PRODUCTION.
THE FOLLOWING PROGRAM IS PART OF
OUR "HERE AND NOW" 2020 ELECTION
COVERAGE.
>> ELECTION DAY TURNED INTO
ELECTION WEEK AFTER VOTERS CAST
THEIR BALLOT, THEN WAITED FOR
THE COUNT.
WISCONSIN CHOSE FORMER VICE
PRESIDENT JOE BIDEN BY A 20,000
VOTE MARGIN.
WITHIN HOURS AFTER THE BALLOTS
WERE TALLIED, PRESIDENT TRUMP
SAID HE WOULD REQUEST A RECOUNT.
DOWN BALLOTS FLIPPED AT THE
CAPITOL.
A STATE DIVIDED BY POLITICS
REMAINS A STATE DIVIDED BY THE
PANDEMIC.
POSITIVE COVID CASES CONTINUE TO
SKYROCKET IN THE ABSENCE OF A
STATEWIDE PLAN TO FIGHT THE
VIRUS.
>> I'M FREDERICA FREYBERG.
TONIGHT ON "HERE AND NOW" MAKING
SENSE OF WHAT HAPPENS NEXT ON
THE PRESIDENCY.
A TOP UW ELECTIONS EXPERT IS
HERE.
ZAC SCHULTZ PIN POINTS THE
RESULTS OF THE STATE RACES.
AND MCCOSHEN AND ROSS LOOK AT
THE POLITICAL DIVIDE THAT WILL
PERSIST LONG AFTER THE NEXT
PRESIDENT IS SWORN IN.
IT'S "HERE AND NOW" FOR
NOVEMBER 6.
>> FUNDING IS PROVIDED BITE
FOCUS FUND FOR JOURNALISM AND
PBS WISCONSIN.
>> JOE BIDEN WAS EXPECTED TO
ADDRESS THE NATION TONIGHT AT
ABOUT THIS HOUR, BUT PULLED BACK
FROM THAT AWAITING THE CALL ON
THE ELECTION.
A LITTLE MORE THAN 24 HOURS AGO
DONALD TRUMP SPOKE SAYING AS THE
BALLOTS COUNT STARTED GOING IN
HIS CHALLENGER'S DIRECTION WITH
ABSENTEES TALLIED LAST, HE WAS
BEING ILLEGALLY ROBBED OF HIS
VICTORY.
>> I'D LIKE TO PROVIDE THE
AMERICAN PEOPLE WITH AN UPDATE
ON OUR EFFORTS TO PROTECT THE
INTEGRITY OF OUR VERY IMPORTANT
2020 ELECTION.
IF YOU COUNT THE LEGAL VOTES, I
EASILY WIN.
IF YOU COUNT THE ILLEGAL VOTES,
THEY CAN TRY TO STEAL THE
ELECTION FROM US.
IF YOU COUNT THE VOTES THAT CAME
IN LATE, WE'RE LOOKING AT THEM
VERY STRONGLY.
A LOT OF VOTES CAME IN LATE.
>> WISCONSIN IS IN PRESIDENT
TRUMP'S PRESIDENT
TRUMP'S SIGHTS AS PART OF WHAT
HE BELIEVES IS THE FRAUD CABAL
AGAINST HIM.
THIS STATE HELPED PUT JOE BIDEN
INTO THE LEAD, AS DID ABSENTEE
BALLOTS ACROSS THE STATES
COUNTED AFTER IN-PERSON VOTES.
WE TURN TO PROFESSOR OF
POLITICAL SCIENCE AT UW-MADISON,
DIRECTOR OF THE RESEARCH CENTER
WHICH CONDUCTS THE BATTLEGROUND
POLL.
>> GLAD TO BE WITH YOU.
>> I WANTED TO ASK WHAT YOUR
REACTION IS TO PRESIDENT TRUMP'S
CLAIMS HE OUTLINED THURSDAY
NIGHT.
>> I DON'T THINK THERE'S A LOT
OF TRUTH IN THEM.
HE REFERRED TO LEGAL AND ILLEGAL
VOTES.
TO MY KNOWLEDGE, THERE ARE NO
ILLEGAL VOTES BEING CAST.
RIGHT NOW ESSENTIALLY ALL OF THE
COUNTS THAT ARE BEING COUNTED,
ESPECIALLY IN PENNSYLVANIA,
THOSE ARE BALLOTS THAT WERE CAST
BEFORE ELECTION DAY, IN SOME
CASES WEEKS BEFORE ELECTION DAY
OR ON ELECTION DAY ITSELF.
SO THERE'S REALLY NOTHING LATE
OR QUESTIONABLE ABOUT THEM.
IT'S SIMPLY TAKING THE STATE A
WHILE TO WORK THROUGH WHAT IS A
PRETTY BIG MAIL OF MAIL BALLOTS.
>> PART OF THE TRUMP'S CAMPAIGN
FIGHT AGAINST THESE RESULTS IS
LAWSUITS IN BATTLEGROUND STATES
AND THE CALL FOR A RECOUNT, FOR
EXAMPLE, IN WISCONSIN, WHERE HE
ALSO CITES IRREGULARITIES, WHAT
OUR ELECTIONS COMMISSION SAY DID
NOT CUR.
WHAT DO WE KNOW ABOUT WHETHER
RECOUNTS IN WISCONSIN FLIP
RESULTS?
>> WELL, LUCKILY I SUPPOSE WE
HAVE A LITTLE BIT OF A RECORD
HERE OF DOING STATEWIDE
RECOUNTS.
AFTER THE 2016 PRESIDENTIAL
ELECTION THERE WAS A FULL
RECOUNT OF THE STATE.
MOST OF THAT WAS DONE BY HAND.
IT WAS A PAINSTAKING PROCESS.
THAT WAS THE RESULT OF A REQUEST
FROM JILL STEIN, THE GREEN PARTY
CANDIDATE IN THAT CONTEST.
IT CHANGED A FEW HUNDRED VOTES
IN THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN
CLINTON AND TRUMP AFTER TWO TO
THREE WEEKS OF COUNTING BALLOTS.
IT DID TURN UP MORE BALLOTS THAT
WERE COUNTABLE FOR BOTH
CAMPAIGNS, BALLOTS INITIALLY
REJECTED BECAUSE MACHINES HAD
TROUBLE READING THEM.
BUT IT DIDN'T CHANGE THE BALANCE
BETWEEN THEM.
VERY SIMILAR PATTERN IF YOU GO
BACK TO THE 2011 SUPREME COURT
RACE.
THAT ALSO TURNED INTO A
STATEWIDE RECOUNT AND HAD VERY
LITTLE EFFECT ON THE OVERALL
BALANCE.
>> SO WOULD IT BE POSSIBLE AS
THE PRESIDENT SAID WAS
PERPETRATED FROM THE PART OF
DEMOCRATS TO HAVE EFFECT WIDESPREAD
FRAUD ACROSS THE STATE?
>> IT WOULD BE IMPOSSIBLE TO DO
THAT IN A SYSTEMIC WAY AROUND
THE COUNTRY GIVEN ALL THE
DIFFERENT ELECTION SYSTEMS, THE
ELECTION RULES, THE AMOUNT OF
TRANSPARENCY IN THIS PROCESS,
ALL OF WHAT'S HAPPENING BOTH
BEFORE ELECTION DAY, ON ELECTION
DAY AND NOW.
IT'S VISIBLE, EITHER IN PERSON
OR ON CAMERA.
SO I DON'T SEE HOW THAT SORT OF
THING COULD HAPPEN.
>> WOULD THE U.S. SUPREME COURT
STEP IN TO RESOLVE LAWSUITS AND
WITH ITS CONSERVATIVE MAJORITY
SUPPORT THE PRESIDENT?
>> IT MIGHT.
I THICHG THINK THE MOST PROMISING PATH
THERE TO THE SUPREME COURT IS IN
PENNSYLVANIA, WHERE THERE WAS A
STATE SUPREME COURT DECISION
THAT EXTENDED THE DEADLINE OF
ABSENTEE BALLOTS BY THREE DAYS.
THEY CAN BE COUNTED ACCORDING TO
THE STATE SUPREME COURT.
THE STATE IS CURRENTLY
SEGREGATING THOSE BALLOTS SO
THEY CAN BE HANDLED SEPARATELY
IN CASE THERE'S MORE COURT
ACTION.
REPUBLICANS ARE TRYING TO
ELEVATE THAT NOW TO THE U.S.
SUPREME COURT WHICH ALREADY HAD
ONE LOOK AT THE CASE BUT THAT
WAS BEFORE BARRETT JOINED THE
COURT.
NOW REPUBLICANS ARE ASKING THE
COURT TAKE IT UP AGAIN.
SO THERE'S A POSSIBILITY OF I
GUESS ANOTHER EXAMINATION OF
THAT CASE AND SOMETHING TO
HAPPEN IN PENNSYLVANIA.
>> THE PRESIDENT INCLUDED
POLLSTERS IN THE CONSPIRACY TO
STEAL THE ELECTION, SAYING
SURVEY RESULTS SHOWING BIDEN WAY
AHEAD MOUNTED TO SUPPRESSION
POLLS.
WHAT'S YOUR REACTION TO THAT,
WITH YOUR OWN BATTLEGROUND STATE
POLL THAT SHOWED BIDEN UP NINE?
>> IT DOESN'T MAKE A LOT OF
SENSE.
BOTH THE DEMOCRAT AND REPUBLICAN
CAMPAIGNS WERE USING THE
PROBLEMS WITH THE POLLS IN 2016
TO MOTIVATE THEIR SUPPORTERS.
DEMOCRATS WERE TELLING THEIR
BACKERS THAT THEY SHOULD NOT GET
COMFORTABLE WITH THE LEAD THAT
BIDEN WAS SHOWING IN THE POLLS,
TO REMEMBER WHAT HAD HAPPENED IN
2016 AND TO MAKE SURE THEY
SHOWED UP.
FOR THE REPUBLICANS THERE WAS A
SIMILAR MESSAGE THAT YOU SHOULD
NOT TRUST THE POLLS, THAT
THERE'S A HIDDEN GROUP OF TRUMP
VOTERS NOT BEING REPRESENTED.
SO BOTH SIDES WERE REMEMBERING
AND LEVERAGING THE FAILURES OF
THE POLLS FOUR YEARS AGO TO TRY
TO TURN OUT SUPPORTERS.
YOU KNOW, TRUMP'S TRAILING IN
THE POLLS ALSO HAPPENED IN 2016
AND HE MANAGED TO WIN THESE
STATES LIKE WISCONSIN, MICHIGAN,
PENNSYLVANIA.
THIS YEAR HE APPEARS TO BE
LOSING ALL THREE STATES EVEN
THOUGH THE POLLS SHOW A SIMILAR
PATTERN.
SO IT'S HARD TO SEE WHY IT WOULD
WORK DIFFERENTLY IN ONE YEAR
THAN ANOTHER.
>> JUST BRIEFLY ABOUT POLLS, ANY
IDEAS YET WHY THEY WERE OFF TO
THE EXTENT THAT THEY WERE?
>> IT'S STILL QUITE A MYSTERY.
THEY WERE OFF IN SOME STATES
LIKE WISCONSIN, BUT NOT OFF IN
OTHERS, LIKE OUR NEIGHBOR,
MINNESOTA, WHERE THE POLLS
SHOWED TRUMP BEHIND BY SEVEN OR
EIGHT POINTS AND THAT LOOKS TO
BE WHERE THE VOTE IS ENDING UP.
SO IT'S NOT A CONSISTENT PATTERN
BUT IS REPEATING SOME OF THE
PROBLEMS WE SAW FOUR YEARS AGO.
>> SO I WANT TO ASK THIS.
COULD THIS COME TO THE POINT
WHERE REPUBLICAN LEGISLATURES
LIKE OUR OWN SUBVERT THE
ELECTORS?
>> I THINK NOT.
THERE HAVE BEEN A VIEW VOICES ON
THE FRINGES CALLING FOR THAT
KIND OF ACTIVITY.
THERE'S BEEN A CALL TO DO THAT
IN PENNSYLVANIA.
I THINK THE PROCESS IS UNFOLDING
IN A PRETTY ORDERLY FASHION
THERE.
AND, IMPORTANTLY, REPUBLICAN
LEADERS IN THE STATE LEGISLATURE
IN PENNSYLVANIA HAVE SAID THAT'S
NOT AN APPROPRIATE ACTION FOR
THEM.
THE LEGISLATURE HAS NO ROLE IN
THE PROCESS AT THIS POINT.
I THINK THAT'S THE RIGHT
ATTITUDE AND SEEMS TO BE HOLDING
UP AMONG LEGISLATIVE LEADERS.
>> ALL RIGHT.
WE LEAVE IT THERE.
BARRY BURDEN, THANKS VERY MUCH
FOR YOUR EXPERTISE.
>> THANKS.
>> AS TO ALLEGED FRAUD,
REPUBLICAN SPEAKER ROBIN VOS IS
NOW DIRECTING THE ELECTIONS ELECTIONS
COMMITTEE SAYING WITH CONCERNS
SURFACING ABOUT MAIL-IN BALLOT
DUMPS AND VOTER FRAUD, WISCONSIN
CITIZENS DESERVE TO KNOW THEIR
VOTE COUNTED.
THERE MUST BE CERTAINTY THAT THE
IMPENDING RECOUNT FINDS ANY AND
ALL IRREGULARTIES.
THE COMMISSION REPORTS NO
IRREGULARITIES.
PEOPLE ARE ALREADY IN THE
STREETS OVER THE ELECTION
RESULTS, INCLUDING AROUND THE
STATE CAPITOL TODAY WHERE
PRO-TRUMP AND BLACK LIVES MATTER
PEOPLE DEBATED.
TONIGHT, REACTION FROM BOTH
SIDES FROM OUR POLITICAL
PANELISTS, REPUBLICAN BILL
MCCOSHEN AND DEMOCRAT SCOT ROSS.
THANKS FOR BEING HERE.
>> THANKS FOR HAVING US.
>> WE SEE HOW SOME FOLKS ARE
REACTING TO WHAT'S GOING ON.
HOW ARE YOU BOTH FEELING TONIGHT
TONIGHT.
BOTH FIRST TO YOU SCOT.
>> I FEEL TERRIFIC.
JOE BIDEN IS THE UNDECLARED NEXT
PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES.
HE'S GOT FOUR MILLION MORE VOTES
THAN DONALD TRUMP.
HE'S GOING TO HIT ABOUT 306
ELECTORAL VOTES.
HE'S UP IN FOUR OF THE SIX
STATES.
I FEEL GREAT FOR DEMOCRACY.
I THINK THE WAY DONALD TRUMP HAS
INDICATED IN THE LAST 72 HOURS
IS A GOOD INDICATION WHY THE
PEOPLE OF THE UNITED STATES OF
AMERICA MADE THE RIGHT DECISION
ON ELECTION DAY.
>> BILL, WHAT ABOUT YOU?
>> I FEEL PRETTY GOOD.
THE PEOPLE HAVE HAD AN
OPPORTUNITY TO SPEAK.
MORE THAN 150 MILLION PEOPLE
NATIONWIDE WENT OUT AND VOTED, A
RECORD NUMBER.
I THINK THAT'S GREAT.
IT SPEAKS WELL OF DEMOCRACY.
THEY SPLIT THEIR TICKET IN MANY
WAYS.
JOE BIDEN HAS A LEAD IN THE
STATE OF WISCONSIN, BUT
REPUBLICANS PICKED UP TWO SEATS
IN THE STATE SENATE AND ONLY
LOST TWO SEATS IN THE STATE
ASSEMBLY.
SO THEY HAVE HEALTHY MAJORITIES
IN BOTH HOUSES OF THE
LEGISLATURE.
>> ASTOUNDING TURNOUT ACROSS THE
COUNTRY.
BUT LET'S TALK FRAUD.
BILL, DO YOU THINK THE TRUMP
CAMPAIGN SHOULD PURSUE THIS IN
THE COURTS ALL THE WAY UP?
>> SO THERE'S THREE STEPS TO
THIS.
I WOULD AGREE WITH PART OF WHAT
PROFESSOR BURDEN SAID.
THE FIRST IS THE ELECTION.
IT'S STILL ASTONISHING TO ME
THAT BIG STATES LIKE FLORIDA CAN
COUNT VOTES ON ELECTION NIGHT,
BUT SMALLER STATES CAN'T.
IT DOESN'T SEEM TO MAKE SENSE.
IT'S IRRATIONAL TO ME THAT THAT
CAN'T HAPPEN.
SO IT REMAINS TO BE SEEN HOW THE
FINAL COUNT WILL TURN OUT.
CLEARLY JOE BIDEN HAS THE
ADVANTAGE AT THIS POINT IN TIME.
BUT ONCE THE ELECTION COUNT IS
DONE, THEN YOU HAVE THE CANVASS.
WISCONSIN IS ALREADY DONE WITH
THAT.
IT HASN'T BEEN CERTIFIED YET.
FINALLY, A RECOUNT.
THERE ARE TWO STATES WHERE THERE
WILL BE A RECOUNT, WISCONSIN AND
GEORGIA.
>> SCOT, WHAT'S YOUR REACTION?
>> THE ONLY FRAUD ARE
POLITICIANS TRYING TO RIG THE
SYSTEM FOR POLITICAL GAIN.
THERE'S NO INDICATION OF FRAUD
IN THIS ELECTION.
PEOPLE WENT OUT AND VOTED, LIKE
BILL SAID, LIKE THEY'VE NEVER
DONE BEFORE.
I WOULD JUST POINT OUT THAT THIS
ELECTION, WE SHOULD HAVE ALREADY
DECLARED JOE BIDEN THE WINNER.
IF PENNSYLVANIA, WISCONSIN AND
MICHIGAN'S REPUBLICAN
LEGISLATURES ALLOWED VOTES TO BE
COUNTED, YOU KNOW, BEFORE
ELECTION DAY, THE ONES THAT CAME
IN THE MAIL-IN, THIS WOULD HAVE
ALREADY BEEN OVER.
THIS IS A MESS CAUSED BY THE
REPUBLICANS AND NOW THEY'RE
TRYING TO CHANGE THE RULES.
ROBIN VOS SHOULD BE ASHAMED OF
HIMSELF.
UNDER OATH, THEY COULD NOT
PRODUCE ONE INCIDENCE OF VOTER
FRAUD WHEN THEY WERE UNDER OATH.
SO THERE'S NO FRAUD IN THE STATE
OF WISCONSIN.
LIKE SCOTT WALKER SAID.
IT'S A HIGH HURDLE TO BE ABLE TO
OVERCOME THOSE 20,000 VOTES.
REPUBLICANS NEED TO THROW IN THE
TOWEL AND ACCEPT JOE BIDEN AS
THE NEXT PRESIDENT.
>> ALL OF THIS THAT WE'RE GOING
THROUGH KIND OF UPEND THE
STANDING DEMOCRATIC PROCESS IN
THIS COUNTRY?
>> WELL, I THINK WHAT'S LACKING
RIGHT NOW IS TRANSPARENCY.
IN THE STATES THAT ARE STILL IN
BALLOT, YOU NEED TO HAVE A
TRANSPARENT PROCESS.
THAT'S IMPORTANT.
OKAY?
IF THAT WERE GOINGO YOU WANT TO
HAVE PEOPLE TO HAVE CONFIDENCE
IN THE ELECTION.
70 MILLION PEOPLE VOTED FOR
DONALD TRUMP.
SO THERE WASN'T A REPUTATION OF
DONALD TRUMP.
YOU WANT THOSE FOLKS TO BE
CONFIDENT THAT IF HE LOST, HE
LOST FAIRLY.
>> SCOT?
>> WE HAD A RECORD NUMBER OF
PEOPLE TURN OUT IN THE CITIES OF
AMERICA, BLACK AND BROWN VOTERS.
AND IT JUST SEEMS EVERY TIME
THAT BLACK AND BROWN VOTERS GO
TO THE POLLS TO TRY TO SAVE
AMERICA, REPUBLICANS CLAIM
THERE'S FRAUD.
THIS IS A REAL PROBLEM.
WHEN PEOPLE DON'T HAVE THE RIGHT
TO VOTE WITHOUT BEING ACCUSED OF
BEING FRAUDULENT, THERE'S A REAL
PROBLEM IN THE DEMOCRATIC
PROCESS AND I THINK THE
REPUBLICANS HAVE CONTRIBUTED TO
THAT.
>> I WANT TO STAY WITH YOU,
SCOT.
DOES ALL OF THIS HAS HAPPENING
NOW HEIGHTEN THE DIVIDE THEN?
IS IT JUST GOING TO GET WORSE?
>> I THINK ABSOLUTELY.
I MEAN, JOE BIDEN'S ALWAYS BEEN
SOMEBODY WHO TRIES TO BRING
PEOPLE TOGETHER THROUGHOUT HIS
CAREER.
YOU'VE GOT GUYS LIKE RON
JOHNSON, GUYS LIKE GLENN
GROTHMAN, ROBIN VOS, REPUBLICANS
WHO ARE SAYING, NO, THERE'S NOT
DEMOCRACY AND THAT'S NOT THE WAY
YOU BRING PEOPLE TOGETHER.
ELECTIONS ARE ABOUT DIVIDING
PEOPLE.
GOVERNANCE IS ABOUT BRINGING
PEOPLE TOGETHER.
REPUBLICANS BROKE THE MOLD UNDER
DONALD TRUMP.
>> BILL, WHAT ABOUT WHETHER OR
NOT THIS HEIGHTENS THE DIVIDE?
>> I DON'T THINK VOTERS MIND
DECIDED GOVERNMENT.
WE HAVE IT HERE IN WISCONSIN.
IT LOOKS LIKE WE'RE GOING TO
HAVE IT IN D.C. IF JOE BIDEN IS
THE PRESIDENT-ELECT AND
REPUBLICANS HOLD THEIR MAJORITY
IN THE UNITED STATES SENATE.
THEY'VE PICKED UP A NUMBER OF
SEATS IN THE HOUSE WHICH WASN'T
EXPECTED.
THERE WON'T BE A TAX INCREASE.
THERE WON'T BE A GREEN NEW DEAL.
AND THERE WON'T BE COURT
PACKING.
AND THAT'S A GOOD THING.
>> HOW DISAPPOINTED ARE
DEMOCRATS WHO ARE LOOKING FOR
THIS ROBUST REPUDIATION OF THE
PRESIDENT?
>> I THINK IT'S JUST A GOOD
INDICATION THAT THE COUNTRY IS
QUITE DIVIDED WHEN IT COMES
IDEOLOGY.
I THINK PERSONALLY IT'S SAD THAT
THAT MANY PEOPLE WANTED TO VOTE
FOR A GUY WHO'S DONE THE THINGS
DONALD TRUMP HAS DONE TO THIS
COUNTRY, SAYING THIS PANDEMIC
WAS NO BIG DEAL.
JOE BIDEN IS GOING TO BE THE
NEXT PRESIDENT.
KAMALA HARRIS IS GOING TO BE THE
NEXT VICE PRESIDENT.
IT'S GOING TO COME DOWN TO TWO
SENATE ELECTIONS IN A 50/50
STATE OF GEORGIA AS TO WHETHER
OR NOT DEMS CONTROL ALL THREE
PARTS OF GOVERNMENT, BEING
CONGRESS AND THE PRESIDENCY.
>> I NEED TO LEAVE IT THERE.
I THINK I OWED YOU AN ANSWER,
BILL, BUT WE LEAVE IT THERE.
THANKS VERY MUCH AND THANKS FOR
ALL YOUR WORK OVER THE SEASON.
>> THANK YOU.
>> THANKS FOR HAVING US.
>> DOWN BALLOT FROM THE
PRESIDENTIAL RACE, REPUBLICANS
AND DEMOCRATS IN THE LEGISLATURE
WERE ABLE TO FLIP SOME SEATS,
BUT THE END RESULT IS THE SAME.
REPUBLICANS WILL RETAIN
COMMANDING MAJORITIES IN THE
STATE LEGISLATURE HEADING INTO
NEXT YEAR.
BUT NOT LARGE ENOUGH WHERE THEY
COULD OVERRIDE GOVERNOR TONY
EVERS' VETO POWER.
SENATE REPUBLICANS WON TWO SEATS
HELD BY DEMOCRATS GIVING THEM A
21-12 MAJORITY.
ASSEMBLY DEMOCRATS WON TWO SEATS
IN THE MILWAUKEE SUBURBS, BUT
CONTROL THE CHAMBER 61-38.
BECAUSEBECAUSE SCOTT FITZGERALD WON A
SEAT IN THE U.S. HOUSE, THERE
WILL BE A NEW MAJORITY LEADER.
WE SAT DOWN WITH ZAC SCHULTZ.
>> THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.
>> MY PLEASURE.
>> SO GOVERNOR EVERS HOLDS ON TO
HIS MIGHTY EGO PEN.
WHAT ARE THE IMPLICATIONS OF
EVERS MAINTAINING HIS VETO
POWER?
>> WELL, THAT SAVE THE VETO
MESSAGE WAS DIRECTED AT
REDISTRICTING.
THE BIGGEST BATTLE GOING FORWARD
IS GOING TO BE HOW THE NEXT SET
OF MAPS ARE DRAWN THAT DIVIDE
OUR DISTRICTS.
TEN YEARS AGO, REPUBLICANS HAD
COMPLETE CONTROL OVER THAT
PROCESS AND THEY CREATED MAPS
THAT PUT THEM IN POWER FOR THE
REST OF THE DECADE.
AND DEMOCRATS WERE AFRAID THAT
WAS GOING TO HAPPEN AGAIN IF
GOVERNOR EVERS DIDN'T HAVE THE
ABILITY TO VETO THOSE MAPS AND
HOPE FOR A DIFFERENT RESOLUTION
AND FORCE SOME COMPROMISE.
>> SO WHAT HAPPENS THEN WHEN THE
REPUBLICANS FASHION THEIR OWN
MAPS AND THE GOVERNOR DECIDES HE
DOESN'T LIKE THAT AND HE VETOES
IT?
THEN WHAT?
>> WELL, IF THAT IS THE WAY IT
PLAYS OUT.
THERE'S ALSO A CHANCE OF
COMPROMISE.
BUT IN THE MOST LIKELY SCENARIO
REPUBLICANS DRAW MAPS, THE
GOVERNOR VETOES THEM.
THEN IT WILL GO TO THE COURTS
MOST LIKELY.
IN PAST DECADES THAT HAS BEEN A
FEDERAL JUDGE WHO HAS BEEN
DRAWING THOSE MAPS.
IN THIS CASE, REPUBLICANS WOULD
LIKE TO SEE THAT BE THE STATE
SUPREME COURT BECAUSE THEY THINK
THEY HAVE AN ADVANTAGE WITH THE
CONSERVATIVES THERE THAT ARE
DRAWING THE MAPS OR FAVORING
MAPS ALREADY DRAWN BY
REPUBLICANS IN THE LEGISLATURE.
>> THAT ADDS UP.
WHAT DOES IT MEAN TO HAVE A NEW
MAJORITY LEADER IN THE SENATE?
>> THEY'LL HAVE THEIR WORK CUT
OUT FOR THEM.
SCOTT FITZGERALD HAD A
REPUTATION FOR REALLY KNOWING
HOW HIS CAUCUS WORKED, WHERE HIS
MEMBERS WERE.
HE'S GOT SOME EXTREMELY
CONSERVATIVE MEMBERS WHO HAVE
BEEN IN THE ASSEMBLY AND SENATE
FOR A LONG TIME, VERY STRONG
INDIVIDUALS THAT AREN'T GOING TO
BE MOVED BY PARTY POLITICS AND
PRESSURE BY ANYONE ELSE.
THIS NEW LEADER WILL HAVE TO
FIGURE OUT HOW TO NEGOTIATE AN
EXPANDED ROSTER.
ONE OF THE THINGS THAT THEY'LL
HAVE TO DO IS SOME OF THOSE VERY
SAME CONSERVATIVES HAVE BEEN
CALLING FOR THE LEGISLATURE TO
COME BACK IN AND STRIKE DOWN
GOVERNOR EVERS' MASK MANDATE AND
HEALTH EMERGENCY ORDERS
REGARDING HOW WE'RE RESPONDING
TO THE COVID PANDEMIC.
BEFORE THE ELECTION, REPUBLICAN
LEADERSHIP HELD OFF ON THAT.
THEY WERE AFRAID OF WHAT THAT
MIGHT MEAN AT THE BALLOT BOX IF
THEY WERE SEEN STRIKING DOWN
WHAT WERE QUITE POPULAR PUBLIC
OFFICIAL POSITIONS ON MASK
MANDATES.
THAT MAY CHANGE GOING FORWARD AS
SOON AS NEXT WEEK IF THE
LEGISLATURE COMES IN.
THE SENATE COULD STRIKE IT DOWN
AND REQUIRE THE ASSEMBLY TO DO
SO AS WELL.
THOSE ARE SOME OF THE
DIFFERENCES WE MAY SEE RIGHT OFF
THE BAT.
>> ALL RIGHT.
MEANWHILE, EVEN NOW THE
RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN THE
REPUBLICAN LEGISLATURE AND THE
EXECUTIVE BRANCH COULD BE
DESCRIBED AS ICY AT THE VERY
BEST.
THERE ARE BIG ISSUES BEFORE THE
STATE, COVID RESPONSE AND THEN
THE STATE BUDGET.
IS POST-ELECTION TIME AS WE'VE
DISCUSSED THE TIME FOR THE
BRANCHES TO COME TOGETHER AND
WORK ON ANY COVID RESPONSE?
>> IT COULD BEMENT COULD BE.
IT DEPENDS ON WHAT HAPPENS AT
THE PRESIDENTIAL AND U.S. SENATE
LEVEL.
IF THERE'S ANOTHER RELIEF
PACKAGE, THE LEGISLATURE IN
WISCONSIN MAY WAIT TO SEE WHAT
THAT LOOKS LIKE TO SEE IF IT
INCLUDES ANY RELIEF FOR CITIES
IN WISCONSIN.
IF NOTHING HAPPENS AT THE
FEDERAL LEVEL, THEN IT MAY
REQUIRE THE STATE TO COME BACK
IN.
BUT THAT WILL BE A WAITING GAME.
I WOULDN'T ANTICIPATE THEM DOING
THAT RIGHT AWAY, ESPECIALLY
SINCE WE'RE GETTING CLOSE TO THE
NEXT SESSION AND NEXT BUDGET.
>> SPEAKING OF THE BUDGET, HOW
TOUGH IS THIS BUDGET YEAR GOING
TO BE GIVEN THE STATE OF THE
ECONOMY RIGHT NOW AND THE
CONTINUING EFFECTS OF THE
PANDEMIC?
>> WELL, IT'S NOT GOING TO BE
PRETTY AT THE MOMENT.
BUT A BIG QUESTION IS HOW
QUICKLY DOES THE ECONOMY IN THE
STATE AND NATIONALLY REBOUND IF
WE EVER GET A HOLD ON THIS COVID
PANDEMIC.
RIGHT NOW WE DON'T HAVE CONTROL
OVER IT AT ALL.
AND THAT'S DIRECTLY AFFECTING
SALES TAX REVENUE, INCOME TAX
REVENUES, ALL THOSE THINGS THAT
HELP FUND STATE GOVERNMENT.
GOING FORWARD, THIS BUDGET WON'T
GO INTO EFFECT UNTIL NEXT JULY,
BUT THEY'LL BE NEGOTIATING IN
THE SPRING.
SO HOW THEY SEE THE COVID
RESPONSE THEN VERSUS WHAT IT
WILL LOOK LIKE THE FOLLOWING TWO
YEARS WILL DETERMINE HOW
COMFORTABLE THEY ARE TO PUT
MONEY INTO THESE PROGRAMS AND
WHAT KIND OF BUDGET THEY PASS.
>> YEAH.
BACK TO THE ELECTION, THE
PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION.
HAVING REPORTED ON SO MANY
ANGLES OF IT OVER THESE MONTHS,
HOW DOES THIS ONE COMPARE TO ALL
THOSE YOU HAVE COVERED OVER THE
YEARS?
>> I DON'T THINK THERE'S ANY
COMPARISON TO ANY PRESIDENTIAL
ELECTION WE'VE HAD IN WISCONSIN.
THE DEMOCRATS IN WISCONSIN
BASICALLY SAT OUT IN PERSON
CAMPAIGNING AND HOLDING RALLIES
WHILE REPUBLICANS WENT FORWARD
WITH IT.
IN PAST YEARS, WE'VE SEEN BARAK
OBAMA COME AND HOLD MASSIVE
RALLIES FOR IMAGES TO SHOW
ENTHUSIASM AND ENERGY.
THAT WASN'T POSSIBLE FOR JOE
BIDEN TO DO.
THEY WERE SOCIALLY DISTANCED.
THERE WERE NO CROWDS.
JUST DIDN'T HAVE THE SAME LOOK
OR EFFECT.
IT WAS COMPLETELY DIFFERENT
ELECTION TO TRY TO COVER WHAT
WAS HAPPENING ON THE GROUND WHEN
WE HAD TO WORRY ABOUT HOW TO
INTERACT WITH THE CANDIDATES,
VOTERS, HOW WERE VOTERS
RESPONDING.
COMPLETELY DIFFERENT ERA
REGARDING ABSENTEE BALLOTS.
WE'LL PROBABLY NEVER SEE
ANYTHING QUITE LIKE THIS WHEN IT
COMES TO BEING IN THE PANDEMIC
OR AT LEAST WE HOPE SO.
>> ALL RIGHT.
ZAC, THANK YOU FOR ALL THE WORK
YOU DID DO DURING THIS ELECTION.
>> THANKS, FRED.
>> IN OUR WEEKLY LIVE WEBCAST,
NOON WEDNESDAY, "HERE AND NOW"
REPORTER MARISA WOJCIK ASKED
ANGELA LANG FROM BLACK LEADERS
ORGANIZING FOR COMMUNITIES AND
PROFESSOR AARON WEINSCHENK ABOUT
VOTER INTIMIDATION AND
ANTICIPATED VIOLENCE AS THE
COUNTRY COMPLETES COUNTING THE
BALLOTS.
>> IN REGARDS TO ANYTHING NOW
MOVING FORWARD, I'M A LITTLE
CONCERNED.
I THINK WHAT I'VE REALIZED THIS
YEAR IN 2020 IS THAT SOME OF US
BLACK, BROWN AND INDIGENOUS
ORGANIZERS, DOING THIS WORK CAN
BE SCARY BECAUSE WE'VE SEEN
THESE INCREASED MILITIA VOTES
TRYING TO INTIMIDATE PEOPLE.
I THINK IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE
NEED TO KEEP AN EYE ON AND BE
CAREFUL AND DO WHATEVER WE CAN
TO MAKE SURE PEOPLE STAY SAFE.
>> ARE WE OUT OF THE WOODS IN
TERMS OF TENSION AND DIVISION AS
MORE RESULTS COME IN?
>> SHOWS HOW RIDICULOUS IT IS
THAT WE ARE EVEN HAVING TO THINK
ABOUT THIS.
WE'RE AN ADVANCED DEMOCRACY.
WE'RE A PLACE OTHER COUNTRIES
ASPIRE TO BE.
WE SHOULD NOT BE TALKING ABOUT
VIOLENCE AND MILITIAS.
THE FACT WE'RE RELIEVED THAT
DIDN'T HAPPEN I THINK SAYS
SOMETHING AND IT'S PRETTY
HORRIBLE.
I DON'T THINK WE'RE QUITE OUT OF
THE WOODS.
POLLS SHOW THAT SUPPORTERS OF
BOTH BIDEN AND TRUMP SAY THEY'RE
NOT GOING TO ACCEPT THE ELECTION
RESULTS.
40% OF PEOPLE ON EACH SIDE SAID
THEY'RE NOT GOING TO ACCEPT A
WIN BY THE OTHER PERSON.
SOMETHING LIKE 20% SAID THEY'D
CONSIDER TAKING TO THE STREETS
AND POSSIBLY GETTING
DESTRUCTIVE.
SO IT COULD POTENTIALLY BE A
SMALL NUMBER OF PEOPLE WHO ARE
REALLY DISSATISFIED.
SO I DO HAVE CONCERNS ABOUT KIND
OF POST-ELECTION CIVILITY AND
WHAT MIGHT HAPPEN.
>> YOU CAN WATCH THAT ENTIRE
NOON WEDNESDAY INTERVIEW BY
GOING TO pbswisconsin.org AND
CLICKING ON NEWS.
THE WISCONSIN APPEALS COURT
TODAY BLOCKED THE EVERS'
ADMINISTRATION 25% CAPACITY
LIMIT ON BARS AND RESTAURANTS.
IT HAS BEEN ON AND OFF IN THE
MIDST OF COURT CHALLENGES SINCE
IT WAS IMPOSED IN EARLY OCTOBER.
MEANWHILE, WISCONSIN REPORTED
6100 COVID 19 POSITIVE CASES
FRIDAY, PUTTING THE SEVEN-DAY
AVERAGE OVER 5,000.
TODAY 62 PEOPLE WERE REPORTED TO
HAVE DIED OF THE VIRUS SINCE
YESTERDAY.
FIND THE LATEST ON COVID AS WELL
AS NEWS ONLINE THROUGHOUT THE
WEEK AT pbswisconsin.org AND
THEN AGAIN CLICKING ON THE NEWS
TAB.
ALSO, FOR ONGOING IN-DEPTH
COVERAGE ON CORONAVIRUS, VISIT
wiscontext.org.
THAT IS ALL FOR TONIGHT'S
PROGRAM.
I'M FREDERICA FREYBERG.
HAVE A GOOD WEEKEND.
>> FOR MORE "HERE AND NOW" 2020
ELECTION COVERAGE, GO TO
pbswisconsin.org AND CLICK ON
NEWS.
>> FUNDING FOR "HERE AND NOW" IS
PROVIDED BY THE FOCUS FUND FOR
JOURNALISM AND FRIENDS OF PBS
WISCONSIN.