MATTER, WHETHER IT'S
MANUFACTURING HERE AT HOME OR
OVERSEAS.
>> JUST AS THE SCHOOL YEAR IS
ABOUT TO BEGIN, NEW RESEARCH
SHOWS A RECORD NUMBER OF TEACHER
TURNOVERS LAST YEAR IN
WISCONSIN.
THAT'S LEAVING THEIR DISTRICTS
OR THEIR TEACHING PROFESSIONAL
TOGETHER.
WHAT'S GOING ON WITH THESE
TRENDS?
THE WISCONSIN POLICY FORUM JUST
RELEASED A REPORT ON TURNOVER
RATES FOR TEACHERS, SPANNING
FROM 2009 TO 2023, DESCRIBING
LAST YEAR AS A SURGE.
THE TURNOVER RATE WAS NEARLY 16%
WITH MORE THAN 9,700 TURNOVERS
LAST YEAR, UP FROM ABOUT 11 1/2%
WITH MORE THAN 97,000 TURNOVERS
OVER THE LAST 15 YEARS.
WE TURN TO THE FOLLOWS FORUM
SENIOR EDUCATION RESEARCHER,
SARA SHAW, FOR MORE ON THIS.
THANK YOU FOR BEING WITH US.
>> MY PLEASURE, FREDERICA.
>> DID THESE NUMBERS SURPRISE
YOU AT THE END OF THIS RESEARCH?
>> THE PANDEMIC NUMBERS AS A
WHOLE, STARTING WITH 2021, WAS
THAT FIRST FULL YEAR OF THE
PANDEMIC, WERE A LITTLE BIT OF A
MYSTERY BOX.
WE HAD BEEN HEARING CONCERNS OF
TURNOVER FOR YEARS.
IT'S PART OF WHY WE WANTED TO
LOOK INTO THE ISSUE.
AND IN 2021, INSTEAD OF SEEING A
SURGE, WE ACTUALLY SEE A DIP TO
BELOW AVERAGE TURNOVER, AND IN
HINDSIGHT IS ALWAYSHINDSIGHINDSF
COVID WERE STAYING PUT EITHER
BECAUSE OF THE ECONOMIC SECURITY
AND/OR WANTING TO BE THERE FOR
THEIR KIDS, AND THEN 2022, IT
STARTS CREEPING UP, AND BY THE
TIME WE HIT 2023, IT'S THE
HIGHEST RATE OF TURNOVER THAT WE
SAW IN THE YEAR STUDIED.
THAT INCLUDED THE HIGHEST RATE
OF MOVES, SO TEACHERS MOVING
FROM ONE DISTRICT TO TEACH IN
ANOTHER DISTRICT AND LEAVES,
WHICH ARE TEACHERS WHO ARE
LEAVING THE PUBLIC SCHOOL
CLASSROOM IN WISCONSIN
ALTOGETHER FOR WHATEVER REASON.
>> WHAT DID YOU FIND OUT ABOUT
WHY THIS IS HAPPENING?
>> THOSE LEAVES IN PARTICULAR
AND THE MOVES SEEM TO BE TIED
NOT ONLY TO SOME OF THE THINGS
THAT PEOPLE THINK ABOUT SPECIFIC
EDUCATION, WHICH IS TO SAY THE
STRAIN OF THE PANDEMIC, THE
INCREASE POLITICIZATION AND
OTHER EXTERNAL FACTORS REALLY
PUTTING PRESSURE ON THE SYSTEM,
BUT ALSO THE BROADER ECONOMY.
SO IN THE SAME WAY THAT IN 2010
AND 2011 WHERE WE HAD THE GREAT
RECESSION BECAUSE TEACHERS WERE
STAYING PUT BECAUSE TEACHING IS
A STEADY PAYCHECK, THE REACTION
TO THE ECONOMY IN THE LAST YEAR
WHERE IT'S VERY LOW UNEMPLOYMENT
RATES, A VERY TIGHT LABOR MARKET
AND HIGH INFLATION SEEMS TO HAVE
GIVEN TEACHERS MORE MOBILITY,
AGAIN, NOT JUST TO LEAVE THE
PROFESSION, BUT ALSO BETWEEN
DISTRICTS.
>> WHERE IS THE TURNOVER MOST
ACUTE IN WISCONSIN?
>> SO IT IS GENERALLY WIDESPREAD
ISSUE.
WE DIDN'T HAVE A SINGLE DISTRICT
TYPE THAT WE LOOKED AT THAT WAS
UNDER A 10% TURNOVER RATE ON
AVERAGE, BUT IT IS BEING FELT
MOST IN OUR DISTRICTS THAT CAN
LEAST AFFORD TO BE ABLE TO HAVE
SUCH TURNOVER.
SO SPECIFICALLY OUR SMALLEST
RURAL DISTRICTS WERE REALLY HIT
HARD.
THAT'S LOOKING OVER THE
FULL-TIME PERIOD THAT WE
STUDIED.
IN ADDITION, OUR DISTRICTS THAT
ARE SERVING MAJORITY OF LOW
INCOME STUDENTS AND THE MAJORITY
OF STUDENTS -- A MAJORITY OF
STUDENTS OF COLOR WERE ALSO
SEEING HIGHER THAN AVERAGE RATES
OF TURNOVER, AND THAT'S
PARTICULARLY CONCERNING DURING
THE COVID YEARS WHEN, OF COURSE,
THE PANDEMIC CREATED SO MUCH
INSTABILITY.
A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF TEACHER
TURNOVER IS NOT A BAD THING.
IT MIGHT BE JUST THE WAY THAT
PEOPLE MOVE BETWEEN JOBS TRYING
TO FIND A GOOD FIT, BUT ELEVATED
LEVELS IS WHEN WE START TO
WORRY.
>> SO WHERE DO ELEVATED LEVELS
OF TURNOVER LEAVE THE CHILDREN
THAT THESE TEACHERS ARE
TEACHING?
>> IT LEAVES CHILDREN WITHOUT
CONSISTENCY.
SO THAT MEANS BOTH WITHOUT
CONSISTENCY OF RELATIONSHIPS, OF
BEING ABLE TO KNOW THERE'S AN
ADULT IN THE CLASSROOM FOR THEM,
BUT ALSO CONSISTENCY IN THE
SCHOOL CULTURE.
IT CAN BE VERY HARD IN A SCHOOL
THAT IS FACING A LOT OF TURNOVER
OF TEACHERS TO MAINTAIN AN
IDENTITY OR TO MAINTAIN ANY KIND
OF CHANGE IN IMPROVEMENT
PROCESSES THAT A LEADER OR A
DISTRICT MIGHT BE TRYING TO
UNDERTAKE SO IT CAN BE DONE, AND
CERTAINLY IN CASES WHERE PERHAPS
THERE'S A LESS EFFECTIVE TEACHER
BEING REPLACED BY A MORE
EFFECTIVE TEACHER, MAYBE THAT'S
A GOOD THING, BUT THAT'S OFTEN
NOT THE WAY THE MOVEMENT GOES
AND TYPICALLY THE STUDENTS PAY
THE PRICE.
>> SO BLACK TEACHERS IN YOUR
RESEARCH HAD SIGNIFICANTLY
HIGHER TURNOVER RATES THAN WHITE
TEACHERS.
WHAT EXPLAINS THAT?
>> SOME OF IT IS EXPLAINED
CIRCUMSTANCE SUBSTANTIALLY IN
THAT THESE TEACHERS WHO ARE
BLACK ARE ALSO CONCENTRATED IN
DISTRICTS THAT SAW OVERALL
TURNOVER RATES THAT WERE HIGHER
FOR ALL RACES AND ETHNICITIES OF
TEACHERS, SO IT MAY BE THAT IT'S
THESE DISTRICTS THAT AS A WHOLE
ARE EXPERIENCING HIGHER THAN
AVERAGE TURNOVER.
IT COULD ALSO BE SOMETHING
UNIQUE TO THE EXPERIENCE OF THE
TEACHERS, AND THE FORUM HAS IN
THE PAST RECORDED ON TEACHER
DIVERSITY AND THE BARRIERS THAT
TEACHERS OF COLOR FACE IN
GETTING TO THE CLASSROOM IN THE
FIRST PLACE AND THEN REMAINING
THERE FEELING LIKE THEY ARE
VALUED AS PART OF A SCHOOL.
>> WITH REALLY JUST ABOUT A
MINUTE LEFT, WHAT ARE THE POLICY
PRESCRIPTIONS FOR RETAINING
TEACHERS?
>> WELL, THE FIRST IS TO THINK
ABOUT IT AS RETENTION.
OFTENTIMES WHEN WE THINK ABOUT
THE PAY PLAN FOR TEACHERS,
THERE'S A LOT OF FOCUS ON
RECRUITMENT AND GETTING NEW
TEACHERS INTO THE CLASSROOM.
THIS REPORT SHOWS US THAT WE
NEED TO BE THINKING ABOUT
RETENTION JUST AS MUCH AS WE'RE
BRINGING NEW TEACHERS IN AND NOT
KEEPING THEM IN THE CLASSROOM,
THE PROBLEM CONTINUES.
THERE ARE TAILORED SOLUTIONS
THAT CAN HELP RETAIN TEACHERS,
WHETHER IT'S FIGURING OUT
HARD-TO-STAFF AREAS,
HARD-TO-STAFF SUBJECT AREAS AND
SCHOOLS AND ATTACHING WHETHER
IT'S SUPPORTS OR FINANCIAL
INCENTIVES TO REALLY HELP TARGET
WHERE THE NEEDS ARE TO RETAIN
TEACHERS THERE.
>> ALL RIGHT.
SARA SHAW FROM THE WISCONSIN
POLICY FORUM, THANKS VERY MUCH.