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production act for changes around the house, that was the only state that actually got

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funding for two different IRA programs, and the money was not undone by the Trump administration.

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Wow.

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That's really good information.

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I didn't know that.

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Yeah.

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And so they have a great resource where people can just, there's a get started on their button

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on the focus website that I can mention, that people just, there's certain programs that

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are available, and then there's like, for heat pumps and other things, they get certain

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level funding for everybody, but if you're low income or for your incomes below a certain

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level, there's even more funding available.

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Okay.

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It could pay for up to 100% of the product.

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Wow.

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Very good info.

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Thank you.

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Sure.

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Okay.

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And we are recording ready when you are.

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As temperatures cool down with the advent of winter, not far behind, it will soon be time

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to turn on the furnace.

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And like gasoline and diesel prices, the cost to heat your home is expected to go up by

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an average of about 8.7% for the season, according to national forecasts.

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Tom content of the Citizen's Utility Board has been tracking the trend.

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And thanks very much for being here.

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Great to be with you.

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So is this just like added to the list of the things that are costing more right now?

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There is so much.

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I mean, we were seeing it everywhere.

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And unfortunately, we had a high heating cost winter last year, in part because of

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how expensive natural gas was, but mainly because of how frigid the winter was, we had

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those double stretches of sub-zero temperatures that hit us hard.

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And so people were firing up their furnaces.

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And then the next month, they were looking at their utility goals going, what the heck

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happened because my prices are off the charts?

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And we're concerned that that could be a problem again this winter.

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Speaking of temperatures, though, this El Nino weather pattern could help, could be warmer.

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It's always kind of not known.

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No, it's not known.

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And we're waiting for an official forecast from the Energy Information Administration.

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It won't come out until that next month.

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And that one will actually incorporate the forecast of temperatures as well.

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And the utilities themselves often put out forecasts, and we're still waiting on that.

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But the information we have so far shows, especially for people in rural Wisconsin that

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use propane or in areas of the state that still use heating oil, but this could be a

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tough winter.

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Because the heating oil price projections put it up more than 30 percent, but is that

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a small number of people who use oil in Wisconsin?

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Yes, it is.

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It's a very small amount.

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I just looked and it's about 35,000 households across the state that use it.

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And this would be a good year to get rid of heating oil if you have time before the real

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sub-zero hits to really take that step and get rid of those and replace it with natural

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gas or a different heating source.

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This would be the year to do it because the prices are off the charts, because heating

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oil is really directly affected by crude oil prices.

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Propane is also affected, but not quite as much by crude oil prices, but it is affected.

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So propane and electric, I understand, represent about 500,000 households together.

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And those price projections are at about nine percent.

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Where do people mostly use propane and electric?

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Because what, like 65 percent of people use natural gas?

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Correct.

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Two-thirds of Wisconsin's use natural gas.

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And propane is the farm.

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The rural areas of Wisconsin are often on propane because the natural gas system hasn't

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connected them.

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And so a lot of rural Wisconsinites should really reach out to their propane dealers

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and maybe get multiple quotes this year just to see what deal you can get and maybe try

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to lock that in because the prices are concerning.

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But there are opportunities to convert to natural gas in some areas now.

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And so that's an option to think about it.

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So you also say that there are other ways that people can potentially save, including

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through the program, focus on energy.

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And that is like legitimate.

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Yeah, that's a statewide program that everybody pays into who's a utility customer in Wisconsin

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pays into focus every year.

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And so what we want to see is more people take advantage of focus and get the benefits.

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So this is the program that used to provide LED light bulbs to everybody.

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And now LED prices have come down so much that focus provides incentives in other ways.

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They actually have incentives if you want to add solar to your house.

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They have incentives on a highly efficient furnace.

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They have incentives on insulation and air sealing.

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And the biggest thing and newest thing that they have is they have funding through the

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Inflation and Reduction Act that Congress passed a few years ago for a whole variety

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of programs that help all customers.

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But actually there's extra incentives for low-income customers that are built into that.

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And so people should really take a look at the Focus on Energy website.

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It's FocusOnEnergy.com and there's a really handy Get Started button on there that you

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can enter in your information and even your income and it'll let you know the kinds of

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things that you're eligible for.

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So that's a really important thing to know.

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The other thing that you are watching is a price hike on the horizon from some utility

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companies coming up to the start of the new year.

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What's that?

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So both we energies and Wisconsin Public Service.

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So a lot of the eastern half of Wisconsin are in for rate hikes right in front of the

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Public Service Commission right now.

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Our consumer advocate is involved in those cases to try to bring down the size of those

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increases.

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And so we've been vocal on that in trying to target high profits and other issues.

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Solar cost overruns for solar projects.

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Sort of directors fees that we think customers shouldn't be responsible for.

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And so those cases are ongoing right now.

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The utility in both cases, both utilities have actually, the residential prices would go

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up 14 to 15% over the next two years.

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Which is even with inflation where it is now, that's well, at least twice the rate of inflation

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over the next two years.

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And so for customers of the Green Bay utility, there's still time to weigh in.

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There's a public hearing coming up this Tuesday on Zoom and in Green Bay that people could

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participate in.

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And public comments are still being accepted on that case through October 5th on the PSC

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website.

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And we have a lot of resources on our active cases page at cubbedmui.org for customers

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who want to participate and have a say before those cases are decided.

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All right.

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Tom, content.

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Thanks very much.

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Thanks for your work.

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All right.

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Thank you so much.

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So the utility company rate hike proposals, two questions, is the PSC expected to just

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approve those or do public comments and the kind of advocacy that you're doing make a difference?

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So our advocacy is in the case, the low-income advocate and Milwaukee is in the case, the

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big manufacturers are in the case, the Walmart is in the case, but public comments do make

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a difference.

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Every commissioner has to either read the comments or sometimes they actually show up at the

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hearings.

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And thematically, it's interesting because in the week energies case, which the public

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comment period has already done, there were, I think, 1800 public comments, which is a

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big number for a rate case.

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And a lot of them, a lot of the comments zeroed in on issues that are experts that we have

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testifying in the case are actually testifying on, which is the profits, the Board of Director

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fees, and kind of just the executive pay, CEO pay, and just corporate power, I guess,

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if you will.

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And so we have testimony that says that we could save a couple hundred million dollars,

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two hundred million for W for we energies and other hundred million dollars for WPS just

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on the profits.

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And so it's interesting that in the we energies case at least, the comments from the public

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are actually resonating with the issues that our experts are bringing up in the case.

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And so this is my other question about that.

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In your review of this, it's more about kind of the quote, corporate profit angle.

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It's not about the demand that is expected from utilities.

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It's more about, so the utilities are trying, they have requests and they say these requests

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are needed because of all the new projects they're building that they, that are going

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into service.

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And yes, that's true, but we found, we, we looked at the case and the PSE staff looked

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at the case, the auditors at the PSE looked at the cases that yes, but there are all

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these other, there's other areas where we can offset some of those increases by bringing

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down the profit or by addressing board of making shareholders instead of customers pay

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for your board of directors fees and a whole host of other issues that the PSE staff brought

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up.

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In fact, between the PSE staff testimony and cubs testimony, we would take a 15% increase

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and bring it almost to zero or even below, even to a decrease if the three commissioners

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voted for everything that cub asked for and the PSE staff recommends in the case.

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All right, well, we'll be watching.

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And they'll be deciding that probably in early November after the election, they'll

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be deciding both those cases, sometime, one of the first or second or third Thursday

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in November is typically when they vote on those, so your, your team's aware.

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Great.

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All right, good.

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Well, thank you so much and, and thanks for joining us on this Friday.

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All right.

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Super.

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00:11:07,080 --> 00:11:09,440
Well, thank you and appreciate the opportunity.

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Okay.

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All right.

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Stay warm.

168
00:11:12,440 --> 00:11:13,440
Yes, exactly.

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Take care.

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Thanks.

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Okay.

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All right.

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All right.

174
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All right.

175
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All right.

176
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All right.

177
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All right.

178
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All right.

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All right.

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All right.

181
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All right.

182
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All right.

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All right.

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All right.

185
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All right.

186
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All right.

187
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All right.

188
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All right.

189
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All right.

190
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All right.

191
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All right.

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All right.

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All right.

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All right.

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All right.

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All right.

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All right.