE IT. >> RIGHT, BECAUSE WHERE WOULD
THOSE INMATES GO FROM GREEN BAY, OTHER MAX SECURITY PRISONS
THEMSELVES ARE OVER CAPACITY AND HAVE THEIR OWN SAFETY ISSUES.
>> RIGHT. THE OPTIONS THAT I'VE HEARD, I
KNOW THE GOVERNOR WANTS TO REDUCE THE PRISON POPULATION AND
HOPEFULLY MOVE PEOPLE OUT OF PLACES LIKE GBCI AND INTO OTHER
FACILITIES. THAT MAY BE AN OPPORTUNITY.
THERE ARE THOSE WHO ARE CALLING TO HAVE A NEW PRISON, A
REPLACEMENT PRISON MOST LIKELY FOR GBCI TO BE ABLE TO PROVIDE
SO THAT THEY CAN PROVIDE THE SERVICES AND PROGRAMS NEEDED BY
THOSE WHO ARE INCARCERATED. I'VE BEEN INSIDE FOUR TIMES OVER
THE LAST EIGHT YEARS. I'VE BEEN IN WITHOUT THE
GOVERNOR AND I'VE TOURED IT WITH THE GOVERNOR AND SECRETARY CARR
AND WHEN I GO IN THERE, YOU REALLY DON'T SEE A LOT OF
PROGRAMS GOING ON BECAUSE THEY JUST DON'T DO THE PROGRAMMING
VERY MUCH ANYMORE. PEOPLE CAN'T GET EDUCATION, THEY
CAN'T GET HEALTH SERVICES, BUT WHEN THE GOVERNOR COMES IN,
PEOPLE ARE LINED UP IN THE CORRIDORS WELCOMING HIM AND
SHAKING HIS HAND, AND WHEN I TOURED IT WITH HIM, HE ASKED
WHERE IN THE PSYCH WARD AREA AND HE ASKED HOW MANY PEOPLE NEED
PSYCHOLOGICAL SERVICES AND THE ANSWER WAS ABOUT 60%, SO THAT'S
ABOUT 600 PEOPLE, AND HE SAID HOW MANY BEDS DO WE HAVE, AND
THEY SAID 13. HE SAID WHAT DO WE DO FOR THE
OTHERS? THEY SLUGGED THEIR SHOULDERS.
THEY DO WHAT THEY CAN, BUT BASICALLY THE METAL NEEDS ACROSS
OUR CORRECTIONS SYSTEM, I'VE LEARNED A LOT OVER THE LAST
EIGHT YEARS ABOUT THIS, IT'S TREMENDOUS.
POPULATIONS: THOSE WHO ARE MENTALLY ILL AND NEED HELP,
THOSE WHO HAVE MADE TERRIBLE MISTAKES IN LIFE AND WILL NOT
REFORM, AND THEN YOU HAVE A GROUP OF THOSE WHO HAVE MADE
TERRIBLE MISTAKES BUT ARE WILLING, ABLE AND INTERESTED IN
LEARNING HOW TO COME BACK INTO SOCIETY SAFELY, AND WE NEED TO
HAVE THE PROGRAMS IN OUR STATE TO BE ABLE TO DO THAT.
WE DON'T TODAY. >> JIM RAFTER FROM ALLOUEZ,