WEBVTT 00:00.000 --> 00:22.920 The 00:22.920 --> 00:27.720 United States Supreme Court throws a curveball into absentee voting, letting the Trump administration 00:27.720 --> 00:32.380 move forward with more restrictive rules, but Wisconsin election officials say were a long 00:32.380 --> 00:35.440 ways from November and there will be more lawsuits. 00:35.440 --> 00:43.000 This is Inside Wisconsin Politics. 00:43.000 --> 00:47.200 I'm Zach Schultz, filling in for Sean Johnson, here with my colleagues Anya Van Wegden-Dank 00:47.200 --> 00:48.880 and Rich Kramer in Eau Claire. 00:48.880 --> 00:51.840 Hello to both of you. 00:51.840 --> 00:56.040 On Monday, the U.S. Supreme Court's shadow docket struck again, releasing an unsigned 00:56.040 --> 00:59.880 opinion that allows the Trump administration to go forward with orders for the postal 00:59.880 --> 01:05.000 service to create rules restricting who can send an absentee ballot through the mail. 01:05.000 --> 01:09.000 Anya, this started as an executive order last spring, Wisconsin was one of the states that 01:09.000 --> 01:10.440 sued to stop it. 01:10.440 --> 01:11.440 So where are we now? 01:11.440 --> 01:13.400 I mean, we're still in the court. 01:13.400 --> 01:18.480 So this was the court did not rule on sort of the merits of the executive order themselves. 01:18.480 --> 01:23.280 They ruled on the timing of the lawsuit that Wisconsin and other states filed, essentially 01:23.280 --> 01:27.240 saying that because the postal service rule has not yet been put in place, they can't 01:27.240 --> 01:28.760 argue that they have been harmed. 01:28.760 --> 01:33.400 Meanwhile, the Postal Service did author and publish the rule that would go into effect 01:33.400 --> 01:35.240 as soon as the order is cleared. 01:35.240 --> 01:38.840 And so now things go back to a lower court, then they will go back to the Supreme Court, 01:38.840 --> 01:44.680 which will eventually we assume kind of weigh in on whether the executive branch, the president, 01:44.680 --> 01:49.400 is allowed to make such a kind of sweeping change to state elections, which are according 01:49.400 --> 01:53.080 to the Constitution sort of supposed to be decided by the states. 01:53.080 --> 01:57.120 So nothing happening at this exact moment, but everyone should be a little bit worried 01:57.120 --> 01:58.120 and aware of what's going on. 01:58.120 --> 02:00.320 Yeah, I mean, we're 10 weeks out from the midterm elections. 02:00.320 --> 02:04.200 And so one of the things that we're hearing from election administrators is sort of, 02:04.200 --> 02:06.080 well, what are we supposed to be doing in the meantime? 02:06.080 --> 02:10.280 They are in the process of printing out these ballots, ballots that go to overseas and military 02:10.280 --> 02:13.960 voters need to be sent out 45 days in advance of the election. 02:13.960 --> 02:16.000 So that's like, I think September 19th. 02:16.000 --> 02:19.920 So all this stuff needs to be happening, this nitty gritty administrative stuff. 02:19.920 --> 02:23.600 And meanwhile, they're trying to figure out just like how the rules function. 02:23.600 --> 02:28.600 Rich, Republicans have an interesting relationship with absentee balloting, going back years 02:28.600 --> 02:33.280 where they've talked about restricting it, but they also love to use it, including Republican 02:33.280 --> 02:36.400 nominee Tom Tiffany. 02:36.400 --> 02:41.600 And President Donald Trump, I believe it was reported used it this year as well. 02:41.600 --> 02:44.280 So it's an interesting paradox. 02:44.280 --> 02:50.480 So going back to 2020, President Donald Trump has made these false claims about widespread 02:50.480 --> 02:55.320 voter fraud that resulted in a stolen election. 02:55.320 --> 03:01.880 But part of that, of course, was his railing against mail-in absentee voting. 03:01.880 --> 03:07.360 And he said it's just a prime opportunity for fraud to happen. 03:07.360 --> 03:10.960 So many of his supporters have bought into that. 03:10.960 --> 03:16.920 And here in Wisconsin, we've got this paradox where you've got the state party chair, Brian 03:16.920 --> 03:23.760 Schimming, the GOP party chair, who he said, well, I was one of the first state party 03:23.760 --> 03:30.280 chairs in the country to advocate for absentee voting and early voting as a way to kind of 03:30.280 --> 03:35.320 match Democrats who have been really successful with that in terms of getting out the vote 03:35.320 --> 03:39.020 early ahead of election day, less work on election day. 03:39.020 --> 03:43.940 At the same time, you've got people within the party that want to impeach the state's 03:43.940 --> 03:47.340 election, top election official, Megan Wolf. 03:47.340 --> 03:52.300 They've went after Republican speaker, outgoing Republican speaker of the Assembly, Robin 03:52.300 --> 03:56.060 Voss, for not trying to de-certify the election, et cetera. 03:56.060 --> 04:03.340 So it's really kind of a paradox between those two worlds in the Wisconsin GOP. 04:03.340 --> 04:06.380 So Anya, what are clerks doing right now? 04:06.380 --> 04:08.980 I guess in Wisconsin history, we've had a lot of lawsuits that happen. 04:08.980 --> 04:12.300 Right before an election, but usually those involve state law. 04:12.300 --> 04:16.380 This would be seemingly a much larger change than one that they really wouldn't have any 04:16.380 --> 04:17.380 impact on. 04:17.380 --> 04:18.380 Yeah. 04:18.380 --> 04:22.620 Well, Wisconsin also is unique because it has sort of the most de-federated election administration 04:22.620 --> 04:23.700 system in the country. 04:23.700 --> 04:29.100 So a lot of other places, you know, it's county clerks who run who administer elections. 04:29.100 --> 04:35.020 Here it is local clerks, and I'm blanking on the exact number, but it is close to 200. 04:35.020 --> 04:38.780 And so they are all, again, doing this kind of nitty-gritty work of printing out the 04:38.780 --> 04:42.820 ballots and checking their lists, and there's all of this work that goes on kind of behind 04:42.820 --> 04:44.620 the scenes to prepare for this. 04:44.620 --> 04:48.260 Every clerk I've spoken to says that, like, as soon as one election ends, the next one 04:48.260 --> 04:49.780 begins for them in terms of their work. 04:49.780 --> 04:51.140 And so the primary just ended. 04:51.140 --> 04:52.980 They're all getting ready for the general. 04:52.980 --> 04:56.380 And so as these rules kind of shift, and as they're waiting, again, for the back and 04:56.380 --> 05:02.420 forth from the courts, it really kind of raises the question of how do they follow the rules 05:02.460 --> 05:06.180 if they don't yet know what the rules are, and especially for something like this, with 05:06.180 --> 05:11.520 the postal service being in charge of potentially determining who is allowed to receive a mailing 05:11.520 --> 05:16.620 ballot and who is not, they could accidentally violate that rule if they're not very, very 05:16.620 --> 05:17.620 careful. 05:17.620 --> 05:20.900 And so they're kind of waiting to see, so we are just kind of in this wait and see moment 05:20.900 --> 05:25.060 when, again, they actually need to be kind of hurrying up just to get stuff like formatted 05:25.060 --> 05:26.060 for the printer. 05:26.060 --> 05:30.340 Again, this very administrative details that really kind of determines how we all vote. 05:30.820 --> 05:35.500 And there have been concerns about how the postal service will handle absentee ballots, 05:35.500 --> 05:39.940 especially under the Trump administration, both two separate Trump administrations. 05:39.940 --> 05:44.100 There have been questions and conspiracies about whether the postal service will lose 05:44.100 --> 05:47.340 the ballots, whether they'll be processing them on time, are there enough postal workers 05:47.340 --> 05:49.540 to handle all of these routes? 05:49.540 --> 05:54.140 And so I know that the parties in the past have told their voters, hey, if you're worried, 05:54.140 --> 05:58.780 make sure you deliver it in person, Rich, have we seen any of these groups, whether the Democrats 05:58.820 --> 06:02.940 or Republicans, trying to make sure that their voters are aware, even if these don't 06:02.940 --> 06:07.020 happen, like, hey, maybe it's safest to hand deliver these, or maybe you do absentee in 06:07.020 --> 06:08.540 person, if you can. 06:08.540 --> 06:09.540 Yeah. 06:09.540 --> 06:16.580 And also some of the clerks, so the Wisconsin Elections Commission surveyed local clerks 06:16.580 --> 06:19.980 this year, I believe, anyway, the results came out this year. 06:19.980 --> 06:25.980 And a lot of them, the majority of them did mention there has been longer than expected 06:25.980 --> 06:28.260 delays with regard to absentee voting. 06:28.260 --> 06:37.180 This was in the April Supreme Court election, but so some of them in the summary of the survey 06:37.180 --> 06:43.060 responses from those clerks have said that people are just saying, well, I won't even 06:43.060 --> 06:44.380 try to absentee vote. 06:44.380 --> 06:46.860 I'll go a different route. 06:46.860 --> 06:52.660 And so some of the clerks were also advising that they consider in-person absentee voting 06:52.660 --> 06:56.700 or other forms, which is really something. 06:56.700 --> 07:02.620 And I got a chance to ask Republican Congressman and candidate for Governor Tom Tiffany about 07:02.620 --> 07:07.900 this specific executive order from the president and what he thought about it. 07:07.900 --> 07:14.700 He deflected and kind of went along the lines of saying, most clerks do a great job, but 07:14.700 --> 07:21.540 he said some without naming them have gone beyond what the color of the law dictates. 07:21.540 --> 07:27.180 So without naming them, we can assume that it might be Dane County and Milwaukee County 07:27.180 --> 07:32.620 that he has an issue with because we've heard that from other Republicans. 07:32.620 --> 07:40.420 So it's just a really interesting situation, and we're right on the cusp of this election, 07:40.420 --> 07:44.860 so this uncertainty definitely has got a lot of eyebrows raised. 07:44.860 --> 07:48.420 So this has only happened to the last, obviously, day or so. 07:48.420 --> 07:51.740 How much can this change the conversation in the gubernatorial election? 07:51.740 --> 07:54.580 Because for the past few weeks, since the candidates have been set, it's been about 07:54.580 --> 07:55.580 data centers. 07:55.580 --> 08:00.700 And that's been the driving force of Tiffany attacking David Crowley and Crowley trying 08:00.700 --> 08:03.660 to defend and put it back in his candidacy. 08:03.660 --> 08:08.340 But could this change the topic and bring up those connections Tom Tiffany has to Donald 08:08.340 --> 08:09.340 Trump? 08:09.340 --> 08:13.620 Or the fact that these almost all come out of election conspiracies from 2020, can this 08:13.620 --> 08:17.300 be an opening to change the narrative of what people are talking about? 08:17.300 --> 08:21.580 To a richest point, I think one of the consequences of something like this isn't just 08:21.580 --> 08:25.780 that it's confusing for election officials, but that it can kind of sow confusion and 08:25.780 --> 08:27.180 doubt among voters. 08:27.180 --> 08:31.980 And so for voters who are kind of already concerned about American democracy, who do 08:31.980 --> 08:35.780 tend to skew Democratic, this is kind of part of that pattern. 08:35.780 --> 08:41.980 For voters who maybe have questions about the 2020 election, or are Trump supporters much 08:41.980 --> 08:47.260 like Tom Tiffany, who was somebody who voted to de-certify 2020 election results in certain 08:47.260 --> 08:52.660 other states, this is just kind of an example of the chaos that they say is just kind of 08:52.660 --> 08:54.140 baked into the system. 08:54.140 --> 08:57.980 And so it kind of gives them an opportunity if things don't necessarily go their way in 08:57.980 --> 09:02.820 November to point to the shifting rules, the back and forth, the courts, the judges as 09:02.820 --> 09:04.540 a reason for that. 09:04.540 --> 09:09.260 And so at the very least, even if it does kind of resolve in a way that allows administrators 09:09.260 --> 09:15.900 to do their job sort of without a hitch, it still creates this sense of chaos in the kind 09:15.940 --> 09:18.380 of basis of our democracy, which is voting. 09:18.380 --> 09:19.380 Yeah. 09:19.380 --> 09:23.380 So Rich, do you think Republicans want to change the conversation here, or is this particularly 09:23.380 --> 09:26.860 the Democrats would love to be able to pin this back, even if it causes confusion and 09:26.860 --> 09:30.020 say this is what you get with Tom Tiffany and Donald Trump? 09:30.020 --> 09:35.780 Yeah, it seems like Democrats are much more eager to talk about this sort of thing than 09:35.780 --> 09:37.460 Republicans. 09:37.460 --> 09:42.140 When Tom Tiffany has been asked about his 2020 votes and his signing on to a Texas lawsuit 09:42.140 --> 09:47.700 that year, that would have tossed out Wisconsin's votes in the presidential election. 09:47.700 --> 09:48.700 He just differs. 09:48.700 --> 09:52.180 Like he'll quickly say Joe Biden is president and then he moves on. 09:52.180 --> 09:59.220 So based on that and also based on some Republican commentary I've seen from people in Wisconsin, 09:59.220 --> 10:03.660 they definitely don't want Tom Tiffany talking about this. 10:03.660 --> 10:09.100 They don't necessarily want him talking about issues that President Trump is pushing that 10:09.100 --> 10:11.460 are unpopular. 10:11.460 --> 10:16.300 But you can rest assured that Democrats are very excited to talk about this development 10:16.300 --> 10:21.380 from the Supreme Court, the president's attempts, his plans, et cetera, because we got a press 10:21.380 --> 10:23.740 release first thing this morning about it. 10:23.740 --> 10:28.100 So another topic that could come up in the governor's race that we're paying attention 10:28.100 --> 10:32.180 to, Governor Evers' Commutation Advisory Board met for the first time last week to 10:32.180 --> 10:36.620 hear a dozen, from a dozen inmates who've applied to have their sentences reduced. 10:37.140 --> 10:42.660 What do we know about this board and then how will that filter out into Tom Tiffany versus 10:42.660 --> 10:43.660 David Crowley? 10:43.660 --> 10:44.900 Why would it have anything to do with them? 10:44.900 --> 10:49.380 Yeah, so it's the first time that this board has met since 1995 that was under Republican 10:49.380 --> 10:52.620 governor Tommy Thompson. 10:52.620 --> 10:58.340 And so this has been sort of a priority of Governor Evers' to make some changes to criminal 10:58.340 --> 10:59.620 justice in Wisconsin. 10:59.620 --> 11:04.580 He has not delivered on many of those, but this was kind of one of his final, you know, 11:04.700 --> 11:09.780 Wisconsin office is to potentially reduce a sentence of grant commutations to some 11:09.780 --> 11:11.060 incarcerated people. 11:11.060 --> 11:16.500 And so this is a big deal in part because crime is just always an issue in any election. 11:16.500 --> 11:20.540 I mean, we've seen it even with Supreme Court races where they don't really have any, you 11:20.540 --> 11:24.820 know, role in fighting crime, but crime is just something that motivates voters. 11:24.820 --> 11:30.020 And so this issue of potentially, you know, lessening the sentence of people, some of 11:30.020 --> 11:34.380 whom were convicted for nonviolent crimes, some of whom were convicted for violent crimes. 11:34.380 --> 11:39.540 According to a series of kind of criteria, including they've served a majority of their 11:39.540 --> 11:40.540 sentence. 11:40.540 --> 11:44.580 They've proven that they've sort of rehabilitated in certain ways, but all of that can be the 11:44.580 --> 11:49.500 type of thing that Republicans in particular who like to say Democrats are kind of easy 11:49.500 --> 11:52.060 on crime can really seize upon. 11:52.060 --> 11:53.300 And you know, I'm from Massachusetts. 11:53.300 --> 11:58.460 And so I grew up learning about sort of the Willie Horton case, which was a person who was 11:58.460 --> 12:01.820 released from prison, went on to commit another very violent crime. 12:01.820 --> 12:05.340 And then this swung the governor's election in a little bit before my time. 12:05.340 --> 12:07.140 But I grew up learning about this. 12:07.140 --> 12:10.020 And that is the kind of thing that can really sink elections. 12:10.020 --> 12:14.940 And so I think as this is going forward, you know, it is popular among voters of many 12:14.940 --> 12:18.380 different stripes to do some sort of criminal justice reform. 12:18.380 --> 12:22.940 But when you kind of look at what that actually looks like, it can be a bit of a tightrope 12:22.940 --> 12:24.500 walk for politicians. 12:24.500 --> 12:28.100 It's interesting you bring up Willie Horton because that came out in the Democratic primary 12:28.100 --> 12:29.100 in 1988. 12:29.100 --> 12:31.740 It was Al Gore versus Dukakis. 12:31.740 --> 12:35.620 And then it ended up playing a major role in the presidential campaign in 1988, where 12:35.620 --> 12:41.540 it was Lee Atwater, who was one of the first negative ad gurus out there, ran it against 12:41.540 --> 12:42.540 Dukakis. 12:42.540 --> 12:45.740 And it was considered one of the things that showed weakness in him and why he went from 12:45.740 --> 12:49.140 high approval ratings to losing that election in 1988. 12:49.140 --> 12:52.940 And Rich, obviously this is something that Republicans have a history of looking at his 12:52.940 --> 12:56.380 crime in Milwaukee and especially people of color. 12:56.380 --> 12:59.220 We've already started to see some of those connections they're trying to draw between 12:59.220 --> 13:02.900 David Crawley and any bad thing that happens in Milwaukee County. 13:02.900 --> 13:05.780 It's a little bit of like throwing spaghetti at the wall, see what sticks right now. 13:05.780 --> 13:09.060 But this is definitely something they will use against him, even if it's the weakest 13:09.060 --> 13:10.060 of links. 13:10.060 --> 13:12.180 Yeah, that's right. 13:12.180 --> 13:15.540 This is something that is proven to be able to stick in the past. 13:15.540 --> 13:21.060 I mean, I think back to 2022, the U.S. Senate race between Republican incumbent and now 13:21.060 --> 13:26.180 Senator Ron Johnson and former Lieutenant Governor Mandela Barnes. 13:26.180 --> 13:32.620 That race, the Republicans supporting Johnson and Johnson himself just blanketed the Wisconsin 13:32.620 --> 13:39.260 airwaves with ads about how Barnes was, you know, about defunding the police or he was 13:39.260 --> 13:42.260 anti-ice and he was weak on crime. 13:42.260 --> 13:48.780 I mean, these sort of things, again, a U.S. Senator doesn't have a ton to do directly 13:48.780 --> 13:54.700 with crime fighting, but these are the kind of topics that stir up people's emotions. 13:54.700 --> 13:58.940 Also back in 2022, the Marquette University Law School did a survey that I found really 13:58.940 --> 14:00.140 interesting. 14:00.140 --> 14:07.860 It showed that, you know, 77% of respondents said they feel safe in their daily activities, 14:07.860 --> 14:15.380 but 85% reported being either somewhat concerned or very concerned about increasing crimes. 14:15.380 --> 14:21.580 So that kind of shows how the emotions can get in the way of numbers on paper. 14:21.580 --> 14:25.700 And Anya, it's interesting, the crime statistics came out for Wisconsin showing a decrease, 14:25.700 --> 14:29.900 as we've seen nationally, including in Milwaukee, but they're still going to be allegations. 14:29.900 --> 14:34.220 We saw it with videos of incidents at the state fair and all of a sudden the connection 14:34.220 --> 14:37.860 we saw was Republicans saying, this is David Crowley's Wisconsin. 14:37.860 --> 14:41.140 And I didn't know that the Milwaukee County exec was in charge of the state fair and like 14:41.140 --> 14:44.540 making sure everyone stayed in line there, but this will keep coming up, right? 14:44.540 --> 14:45.540 Yeah. 14:45.540 --> 14:49.620 I mean, as Rich said, statistics and people's feelings kind of have almost nothing to do 14:49.620 --> 14:50.620 with one another. 14:50.620 --> 14:54.700 In fact, there's been research that shows that as crime rates have steadily gone down 14:54.700 --> 15:01.500 minus the COVID spike, you know, from the 90s, coverage of crime has gone up in local media. 15:01.500 --> 15:05.100 And so it gives the impression to a lot of people, you know, I talk to people from outside 15:05.100 --> 15:10.060 of Milwaukee who are convinced that it's kind of on fire just 100% of the time. 15:10.060 --> 15:13.740 And so if you feel that way, it kind of doesn't matter what the statistics say. 15:13.740 --> 15:17.860 And you can really leverage that concern, especially for somebody like David Crowley, 15:17.860 --> 15:22.740 who is so Milwaukee, right, that he is of Milwaukee, he is the county executive, the 15:22.740 --> 15:27.980 Tom Tiffany campaign will try to tie him to every single problem that Milwaukee has, 15:27.980 --> 15:31.300 including crime rates that are higher than elsewhere in the state because that is just 15:31.300 --> 15:33.940 kind of the nature of urban centers. 15:33.940 --> 15:37.780 So one last area I want to talk about today and talking about changing the topic in the 15:37.780 --> 15:38.780 governor's race. 15:38.780 --> 15:42.860 If we ever get away from data centers being this primary driver, there is the obvious 15:42.860 --> 15:48.020 tariffs coming in, and we have a couple different aspects of one is Trump is escalating 15:48.020 --> 15:50.220 a new trade war with Canada. 15:50.220 --> 15:54.260 And we're also seeing questions about whether he would allow imported beef coming in from 15:54.260 --> 15:57.980 South America to come into the market and reducing tariffs there. 15:57.980 --> 16:01.860 And rich tariffs have an interesting, another interesting aspect of Republicans of when 16:01.860 --> 16:05.820 Trump imposes them that they don't change the cost according to Republicans, but when 16:05.820 --> 16:08.660 he lowers them, it's supposed to lower the cost of beef coming in. 16:08.780 --> 16:14.220 What's been the reaction to some of these different tariff war battles going on? 16:14.220 --> 16:19.060 So again, this is something that I would imagine Republicans aren't excited to talk about, 16:19.060 --> 16:25.340 but Tom Tiffany has in the past, he's talked about how the president is doing these things, 16:25.340 --> 16:29.660 these tariffs, in order to re-shore manufacturing in Wisconsin. 16:29.660 --> 16:32.620 He said the media doesn't talk about the success stories. 16:32.620 --> 16:40.620 He mentioned something about Harley-Davidson plant, something happening with that in Tomahawk. 16:40.620 --> 16:43.980 So they don't want to talk about the downsides of that. 16:43.980 --> 16:49.100 I did see something, I honestly wasn't able to go through the whole article, but that 16:49.100 --> 16:53.420 Tom Tiffany might have been creating some distance between the president on this latest batch 16:53.420 --> 16:58.820 with regard to Canada, but again, I'm not as super well versed on that. 16:58.820 --> 17:05.060 It's definitely a topic, though, with affordability being top concern among voters in general, 17:05.060 --> 17:07.340 and Democrats are going to try to make hay with it. 17:07.340 --> 17:11.620 And Anya, in our last minute here, talking about these tariff issues, Democrats were 17:11.620 --> 17:16.540 quick to pounce on this, Governor Evers saying, we have $7 billion in trade with Canada, our 17:16.540 --> 17:18.540 closest neighbor. 17:18.540 --> 17:21.260 These have real-world implications, not just political implications. 17:21.260 --> 17:26.980 Right, but again, it's the work of politicians to draw those connections and make people 17:26.980 --> 17:28.660 understand. 17:28.660 --> 17:32.700 When you go to the grocery store, it doesn't say like this came from XYZ, you just sort 17:32.700 --> 17:35.780 of pick up your eggs and your milk and you go on your way. 17:35.780 --> 17:41.220 And then likewise, especially kind of further out on the supply chain, we get a ton of wood 17:41.220 --> 17:42.860 from Canada, for example. 17:42.860 --> 17:47.300 I don't see a sticker on this table kind of explaining how this table came to be. 17:47.300 --> 17:50.700 And so it's easy to feel kind of distanced as just a normal person going through the 17:50.700 --> 17:53.180 world from some of these policies. 17:53.180 --> 17:57.220 So it's the job of Democrats if they want to make hay with this, as Rich said, to make 17:57.300 --> 18:02.820 that hay, which also involves a little bit of complicated explaining a sort of geopolitical 18:02.820 --> 18:06.900 maneuvering, which is a little tricky in like a 30-second ad as we've talked about. 18:06.900 --> 18:07.900 Yeah. 18:07.900 --> 18:11.940 And you have to have the money to run those 30-second ads over and over to explain perhaps 18:11.940 --> 18:15.140 nuanced geopolitical maneuvers in an election. 18:15.140 --> 18:16.940 Well, that is all the time we have for today. 18:16.940 --> 18:19.700 Our colleague, Sean Johnson, will be back next week. 18:19.700 --> 18:21.820 This has been Inside Wisconsin Politics. 18:21.820 --> 18:27.300 Be sure to follow us on pbswisconsin.org, wpr.org, YouTube, or wherever you get your 18:27.300 --> 18:28.300 podcasts. 18:40.380 --> 18:42.980 Did I say that Willie Horton was in the governor's race? 18:42.980 --> 18:43.980 Fuck. 18:43.980 --> 18:46.660 Because he was my governor. 18:46.660 --> 18:48.580 I wasn't alive, but he would have been. 18:48.580 --> 18:49.580 Do caucus was the governor. 18:49.580 --> 18:50.580 Yes. 18:50.580 --> 18:51.580 I knew where you were going with it. 18:51.580 --> 18:52.580 Yeah. 18:52.580 --> 18:53.580 Thank you.