DeMURI.
THANKS VERY MUCH.
>> MY PLEASURE.
THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.
>> IN NOVEMBER, WE REPORTED ON
AN INVESTIGATION INTO CHILD
LABOR VIOLATIONS BY
WISCONSIN-BASED COMPANY, PACKERS
SANITATION SERVICES.
IN FEBRUARY, THE U.S. DEPARTMENT
OF LABOR REPORTED MORE THAN 100
CHILDREN WERE WORKING ILLEGALLY
FOR THE COMPANY ACROSS EIGHT
STATES.
THE MINORS WERE WORKING
OVERNIGHT SHIFTS AS WELL AS
WORKING WITH HAZARDOUS CHEMICALS
AND DANGEROUS MEAT PROCESSING
EQUIPMENT.
THE 1.5 MILLION DOLLARS IN
PENALTIES TO BE PAID BY THE
COMPANY MAKES IT ONE OF THE
LARGEST CHILD LABOR CASES IN THE
DEPARTMENT'S HISTORY.
CHILD LABOR HAS INCREASED BY
NEARLY 70% SINCE 2018, LEADING
TO A CALL FOR INCREASED
PENALTIES AND OTHER MEASURES TO
CURB ILLEGAL CHILD LABOR.
WE GO NOW TO MICHAEL LAZZERI,
THE REGIONAL ADMINISTRATOR OF
THE WAGE AND HOUR DIVISION AT
THE U.S. DEPARTMENT OF LABOR.
THANK YOU FOR BEING WITH US.
>> THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.
>> SO ACCORDING TO DATA FROM
YOUR AGENCY, WISCONSIN HAS THE
SECOND MOST CHILD LABOR
VIOLATIONS OF OUR SURROUNDING
STATES, AVERAGING ABOUT 99 PER
YEAR SINCE 2018.
ONLY MICHIGAN WAS HIGHER.
WHY HAS CHILD LABOR EXPLODED ON
THE NATIONAL LEVEL?
>> OUR FOCUS IS ALWAYS TO
IDENTIFY INSTANCES WHERE
EMPLOYERS ARE EXPLOITING
VULNERABLE WORKERS.
KIDS ARE VULNERABLE UNDER ANY
CIRCUMSTANCE.
THEY'RE FRIGHTENED TO COMPLAIN,
THEY'RE AFRAID OF LETTING THEIR
FAMILIES AND THEIR COMMUNITIES
DOWN AND, HONESTLY, THEY THEY
THEY'RE GOING TO BE IN TROUBLE,
AND THAT VULNERABILITY
TRANSLATES TO THEM BEING MORE
PRONE TO INJURIES IN THE
WORKPLACE, AND IN SETTINGS THAT
ARE ESPECIALLY DANGEROUS, LIKE A
MANUFACTURING FACILITY OR A MEAT
PROCESSING PLANT.
THOSE VULNERABILITIES ARE EVEN
FURTHER AMPLIFIED.
>> BUT WE DO KNOW THAT THE
NUMBER OF UNACCOMPANIED MINORS
ENTERING THE UNITED STATES
CLIMBED TO A HIGH OF 130,000
LAST YEAR, THREE TIMES WHAT IT
WAS FIVE YEARS EARLIER.
IS THAT A DEM GRAPHIC OF
CHILDREN THAT IS BEING EXPLOITED
AND THE RESULT OF THESE CHILD
LABOR LAW VIOLATIONS, MIGRANTS
COMING IN?
>> WELL, ONE THING I CAN SAY IS
THAT EXPLOITATION IS
EXPLOITATION, REGARDLESS OF WHO
THE CHILD IS AND WHAT THEIR
BACKGROUND IS, AND WHEN WE ARE
LOOKING AT INVESTIGATIONS, OUR
PRIMARY PURPOSE IS TO LOOK AT
WHO THE EMPLOYER IS AND WHO THE
EMPLOYEE IS, SO WE LOOK AT IT
NOT WITH A BLIND EYE, BUT NEW
NEUTRALLY.
WE DON'T ASK QUESTIONS ABOUT
STATUS OR BACKGROUND.
WE DO DETERMINE WHETHER OR NOT
THE CHILD IS IN A SAFE
ENVIRONMENT AND WE ARE TRAINED
TO IDENTIFY INSTANCES OF
TRAFFICLING, IF THAT'S
APPROPRIATE.
HOWEVER, IT'S NOT OUR PRIMARY
PURPOSE.
WE INVESTIGATE THE CHILD LABOR
STANDARDS WITH THE FAIR LABOR
STANDARDS ACT AND THAT ACT
DEFINES THE EMPLOYEE AND THE
EMPLOYER WITHOUT REGARD TO
STATUS OR BACKGROUND.
>> IN YOUR MIND, COULD THE
NUMBER OF VIOLATIONS ACTUALLY BE
UNDERCOUNTED?
>> I HAVE NO DOUBT.
ACROSS 10 STATES IN THE MIDWEST,
WE HAVE LESS THAN 150
INVESTIGATORS THAT ARE COVERING
HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF
EMPLOYERS OVER HUNDREDS OF
THOUSANDS OF MILES AND WE DO
EVERYTHING THAT WE CAN TO TARGET
INDUSTRIES THAT ARE MOST LIKELY
TO EMPLOY MINORS AND WE DO A
SUBSTANTIAL AMOUNT OF OUTREACH
TO COMMUNITIES, TO EMPLOYERS, TO
SCHOOLS, AND WE RECEIVE A LOT OF
INFORMATION FROM THE PUBLIC AND
FROM THE COMMUNITY AND WE HAVE
AN OBLIGATION TO ACT ON THAT
INFORMATION VERY QUICKLY, BUT
WHEN YOU'RE DEALING WITH
INDUSTRIES THAT ARE BEHIND WALLS
AND FENCES, THE PUBLIC CAN'T SEE
THEM, AND THEY CAN'T SEE WHAT'S
HAPPENING INSIDE THOSE FOUR
WALLS.
AND SO IT REQUIRES A LOT MORE
WORK FOR US AND, YOU KNOW, WE
RELY ON THE PUBLIC AND WE RELY
ON EMPLOYERS AND WE DO OUR BEST
TO TARGET INVESTIGATIONS AS WELL
INTO CERTAIN INDUSTRIES WHERE WE
THINK THERE ARE GOING TO BE
KIDS, BUT WITH LESS THAN 150
INVESTIGATORS, THERE'S ONLY SO
MUCH GROUND WE CAN COVER.
>> GIVEN THE INDUSTRIAL MIX, HOW
FERTILE IS A STATE LIKE
WISCONSIN FOR CHILD LABOR
VIOLATIONS?
>> WELL, I THINK ACROSS THE
MIDWEST, THE SITUATION IS
ESPECIALLY DIRE WHEN YOU'RE
TALKING ABOUT MANUFACTURING,
WHEN YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT THE
TYPES OF INDUSTRIES.
MEAT PROCESSING, WHERE WE WERE
JUST DOING INVESTIGATION OF
P.S.S.I., YOU KNOW, WE LOOKED
ACROSS MULTIPLE STATES, NOT JUST
ACROSS THE MIDWEST, BUT ACROSS
THE ENTIRE COUNTRY, BUT THE
GREATER CONCENTRATION OF PLANTS
THAT WE SAW WAS DEFINITELY HERE.
>> WHAT KINDS OF JOBS ARE MINORS
WORKING AND WHAT KIND OF HOURS?
>> GENERALLY, I THINK IT'S
IMPORTANT TO MAKE A DISTINCTION
BETWEEN CHILD LABOR, WHICH WE
TYPICALLY SEE, WHICH IS IN, FOR
EXAMPLE, IN FAST FOOD, WHERE
YOUR ISSUES WITH MINORS WOULD BE
KIND OF CONFINED TO HOURS
WORKED, USE OF EQUIPMENT, SO IF
THEY'RE WORKING PAST 9:00 DURING
A SCHOOL NIGHT OR DURING THE
WEEK OR THEY'RE WORKING TOO MANY
HOURS, THAT'S ONE TYPE OF
VIOLATION.
WHEN YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT
MANUFACTURING AND SOME OF THESE
OTHER INDUSTRIES, NOW YOU'RE
TALKING ABOUT THE TYPES OF
EQUIPMENT THAT MINORS ARE USING,
AND SO FOR EVEN 16,
17-YEAR-OLDS, THEY'RE PROHIBITED
FROM USING OR CLEANING THINGS
LIKE A HEAD SPLITTER, BONE SAWS,
EQUIPMENT THAT COULD CAUSE
SERIOUS INJURY, THEY CAN'T
USE -- THEY CAN'T BE DOING
CONSTRUCTION.
ROOFING.
THOSE KINDS OF THINGS.
SO I THINK IT JUST DEPENDS ON
WHICH TYPE OF CHILD LABOR WE'RE
TALKING ABOUT, THE TYPE THAT WE
TYPICALLY SEE OR THE MORE
RECENTLY, WHICH IS CONFINED TO
VERY DANGEROUS TYPES OF WORK.
>> WHAT DO YOU TO COMPANIES
EMPLOYING CHILDREN IN VIOLATION
OF THE LAW?
>> WELL, IT'S THEIR
RESPONSIBILITY AS AN EMPLOYER
WHEN THEY'RE HIRING OR EVEN
BRINGING IN STAFFING AGENCIES,
SO PUT WORKERS IN THEIR
FACTORIES OR IN THEIR
FACILITIES, IT'S REALLY UP TO
THEM TO BE ABLE TO IDENTIFY.
I MEAN, WE LOOKED AT P.S.S.I.
AND WE LOOKED AT THE TYPES OF
MINORS OR THE NUMBER OF MINORS
THAT WERE BEING EMPLOYED ACROSS
THE COUNTRY AND YOU SEE PICTURES
OF THESE KIDS AND THERE IS NO
WAY A REASONABLE PERSON WOULD
LOOK AT THESE KIDS AND SAY THAT
THAT IS A 30-YEAR OLD OR
SOMEBODY WHO IS OVER 18, EVEN IN
THEIR 20s.
SO EMPLOYERS HAVE TO NOT RELY
ON, YOU KNOW -- THEY HAVE TO BE
ABLE TO SEE WHAT THESE AND BE
ABLE TO TAKE ACTION TO BE ABLE
TO MAKE SURE THAT THESE MINORS
ARE NOT BEING EMPLOYED IN
DANGEROUS WORK.
>> ALL RIGHT.
MICHAEL LAZZERI FROM THE U.S.
DEPARTMENT OF LABOR, THANK YOU