We're good.
All right.
Josh Showman, thanks for joining us.
Yeah, thanks for having me.
Good to be here.
So for voters who don't know you, give us the quick story.
Who are you and why are you running for governor?
The 62nd version is I'm a Christian first.
I'm the son of a minister.
My dad's ministry was in mostly northeastern Wisconsin.
My mother, she was a registered nurse.
My wife and I have been married almost 25 years.
Both Wisconsin kids were raised our family and mostly in
Washington County.
And we now have an 80 acre farm in between West Bend and
Grafton.
Love Wisconsin through and through, aside from a tour of
duty in Iraq in 2003, and I always joke a tour of duty in
the Chicagoland suburbs while I was getting my master's
degree at Northern Illinois.
I'm a Wisconsin kid and I've been back working in public
service my whole life, dedicated it to the service and
sacrifice of the guys and gals who didn't make it back and
reflecting the Lord's love by loving my neighbor as myself
in public service the last 12 years in Washington County.
So is there a single issue that would define you or maybe
a lane within the Republican party that helps define you?
Yeah, I think people driven being very people focused and
mostly interested in solving problems.
That's why I got into public service.
I actually started in public administration because I
thought politics was a little too volatile and too
theoretical.
Public administration is really where the rubber hits the road
and you're dealing with people where they're at.
My first job back in Wisconsin was deputy clerk treasure in
Princeton, Greenlight County, and I ended up taking on
responsibilities in public works, literally shoveling out
lift stations.
So I think those are important things, making sure when
you flush the toilet, it does what it's supposed to do and
the garbage is collected on time.
And to this day, that's who I am as Washington County
executive and who I will be as governor.
How much money do you think you're going to need to raise
to win this primary?
And then what happens after that in a general election?
Yeah, I mean, it's embarrassing the fact that this is
probably a quarter billion dollar ace all in for both sides
and all the outside spending and just the candidate alone.
I'm told about basement floor 20 million, first floor,
probably closer to 40 million.
So it's a serious endeavor and one that we're excited about.
When it comes to a competitive primary, where do you
personally draw the line between negative campaigning versus
just defining the differences between yourself and an
opponent?
Well, I think when it gets personal, that's really the
dividing line.
There's certainly differences on our side of the aisle.
There's only two of us in this race right now and there's
certainly differences between policy approach.
I think those are important to point out and I think that's
the essence of the primary process, but once it becomes
personal attacks, I mean, I think that's where we've seen
primaries in the past go awry and I have no intention of
going down that lane and I hope the door swings both ways.
For voters who aren't aware of the candidates, should they be
looking at which candidate has the closest issues to them or
general electability?
Well, I think it's both.
I mean, first and foremost, I think this has got to be about
the people and local communities, a little bit more about
Washington County type and a little less about Washington,
but I also think there's something to be said about the
types of attributes it's going to take to win a general
election.
Generals are, of course, much different than primaries.
I think on the Republican side in particular, we've spent a
little bit too much time focusing on who can win a primary
purity test of sorts and we need to spend more time thinking
about what can win in the general election.
I think when you put my resume next to anybody, I think the
answer is clear.
If we want to be in the governor's mansion in January of
2027, I think not only me, but my profile and our campaign is
the type that wins.
This is an interesting contrast to these.
We have the Northern Wisconsin, which is kind of the new prime
territory in Wisconsin for Republicans versus the Old
Garden, the Wildcounties, which obviously represents.
So how do you view that matchup?
Yeah, I mean, I think that's one of the main contrasts, North
versus South.
I think there's certainly a generational difference, but
I also think it's local and personal versus kind of state and
D.C.
Madison and Washington D.C.
I think those are basically the dividing lines and I think
it's a good contrast for people to really wrestle with what's
best for us to choose in August to put up in November for the
best shot to have the governor's mansion in January.
How do you think Donald Trump will impact this race?
Oh, huge.
I mean, you know, it's the president's party and that's been
clear for the last 10 years, but I think one thing to keep in
mind is President Trump came on the scene in 2015 after the
2010 Tea Party wave.
Republicans basically ran on three major points, reduced the
debt, eliminate deficits and repeal and replace Obamacare.
Here we are 15 years later and we're still talking about those
three things.
Sometimes President Trump seems like he's the only one pushing
the needle on any of those by himself.
That's unacceptable.
And I think it's why we continue to feel a churn in politics
across America.
So he's got a humongous impact.
I certainly am going to work my tail off to earn his support
and endorsement and show him that, you know, he can have the
confidence in me that I've got this race once we get past
August and we lead it to victory in November.
What's your view on tariffs and his tariff policy?
Well, I think there's a complete economic order, reorder happening
right now all across the globe.
I think President Trump sees tariffs as a lever to be able to
guide that reorder in a way that benefits America in the long
term and, quite frankly, the Western Hemisphere.
You know, I'm willing to be patient as I've talked to a number
of farmers and manufacturers in Washington County and now
all across the state to see that play out.
But it's waning patience.
You know, this economy has been tough.
It's particularly hitting people who are making less than six
figures and I'm excited to see the results.
And I think they're coming very, very soon.
As governor, there's a good chance that you would have a
Republican legislature behind you.
What would you like to see as AB1, the first bill you can sign
into law?
Well, I think there's a laundry list and that's part of our
challenge.
But one of the things that I want to see first is things that are
focused on affordability, property taxes and income taxes in
particular.
It's embarrassing to me that our top bracket of income tax is
almost double what Illinois says.
I'd like to see it flattened out and then slowly eliminated.
And then property taxes, I'd like to see a school from four or
five entities on property tax bills down to two or three.
The goal of cutting them by 50%.
You make a moonshot and if you hit the stratosphere, you've won.
So there's also a chance that Democrats could hold one of the
chambers.
What's your history of working across the aisle?
Yeah, I definitely think there's a chance.
But this is why it's important to have the best player on the
field for the Republican side to make it most likely that not
only do we have the governor's mansion, but we also hold the
Senate and the Assembly in the event we don't.
I think this has been one of the things I've been most critical
of recently is the lack of communication between the east
wing and the legislative branches both.
I mean, look back to the state budget process.
The Democrat minority leader is critical of the Democrat
governor for not even giving her a seat at the table in the
conversation about the budget.
You know, Greta, Nuba and I probably don't agree on a whole
lot.
One thing we do agree on is everybody should have a seat at
the table.
90% of things we probably disagree, but there's probably
going to be one or two where I'm like, yeah, that makes sense.
How do we get to yes?
And there's a laundry list of things that we need to talk to
each other on, whether it's funding for schools and the
funding formula being broken, funding for a prison system,
which has been broken for 50 years.
The transportation fund that was rated by Governor Doyle and
needs to get fixed and doing it in a way that is effective for
people and makes things more affordable.
All of those things are things we need to work together on.
The public service commission is looking at a large number of
utility rate hikes.
Data centers are looking, popping up all across the state.
What's your view of data centers and this issue going forward?
Well, I think we don't know enough.
And that's one of the scariest parts about this process.
I've got one popping up about 10, 15 miles from my house in
Port Washington.
The transmission lines that are going to come through are
about two miles from my house.
I know it firsthand from talking to my neighbors.
You know, I'm very concerned.
And it's predominantly power driven, power distribution and
power supply.
You know, I grew up middle school and high school in
Quani, 10 minutes down the road from the old nuclear power
plant that's now being decommissioned.
That is the essential energy solution.
Why we're not talking about it?
While right here on the Madison campus, we have the number three
school in the country for nuclear engineering.
We should be leading the way.
I think we need to slow down the conversation about data centers
with a goal, create goals for how we become the forefront of
AI and data centers in Wisconsin, and the forefront of energy,
the energy revolution, which I believe starts with nuclear.
What would you like to see happen with public education?
Does it need more funding?
Does it need an overhaul?
Yeah, that's a great question.
I was a school board president in Hartford and it's near and
near to me.
My oldest son graduated from Hartford Union High School.
My youngest son is on a special needs scholarship voucher at
the Kettleman Luther High School.
I'm a huge believer in universal school choice for every parent,
but that funding formula for public schools needs to be
reformed.
It's from the 1970s.
It's almost 50 years old at that time.
Then in the 90s, when Governor Thompson tried to reformulate
it, unfortunately unsuccessfully, our student population was
growing, imminently growing.
Now we're looking at the next 25 years, it's going to be
declining precipitously, not to mention the outcomes, which
aren't great either.
So I think we need to get all the players at the table, school
boards, superintendents, parents, home schoolers, voucher
schools, all around the discussion and say, how do we
leverage these dollars best and make it best for outcomes for
our kids?
As soon as it becomes about our kids and not about bureaucracy
or institutions or winners and losers, no more zero sum games.
It's got to be about our kids in the future of the state of
Wisconsin.
It's going to be one of the things I'm laser-like focused on,
but it's not going to happen quickly.
We've gotten 50 years to be to this point.
We're not going to solve in 50 days or 50 weeks.
What would you like to see happen with vouchers in the
voucher program?
I certainly think it needs to be expanded, but I don't like
the talk about money following the kid.
My concern with that is kids become a commodity.
What do we do with commodities?
We buy, sell and trade them.
I don't think that's the solution.
I think there needs to be some kind of baseline funding where
all of our schools have some reliability in their funding
and sustainability fiscally.
And then everything, I think there needs to be an outcome
based.
How are kids doing better?
When kids do better, schools do better, whether it's public,
private, homeschooling, charter schooling, all of those things,
virtual schooling, that's why it's a complicated issue that I
think we need to be thoughtful and pragmatic about.
What is the number one tax reform you'd like to see happen?
The very first thing I'd like to see is property tax reform.
And it's hard for me to take property taxes and income taxes
and separate them.
So I would say they go hand in hand, frankly.
I don't think you can separate one for the other.
Our grandparents leaving to go down to Florida, Texas,
Tennessee, Arizona, we've got to stop that bleeding and our
young people leaving because they can't afford to live here or
the opportunity at a new job or a new business, that too.
So I guess in the end, I would say property taxes and income taxes
together.
They both have to be solved.
Over the course of the last year, we've seen the Supreme Court
eliminate a lot of legislative oversight over the rule making
process.
Would you like to see reforms?
Do you think there's a bipartisan solution there?
I do think there's a bipartisan solution.
I actually think there needs to be a constitutional amendment with
regard to the governor's veto.
With what happened with that 402-year veto, I think that's
problematic.
I think the legislative branch definitely has an important
role in responsibility.
I've experienced that firsthand as an executive myself at the
county level.
I respect it, and I would respect it at the state level.
There's a lot of work for us to do in that regard.
In the last six and a half years, I think a lot of eroded trust
on both sides.
That needs to be repaired.
You obviously have experience at the county level.
What would you like to see happen with funding for local
government?
Well, we made a stop with shared revenue.
I was proud to be a part of leading that as president of the
executives and administrators association with the counties,
but it was a step.
It was a big step, the first in about 40 years, almost my
whole life, but it was just a step.
We need now one giant leap for mankind.
I think that's how you actually solve the property tax issue.
Look at all the people coming from Chicago on the east side of
our state, Minneapolis on the west and northwest part of our
state that aren't really contributing a heck of a lot when
you think about it.
Our sales tax is relatively low and we're not capturing nearly
enough from those folks.
I think it's a huge part of the solution.
There's got to be some reliability in that fiscal model
for municipalities, but huge reform opportunity and I'm proud
of the step we took and now we got to take a much bigger leap.
Right now in northern Wisconsin, there are exploratory drilling
projects for potential mines in the future.
Do you think that Wisconsin's current mining laws are tough enough?
Do you have any changes?
I think there definitely need to be changes.
I mean, look at our flag.
Mining is our heritage.
I think we've gone too far away from it.
I think there's plenty of opportunity and probably
agreement, frankly, on both sides that there's smart ways to do
this, but I do think there's giant opportunity area, particularly
in the northern part of the state and they're desperate for
jobs.
So I think there is opportunity and it's something that I'm excited
to work together with the other side.
Have you had any concerns about your own safety in this modern
political environment?
When Charlie was assassinated, that was the first time.
You know, I talked to my wife long and hard about this decision
to jump into the race and she's a talker, normally hard to get
a word out of edge wise, but she took a pause and said,
well, it can't be worse than Iraq.
And that was the moment we decided to get in.
When Charlie was assassinated, that was the first time that I
had second thoughts, like, wow, this is very real.
And of course, you know, that goes across the spectrum,
whether it was Governor Shapiro in Pennsylvania or the former
speaker up in Minnesota.
It was a scary time.
I mean, we've got to bring the temperature down.
I think part of the problem with politics in America and
politics in Wisconsin is we just don't talk to each other.
We talk past each other.
We throw social media bombs.
There's no conversation.
I think we have to get back to talking to one another again.
It's why I've gone to all 72 counties.
And now I'm on my second tour about halfway through.
We're Wisconsinites.
We should be talking to each other.
Americans first.
What is your plan for increasing affordable housing?
Do you think it's regulations, density?
What's the solution there?
Well, it's build, baby, build.
We have choked off the ability for small homes on small lots,
building just in general.
I think it started back about 50 years ago when we started to
tighten up how financing worked for local developers.
And we completely choked it off after Dodd-Frank.
At the same time, we went from post-World War II about 60 pages
of zoning regulation to today, six and a half inches of
subdivision codes and comprehensive plans and zoning codes.
And the list goes on.
Regulation is massively a problem.
And then not in my backyard attitude.
I think we've got to loosen all of that up.
I think you look to models like Montana and the Montana
Miracle where they're now building like crazy.
This housing issue is a supply side problem.
It's an old Ronald Reagan type of supply side
economics issue.
We have to create the environment where we're making it
possible for the opportunity at the American Dream.
To me, this is constitutional.
This is declaration of life liberty in the pursuit of happiness.
We have solutions in Washington County that are moving the
needle.
We've got professors.
We've got institutes from across the globe who are
calling us and saying, what are you guys doing?
It's something difference happening in Washington County.
We can scale that up.
It'll be a little different statewide.
But we could scale that up statewide and make it a
solution for everybody, give everybody a shot at the
American Dream in a affordable manner.
In the Department of Corrections, Governor Evers has a
pretty massive overhaul plan.
Would you carry that plan forward?
There's components of it that I like.
What I don't like is opening the doors and letting people
out.
I think we need to get a much tougher on crime approach.
I think it starts by electing Eric Tony.
But I also believe we have to give law enforcement the
resources.
They need DA's offices and police departments alike.
We've done way too much of that.
I call it a slow role in the city of Milwaukee in particular
on defunding the police.
Yeah, they haven't actually cut funding per se.
But they've held funding flat.
They've held positions open.
We need to deploy as many resources as possible to local
law enforcement and give them everything they need from local
state to federal law enforcement.
Know that they have.
We have their back 110%.
On the topic of abortion, is there any changes you would
like to see to state law?
I think our life culture is what has to change.
I think we need to create a culture of life in Wisconsin.
Now that the state Supreme Court has ruled the bill that
Governor Walker signed 20 weeks, I think it's a subtle
issue both here in the state and at the federal level in that
regard.
I think we need to focus on different things like making
adoption cheaper than abortion.
I think we need to make it such that child support starts at
conception rather than waiting until birth.
I think we need to give mothers resources all the way through
the first year postpartum when need be.
I think those types of reforms are what we as conservative need
to focus on so that we prove we're pro-life.
This isn't just about anti-abortion.
Alright, Josh show me.
Thanks for your time.
Thanks for having me.
Alright.
Thank you so much.
We covered a lot of territory there.
Alright.
That was good.
Thank you very much.
Yeah.
Nice to meet you.
You too.
Congrats on the couple of deer.