1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:29,400 The 2 00:00:29,400 --> 00:00:34,360 field of candidates in Wisconsin's Democratic primary for governor gets smaller as the campaign 3 00:00:34,360 --> 00:00:38,940 ad war heats up and the vice president visits Wisconsin. 4 00:00:38,940 --> 00:00:43,360 This is Inside Wisconsin Politics. 5 00:00:43,360 --> 00:00:48,360 I'm Sean Johnson here with Anya Van Wankton-Dank and Zach Schultz, say you too. 6 00:00:48,360 --> 00:00:54,480 So we've been talking about this as a crowded Democratic primary for a long time now and 7 00:00:54,480 --> 00:00:57,200 we had seven Democratic candidates just a few weeks ago. 8 00:00:57,200 --> 00:01:01,280 And that was narrowed down to six as Missy Hughes got out of the race. 9 00:01:01,280 --> 00:01:03,480 David Crowley this week gets out of the race. 10 00:01:03,480 --> 00:01:05,680 Now we're down to five. 11 00:01:05,680 --> 00:01:11,760 Zach, is it still crowded or has this race shifted to you in a meaningful way? 12 00:01:11,760 --> 00:01:15,440 I think the crowd, it depends more on the lanes of what we're talking about. 13 00:01:15,440 --> 00:01:17,520 I think there's clearly a progressive lane. 14 00:01:17,520 --> 00:01:21,840 There's clearly a more establishment center government lane. 15 00:01:21,840 --> 00:01:25,360 And then there's a question of if there's room in between for any of the rest of them 16 00:01:25,360 --> 00:01:29,520 to kind of stake their own area or if they're competing for those two groups. 17 00:01:29,520 --> 00:01:33,600 But there clearly is this sense as the two candidates have dropped out that have now 18 00:01:33,600 --> 00:01:37,400 endorsed Sarah Rodriguez, that there is an establishment going on. 19 00:01:37,400 --> 00:01:42,720 And that fits this national theme that we're seeing of establishment Dems worrying about 20 00:01:42,720 --> 00:01:48,560 progressive Dems potentially undermining chances to win seats in November versus progressives 21 00:01:48,560 --> 00:01:53,360 who are saying no, we are the ones that are going to win these primaries and win in November 22 00:01:53,360 --> 00:01:55,440 get behind us as we keep going forward. 23 00:01:55,440 --> 00:02:00,640 So there's definitely a shrinkage there, but it's almost a shrinkage into lanes as opposed 24 00:02:00,640 --> 00:02:02,160 to these individual candidates. 25 00:02:02,160 --> 00:02:03,600 Anya, how do you see those lanes? 26 00:02:03,600 --> 00:02:08,160 I mean, I think just a few weeks ago, I was kind of having a hard time putting the candidates 27 00:02:08,160 --> 00:02:10,400 into different lanes or buckets. 28 00:02:10,400 --> 00:02:14,320 However you want to do it, what are the lanes now as you see it? 29 00:02:14,320 --> 00:02:18,080 Yeah, I think that sort of hit the nail in the head with establishment versus progressive. 30 00:02:18,080 --> 00:02:21,760 And one way that we're seeing that is when these candidates are dropping out that they 31 00:02:21,760 --> 00:02:23,520 are endorsing other candidates. 32 00:02:23,520 --> 00:02:28,920 There's a world in which you drop out and you say, I love my party and all I want is 33 00:02:28,920 --> 00:02:30,320 for a Democrat to win. 34 00:02:30,320 --> 00:02:33,960 And David Crawley did that kind of initially in his original announcement that he was stepping 35 00:02:33,960 --> 00:02:34,960 down. 36 00:02:34,960 --> 00:02:35,960 He didn't immediately endorse anyone. 37 00:02:35,960 --> 00:02:40,040 He said the most important thing is just that somebody beats Tom Tiffany in the fall. 38 00:02:40,040 --> 00:02:42,240 And then this morning came out and endorsed Sarah Rodriguez. 39 00:02:42,240 --> 00:02:47,040 So I think that's a sign that people are kind of choosing teams and trying to say who do 40 00:02:47,040 --> 00:02:51,800 I think is the best ability for Democrats to win in November. 41 00:02:51,800 --> 00:02:53,880 Is it the sort of hung progressive lane? 42 00:02:53,880 --> 00:02:56,840 Is it the Rodriguez more sort of establishment lane? 43 00:02:56,840 --> 00:03:02,400 Nobody that I've heard has come out and said, well, we got to stop Francesca Hong. 44 00:03:02,400 --> 00:03:05,840 But we've seen this debate that you've referenced at the national level where you have sort 45 00:03:05,840 --> 00:03:13,440 of the national establishment Democrats fighting against this Democratic socialist caucus this 46 00:03:13,440 --> 00:03:15,080 growing. 47 00:03:15,080 --> 00:03:21,000 Is there an unspoken, we got to stop Francesca Hong in all this or are we making that up? 48 00:03:21,000 --> 00:03:23,920 Are we looking for conflict where there is none here in Wisconsin? 49 00:03:23,920 --> 00:03:27,320 I don't think it would be wise for anyone to say that out loud from the Democratic Party 50 00:03:27,320 --> 00:03:30,400 because there's a very good chance that Hong can win this. 51 00:03:30,400 --> 00:03:32,200 And then they have to unite behind her. 52 00:03:32,200 --> 00:03:35,920 So that is the the other half of this game is you can drop out and you can endorse someone 53 00:03:35,920 --> 00:03:37,360 that you would prefer. 54 00:03:37,360 --> 00:03:40,920 But then you still want to create a sense of party unity that like that is still the 55 00:03:40,920 --> 00:03:45,200 goal is for the Democrats in their minds is to beat Tom Tiffany and whether that is 56 00:03:45,200 --> 00:03:49,600 Francesca Hong, whether that's Sarah Rodriguez or Mandela Barnes or Brennan or Roy's or 57 00:03:49,600 --> 00:03:53,360 anyone that's still in this race at this point, they have to worry about that in the long 58 00:03:53,360 --> 00:03:54,360 run. 59 00:03:54,360 --> 00:03:57,480 So in the short run, we're not seeing some of the disunity of attacking each other that 60 00:03:57,480 --> 00:03:59,840 was a potential with a more crowded race. 61 00:03:59,840 --> 00:04:03,080 There's still time and there's still million dollar ad buys coming up. 62 00:04:03,080 --> 00:04:07,200 Count of Roy's just announced an hour ago that she's got 1.2 million that she's going 63 00:04:07,200 --> 00:04:09,680 to announce and she's going to spend every last penny of it. 64 00:04:09,680 --> 00:04:11,680 She's not going to drop out of this race. 65 00:04:11,680 --> 00:04:16,440 And she has a history in some of these big competitive elections of going a little contrarian 66 00:04:16,440 --> 00:04:17,440 towards the end. 67 00:04:17,440 --> 00:04:21,520 So I don't think it's going to be all quiet and rosy from here until August. 68 00:04:21,520 --> 00:04:26,200 There's going to be some fireworks as they try and create that last separation to hopefully 69 00:04:26,200 --> 00:04:30,840 put themselves over the 30 to 35 percent that maybe needed to win. 70 00:04:30,840 --> 00:04:37,240 Anya, you were all set to do this profile of David Crowley, which you know, it just sounds 71 00:04:37,320 --> 00:04:40,760 like it's not going to happen at this point. 72 00:04:40,760 --> 00:04:46,120 But can you kind of talk through why it didn't work out for his campaign from your perspective? 73 00:04:46,120 --> 00:04:51,800 I mean, there's a world where you can imagine David Crowley being seen as one of the front 74 00:04:51,800 --> 00:04:55,880 runners in this race and it never felt like that way as this campaign unfolded. 75 00:04:55,880 --> 00:04:56,880 Yeah. 76 00:04:56,880 --> 00:05:00,440 One of the ways that he was positioning himself throughout was essentially, you know, I had 77 00:05:00,440 --> 00:05:01,440 the cities on lock. 78 00:05:01,440 --> 00:05:03,000 I am a Milwaukee native. 79 00:05:03,080 --> 00:05:05,080 I have been able to work with the suburbs. 80 00:05:05,080 --> 00:05:09,440 I represent a county that, you know, straddles suburban and urban areas and I can hold the 81 00:05:09,440 --> 00:05:10,440 line on rural areas. 82 00:05:10,440 --> 00:05:14,680 So he was essentially making this pitch of like, I can be this kind of statewide candidate 83 00:05:14,680 --> 00:05:15,680 for many people. 84 00:05:15,680 --> 00:05:19,920 One of the things that came up while I was trying to write this profile that is no longer, 85 00:05:19,920 --> 00:05:24,480 you know, whenever we write profile, poor went out for my having a little bit free time 86 00:05:24,480 --> 00:05:25,480 this weekend. 87 00:05:25,480 --> 00:05:29,840 But, you know, you always look for both, you know, supporters and critics. 88 00:05:29,840 --> 00:05:32,320 And I could not find a critic of David Crowley. 89 00:05:32,360 --> 00:05:36,520 I called people who have been on the record criticizing his, you know, his policies and 90 00:05:36,520 --> 00:05:40,280 some of how he's handled, for example, the lapse of health insurance at the county level. 91 00:05:40,280 --> 00:05:43,840 And even his like most vocal critics were like, I really like him as a person. 92 00:05:43,840 --> 00:05:45,680 And I think he'd work really well in Madison. 93 00:05:45,680 --> 00:05:48,720 And these are like conservative Republicans that I'm calling. 94 00:05:48,720 --> 00:05:53,600 And so I think that was kind of where he fit in is this really kind of affable person 95 00:05:53,600 --> 00:05:57,000 who gets along well with who plays nice with others. 96 00:05:57,000 --> 00:06:00,160 And I think in a certain way, what we're seeing is that maybe that is not as appealing to 97 00:06:00,160 --> 00:06:01,160 voters. 98 00:06:01,160 --> 00:06:04,840 Voters are mad and things are really hard for a lot of people right now. 99 00:06:04,840 --> 00:06:09,040 And maybe they want somebody who seems like a little bit of a fighter, maybe like a little 100 00:06:09,040 --> 00:06:14,400 bit of a FU to some of the institutions that they are not feeling very happy with right 101 00:06:14,400 --> 00:06:15,400 now. 102 00:06:15,400 --> 00:06:20,360 So I think Sarah Rodriguez would obviously say, this is great for me. 103 00:06:20,360 --> 00:06:21,360 He's endorsing me. 104 00:06:21,360 --> 00:06:22,360 Did you notice that? 105 00:06:22,360 --> 00:06:25,400 This is unquestionably good news for me. 106 00:06:25,400 --> 00:06:29,040 Is there a case that this is good for Mandela Barnes? 107 00:06:29,040 --> 00:06:31,640 These campaigns says, yes, we benefit the most. 108 00:06:31,640 --> 00:06:33,000 They're calling to show it. 109 00:06:33,000 --> 00:06:36,200 Already making that case, and everyone's in boxes that will listen. 110 00:06:36,200 --> 00:06:39,800 And I think there's a rational argument, especially for those that kind of follow this 111 00:06:39,800 --> 00:06:43,000 from a distance that put people into those other broader categories. 112 00:06:43,000 --> 00:06:47,760 If we have two African American men with Milwaukee roots that have connections to that part of 113 00:06:47,760 --> 00:06:52,200 the state, deep establishment ties to winning lots of local elections there, that you could 114 00:06:52,200 --> 00:06:55,880 argue that some people may say, well, that's a natural transition. 115 00:06:55,880 --> 00:06:59,400 If you liked David Crowley, you should also like Mandela Barnes. 116 00:06:59,400 --> 00:07:01,680 They don't have the same electoral history. 117 00:07:01,680 --> 00:07:05,800 They don't have the same record of working in Madison. 118 00:07:05,800 --> 00:07:09,160 They have challenged Mandela Barnes as challenged members within his own party. 119 00:07:09,160 --> 00:07:10,520 He's run a statewide contest. 120 00:07:10,520 --> 00:07:14,360 David Crowley is known for working more with Republicans as part of his pitches. 121 00:07:14,360 --> 00:07:19,080 I've worked with people to help rural Wisconsin with his bills for local issues. 122 00:07:19,080 --> 00:07:25,040 So there's an argument at one optic that this absolutely should help Mandela Barnes. 123 00:07:25,080 --> 00:07:32,120 And then there is the other end of it of who, if there is 5% that Crowley had in the state. 124 00:07:32,120 --> 00:07:35,880 Were they looking at him as more of that centrist candidate that can know how to make government 125 00:07:35,880 --> 00:07:40,840 work and won't be too crazy or too loud, more of a Tony Evers style, aw, shocks let's 126 00:07:40,840 --> 00:07:44,600 all work together and make things function, or were they looking at him as more of a, 127 00:07:44,600 --> 00:07:47,000 we need some of them from that part of the state to fight for us. 128 00:07:47,000 --> 00:07:49,320 And that goes back to that original argument we've been having. 129 00:07:49,320 --> 00:07:54,200 So were his 5% those let's get it done or let's fight? 130 00:07:54,200 --> 00:07:57,520 I think that could determine where some of those voters go. 131 00:07:57,520 --> 00:08:01,680 And I think it's a sign that this race has kind of flown under the radar this year in 132 00:08:01,680 --> 00:08:06,120 that we haven't heard people complaining about, gosh, you're being bombarded by all these 133 00:08:06,120 --> 00:08:07,480 political ads. 134 00:08:07,480 --> 00:08:11,960 There has not been an advertising blitz in this race the way that we've seen in, you 135 00:08:11,960 --> 00:08:16,640 know, the races for Supreme Court that we're used to by now or a November general election 136 00:08:16,640 --> 00:08:21,040 campaign, you know, the kind of ad bliss you're going to see in a few months. 137 00:08:21,040 --> 00:08:26,520 And so in that context, how does it matter, I guess when Sarah Rodriguez says, I'm going 138 00:08:26,520 --> 00:08:32,080 to have a million dollar ad buy that I'm going to pay for with my campaign in this sort of, 139 00:08:32,080 --> 00:08:33,880 you know, under the radar race. 140 00:08:33,880 --> 00:08:37,960 You know, one person I once spoke to a political scientist I once spoke to kind of explained 141 00:08:37,960 --> 00:08:40,560 that money in politics kind of serves two functions. 142 00:08:40,560 --> 00:08:44,840 So there's money as money, right, like the thing that you use to buy things. 143 00:08:44,840 --> 00:08:46,960 And she has a million dollars to spend on this ad. 144 00:08:46,960 --> 00:08:50,560 But then it's also money as a signal is sort of a signal of your strength, the signal 145 00:08:50,560 --> 00:08:54,720 of, you know, maybe I want other candidates to kind of back off because I have this in 146 00:08:54,720 --> 00:08:55,720 my bank account. 147 00:08:55,720 --> 00:08:56,720 What do you have? 148 00:08:56,720 --> 00:09:01,320 And so in this case, it's kind of that that to fur where both she will be able to get 149 00:09:01,320 --> 00:09:06,960 a pretty sizable amount of spread for her money paying directly from her campaign. 150 00:09:06,960 --> 00:09:10,280 But then also it signals to the other candidates like what do you got, right? 151 00:09:10,280 --> 00:09:14,920 And so it kind of again is her kind of establishing that she is a front runner because she has 152 00:09:14,920 --> 00:09:16,360 this money to spend. 153 00:09:16,360 --> 00:09:20,240 And so maybe she's also trying to, you know, sort of intimidate others who may not have 154 00:09:20,240 --> 00:09:21,240 that, right? 155 00:09:21,240 --> 00:09:23,840 Like she's sending the signal of come and get me. 156 00:09:23,840 --> 00:09:28,440 I kind of wondered if that was a factor in Crowley dropping out actually, you know, because 157 00:09:28,440 --> 00:09:29,680 they happen pretty close together. 158 00:09:29,680 --> 00:09:33,320 And I imagine a decision like that builds up more than just overnight. 159 00:09:33,320 --> 00:09:35,160 And it came right after the fundraising deadline. 160 00:09:35,160 --> 00:09:39,360 And so it's possible, you know, that campaigns have their internal goals of like if we hit 161 00:09:39,360 --> 00:09:42,080 X by certain date, we're still viable. 162 00:09:42,080 --> 00:09:45,160 And one of the things he said in his dropout was like, it is clear I will not become 163 00:09:45,160 --> 00:09:46,160 the Democratic nominee. 164 00:09:46,160 --> 00:09:49,840 And so clearly there's like a calculus of what makes that clear and maybe money was part 165 00:09:49,840 --> 00:09:50,840 of it. 166 00:09:50,840 --> 00:09:52,800 Yeah, you know, she's got at least $1 million according to her. 167 00:09:52,800 --> 00:09:56,840 And she has this outside group that has been spending money on her behalf kind of throughout 168 00:09:56,840 --> 00:09:57,840 the year. 169 00:09:57,840 --> 00:10:01,840 And they don't have to report their donors and kind of like the Wild West in terms of 170 00:10:01,840 --> 00:10:02,840 fundraising. 171 00:10:02,840 --> 00:10:10,520 The tone of the ad is, well, what says a bad word to start out with? 172 00:10:10,520 --> 00:10:12,360 There's a bleep off the top of the ad. 173 00:10:12,360 --> 00:10:14,360 And that's obviously very intentional. 174 00:10:14,360 --> 00:10:18,960 They craft these ads with a lot of money spent on the people writing the ads, speaking to 175 00:10:18,960 --> 00:10:20,440 specific audiences. 176 00:10:20,440 --> 00:10:24,520 And I think there's a lot to actually analyze within the decision of that word alone off 177 00:10:24,520 --> 00:10:25,520 the top of the ad. 178 00:10:25,520 --> 00:10:26,520 I think so, too. 179 00:10:26,520 --> 00:10:29,880 I think the first reaction that I have is this is a sign of the coarseness of American 180 00:10:29,880 --> 00:10:34,960 politics since Donald Trump entered the platform in the atmosphere more than a decade ago is 181 00:10:34,960 --> 00:10:39,320 that it's acceptable for your political candidate to use an expletive in their ad. 182 00:10:39,320 --> 00:10:43,880 Even if it's bleeped out as a way of showing their rawness, their approachability, the 183 00:10:43,880 --> 00:10:49,080 way that normal people speak at maybe not the dinner table, but at least at the bar with 184 00:10:49,080 --> 00:10:50,080 friends. 185 00:10:50,080 --> 00:10:54,360 I think there's a sense of that does make them more real in the same way that Tony Evers 186 00:10:54,360 --> 00:11:00,600 has been let off the hook time and time again for swearing over and over because he seems 187 00:11:00,600 --> 00:11:02,120 like this kind old man. 188 00:11:02,120 --> 00:11:05,720 And when he says that he really means it, and if someone else says it, oh, that's course 189 00:11:05,720 --> 00:11:06,720 and disgust. 190 00:11:06,720 --> 00:11:10,320 So it's definitely a change in that atmosphere, but it also goes back to the original question 191 00:11:10,320 --> 00:11:11,320 we have. 192 00:11:11,320 --> 00:11:15,400 This is a nicely themed episode, Sean, of the establishment versus the rage. 193 00:11:15,400 --> 00:11:19,440 If Rodriguez does represent the establishment in the center, she is the lieutenant governor 194 00:11:19,440 --> 00:11:24,040 at this point, but she's the one showing a little more flair, a little more fight with 195 00:11:24,040 --> 00:11:27,640 the words that she's dropping off the top and talking about she'll fight for you. 196 00:11:27,640 --> 00:11:32,840 She's definitely reaching out to bring the rest of that democratic primary audience over 197 00:11:32,840 --> 00:11:36,480 to her to say, I'm not just the person that is the establishment and that I'm the 198 00:11:36,480 --> 00:11:39,520 sitting lieutenant governor and the first person to enter the race. 199 00:11:39,520 --> 00:11:42,520 I'm also the person that will swear and fight for you. 200 00:11:42,520 --> 00:11:45,720 The other person likes to swear a lot in this race, Francesca Hong, she's got a history 201 00:11:45,720 --> 00:11:47,640 of dropping a few F bombs out there. 202 00:11:47,640 --> 00:11:51,840 So I think that shows this broad spectrum and this interest in these two different categories 203 00:11:51,840 --> 00:11:52,840 of voters. 204 00:11:52,840 --> 00:11:57,200 Yeah, I mean, I'm reminded that Francesca Hong in, I believe her introductory speech 205 00:11:57,200 --> 00:12:01,920 in the assembly dropped an F bomb and in her final speech in the assembly, if you ever 206 00:12:01,920 --> 00:12:07,200 had a chance to see that, she just let one linger as she forbid we're farewell to 207 00:12:07,200 --> 00:12:08,200 her colleagues. 208 00:12:08,200 --> 00:12:09,200 And plenty in between. 209 00:12:09,200 --> 00:12:10,200 Those weren't the only two. 210 00:12:10,200 --> 00:12:11,200 No, they're not. 211 00:12:11,200 --> 00:12:12,200 I think it's expected. 212 00:12:12,200 --> 00:12:16,300 I mean, I think it's expected that in today's politics right now, I think Democrats are 213 00:12:16,300 --> 00:12:22,720 so mad at President Trump that you have to show in your ads that you're not just like 214 00:12:22,720 --> 00:12:26,960 an old time Democrat that you're going to get up there and fight, fight, fight. 215 00:12:26,960 --> 00:12:28,120 I mean, that is the word. 216 00:12:28,120 --> 00:12:32,080 And again, that you are not sort of part of this establishment that people are so angry 217 00:12:32,080 --> 00:12:36,000 with and do see as, you know, too moderate or too incremental. 218 00:12:36,000 --> 00:12:40,400 And so they don't want these sort of consultant polished candidates, right? 219 00:12:40,400 --> 00:12:41,680 They want people who are more real. 220 00:12:41,680 --> 00:12:43,600 That's certainly part of the appeal of Hong. 221 00:12:43,600 --> 00:12:48,240 I keep hearing that from voters who support her is that she seems like she is who she's 222 00:12:48,240 --> 00:12:51,320 always been in the same way that you kind of hear about Bernie Sanders. 223 00:12:51,320 --> 00:12:54,640 And you know, it's hard this week to talk about politics without mentioning sort of 224 00:12:54,640 --> 00:12:58,520 the Graham Plattner situation in Maine, but one of the kind of series of reactions 225 00:12:58,520 --> 00:13:03,160 to that has been now that he's dropped out, the progressive wing saying, okay, but voters 226 00:13:03,160 --> 00:13:07,960 clearly wanted his politics, if not sort of all of the other things that went along 227 00:13:07,960 --> 00:13:09,120 with it. 228 00:13:09,120 --> 00:13:12,680 So they're waiting to see whether, you know, the Democratic Party, if they try to shoehorn 229 00:13:12,680 --> 00:13:14,920 in a more establishment sort of candidate. 230 00:13:14,920 --> 00:13:17,400 And so I think we're seeing these like real fights. 231 00:13:17,400 --> 00:13:20,960 And so Wisconsin, I think, will be another kind of bellwether, maybe not in the sort 232 00:13:20,960 --> 00:13:24,720 of fireworks and really scandalous way of what's going on in Maine, but I think 233 00:13:24,720 --> 00:13:27,840 that we're having sort of our own version of that play out right here. 234 00:13:27,840 --> 00:13:28,840 Yeah. 235 00:13:28,840 --> 00:13:31,480 I mean, I think nationalize or elsewhere right now, but over the next month, we are going 236 00:13:31,480 --> 00:13:36,880 to have a real debate among Democrats here about what it means to be their party in 237 00:13:36,880 --> 00:13:37,880 2026. 238 00:13:37,880 --> 00:13:44,120 What about Mandela Barnes as we kind of look at other advertising in this race? 239 00:13:44,120 --> 00:13:47,680 He is one of the other candidates who at least through his own money and through that 240 00:13:47,680 --> 00:13:50,920 outside money has been up on the air, right? 241 00:13:51,000 --> 00:13:57,200 He's gotten out there that it's hard to figure out if he's rerunning his Senate race and 242 00:13:57,200 --> 00:14:00,920 living off that experience of like, I'm the guy you remember, you liked me before. 243 00:14:00,920 --> 00:14:03,680 I got the most votes of anyone who's lost a US Senate race. 244 00:14:03,680 --> 00:14:06,800 I should have won, but I was the only one that lost to an incumbent. 245 00:14:06,800 --> 00:14:11,160 Or if he's running a new race, but it doesn't feel like there's a different message than 246 00:14:11,160 --> 00:14:12,160 there was before. 247 00:14:12,160 --> 00:14:14,240 So he's definitely running on that platform. 248 00:14:14,240 --> 00:14:17,920 And the question is, where does he fall within these frameworks we've talked about 249 00:14:17,920 --> 00:14:19,800 because he's got establishment history. 250 00:14:19,800 --> 00:14:21,920 He's also got very progressive history. 251 00:14:21,920 --> 00:14:26,720 The question is, does he carry through to voters to say, no, I'm the best of both worlds. 252 00:14:26,720 --> 00:14:32,000 And how much does that loss in the Senate race still linger over the top of them? 253 00:14:32,000 --> 00:14:34,880 His opponents have used it against them on the campaign trail. 254 00:14:34,880 --> 00:14:39,840 It does seem like when he got into the race, his message was, I am the front runner here. 255 00:14:39,840 --> 00:14:41,280 You know, it's just a matter of time. 256 00:14:41,280 --> 00:14:45,440 I am going to set the agenda in this race and I'm focused on November. 257 00:14:45,440 --> 00:14:50,200 You're now starting to see Sarah Rodriguez make that same general argument. 258 00:14:50,200 --> 00:14:52,440 Look, these candidates are coming in endorsing me. 259 00:14:52,440 --> 00:14:57,960 The state party in these straw polls has been supporting me. 260 00:14:57,960 --> 00:15:00,440 But you know, we don't know. 261 00:15:00,440 --> 00:15:01,440 We don't know. 262 00:15:01,440 --> 00:15:05,360 Mandela Barnes did come in here with actual name recognition that nobody else could really 263 00:15:05,360 --> 00:15:06,360 match. 264 00:15:06,360 --> 00:15:10,200 And so we'll find out soon whether the other candidates have kind of cracked the consciousness 265 00:15:10,200 --> 00:15:13,360 of people who've been on their summer breaks here. 266 00:15:13,360 --> 00:15:16,960 And one thing that should also be noted is that while the Democrats are kind of working 267 00:15:16,960 --> 00:15:20,440 all of this out amongst themselves and we are devoting so much airtime to what they're 268 00:15:20,440 --> 00:15:24,280 talking about, Tom Tiffany essentially has the Republican field to himself. 269 00:15:24,280 --> 00:15:28,120 And so he just launched his own, his, I think, fourth ad campaign. 270 00:15:28,120 --> 00:15:30,520 And it shows him having a pancake breakfast. 271 00:15:30,520 --> 00:15:35,960 And it's like this very kind of wholesome, folksy, you know, all American, I'm a normal 272 00:15:35,960 --> 00:15:37,520 guy, you betcha, right? 273 00:15:37,520 --> 00:15:41,840 And because he kind of has the field to himself, he doesn't need to be kind of parsing those 274 00:15:41,840 --> 00:15:42,840 details. 275 00:15:42,840 --> 00:15:47,240 And I think it's really good for Republicans that Democrats are kind of out there splitting 276 00:15:47,240 --> 00:15:52,680 hairs in all of these different ways, splitting donors and right, splitting attention while 277 00:15:52,680 --> 00:15:55,000 Tom Tiffany can just sort of like have the field to himself. 278 00:15:55,000 --> 00:15:58,960 And so I think we're also going to see a real shift in dynamic after the primary because 279 00:15:58,960 --> 00:16:03,200 that's when all of these national Democratic groups, et cetera, will throw their weight 280 00:16:03,200 --> 00:16:07,600 behind one candidate and see if they can pick up, you know, whatever that is, six months, 281 00:16:07,600 --> 00:16:12,520 or six weeks, 80 weeks of momentum on top of everything that Tom Tiffany has essentially 282 00:16:12,520 --> 00:16:13,520 had since January. 283 00:16:13,520 --> 00:16:16,960 Yeah, you did see the Democratic governor's association through an affiliated group start 284 00:16:16,960 --> 00:16:18,680 running ads against him this week. 285 00:16:18,680 --> 00:16:19,680 But you're right. 286 00:16:19,680 --> 00:16:24,600 He has spent millions of dollars just painting himself as Mr. Wisconsin love pancakes, old 287 00:16:24,600 --> 00:16:29,520 fashions, just kind of like your neighbor, basically. 288 00:16:29,520 --> 00:16:30,520 What's that primary is done? 289 00:16:30,520 --> 00:16:32,640 There's just going to be an onslaught of money, though. 290 00:16:32,640 --> 00:16:35,320 We had to talk about the vice president coming to Wisconsin. 291 00:16:35,320 --> 00:16:37,200 He does that from time to time. 292 00:16:37,200 --> 00:16:38,200 Zach, why? 293 00:16:38,200 --> 00:16:39,960 It's not a presidential year. 294 00:16:39,960 --> 00:16:41,200 He wasn't in a swing district. 295 00:16:41,200 --> 00:16:42,200 What was he doing here? 296 00:16:42,200 --> 00:16:46,520 Well, any time a Republican comes to Milwaukee, they're there to raise money, first and foremost. 297 00:16:46,520 --> 00:16:50,440 The difference is he actually held an event open to the public on top of it during the 298 00:16:50,440 --> 00:16:51,440 Bush era. 299 00:16:51,440 --> 00:16:55,200 The Republicans coming in constantly is just they held a fundraiser in left town with 300 00:16:55,200 --> 00:16:57,640 the money, not with any ad recognition. 301 00:16:57,640 --> 00:16:59,200 But he's still here campaigning. 302 00:16:59,200 --> 00:17:00,440 He's campaigning for Tom Tiffany. 303 00:17:00,440 --> 00:17:01,600 He's campaigning for himself. 304 00:17:01,600 --> 00:17:04,200 No matter what Donald Trump thinks, he can't run for president again. 305 00:17:04,200 --> 00:17:08,320 And JD Vance wants to be the presumptive Republican nominee in 28. 306 00:17:08,320 --> 00:17:10,760 No one's is beyond looking two years ahead. 307 00:17:10,760 --> 00:17:13,200 That's actually a short window for them to be looking ahead. 308 00:17:13,200 --> 00:17:16,960 So this was entirely political, no matter what the platform on the stage said. 309 00:17:16,960 --> 00:17:19,160 Yeah, campaigning is kind of like exercise, right? 310 00:17:19,160 --> 00:17:22,080 Like even when you don't feel like doing it, it seems like candidates feel like they got 311 00:17:22,080 --> 00:17:26,480 to keep coming to these swing states, just kind of rinse and repeat. 312 00:17:26,480 --> 00:17:30,640 Anya, anything in the message, stand out, or just the visit as a whole, stand out to you 313 00:17:30,640 --> 00:17:32,840 about why JD Vance is here now? 314 00:17:32,840 --> 00:17:36,920 I mean, yeah, I think you can't in an election year ignore Wisconsin or other swing states. 315 00:17:36,920 --> 00:17:39,160 I think he was also campaigning for Derek Van Orden to say. 316 00:17:39,160 --> 00:17:42,520 And Brian's style, yep, the two kind of targeted Republicans in Wisconsin. 317 00:17:42,520 --> 00:17:43,520 Yeah. 318 00:17:43,520 --> 00:17:47,880 So just again, sort of bringing some national attention, some money, but also he had this 319 00:17:47,880 --> 00:17:52,320 message around fraud and rooting out fraud and sort of the federal government's response 320 00:17:52,320 --> 00:17:53,320 to fraud. 321 00:17:53,320 --> 00:17:57,080 And so I think this is a way in which we're seeing that concept emerge as an election 322 00:17:57,080 --> 00:18:01,640 year issue of sort of rooting out corruption and like they are going to be the honest and 323 00:18:01,680 --> 00:18:06,240 transparent arm of government, which is a sort of interesting tactic to take at a time 324 00:18:06,240 --> 00:18:09,760 that I think people are much more concerned about, you know, prices than necessarily 325 00:18:09,760 --> 00:18:15,160 the specter of fraud that again, sort of there's no evidence actually exists. 326 00:18:15,160 --> 00:18:16,160 All right. 327 00:18:16,160 --> 00:18:18,000 That's all the time we have for today. 328 00:18:18,000 --> 00:18:19,000 Thanks for joining us. 329 00:18:19,000 --> 00:18:21,560 Our colleague Rich Kramer will be back next week. 330 00:18:21,560 --> 00:18:23,400 This has been Inside Wisconsin Politics. 331 00:18:23,400 --> 00:18:29,440 Be sure to follow us on PBSWisconsin.org, WPR.org, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts.