THANKS VERY MUCH.
>> THANK YOU.
>> VOTING RULES AND GUIDANCE ARE
STILL CHANGING EVEN THIS CLOSE
TO THE NOVEMBER ELECTION.
THE LATEST CHANGE SAW A COURT
AND THEN THE WISCONSIN ELECTIONS
COMMISSION THIS WEEK DUMP
GUIDANCE TO CLERKS THAT THEY
COULD FIX THE PART OF ABSENTEE
BALLOT ENVELOPES HOLDING THE
WITNESS SIGNATURES, CURING SUCH
THINGS AS A ZIP CODE OR SPELLING
OF A STREET NAME.
IS THAT A BIG DEAL?
WE ASKED DANE COUNTY CLERK SCOTT
MACDONALD.
THANKS VERY MUCH FOR BEING HERE.
>> THANKS FOR HAVING ME.
>> SO IS IT A BIG DEAL?
WHAT'S YOUR REACTION TO DUMPING
THE GUIDANCE THAT CLERKS CAN
CURE ABSENTEE BALLOTS IN THIS
WAY?
>> WELL, FOR THE MOST PART, IT
JUST MEANS MORE WORK FOR THE
CLERKS.
I THINK WE SAW THAT IN THE
AUGUST ELECTION.
CLERKS ARE SPENDING A LOT OF
TIME TRYING TO MAKE SURE THAT
ENVELOPES THAT WEREN'T COMPLETE
WERE GETTING BACK TO THE VOTERS
SO THEY COULD COMPLETE IT AND
GET IT BACK AGAIN.
YOU KNOW, THEY DID THAT WORK.
THERE WAS ONLY A HANDFUL OF
BALLOTS THAT I SAW THAT HAD BEEN
CURED AND SO THEN WHEN WE -- YOU
KNOW, 25 OF THEM, I THINK, OUT
OF 130,000 IN AUGUST IN DANE
COUNTY.
BUT THAT WAS BECAUSE CLERKS WERE
WORKING HARD TO MAKE SURE THAT
THEY HAD GOTTEN CURED AND YOU'RE
GOING TO SEE EVEN MORE OF THAT
IN NOVEMBER, JUST BECAUSE NUMBER
OF VOTERS GOES UP.
>> IN YOUR MIND, DID THAT KIND
OF CURING RESULT IN FRAUD?
>> NO, ALL OF THOSE -- THE
CURING WAS DONE BY CLERKS AFTER
THEY COULD VERIFY WHO THAT
PERSON WAS.
THEY LOOKED THEM UP IN THE
SYSTEM, THEY COULD VERIFY THE
ADDRESS, THE PERSON.
SO YOU KNOW, AND ALL OF THAT
COULD HAVE BEEN TRACED BACK TO
SHOW WHO IT WAS, AND THE PURPOSE
OF THAT ADDRESS, FOR EXAMPLE,
FOR THE WITNESS IS SO THAT LAW
ENFORCEMENT CAN INTERVIEW THEM
AND SAY, IS THIS THE PERSON WHO
VOTED?
DID YOU SEE THEM VOTE?
IS THERE FRAUD?
SO FROM OUR POINT OF VIEW, IF
YOU CAN SHOW LAW ENFORCEMENT WHO
THIS PERSON IS AND WHERE TO FIND
THEM, THAT'S JUST THE OPPOSITE,
IT PREVENTS FRAUD.
>> DO YOU THINK THAT THE NEW
RULES WILL DISCOURAGE PEOPLE
FROM VOTING ABSENTEE OR RESULT
IN NUMBERS OF BALLOTS BEING
THROWN OUT, OR WHAT DO YOU
THINK?
>> YOU KNOW, I JUST THINK IT'S
REALLY ON THE MARGIN, AND I
WOULD SAY IT'S EVENLY
DISTRIBUTED AROUND THE STATE.
I MEAN, GENERALLY THESE MISTAKES
THAT WE SEE OFTEN ARE AN OLDER
COUPLE LIVING AT HOME, THEY
WITNESS EACH OTHER'S BALLOT, AND
THAT HAPPENS EVERYWHERE KIND OF
EVENLY.
SO I DON'T THINK IT AFFECTS THE
ELECTION, AND I DON'T THINK
THERE'S A LOT OF IT, BUT IT'S
JUST FRUSTRATING FROM A CLERK'S
POINT OF VIEW, BECAUSE WE CAN
SEE WHO THESE PEOPLE ARE, AND TO
DISENFRANCHISE THEM JUST SEEMS
WRONG.
>> WHAT IS IT LIKE THIS YEAR,
TRYING TO READY FOR A MAJOR
ELECTION?
>> WELL, IN SOME WAYS, IT'S THE
SAME OLD SAME OLD.
I MEAN, WE DO THIS ALL THE TIME.
BUT I THINK THE BIGGER
DIFFERENCE IS, YOU KNOW, WE'VE
SEEN JUST OUR WORKLOAD REALLY GO
UP.
A LOT OF OPEN RECORDS REQUESTS
COMING IN.
I CAN'T TELL YOU HOW MANY I'VE
GOTTEN.
AND IT'S TRUE ALL OVER THE STATE
AND ALL OVER THE COUNTRY,
HONESTLY.
ALSO JUST TRYING TO PLAN
CONTINGENCY WISE FOR THINGS YOU
HAVEN'T HAD TO WORRY ABOUT
BEFORE, DISRUPTIONS IN THE
POLLING PLACES, HOW ARE YOU
GOING TO MAKE SURE LAW
ENFORCEMENT AND THE CLERK'S
OFFICE ARE ON THE SAME PAGE ON
HOW THEY'RE GOING TO RESPOND TO
THOSE THINGS?
JUST A LOT MORE WORKLOAD THAN
NORMAL.
>> SO IN TERMS OF THOSE OPEN
RECORDS REQUESTS, ARE THESE FROM
PEOPLE WANTING TO SLEUTH OUT
FRAUD?
>> WELL, THERE'S A LOT OF
DIFFERENT OPEN RECORDS REQUESTS.
THE ONES THAT I'VE GOTTEN
RECENTLY SEEM -- THE GOAL SEEMS
TO BE TO PREVENT THE DESTRUCTION
OF MATERIALS FROM THE 2020
LUCKTION.
LUCK 2020
ELECTION.
SO RIGHT NOW, AFTER 22 MONTHS,
IS WHEN WE WOULD DESTROY THINGS
LIKE THE BALLOTS TO MAKE ROOM
FOR THE ONES COMING IN NOVEMBER,
THE ENVELOPES, YOU KNOW, POLL
BOOKS, THINGS LIKE THAT.
SO THEY TEND TO BE A COPY AND
PASTE THAT HAVE GONE ALL OVER
THE PLACE SAYING, YOU KNOW, YOU
MUST RETAIN THESE RECORDS, THERE
MAY BE A LAWSUIT, OR THIS IS AN
OPEN RECORDS REQUEST, BUT THEN
WHEN YOU FOLLOW UP WITH THEM,
IT'S A LITTLE HARDER TO NAIL
THEM DOWN ON WHAT THEY WANT.
THEY SEEM TO BE JUST TRYING TO
DELAY THE NORMAL CYCLE FOR US,
AND OF COURSE THAT CREATES ITS
OWN CHALLENGES FOR CLERKS AROUND
THE STATE.
>> YOU SPOKE TO CONTINGENCY
PLANS AT POLLING PLACES THIS
YEAR, LIKE WHAT?
>> WELL, WE SAW IN MICHIGAN, YOU
KNOW, THERE WAS TRAININGS GOING
ON IN SOME COUNTIES WHERE THEY
WERE URGING POLL WATCHERS TO
BRING CAMERAS IN AND
SURREPTITIOUSLY DO THINGS
AGAINST THE LAW.
YOU REALLY CAN'T RECORD PEOPLE
VOTING IN A POLLING PLACE, FOR
OBVIOUS REASONS.
AND FOR SOME NOT SO OBVIOUS
REASONS.
THERE ARE PEOPLE VOTING THERE
WHO ARE CONFIDENTIAL VOTERS WHO
ARE, YOU KNOW, VICTIMS OF
DOMESTIC VIOLENCE.
SO WE JUST WORRY THERE MAY BE
PEOPLE BEING DISRUPTED IN THE D-
DISRUPTIVE IN THE POLLING PLACE.
THAT DID NOT HAPPEN IN AUGUST,
SO MAYBE IT'S MUCH TO DO ABOUT
NOTHING, BUT YOU HAVE TO ASSUME
THE WORST, AND HOPE FOR THE
BEST.
>> YOU SPOKE THIS WEEK ABOUT
PERSISTENT MISINFORMATION AROUND
ELECTION ADMINISTRATION.
WHAT DOES THIS DO TO PEOPLE'S
FAITH IN THE PROCESS?
>> WELL, THE SYSTEM DOESN'T WORK
IF HALF THE VOTERS DON'T THINK
THEIR BALLOTS ARE BEING TALLIED
CORRECTLY OR THE MACHINES HAVE
BEEN HACKED.
SO I'M NOT SURE WHAT WE CAN DO
ABOUT IT.
BUT DEMOCRACY DEPENDS ON BOTH
SIDES BELIEVING IN THE RESULTS.
>> ALL RIGHT, WELL, WE LEAVE IT
THERE AND WE WISH YOU LUCK,
SCOTT MCDONALD.
THANK YOU.