1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:02,000 To order, this is a meeting of the 2 00:00:02,000 --> 00:00:05,640 Poor Washington Planning Commission on May 21st, 2026. 3 00:00:05,640 --> 00:00:07,880 Happy birthday to Barb Matera and Tom Nitsky. 4 00:00:07,880 --> 00:00:10,440 Roll call, all members are here. 5 00:00:10,440 --> 00:00:12,080 And I'm looking for someone to approve 6 00:00:12,080 --> 00:00:13,980 the previous meeting minutes. 7 00:00:13,980 --> 00:00:15,120 Second. 8 00:00:15,120 --> 00:00:16,280 There's a motion and a second. 9 00:00:16,280 --> 00:00:18,600 Any questions or concerns on the motion? 10 00:00:18,600 --> 00:00:21,120 Seeing none, all in favor signify by saying aye. 11 00:00:21,120 --> 00:00:21,960 Aye. 12 00:00:21,960 --> 00:00:22,800 Opposed? 13 00:00:22,800 --> 00:00:23,840 Okay, motion carries. 14 00:00:23,840 --> 00:00:25,960 I'm gonna move up agenda item five, 15 00:00:25,960 --> 00:00:29,720 which was added later to right after 16 00:00:29,720 --> 00:00:30,560 the public comments. 17 00:00:30,560 --> 00:00:32,720 Is there anyone here to make public comments tonight? 18 00:00:34,200 --> 00:00:36,760 Okay, there are no public comments. 19 00:00:36,760 --> 00:00:39,680 So that brings us into agenda item five. 20 00:00:39,680 --> 00:00:43,480 I'm gonna skip over four and end on the Sony Code Rewrite. 21 00:00:43,480 --> 00:00:45,080 Agenda item number five is consideration 22 00:00:45,080 --> 00:00:47,840 and possible action on a proposed public sculpture piece 23 00:00:47,840 --> 00:00:51,080 for Coldock Park at 190 South Wisconsin Street. 24 00:00:51,080 --> 00:00:54,400 The project is being asked to provide a recommendation 25 00:00:54,400 --> 00:00:57,720 of the common council on proposal and install a Coldock Park. 26 00:00:57,720 --> 00:01:01,040 The project is fully funded and ready to go. 27 00:01:01,040 --> 00:01:02,480 And the staff is recommending approval 28 00:01:02,480 --> 00:01:04,920 of the proposed sculpture at Coldock Park. 29 00:01:04,920 --> 00:01:05,760 Mr. Harris. 30 00:01:15,640 --> 00:01:16,960 No, but. 31 00:01:23,360 --> 00:01:24,760 Never been muted before. 32 00:01:25,760 --> 00:01:27,080 So. 33 00:01:27,080 --> 00:01:29,280 Do I have that, do I have that power from here? 34 00:01:34,600 --> 00:01:37,720 So the city has received a donation 35 00:01:37,720 --> 00:01:40,000 in the amount of $100,000. 36 00:01:40,000 --> 00:01:43,120 And that donation is for the creation 37 00:01:43,120 --> 00:01:46,360 and the installation of a sculpture 38 00:01:46,360 --> 00:01:50,200 to be placed at Coldock Park. 39 00:01:50,200 --> 00:01:51,920 And actually that's consistent 40 00:01:51,920 --> 00:01:55,920 with the 2009 Coldock Park master plan. 41 00:01:57,120 --> 00:01:59,200 And this is kind of an initiative 42 00:01:59,200 --> 00:02:01,200 that I know the mayor has been working on 43 00:02:01,200 --> 00:02:03,240 for a few years now. 44 00:02:03,240 --> 00:02:07,680 And along with the friends of the park and rec 45 00:02:07,680 --> 00:02:11,040 and now with this donation, 46 00:02:11,040 --> 00:02:14,440 there's the proposal and that will take the $100,000 47 00:02:14,440 --> 00:02:16,840 both for the creation of the sculpture 48 00:02:16,840 --> 00:02:20,240 and also the remaining funds about $20,000 49 00:02:20,280 --> 00:02:24,000 will be placed in an account for its maintenance. 50 00:02:24,000 --> 00:02:29,160 And so I'm just going to show the commission real quick. 51 00:02:29,160 --> 00:02:32,840 The location and what the sculpture will look like. 52 00:02:32,840 --> 00:02:36,760 So here is the 2009 Coldock Park plan. 53 00:02:36,760 --> 00:02:40,400 And in the highlighted in red is the first, 54 00:02:40,400 --> 00:02:42,560 the idea that there was a sculpture garden 55 00:02:42,560 --> 00:02:47,160 always kind of thought of or envisioned for this property. 56 00:02:47,160 --> 00:02:49,760 Kind of within that teardrop island 57 00:02:49,760 --> 00:02:53,520 that's created by that ring road of parking. 58 00:02:53,520 --> 00:02:58,520 And then this is just kind of the perspective of that teardrop 59 00:02:59,680 --> 00:03:04,680 from looking east where the lighthouse is lined up 60 00:03:06,040 --> 00:03:09,120 and it'll be in this general location. 61 00:03:09,120 --> 00:03:12,440 And then this is the proposed sculpture, 62 00:03:12,440 --> 00:03:15,520 the Isle of Port Washington sculpture. 63 00:03:15,520 --> 00:03:20,240 And so there was kind of this research done 64 00:03:20,240 --> 00:03:23,440 given that this is the Coldock Park land. 65 00:03:23,440 --> 00:03:24,560 This is Lake Bed land. 66 00:03:24,560 --> 00:03:26,120 This is We Energy's land. 67 00:03:26,120 --> 00:03:28,120 And the recommendation from council 68 00:03:28,120 --> 00:03:33,120 is that the formal process should be 69 00:03:33,240 --> 00:03:36,080 that this should have an approval and recommendation 70 00:03:36,080 --> 00:03:39,000 from both planned commission and council. 71 00:03:39,000 --> 00:03:41,840 And that's why we are here tonight. 72 00:03:41,840 --> 00:03:45,960 The recommendation is by part is to recommend 73 00:03:45,960 --> 00:03:49,160 and I'll just hand it over to the mayor and the council. 74 00:03:51,160 --> 00:03:53,040 Yep, you did a nice job covering that Bob. 75 00:03:53,040 --> 00:03:58,040 The sculpture is supposed to begin its manufacturing 76 00:03:58,520 --> 00:04:02,080 if it's a final approve tonight early next week. 77 00:04:02,080 --> 00:04:06,320 And then installation should be here in the middle of June 78 00:04:06,320 --> 00:04:07,960 with anticipation that it's done well 79 00:04:07,960 --> 00:04:10,000 before the 4th of July and fish day. 80 00:04:10,000 --> 00:04:11,920 The heart will be painted red. 81 00:04:11,920 --> 00:04:14,680 The I and PW will be painted 82 00:04:14,680 --> 00:04:18,640 in almost a matching color of the lighthouse. 83 00:04:18,640 --> 00:04:21,000 And then the way it'll be set is 84 00:04:22,200 --> 00:04:26,160 if you are walking along the inner harbor on the sidewalk, 85 00:04:26,160 --> 00:04:28,800 when you get to the last staircase in the teardrop 86 00:04:28,800 --> 00:04:30,760 that Bob was referring to, 87 00:04:30,760 --> 00:04:34,080 it will be just to the south of that. 88 00:04:34,080 --> 00:04:37,760 And then it will be angled in a fashion 89 00:04:37,760 --> 00:04:40,680 so that when you're downtown at Rotary Park, 90 00:04:40,680 --> 00:04:42,640 inventors, brew pub, et cetera, 91 00:04:42,640 --> 00:04:44,160 you'll be able to read and see it. 92 00:04:44,160 --> 00:04:48,720 But then it is also designed so that our hope 93 00:04:48,720 --> 00:04:50,400 and my hope with this particular sculpture 94 00:04:50,400 --> 00:04:52,520 was that this would become kind of the focal point 95 00:04:52,520 --> 00:04:57,040 for homecoming, prom, wedding pictures, reunions, 96 00:04:57,040 --> 00:04:58,080 welcome, production. 97 00:04:58,080 --> 00:05:00,640 But then also draw more people over to Coldock Park. 98 00:05:00,640 --> 00:05:03,320 It's a highly underutilized space 99 00:05:03,320 --> 00:05:05,200 because it's not really easy to get to 100 00:05:05,200 --> 00:05:06,360 if you don't know how to navigate it. 101 00:05:06,360 --> 00:05:08,160 So that's what it is. 102 00:05:08,160 --> 00:05:09,760 It's being donated by Cloverleaf 103 00:05:09,760 --> 00:05:13,640 and then CD Smith gave an additional $10,000 104 00:05:13,640 --> 00:05:15,760 so that we could keep a fund for maintenance. 105 00:05:15,760 --> 00:05:17,880 It will be fully landscaped around the platform 106 00:05:17,880 --> 00:05:19,040 on a concrete platform. 107 00:05:19,040 --> 00:05:21,800 It will be poured into the platform. 108 00:05:21,800 --> 00:05:24,720 And then it will be what is it magnetically painted 109 00:05:24,720 --> 00:05:29,240 so it'll be painted very well. 110 00:05:29,240 --> 00:05:31,400 So it's kind of the background. 111 00:05:31,400 --> 00:05:32,920 That's this. 112 00:05:32,920 --> 00:05:35,280 So any other questions on that or wonderings? 113 00:05:37,360 --> 00:05:39,400 I'm just writing it for you. 114 00:05:39,400 --> 00:05:41,240 Lighting is included in it. 115 00:05:41,240 --> 00:05:44,080 So it will be lit from a distance 116 00:05:44,080 --> 00:05:47,720 and it will be lit throughout the evening. 117 00:05:47,720 --> 00:05:51,560 So yeah, so the money raised was to ensure 118 00:05:51,560 --> 00:05:54,080 that we could light it, landscape it and then maintain it. 119 00:05:54,080 --> 00:05:57,400 So there'll be a fund kept by the Friends of Park and Rec 120 00:05:57,400 --> 00:06:00,280 to be able to offer repairs, et cetera for it. 121 00:06:01,360 --> 00:06:02,560 Yeah, good question. 122 00:06:02,560 --> 00:06:03,920 Sorry, I missed that point. 123 00:06:07,000 --> 00:06:08,560 Is it steel? 124 00:06:08,560 --> 00:06:09,840 Yeah, it's also steel. 125 00:06:09,840 --> 00:06:12,360 Yeah, it's fabricated and it's not tubular 126 00:06:12,360 --> 00:06:13,440 but I think it, what is it? 127 00:06:13,440 --> 00:06:14,760 I think it's a foot wide. 128 00:06:16,920 --> 00:06:20,080 Yeah, it is being manufactured up in the Fond du Lac area. 129 00:06:20,080 --> 00:06:20,920 Okay. 130 00:06:21,800 --> 00:06:23,800 And CD Smith fled out the whole project for us 131 00:06:23,800 --> 00:06:26,360 and donated, like I said, some time and effort 132 00:06:26,360 --> 00:06:28,240 as well as some money. 133 00:06:30,000 --> 00:06:31,800 I'll move approval. 134 00:06:31,800 --> 00:06:32,920 There's a motion to approve. 135 00:06:32,920 --> 00:06:34,320 Roger, did you have a question? 136 00:06:35,320 --> 00:06:36,480 Although I just can't make a second 137 00:06:36,480 --> 00:06:38,480 so we can stay on a little Robert's motion. 138 00:06:38,480 --> 00:06:39,840 Okay, so there's a motion and a second 139 00:06:39,840 --> 00:06:41,280 and did you have something, Roger? 140 00:06:41,280 --> 00:06:42,880 I just say, I'm in favor of public art 141 00:06:42,880 --> 00:06:44,560 so I'm all for this. 142 00:06:44,560 --> 00:06:46,360 Yep, appreciate that. 143 00:06:46,360 --> 00:06:48,920 Okay, any other questions on this? 144 00:06:48,920 --> 00:06:51,240 All right, seeing none, all in favor signify by saying aye. 145 00:06:51,240 --> 00:06:53,320 Aye. Aye. Opposed? 146 00:06:53,320 --> 00:06:54,960 All right, motion carries. 147 00:06:54,960 --> 00:06:56,080 Roger, I joined with you. 148 00:06:56,080 --> 00:06:59,520 I mean, my hope is that this installation 149 00:06:59,520 --> 00:07:03,520 will then create a consciousness 150 00:07:03,520 --> 00:07:05,000 around other philanthropists that like, 151 00:07:05,000 --> 00:07:09,120 hey, we can actually realize sculptures not just there 152 00:07:09,120 --> 00:07:11,280 but throughout the city to match our murals 153 00:07:11,280 --> 00:07:12,680 that we put in place. 154 00:07:12,680 --> 00:07:16,400 So another reason to visit for Washington or to stay. 155 00:07:16,400 --> 00:07:19,160 All right, that brings us into agenda item number four, 156 00:07:19,160 --> 00:07:21,880 which is the zoning code rewrite. 157 00:07:21,880 --> 00:07:24,000 This is a staff update and discussion item 158 00:07:24,000 --> 00:07:28,280 only on draft articles 18 and appendix C dimensional standards, 159 00:07:28,280 --> 00:07:30,800 19 engineering and environmental standards 160 00:07:30,840 --> 00:07:35,840 and 20 architectural standards for the proposed zoning rewrite. 161 00:07:35,840 --> 00:07:37,520 Mr. Harris, as we move into this, 162 00:07:37,520 --> 00:07:40,640 the one thing that I wanted to just reserve 163 00:07:40,640 --> 00:07:42,840 for your time is a little bit about 164 00:07:44,000 --> 00:07:47,240 when we get into architectural standards, 165 00:07:47,240 --> 00:07:50,480 some of the height considerations for multi-families 166 00:07:50,480 --> 00:07:55,480 that in this draft that I think before we send it to council, 167 00:07:55,480 --> 00:07:56,960 I'd like to get us to consensus 168 00:07:56,960 --> 00:08:00,320 because I don't think everybody wants to go to 48 feet. 169 00:08:01,040 --> 00:08:03,400 No, you'll see that I have shown. 170 00:08:03,400 --> 00:08:05,360 There's a slide for that. 171 00:08:05,360 --> 00:08:07,040 Slide, all right. 172 00:08:07,040 --> 00:08:08,200 You have the floor, sir. 173 00:08:08,200 --> 00:08:10,880 All right, so actually through a little bit 174 00:08:10,880 --> 00:08:13,400 of a lot of information at you. 175 00:08:13,400 --> 00:08:15,160 And so as we're coming in, 176 00:08:15,160 --> 00:08:19,440 starting to kind of come down in altitude 177 00:08:19,440 --> 00:08:23,160 and start lining up for a landing, it's pretty soon. 178 00:08:23,160 --> 00:08:26,960 This is kind of the, you know, some significant chapters. 179 00:08:26,960 --> 00:08:31,400 And so let me just, as I have been doing, 180 00:08:31,400 --> 00:08:34,720 we're just introducing these chapters or articles 181 00:08:34,720 --> 00:08:35,960 as they're technically called. 182 00:08:35,960 --> 00:08:38,440 And then just kind of what some of the, 183 00:08:38,440 --> 00:08:41,800 I'll summarize or just kind of point out some questions 184 00:08:41,800 --> 00:08:44,640 or issues that I want to, you know, 185 00:08:44,640 --> 00:08:48,880 throw at the plan commission for any possible discussions. 186 00:08:48,880 --> 00:08:52,080 So I'll just start going through 18, 19, 20 187 00:08:52,120 --> 00:08:57,040 and then laying out some of the issues for that. 188 00:08:57,040 --> 00:08:59,520 So starting with the dimensional standards. 189 00:09:00,720 --> 00:09:04,160 This is, you know, as we see, you know, 190 00:09:04,160 --> 00:09:06,680 this is defining lot area setbacks. 191 00:09:07,520 --> 00:09:09,040 Building heights, as mentioned, 192 00:09:09,040 --> 00:09:10,760 and we'll get back to that, you know, 193 00:09:10,760 --> 00:09:13,240 and then kind of the accessory garages 194 00:09:13,240 --> 00:09:15,680 and how things are measured, how big they are, 195 00:09:15,680 --> 00:09:18,120 how they're placed on the lots. 196 00:09:18,120 --> 00:09:21,240 But I did want to highlight some 197 00:09:21,240 --> 00:09:25,000 of the building height components to this. 198 00:09:25,000 --> 00:09:27,360 And then again, this is discussion. 199 00:09:27,360 --> 00:09:29,840 We're not deciding anything tonight. 200 00:09:29,840 --> 00:09:31,760 But this is, as the mayor pointed out, 201 00:09:31,760 --> 00:09:33,960 something that we can discuss. 202 00:09:33,960 --> 00:09:37,640 And prior to going into the approval cycle, 203 00:09:37,640 --> 00:09:41,320 try to get some consensus between now and then. 204 00:09:41,320 --> 00:09:45,000 So real quick, a little highlight that I thought 205 00:09:45,000 --> 00:09:47,160 was actually having the diagrams 206 00:09:47,160 --> 00:09:51,400 of how certain buildings with rooflines are measured. 207 00:09:51,400 --> 00:09:54,760 I know in the past, there was always sometimes 208 00:09:54,760 --> 00:09:57,040 some confusion with how building heights are measured, 209 00:09:57,040 --> 00:09:59,840 particularly our garage heights measured 210 00:09:59,840 --> 00:10:02,560 when we would have some of these special exceptions. 211 00:10:02,560 --> 00:10:05,360 And so we kind of have a picture for everyone. 212 00:10:05,360 --> 00:10:09,720 And I think it kind of demonstrates, you know, 213 00:10:09,720 --> 00:10:11,360 how to measure based on these rooflines. 214 00:10:11,360 --> 00:10:14,800 This is actually too much different from our current code. 215 00:10:14,800 --> 00:10:17,240 It's just that when you see the diagram 216 00:10:17,240 --> 00:10:18,840 it makes a big difference. 217 00:10:18,840 --> 00:10:22,200 And so we're going to see them in front of you. 218 00:10:22,200 --> 00:10:23,880 The other item I wanted to bring up, 219 00:10:23,880 --> 00:10:25,520 or just kind of mention at least, 220 00:10:25,520 --> 00:10:30,520 was the idea of a required step back for attached garages. 221 00:10:30,600 --> 00:10:33,360 And I think the intent text that we see here 222 00:10:33,360 --> 00:10:34,600 kind of sums it up. 223 00:10:34,600 --> 00:10:38,000 And it's just so we kind of have in Port Washington 224 00:10:38,000 --> 00:10:41,640 moving forward, if we get this far with this provision, 225 00:10:41,640 --> 00:10:46,640 is highlighting the residential portion of a house 226 00:10:46,800 --> 00:10:49,000 fronting a street and in a neighborhood 227 00:10:49,000 --> 00:10:51,960 rather than, you know, the garage portion of it. 228 00:10:51,960 --> 00:10:55,280 And so the proposal in the zoning code 229 00:10:55,280 --> 00:10:58,240 will be a kind of a modest step back 230 00:10:58,240 --> 00:11:00,360 from the front living portion of the house. 231 00:11:00,360 --> 00:11:03,720 And then, and so the garage doors are, you know, 232 00:11:03,720 --> 00:11:05,560 in this case, they're proposed for like a two, 233 00:11:05,560 --> 00:11:07,800 just a modest two foot setback. 234 00:11:07,800 --> 00:11:10,480 And then that kind of gives, you know, 235 00:11:10,480 --> 00:11:12,160 that kind of gives a prominence 236 00:11:12,160 --> 00:11:14,320 to the residential portion of the house 237 00:11:14,320 --> 00:11:16,800 and kind of its neighborhoods for people 238 00:11:16,800 --> 00:11:21,120 and kind of puts the cars in the back seat, so to speak. 239 00:11:21,120 --> 00:11:23,560 So I just wanted to highlight that. 240 00:11:23,560 --> 00:11:26,800 Just moving into touching on the building heights, 241 00:11:26,800 --> 00:11:30,920 I thought I'd get some previously reviewed 242 00:11:30,920 --> 00:11:35,920 multifamily apartments and kind of showing their heights 243 00:11:36,920 --> 00:11:41,920 in comparison to what is proposed, at least or drafted in. 244 00:11:42,320 --> 00:11:47,320 Real quick, RM4 is the multifamily district 245 00:11:49,760 --> 00:11:51,360 that we have now. 246 00:11:51,360 --> 00:11:56,360 And then R4 will be, is the multi-district 247 00:11:57,200 --> 00:11:58,560 in the proposed code. 248 00:11:59,560 --> 00:12:04,200 As some of you may know, 60 feet has been the maximum height 249 00:12:04,280 --> 00:12:09,160 in our RM4 district for as far as I can tell, decades. 250 00:12:09,160 --> 00:12:11,880 It's a pretty big, it's a pretty tall height. 251 00:12:11,880 --> 00:12:14,360 And I don't think outside of downtown 252 00:12:14,360 --> 00:12:17,800 that it's come up at least since I've been here. 253 00:12:17,800 --> 00:12:20,440 And I remember even when I first got here, 254 00:12:20,440 --> 00:12:23,440 architects remarking that, you know, 255 00:12:23,440 --> 00:12:26,920 for a, you know, outside of a major city 256 00:12:26,920 --> 00:12:29,440 or a density in the Milwaukee area, 257 00:12:29,440 --> 00:12:31,040 you know, they were surprised to see that. 258 00:12:31,040 --> 00:12:36,040 So I think it's outlived its life in this code. 259 00:12:36,200 --> 00:12:39,080 I think it hasn't been used outside of downtown. 260 00:12:39,080 --> 00:12:42,120 And so we're looking at, you know, 261 00:12:42,120 --> 00:12:44,440 changing the maximum height 262 00:12:44,440 --> 00:12:48,400 of our dense multifamily district that we'll have. 263 00:12:48,400 --> 00:12:51,360 Currently in the draft that you had, it is 60 feet. 264 00:12:51,360 --> 00:12:54,720 I've since, you know, given the heads up to our consultants 265 00:12:54,720 --> 00:12:56,440 that this should come down. 266 00:12:57,520 --> 00:12:59,880 I have the suggestion at 48 feet, 267 00:12:59,880 --> 00:13:01,920 it's actually, I eventually have a suggestion 268 00:13:01,920 --> 00:13:04,720 that previously was 42 feet. 269 00:13:04,720 --> 00:13:07,560 And I can just show, you know, how we get there. 270 00:13:07,560 --> 00:13:11,320 So real quick, the apartment on the top, 271 00:13:11,320 --> 00:13:15,680 that was a proposal that you saw last year, 272 00:13:15,680 --> 00:13:17,840 late last year on Seven Hills Road 273 00:13:17,840 --> 00:13:20,360 between the Holiday Inn and the parking ride a lot. 274 00:13:20,360 --> 00:13:22,120 This is a four-story building. 275 00:13:22,120 --> 00:13:25,200 And based on their submitted elevations, 276 00:13:25,200 --> 00:13:26,800 granted it was just a concept plan, 277 00:13:26,800 --> 00:13:29,080 but their submitted elevations showed 278 00:13:29,080 --> 00:13:34,040 about a 49-foot building height up to the top, 279 00:13:34,040 --> 00:13:35,920 the ridge line or the top of the roof. 280 00:13:37,640 --> 00:13:41,960 This is a slide below is a cardinal capital proposal 281 00:13:41,960 --> 00:13:44,360 from about seven years ago on LL. 282 00:13:44,360 --> 00:13:49,120 Again, a four-story building and looking at, 283 00:13:49,120 --> 00:13:51,160 it was approximately 46, 284 00:13:51,160 --> 00:13:54,520 and not approximately 46 feet. 285 00:13:54,520 --> 00:13:56,120 Again, this is a flat roof, 286 00:13:56,120 --> 00:13:58,380 so up to that flat roof line. 287 00:13:59,240 --> 00:14:02,160 A little more perspective for you all, 288 00:14:02,160 --> 00:14:04,560 looking at the recent police and fire building. 289 00:14:05,680 --> 00:14:10,680 That top section over the overhead fire doors is 35 feet. 290 00:14:11,680 --> 00:14:16,680 45 feet is actually the top of the base of the host tower 291 00:14:17,440 --> 00:14:21,040 and then the light fixture, that part is above it. 292 00:14:21,040 --> 00:14:24,160 So just to give you perspective of 35 feet, 293 00:14:24,160 --> 00:14:26,280 looks like 45 feet looks like. 294 00:14:26,280 --> 00:14:29,120 And then getting to that 42 feet, 295 00:14:29,120 --> 00:14:33,160 that was that I kind of suggest, 296 00:14:33,160 --> 00:14:34,720 that has been discussed. 297 00:14:34,720 --> 00:14:39,600 And this is kind of the harbor springs on Highway 32, 298 00:14:39,600 --> 00:14:41,800 which I think is a, you know, 299 00:14:41,800 --> 00:14:43,080 the scale of that building, 300 00:14:43,080 --> 00:14:45,880 I think really granted it's oriented, 301 00:14:45,880 --> 00:14:50,880 you know, the short faces is fronting 32. 302 00:14:51,880 --> 00:14:56,000 But I think overall, this is a nice scale for port. 303 00:14:56,000 --> 00:14:59,640 And then you can see how it's about 42, 304 00:14:59,640 --> 00:15:02,840 approximately 42 feet, again, to that ridge line. 305 00:15:02,840 --> 00:15:06,320 And so I think, you know, 306 00:15:06,320 --> 00:15:08,240 I don't think there's any argument 307 00:15:08,240 --> 00:15:10,200 about getting away from that 60 feet. 308 00:15:10,200 --> 00:15:12,360 And then the discussion is, 309 00:15:12,360 --> 00:15:15,120 how do we, where do we wanna land? 310 00:15:15,120 --> 00:15:18,320 42 feet, 45 feet, 48 feet. 311 00:15:18,360 --> 00:15:21,400 And then we also have to take into consideration, 312 00:15:21,400 --> 00:15:25,280 you know, the different types of roof lines. 313 00:15:25,280 --> 00:15:26,600 So how we measure that. 314 00:15:26,600 --> 00:15:29,160 So that's what I really wanted to bring 315 00:15:29,160 --> 00:15:32,160 to the commission's attention. 316 00:15:32,160 --> 00:15:33,960 Maybe have some discussion tonight, 317 00:15:33,960 --> 00:15:36,040 and that can continue. 318 00:15:37,280 --> 00:15:40,400 Just moving along and highlighting the next chapter, 319 00:15:40,400 --> 00:15:42,200 as far as architectural standards. 320 00:15:42,200 --> 00:15:43,520 Well, let me back up. 321 00:15:43,520 --> 00:15:46,280 Engineering and environmental standards, 322 00:15:46,280 --> 00:15:49,680 not much to them, it's a short chapter. 323 00:15:49,680 --> 00:15:51,920 And a lot of it is just kind of required items, 324 00:15:51,920 --> 00:15:54,600 like state's required items. 325 00:15:54,600 --> 00:15:57,800 It does make a provision for the commission, 326 00:15:57,800 --> 00:16:01,400 can make have the power to require a, 327 00:16:01,400 --> 00:16:03,840 or ask for a traffic study 328 00:16:03,840 --> 00:16:06,400 for any development that comes up. 329 00:16:06,400 --> 00:16:09,080 The only thing I would add is just, 330 00:16:09,080 --> 00:16:11,120 instead of requiring a traffic study 331 00:16:11,120 --> 00:16:14,240 for certain benchmarks of a development, 332 00:16:15,000 --> 00:16:17,240 I think it'd be best and a little more flexible 333 00:16:17,240 --> 00:16:20,480 if this is an optional tool 334 00:16:20,480 --> 00:16:23,000 that the commission can have in their back pocket 335 00:16:23,000 --> 00:16:25,920 and not necessarily a requirement. 336 00:16:25,920 --> 00:16:29,440 I think I can opine on parking studies. 337 00:16:29,440 --> 00:16:32,000 I think the city engineer can as well. 338 00:16:32,000 --> 00:16:33,720 I think it'd be a little more flexible 339 00:16:33,720 --> 00:16:38,280 if you just have that ability on a case-to-case basis 340 00:16:38,280 --> 00:16:40,720 and rather than requiring one. 341 00:16:41,080 --> 00:16:44,520 And then finally moving to architectural standards. 342 00:16:44,520 --> 00:16:46,600 A couple of highlights in my report, 343 00:16:48,120 --> 00:16:52,400 requiring a four-sided architecture in defined cases. 344 00:16:52,400 --> 00:16:55,000 What that means is that it's not just 345 00:16:55,000 --> 00:16:57,920 the nice face of the building, 346 00:16:57,920 --> 00:17:02,920 it's on the front having kind of the architectural, 347 00:17:04,400 --> 00:17:06,360 the nicer architectural details, 348 00:17:06,360 --> 00:17:10,360 but if there's a building backing into a residential, 349 00:17:10,360 --> 00:17:15,360 then so the public right-of-way facing front 350 00:17:15,680 --> 00:17:17,480 should also have some type of standards 351 00:17:17,480 --> 00:17:20,680 for the residential portions as well. 352 00:17:20,680 --> 00:17:23,960 It's not just residential, it's just if it's visible 353 00:17:23,960 --> 00:17:27,560 and it's not requiring a full treatment, 354 00:17:27,560 --> 00:17:31,240 but for example, if you're driving down 43 south in Mequon, 355 00:17:31,240 --> 00:17:36,240 you see that longer strip mall that backs into 43. 356 00:17:36,480 --> 00:17:39,520 Four-sided architecture also can just include matching 357 00:17:39,520 --> 00:17:41,840 paint color in some of the details. 358 00:17:41,840 --> 00:17:43,560 And on that strip mall, Mequon, 359 00:17:43,560 --> 00:17:46,560 you see like the blue matching color in the front, 360 00:17:46,560 --> 00:17:50,920 there's trim paint and it just kind of helps it blend in 361 00:17:50,920 --> 00:17:54,600 rather than the stark unfinished or untreated 362 00:17:54,600 --> 00:17:57,640 block brick masonry or what have you. 363 00:17:57,640 --> 00:18:01,600 The other one is when, I think it's the one 364 00:18:01,600 --> 00:18:03,120 that was the family dollar, 365 00:18:03,120 --> 00:18:07,720 I remember talking to Marty Becker when he was mayor 366 00:18:07,760 --> 00:18:10,280 and he told a story about how the city required 367 00:18:10,280 --> 00:18:13,280 some type of finishing product on the roof lines 368 00:18:13,280 --> 00:18:15,200 since it was backing up onto the residential. 369 00:18:15,200 --> 00:18:18,600 So that's what it means by four-sided architecture. 370 00:18:18,600 --> 00:18:22,160 It's just nice having that codified in a new zoning code. 371 00:18:23,080 --> 00:18:27,480 The other item is just pointing out scale, 372 00:18:27,480 --> 00:18:32,000 scale of residential homes next to each other, 373 00:18:32,000 --> 00:18:35,240 but also when there's a residential district, 374 00:18:35,240 --> 00:18:37,440 a budding and non-residential district 375 00:18:37,440 --> 00:18:39,880 and requiring a certain kind of scale. 376 00:18:39,880 --> 00:18:44,880 So in the example above, there's an idea 377 00:18:45,840 --> 00:18:50,840 where residential additions within a residential district, 378 00:18:52,200 --> 00:18:54,280 the plan commission and the code 379 00:18:54,280 --> 00:18:57,040 would provide some language to prevent kind of, 380 00:18:57,040 --> 00:19:00,400 and this is an exaggeration example for port, 381 00:19:00,400 --> 00:19:04,400 but this is an actual, this actually happened. 382 00:19:04,400 --> 00:19:07,240 And so to prevent kind of these out of scale additions 383 00:19:07,960 --> 00:19:10,960 or new homes that could be part of any rebuild. 384 00:19:10,960 --> 00:19:13,160 So it's not just completely, 385 00:19:13,160 --> 00:19:17,720 it's preventing some form exaggerated or not 386 00:19:17,720 --> 00:19:19,760 this type of situation. 387 00:19:21,000 --> 00:19:21,840 Excuse me. 388 00:19:23,400 --> 00:19:26,080 Wanna note this picture here 389 00:19:26,080 --> 00:19:28,880 with the large residential addition. 390 00:19:28,880 --> 00:19:31,000 This is a recent story from the New York Times 391 00:19:31,000 --> 00:19:33,760 and I remember noting that when I was reading it, 392 00:19:33,760 --> 00:19:36,560 but I also got an email from a resident 393 00:19:36,600 --> 00:19:38,080 referring to the same article. 394 00:19:38,080 --> 00:19:39,840 So that kind of, you know, 395 00:19:39,840 --> 00:19:42,120 there was kind of nice to see that. 396 00:19:42,120 --> 00:19:44,560 The code is covering what, you know, 397 00:19:44,560 --> 00:19:47,400 what kind of public input I've received so far. 398 00:19:47,400 --> 00:19:49,120 The other items are just kind of simple. 399 00:19:49,120 --> 00:19:52,080 Like for example, in the design review board 400 00:19:52,080 --> 00:19:54,840 kind of is on top of this, but taking these large, 401 00:19:54,840 --> 00:19:56,680 some of these multifamily buildings 402 00:19:56,680 --> 00:19:58,800 or commercial buildings for that matter 403 00:19:58,800 --> 00:20:02,560 and just ensuring what I put as a building needs a hat. 404 00:20:02,560 --> 00:20:05,680 That's kind of my, one of my little pet peeves 405 00:20:05,680 --> 00:20:07,400 of certain types of architecture, 406 00:20:07,400 --> 00:20:09,920 particularly some that's going on today 407 00:20:09,920 --> 00:20:12,520 where you just have minimal coping 408 00:20:12,520 --> 00:20:14,640 really or no parapets at all. 409 00:20:14,640 --> 00:20:18,560 So this code is gonna require that we get it, 410 00:20:18,560 --> 00:20:21,960 we don't have this situation in the bottom left-hand sort 411 00:20:21,960 --> 00:20:24,000 where it's just kind of this flat building 412 00:20:24,000 --> 00:20:27,000 with minimal treatment at the rough edge. 413 00:20:27,000 --> 00:20:31,160 So we kind of have some visual variety 414 00:20:31,160 --> 00:20:32,880 and distinction at the top. 415 00:20:32,880 --> 00:20:37,280 And then just a simple thing of requiring mechanical screening. 416 00:20:37,280 --> 00:20:40,200 That's not a, it's not something that's in our code 417 00:20:40,200 --> 00:20:43,760 and that's a pretty standard requirement. 418 00:20:44,760 --> 00:20:46,880 I think that's all I have for this. 419 00:20:46,880 --> 00:20:49,240 But I know going back to discussion here 420 00:20:49,240 --> 00:20:54,240 is the idea of our multi, our RM4 type of multifamily 421 00:20:56,360 --> 00:20:59,480 and getting away from 60 feet and where do we wanna land? 422 00:20:59,480 --> 00:21:01,600 I will note that it's not much of an issue 423 00:21:01,600 --> 00:21:04,120 for the remaining districts, they're all pretty consistent 424 00:21:04,120 --> 00:21:08,160 or it's all pretty much the same as what we have now. 425 00:21:08,160 --> 00:21:10,640 Residential districts in our current code, 426 00:21:10,640 --> 00:21:12,080 it's always been 30 feet. 427 00:21:13,160 --> 00:21:15,520 There's a newer addition where it's gonna be, 428 00:21:15,520 --> 00:21:17,720 it's proposed they have 32 feet. 429 00:21:17,720 --> 00:21:21,800 The older multifamily districts in the proposed code, 430 00:21:21,800 --> 00:21:25,960 there hasn't changed, it's about 35 feet or so. 431 00:21:25,960 --> 00:21:30,040 So it's really this RM4, this high density multifamily district 432 00:21:30,880 --> 00:21:34,720 that's really bears or needs some discussion 433 00:21:34,720 --> 00:21:37,080 on where we wanna go with that. 434 00:21:37,080 --> 00:21:39,560 And with that, I'll stop my summary 435 00:21:39,560 --> 00:21:41,280 and throw it over to the commission. 436 00:21:42,880 --> 00:21:44,520 Questions or wonderings for Bob? 437 00:21:46,040 --> 00:21:46,880 Mr. Ehrlich. 438 00:21:48,160 --> 00:21:50,440 Quick question I have is in 439 00:21:53,240 --> 00:21:56,240 where you start looking at how you're measuring the heights, 440 00:21:56,240 --> 00:21:59,880 building heights and how you've shown 441 00:21:59,880 --> 00:22:04,200 that graphic and where you kind of cut the peak in half 442 00:22:04,200 --> 00:22:05,320 and so on and so forth. 443 00:22:05,320 --> 00:22:07,480 But we're not being very consistent 444 00:22:07,480 --> 00:22:10,280 if you're looking at some of the other things 445 00:22:10,280 --> 00:22:12,880 where you're going to the peak, you know what I mean? 446 00:22:12,880 --> 00:22:15,640 We have to make sure that we're very clear 447 00:22:15,640 --> 00:22:18,120 where we're changing it, if we're going to change it 448 00:22:18,120 --> 00:22:20,480 or if we're gonna count that 42 feet 449 00:22:20,480 --> 00:22:24,320 or that 45 feet to the middle, correct. 450 00:22:24,320 --> 00:22:28,640 Okay, and then the other thing that I wanted to talk about 451 00:22:28,640 --> 00:22:32,040 which is not on the slide is there's exceptions 452 00:22:32,040 --> 00:22:34,440 to the building height that you have. 453 00:22:35,640 --> 00:22:38,480 And that was something that was kind of a thing 454 00:22:38,480 --> 00:22:40,080 of contention on some buildings 455 00:22:40,080 --> 00:22:43,800 that were proposed here in downtown. 456 00:22:43,800 --> 00:22:46,320 One of it is the elevator penthouse, 457 00:22:46,320 --> 00:22:49,360 allowing that to go above that minimum height. 458 00:22:51,080 --> 00:22:52,800 Is that, I just wanna make sure 459 00:22:52,800 --> 00:22:54,160 that we're all on the same page 460 00:22:54,160 --> 00:22:56,920 that that's an exception that we want 461 00:22:56,920 --> 00:23:01,920 or is it, look, it's 45 feet and that's it, you know? 462 00:23:02,240 --> 00:23:04,840 Now downtown will have its own, really? 463 00:23:04,840 --> 00:23:06,200 Okay, yeah. 464 00:23:08,040 --> 00:23:11,000 I mean, and I'm not saying one way or another at this point, 465 00:23:11,000 --> 00:23:13,040 I just wanna make sure that we're all on the same page 466 00:23:13,040 --> 00:23:18,040 that that doesn't become something that it's, well, yeah, but, 467 00:23:18,880 --> 00:23:19,720 you know. 468 00:23:19,720 --> 00:23:21,440 I'm sorry, I agree with you on that 469 00:23:21,440 --> 00:23:26,440 because one of the notes I took in my packet was, 470 00:23:27,440 --> 00:23:31,960 if we set it at 48 or 42 or 51 feet, 471 00:23:32,840 --> 00:23:35,320 how often are we gonna be sitting here 472 00:23:35,320 --> 00:23:37,440 going against the intention which was to be able 473 00:23:37,440 --> 00:23:39,920 to just simply call balls and strikes on everything 474 00:23:39,920 --> 00:23:41,920 and then have people coming in for variances 475 00:23:41,920 --> 00:23:45,960 because as we saw with the potential apartment development 476 00:23:45,960 --> 00:23:47,680 on the north side, that's a canned, 477 00:23:47,680 --> 00:23:49,640 pre-architecturally designed, developed piece 478 00:23:49,640 --> 00:23:51,840 with a good ROI for the developer 479 00:23:51,840 --> 00:23:54,280 and who the heck is poor Washington to say, 480 00:23:54,280 --> 00:23:56,800 I can't be at 46 feet, every other community in the world 481 00:23:56,800 --> 00:23:59,920 is at 46 feet, so how do I cut four feet off of this 482 00:23:59,920 --> 00:24:02,480 or how do I add, you know, those different pieces? 483 00:24:02,480 --> 00:24:06,080 Because I, when we can set it wherever we want to, 484 00:24:07,160 --> 00:24:09,280 and make that recommendation up to council, 485 00:24:09,280 --> 00:24:11,720 I just, my greater concern is, 486 00:24:13,400 --> 00:24:16,120 wherever we set it, I just want it to be in a spot 487 00:24:16,120 --> 00:24:20,960 where that's a standard for that type of level development 488 00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:23,440 because I don't think poor Washington is appropriate 489 00:24:23,440 --> 00:24:27,920 for eight, nine, 10 stories anywhere yet, 490 00:24:27,920 --> 00:24:30,640 but as we do that, I just want to make sure 491 00:24:30,640 --> 00:24:32,600 that that's something we can answer. 492 00:24:33,760 --> 00:24:37,160 Because I thought we had settled on 42 feet 493 00:24:37,160 --> 00:24:39,480 and when I saw 48, I was a little surprised. 494 00:24:39,480 --> 00:24:40,520 Mr. Reyer? 495 00:24:40,520 --> 00:24:45,520 Yep, yeah, I would echo, I'm at 42 at the top end 496 00:24:46,480 --> 00:24:48,760 for what I would be comfortable with. 497 00:24:48,800 --> 00:24:51,160 You look at the rest of the residential districts 498 00:24:51,160 --> 00:24:53,640 and like Bob said, you're sitting at like 32 feet 499 00:24:53,640 --> 00:24:54,760 for most of them. 500 00:24:55,680 --> 00:24:59,680 The neighbors that came in when the taller buildings 501 00:24:59,680 --> 00:25:01,560 were proposed by the old hospital, 502 00:25:01,560 --> 00:25:04,200 I think we heard them pretty much loud and clear 503 00:25:04,200 --> 00:25:07,400 that when you're dealing with an existing residential 504 00:25:07,400 --> 00:25:09,280 neighborhood, people were not in support 505 00:25:09,280 --> 00:25:11,600 of something that was out of scale. 506 00:25:11,600 --> 00:25:15,000 And there's not too many areas of town 507 00:25:15,000 --> 00:25:17,120 that already have that height. 508 00:25:17,120 --> 00:25:19,160 So almost anywhere you go and anywhere you build 509 00:25:19,160 --> 00:25:21,600 unless you're really separated from that, 510 00:25:21,600 --> 00:25:25,240 you're gonna have existing residential that's shorter 511 00:25:25,240 --> 00:25:28,720 right next to something that could be a lot taller. 512 00:25:28,720 --> 00:25:31,120 And I agree with the two of you, the comments, 513 00:25:32,840 --> 00:25:37,840 either removing the exceptions from anywhere other 514 00:25:38,040 --> 00:25:42,480 than downtown, otherwise you probably are gonna be in here 515 00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:44,920 with each developer with a product 516 00:25:44,920 --> 00:25:47,240 that's been successful somewhere else, 517 00:25:47,240 --> 00:25:50,400 making their case that I can do this project 518 00:25:50,400 --> 00:25:52,920 but only if I get the extra five feet 519 00:25:52,920 --> 00:25:57,480 or the extra six feet or what is the height, 520 00:25:57,480 --> 00:25:59,480 where does the height stop, 521 00:25:59,480 --> 00:26:02,960 then can I do a such and such on top? 522 00:26:02,960 --> 00:26:05,960 And then I feel like we're back to where we've been before 523 00:26:05,960 --> 00:26:08,840 and I would just encourage us as a group 524 00:26:08,840 --> 00:26:13,200 to stick with that shorter height, that 42 feet as a cap 525 00:26:14,200 --> 00:26:19,120 and outside of the downtown area where people might come in 526 00:26:19,120 --> 00:26:21,240 and pitch something that's super unique 527 00:26:21,240 --> 00:26:24,720 and something that the community doesn't wanna pass up on, 528 00:26:24,720 --> 00:26:26,760 really minimizing or removing that exception, 529 00:26:26,760 --> 00:26:30,440 otherwise we'll be faced with that. 530 00:26:30,440 --> 00:26:31,280 So. 531 00:26:32,840 --> 00:26:35,080 Where do other commissioners fall in that? 532 00:26:38,520 --> 00:26:40,480 I'd like to stick with the 42 533 00:26:40,480 --> 00:26:43,200 and talking about the exceptions, 534 00:26:43,200 --> 00:26:45,720 since you and I've been on the planning commission together, 535 00:26:45,720 --> 00:26:49,960 which is I don't wanna get into this variance battle. 536 00:26:49,960 --> 00:26:50,800 Yeah. 537 00:26:50,800 --> 00:26:52,880 I want, no, yes, no, yes, no, 538 00:26:52,880 --> 00:26:54,320 except for the overlay downtown 539 00:26:54,320 --> 00:26:56,800 but I wanna consistent 42. 540 00:26:56,800 --> 00:27:00,400 As well as the planner to be able to stop something 541 00:27:00,400 --> 00:27:03,240 at his desk and say, I'm not gonna recommend that. 542 00:27:04,360 --> 00:27:05,200 Okay. 543 00:27:07,200 --> 00:27:08,240 You okay with 42? 544 00:27:09,080 --> 00:27:11,440 Yeah, I agree with 42 as well, 545 00:27:11,440 --> 00:27:15,040 hearing what you were saying about the existing residential 546 00:27:15,040 --> 00:27:17,640 and then what you mentioned, I think months ago, 547 00:27:17,640 --> 00:27:20,440 about the gateways into town, you know, 548 00:27:20,440 --> 00:27:22,080 the first thing you see, you know, 549 00:27:22,080 --> 00:27:23,520 do you really want something that high? 550 00:27:23,520 --> 00:27:26,960 I think 42 is, I think a better height. 551 00:27:28,040 --> 00:27:31,880 And just something, for me, contextually, 552 00:27:31,880 --> 00:27:33,320 like when I look at, and I'm not, 553 00:27:33,320 --> 00:27:36,200 I don't wanna name any communities, 554 00:27:36,200 --> 00:27:39,240 but there's been some significant apartment growth 555 00:27:39,240 --> 00:27:42,680 in some communities in Ozaki County. 556 00:27:42,680 --> 00:27:44,520 And when you see the scale of some 557 00:27:44,520 --> 00:27:47,040 of those apartment buildings, when you go through, 558 00:27:47,040 --> 00:27:48,520 you know, again, I don't wanna say the name 559 00:27:48,520 --> 00:27:50,080 of the community rhymes with rafting, 560 00:27:50,080 --> 00:27:52,880 but like they're just, they're huge. 561 00:27:52,880 --> 00:27:56,080 And they're kinda weirdly, they're just, 562 00:27:56,080 --> 00:27:59,760 their zoning code must be, I don't know, 563 00:27:59,760 --> 00:28:01,960 it's not critical, but when you drive into town 564 00:28:01,960 --> 00:28:03,640 or you're looking up over the interstate, 565 00:28:03,640 --> 00:28:07,520 it creates that canyon effect that we would lose 566 00:28:07,520 --> 00:28:10,640 a lot of quaintness, and even as we expand to the West 567 00:28:10,640 --> 00:28:13,600 and North and South and Port Washington, 568 00:28:13,600 --> 00:28:16,720 I don't necessarily know that we need that large pieces, 569 00:28:16,720 --> 00:28:19,160 but Roger, what are your thoughts? 570 00:28:19,160 --> 00:28:20,920 Yeah, I guess I'm the only eyeball in here. 571 00:28:20,920 --> 00:28:24,080 I like a four-story building in these areas, 572 00:28:24,080 --> 00:28:27,880 and I guess I equate four stories with 48 feet, so, 573 00:28:27,880 --> 00:28:32,880 I mean, you can always go 42 by going into the ground 574 00:28:32,880 --> 00:28:36,680 and get four stories, but, so, I guess I'm okay with 48, 575 00:28:36,680 --> 00:28:38,800 but I'm not gonna die in that hill. 576 00:28:38,800 --> 00:28:40,120 Yeah. 577 00:28:40,120 --> 00:28:41,040 Darden level. 578 00:28:43,680 --> 00:28:45,240 Right, okay. 579 00:28:45,240 --> 00:28:47,880 I do wanna point out in the proposed code, 580 00:28:47,880 --> 00:28:50,800 it does have a little table of exceptions. 581 00:28:52,280 --> 00:28:57,520 Chimneys, flus, spire steeples, cupolas, 582 00:28:57,520 --> 00:28:59,920 solar chimneys, it does have a, 583 00:28:59,920 --> 00:29:02,400 and then also a elevator pet house. 584 00:29:02,760 --> 00:29:06,400 That's where I kind of was like, okay, we did talk about it, 585 00:29:06,400 --> 00:29:08,880 and so I wanted to make sure everybody knew 586 00:29:08,880 --> 00:29:09,880 what we were getting into, 587 00:29:09,880 --> 00:29:11,520 because these are now exceptions 588 00:29:11,520 --> 00:29:13,880 that we would allow above and beyond that. 589 00:29:13,880 --> 00:29:18,880 So right now, and this is for height outside of downtown, 590 00:29:20,360 --> 00:29:23,720 elevator penthouse, they're proposing up to eight feet 591 00:29:23,720 --> 00:29:25,920 over the maximum building height, which makes sense, 592 00:29:25,920 --> 00:29:28,080 because it's a foot elevator. 593 00:29:28,080 --> 00:29:28,920 Sure. 594 00:29:28,920 --> 00:29:33,920 I'm not gonna get too worried about those exceptions. 595 00:29:36,400 --> 00:29:38,600 It's just, again, if we're sitting in here 596 00:29:38,600 --> 00:29:40,320 in variance hell for an evening, 597 00:29:40,320 --> 00:29:44,920 and then I think that's a greater problem. 598 00:29:44,920 --> 00:29:47,680 I think it might be a nice compromise 599 00:29:47,680 --> 00:29:49,120 to what Roger was saying is, 600 00:29:49,120 --> 00:29:53,120 maybe it allows a little bit more height 601 00:29:53,120 --> 00:29:55,680 so that you could get a little bit higher building. 602 00:29:56,680 --> 00:30:01,240 You know, you can bring the building to the 42 feet, 603 00:30:01,240 --> 00:30:04,640 and then your elevator can go above that if you need it to. 604 00:30:07,440 --> 00:30:09,760 Particularly if it's stepped back enough further 605 00:30:09,760 --> 00:30:13,000 inside the middle of the building floor plate 606 00:30:13,000 --> 00:30:14,160 on the roof plate. 607 00:30:14,160 --> 00:30:15,800 Right, right. 608 00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:18,760 Well, we are making a recommendation, 609 00:30:18,760 --> 00:30:21,720 and our recommendation is, it sounds like 42 feet. 610 00:30:22,720 --> 00:30:25,720 The other recommendation is to provide 611 00:30:25,720 --> 00:30:27,880 an architectural dictionary so I can learn 612 00:30:27,880 --> 00:30:30,440 what a gambrel and a man's art is without, 613 00:30:31,880 --> 00:30:34,440 and a hip cable, these all sound like dance moves 614 00:30:34,440 --> 00:30:35,320 from the 80s. 615 00:30:37,160 --> 00:30:39,880 The man's art is the McDonald's, roughly. 616 00:30:39,880 --> 00:30:42,480 Yeah, no, I see that, but like, I just, 617 00:30:42,480 --> 00:30:45,960 some of the, you know, it's not, 618 00:30:45,960 --> 00:30:49,040 like I just, I don't know if architects lack imagination 619 00:30:49,040 --> 00:30:51,600 in their naming things, or... 620 00:30:51,600 --> 00:30:53,920 There's no lack of imagination in our community. 621 00:30:53,920 --> 00:30:56,600 They're born, yeah, no, just in the words. 622 00:30:56,600 --> 00:30:57,440 Just in the words. 623 00:30:57,440 --> 00:30:58,520 Yeah. 624 00:30:58,520 --> 00:30:59,360 Okay. 625 00:30:59,360 --> 00:31:00,200 I have one question for you. 626 00:31:00,200 --> 00:31:01,120 Mr. Numer? 627 00:31:01,120 --> 00:31:03,240 Just going back to the traffic study, 628 00:31:03,240 --> 00:31:04,840 we're gonna leave as an option. 629 00:31:04,840 --> 00:31:07,520 If we do require that, or a parking study, 630 00:31:07,520 --> 00:31:09,240 does the developer have to pay for that, 631 00:31:09,240 --> 00:31:10,480 or is that on the city? 632 00:31:10,480 --> 00:31:12,920 That's not developer, paying the developer, okay. 633 00:31:12,920 --> 00:31:14,400 That's all it's written in there? 634 00:31:14,400 --> 00:31:15,240 Okay. 635 00:31:15,240 --> 00:31:16,320 Okay, thank you. 636 00:31:16,320 --> 00:31:17,800 I have one other question. 637 00:31:17,800 --> 00:31:18,640 Yeah. 638 00:31:18,640 --> 00:31:19,480 The houses. 639 00:31:19,480 --> 00:31:23,960 So if you, if that design standard gets put in there 640 00:31:23,960 --> 00:31:28,200 and the developer has like a product line of houses 641 00:31:28,200 --> 00:31:30,040 and the menu of options, 642 00:31:31,320 --> 00:31:32,680 does that mean you just sit down with them 643 00:31:32,680 --> 00:31:35,240 and simply say, before you even come in with a plat 644 00:31:35,240 --> 00:31:37,600 and you have like your stock designs, 645 00:31:37,600 --> 00:31:39,480 you just let them know that this is how it is, 646 00:31:39,480 --> 00:31:42,040 and people that wanted to pick that design, 647 00:31:42,040 --> 00:31:43,520 it's just not an option? 648 00:31:43,520 --> 00:31:45,200 Yeah, I've been looking at, you know, 649 00:31:45,200 --> 00:31:50,080 because I'll be talking to kind of the subdivision developers here. 650 00:31:51,160 --> 00:31:52,680 They're kind of trending that way. 651 00:31:52,680 --> 00:31:56,720 This is becoming more of, this is not unique, 652 00:31:56,720 --> 00:31:58,960 this step back for garages. 653 00:31:58,960 --> 00:32:01,160 Yeah, no, I like it. 654 00:32:01,160 --> 00:32:03,440 They have, I've seen like for example, 655 00:32:03,440 --> 00:32:07,880 but both Newman and Billensky, they have products for that. 656 00:32:07,880 --> 00:32:12,720 And so it's much like how garages were a prominent thing, 657 00:32:12,720 --> 00:32:14,080 you know, you can come home from work, 658 00:32:14,080 --> 00:32:17,320 pull into your garage and don't have to worry about anything. 659 00:32:17,320 --> 00:32:18,920 And now we're starting to, you know, 660 00:32:18,920 --> 00:32:22,720 go back to a little more traditional neighborhood development 661 00:32:22,720 --> 00:32:25,960 type of feel for our homes. 662 00:32:25,960 --> 00:32:31,960 And so, this is, I lost track of what was your question. 663 00:32:31,960 --> 00:32:35,960 Yeah, it's as simple as that then. 664 00:32:35,960 --> 00:32:39,560 So just sit down with them and say this is the design. 665 00:32:39,560 --> 00:32:41,560 Yeah, this is where we're going, 666 00:32:41,560 --> 00:32:44,240 this is what the zoning code is being proposed for. 667 00:32:44,240 --> 00:32:46,840 Okay. 668 00:32:46,840 --> 00:32:48,640 Bob, I just want you know, I have high empathy for that, 669 00:32:48,640 --> 00:32:53,720 like trying to thought, you know, 630, mid 50s. 670 00:32:53,720 --> 00:32:55,480 All right. 671 00:32:55,480 --> 00:32:59,720 Appendix C, Zoning Districts and Dimensional Standards. 672 00:32:59,720 --> 00:33:01,640 I didn't have much for that. 673 00:33:01,640 --> 00:33:05,400 It's just kind of a little more diagrammatic 674 00:33:05,400 --> 00:33:08,920 and specific to chapter 18. 675 00:33:11,800 --> 00:33:13,960 I had no questions at anyone else. 676 00:33:13,960 --> 00:33:18,000 No, I just wanted to comment that this is really helpful, 677 00:33:18,000 --> 00:33:22,040 just because I'm digging into the zoning codes a lot. 678 00:33:22,040 --> 00:33:22,880 Yeah. 679 00:33:22,880 --> 00:33:25,040 It's really helpful to, okay, what do they mean by this? 680 00:33:25,040 --> 00:33:28,560 You know, it's so, I appreciate you doing it. 681 00:33:28,560 --> 00:33:30,960 Yeah, I pointed out that, I think in an earlier meeting 682 00:33:30,960 --> 00:33:33,960 where the way how this is coming together, 683 00:33:33,960 --> 00:33:37,440 it's a lot more detailed. 684 00:33:37,440 --> 00:33:40,000 It's a lot more detailed and I think that's helpful. 685 00:33:40,000 --> 00:33:42,720 It's a lot more detailed on spelling out what things are, 686 00:33:42,720 --> 00:33:44,000 what, how they're measured, 687 00:33:44,000 --> 00:33:46,560 and it's also more detailed on the procedure. 688 00:33:46,560 --> 00:33:48,040 Right. 689 00:33:48,040 --> 00:33:51,880 So I think hopefully this will give, 690 00:33:53,000 --> 00:33:55,760 takes out the guesswork, takes out some of the ambiguity. 691 00:33:55,760 --> 00:33:58,520 There'll always be some in a zoning code. 692 00:33:58,520 --> 00:33:59,960 There's a little bit of an art to it, 693 00:33:59,960 --> 00:34:02,000 but I think this is actually, 694 00:34:02,000 --> 00:34:04,720 but this will kind of, I think, really have, 695 00:34:04,720 --> 00:34:08,280 rather going from fuzzy, it's kind of, you know, 696 00:34:08,280 --> 00:34:09,560 more black and white. 697 00:34:09,560 --> 00:34:10,560 Right. 698 00:34:10,560 --> 00:34:11,400 Right. 699 00:34:11,400 --> 00:34:12,240 Yeah. 700 00:34:12,240 --> 00:34:13,080 I appreciate it. 701 00:34:15,600 --> 00:34:16,800 That brings us to Article 19, 702 00:34:16,800 --> 00:34:18,720 Engineering and Environmental Standards. 703 00:34:20,120 --> 00:34:21,920 Oh, I covered that, that was with the. 704 00:34:21,920 --> 00:34:22,840 So we're good with that? 705 00:34:22,840 --> 00:34:23,680 Yeah, we. 706 00:34:23,680 --> 00:34:25,440 Then 20, Architectural Standards, General Standards. 707 00:34:25,440 --> 00:34:26,920 We covered that as well, just now. 708 00:34:26,920 --> 00:34:27,760 We're good to go. 709 00:34:29,280 --> 00:34:31,480 The only wondering, I do have Bob, 710 00:34:31,480 --> 00:34:34,120 as we close out this evening's meeting is, 711 00:34:34,120 --> 00:34:36,240 is there any architect, 712 00:34:36,240 --> 00:34:39,040 and when we're looking at coding, 713 00:34:39,040 --> 00:34:41,320 is there ever built into the code, 714 00:34:41,320 --> 00:34:43,720 review by school district for impact? 715 00:34:45,560 --> 00:34:46,840 Or is that an ordinance? 716 00:34:48,280 --> 00:34:50,440 So, poor question is unique because our superintendents, 717 00:34:50,440 --> 00:34:51,640 our school district's superintendents, 718 00:34:51,640 --> 00:34:54,200 it's on the planning commission for advisory purposes. 719 00:34:54,200 --> 00:34:56,840 But has there ever been, you know, 720 00:34:56,840 --> 00:34:59,360 like if someone wants to come and do a multi, 721 00:35:01,760 --> 00:35:05,080 complex apartment development, 722 00:35:05,080 --> 00:35:08,760 and say it brings 600 apartments to the city, 723 00:35:08,760 --> 00:35:11,840 is there ever a review by the school district 724 00:35:11,840 --> 00:35:13,840 to determine impact before approval? 725 00:35:14,800 --> 00:35:17,480 As part of either the code or ordinance? 726 00:35:17,480 --> 00:35:21,200 I haven't seen, I've never seen it in a zoning code. 727 00:35:21,200 --> 00:35:26,200 I do think that some like some reports or staff reports, 728 00:35:28,000 --> 00:35:31,800 they might mention the impact on the school district. 729 00:35:31,800 --> 00:35:34,880 And I don't know if it's just based on projected number 730 00:35:34,880 --> 00:35:38,160 of children or persons living here under the age of 18 731 00:35:38,160 --> 00:35:40,760 and how that applies to the headcount 732 00:35:40,760 --> 00:35:42,000 and the funding formula. 733 00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:43,160 Yeah. 734 00:35:43,160 --> 00:35:45,440 I just remember when the apartment complexes 735 00:35:45,440 --> 00:35:47,400 were built on the west side of town, 736 00:35:47,400 --> 00:35:49,760 just west of Culver's, south and west, 737 00:35:49,760 --> 00:35:54,120 or yeah, southwest of Culver's that, 738 00:35:54,120 --> 00:35:56,240 the way that that was originally designed and developed, 739 00:35:56,240 --> 00:35:58,200 it had a pretty significant impact on that, 740 00:35:58,200 --> 00:35:59,520 on Dunwoody and that area 741 00:35:59,520 --> 00:36:02,440 because of a kind of an explosion of growth of young kids. 742 00:36:02,440 --> 00:36:03,520 And I just think that that's important 743 00:36:03,520 --> 00:36:07,040 to make sure the school district is part of 744 00:36:07,040 --> 00:36:10,400 either the review process or the approval process. 745 00:36:10,400 --> 00:36:12,320 I mean, as long as, you know, 746 00:36:12,320 --> 00:36:13,720 Michael's here, we're in good shape. 747 00:36:13,720 --> 00:36:16,080 Yeah, I haven't seen it so much for multifamily. 748 00:36:16,080 --> 00:36:18,000 I've seen it for subdivisions, of course. 749 00:36:18,000 --> 00:36:19,160 Yeah. 750 00:36:19,160 --> 00:36:20,000 Okay. 751 00:36:20,000 --> 00:36:21,320 The superintendent in Cedarburg, 752 00:36:21,320 --> 00:36:24,720 they have like a chamber event every year in summer 753 00:36:24,720 --> 00:36:27,840 and he'll get up and he'll talk about like how many kids 754 00:36:27,840 --> 00:36:31,000 per home are generated by each new home 755 00:36:31,000 --> 00:36:33,400 versus each new apartment and they've got it down 756 00:36:33,400 --> 00:36:38,080 to like each new unit is 0.76 children and apartment. 757 00:36:38,080 --> 00:36:39,480 Well, there's a formula. 758 00:36:40,840 --> 00:36:41,680 Yeah. 759 00:36:41,680 --> 00:36:43,320 What happens to the rest of the kids? 760 00:36:44,840 --> 00:36:45,680 Okay. 761 00:36:45,680 --> 00:36:46,520 So with that, is there anyone willing 762 00:36:46,520 --> 00:36:47,960 to make a motion to adjourn? 763 00:36:49,400 --> 00:36:50,920 There's a motion to adjourn in a second. 764 00:36:50,920 --> 00:36:52,760 Any questions or concerns on the motion? 765 00:36:52,760 --> 00:36:53,600 Seeing none. 766 00:36:53,600 --> 00:36:55,440 All in favor signify by saying aye. 767 00:36:55,440 --> 00:36:56,280 Aye. 768 00:36:56,280 --> 00:36:57,120 Opposed? 769 00:36:57,120 --> 00:36:58,040 That motion carries. 770 00:36:58,040 --> 00:36:58,880 Good night, everybody. 771 00:36:58,880 --> 00:36:59,720 This meeting is adjourned. 772 00:36:59,720 --> 00:37:00,560 Go pirates. 773 00:37:03,400 --> 00:37:05,080 Thank you.