1
00:00:34,930 --> 00:00:36,409
As the general election campaign

2
00:00:36,410 --> 00:00:38,109
begins, the candidates for governor

3
00:00:38,110 --> 00:00:39,789
look to define one another.

4
00:00:39,790 --> 00:00:41,629
That includes Tom Tiffany attacking

5
00:00:41,630 --> 00:00:44,369
David Crowley on data centers.

6
00:00:44,370 --> 00:00:46,510
This is Inside Wisconsin Politics.

7
00:00:51,670 --> 00:00:53,129
I'm Sean Johnson here with my

8
00:00:53,130 --> 00:00:54,969
colleagues, Anya Van Wectendonk and

9
00:00:54,970 --> 00:00:56,449
Zach Schultz. Hey you two.

10
00:00:56,450 --> 00:00:57,409
Hello.

11
00:00:57,410 --> 00:00:59,309
So it feels like ads

12
00:00:59,310 --> 00:01:01,089
are just always running in

13
00:01:01,090 --> 00:01:02,569
Wisconsin, Swing State, Wisconsin,

14
00:01:02,570 --> 00:01:03,809
where every election is so

15
00:01:03,810 --> 00:01:05,208
important.

16
00:01:05,209 --> 00:01:07,369
But Anya, I wonder if there

17
00:01:07,370 --> 00:01:09,269
is an argument to be made

18
00:01:09,270 --> 00:01:11,049
that the ads that are running right

19
00:01:11,050 --> 00:01:12,949
now are potentially

20
00:01:12,950 --> 00:01:14,769
very critical to the outcome of

21
00:01:14,770 --> 00:01:16,169
a race like the one we have for

22
00:01:16,170 --> 00:01:16,579
governor.

23
00:01:16,580 --> 00:01:18,079
I mean, right, this is sort of the

24
00:01:18,080 --> 00:01:19,139
pivot point. We are going from

25
00:01:19,140 --> 00:01:21,019
primary to general, and especially

26
00:01:21,020 --> 00:01:22,599
in this particular instance where we

27
00:01:22,600 --> 00:01:24,259
had such a kind of crazy democratic

28
00:01:24,260 --> 00:01:26,319
primary, there's now two very

29
00:01:26,320 --> 00:01:27,679
clear candidates that are going to

30
00:01:27,680 --> 00:01:28,559
be on the ballot.

31
00:01:28,560 --> 00:01:29,739
And so they are trying to define

32
00:01:29,740 --> 00:01:30,819
themselves and they're trying to

33
00:01:30,820 --> 00:01:32,239
find one another. And so right now,

34
00:01:32,240 --> 00:01:33,699
I think with all of that momentum

35
00:01:33,700 --> 00:01:35,419
kind of coming out of the primary

36
00:01:35,420 --> 00:01:37,019
week, now is the time that they have

37
00:01:37,020 --> 00:01:38,639
to turn to the entire state, not

38
00:01:38,640 --> 00:01:40,339
just their party base, and say, this

39
00:01:40,340 --> 00:01:41,779
who I am, but more importantly,

40
00:01:41,780 --> 00:01:43,179
perhaps this is who that other guy

41
00:01:43,180 --> 00:01:44,379
is and here's why you don't wanna

42
00:01:44,380 --> 00:01:45,149
vote for him.

43
00:01:45,150 --> 00:01:47,169
Define or be defined,

44
00:01:47,170 --> 00:01:49,089
Zach. And it strikes me that these

45
00:01:49,090 --> 00:01:50,709
two candidates in particular are

46
00:01:50,710 --> 00:01:52,529
maybe especially vulnerable

47
00:01:52,530 --> 00:01:53,479
to that because.

48
00:01:53,480 --> 00:01:54,459
They're not that well known.

49
00:01:54,460 --> 00:01:56,319
They're not that well statewide.

50
00:01:56,320 --> 00:01:57,779
And this is really their opportunity

51
00:01:57,780 --> 00:02:00,059
to decide on what territory

52
00:02:00,060 --> 00:02:01,999
the election will be fought.

53
00:02:02,000 --> 00:02:03,919
Will it be about, for Tom Tiffany,

54
00:02:03,920 --> 00:02:05,059
his greatest fear is this is an

55
00:02:05,060 --> 00:02:06,579
election on his connections to

56
00:02:06,580 --> 00:02:07,899
Donald Trump and the national

57
00:02:07,900 --> 00:02:09,859
economy and affordability or

58
00:02:09,860 --> 00:02:11,499
abortion or any of those topics that

59
00:02:11,500 --> 00:02:12,599
he really doesn't want to talk

60
00:02:12,600 --> 00:02:13,599
about.

61
00:02:13,600 --> 00:02:15,159
For David Crowley, it's absolutely,

62
00:02:15,160 --> 00:02:16,859
he doesn't wanna have to talk about

63
00:02:16,860 --> 00:02:18,599
crime rates or doesn't have to talk

64
00:02:18,600 --> 00:02:20,099
about some of the executive

65
00:02:20,100 --> 00:02:21,559
decisions he's made in Milwaukee or

66
00:02:21,560 --> 00:02:23,149
some of the history of that county.

67
00:02:23,150 --> 00:02:25,029
And especially where he is on data

68
00:02:25,030 --> 00:02:26,169
centers. This is one of those pivot

69
00:02:26,170 --> 00:02:28,129
points that Tom Tiffany is trying

70
00:02:28,130 --> 00:02:29,949
to say, let's put the race in that

71
00:02:29,950 --> 00:02:31,229
category, because I think that's an

72
00:02:31,230 --> 00:02:32,809
area that people want to talk about,

73
00:02:32,810 --> 00:02:34,409
and I think I can make it more

74
00:02:34,410 --> 00:02:36,389
favorable to myself, especially

75
00:02:36,390 --> 00:02:37,929
in the sense that he's not

76
00:02:37,930 --> 00:02:39,449
well-defined in that area, just as

77
00:02:39,450 --> 00:02:40,549
we were talking about. He's trying

78
00:02:40,550 --> 00:02:42,409
to create the definition of where

79
00:02:42,410 --> 00:02:44,009
does Tom Tiffany stand on data

80
00:02:44,010 --> 00:02:45,489
centers because it's not super

81
00:02:45,490 --> 00:02:45,829
clear.

82
00:02:45,830 --> 00:02:47,869
Yeah, I mean, with the caveat that

83
00:02:47,870 --> 00:02:49,249
we don't know how it's going to

84
00:02:49,250 --> 00:02:50,849
work, and neither does the Tiffany

85
00:02:50,850 --> 00:02:51,749
campaign.

86
00:02:51,750 --> 00:02:53,869
As far as wedge issues go, it's

87
00:02:53,870 --> 00:02:54,729
fairly clever.

88
00:02:54,730 --> 00:02:56,749
This is a relatively new issue to

89
00:02:56,750 --> 00:02:59,089
politics, so it's not defined

90
00:02:59,090 --> 00:03:00,269
in the way that some other issues

91
00:03:00,270 --> 00:03:01,629
are. You don't know exactly where

92
00:03:01,630 --> 00:03:03,169
the interest groups stand with the

93
00:03:03,170 --> 00:03:04,170
parties.

94
00:03:04,670 --> 00:03:06,689
So Anya, how is that playing out in

95
00:03:06,690 --> 00:03:09,249
this attack from Tom Tiffany?

96
00:03:09,250 --> 00:03:10,769
How is he going after David Crowley,

97
00:03:10,770 --> 00:03:11,929
trying to frame him?

98
00:03:11,930 --> 00:03:13,409
Yeah, I mean, he's trying to use his

99
00:03:13,410 --> 00:03:14,269
initials against him.

100
00:03:14,270 --> 00:03:16,189
He's calling him data center

101
00:03:16,190 --> 00:03:18,449
David Crowley, DCDC,

102
00:03:18,450 --> 00:03:20,029
as a way of trying to kind of tie

103
00:03:20,030 --> 00:03:21,309
him to this. And the way he's doing

104
00:03:21,310 --> 00:03:22,949
it is in a slightly convoluted way

105
00:03:22,950 --> 00:03:24,789
by saying that because David Crowely

106
00:03:24,790 --> 00:03:26,509
hasn't pledged to kind roll back

107
00:03:26,510 --> 00:03:28,249
these specific tax incentives, that

108
00:03:28,250 --> 00:03:30,249
that makes him more pro data center.

109
00:03:30,250 --> 00:03:31,689
David Crowly is also kind of trying

110
00:03:31,690 --> 00:03:32,989
to split the difference a little bit

111
00:03:32,990 --> 00:03:34,689
and say, well, I support local

112
00:03:34,690 --> 00:03:36,529
control, so communities that don't

113
00:03:36,530 --> 00:03:38,529
want it don't have to have it.

114
00:03:38,530 --> 00:03:40,469
I would want, you know, sort of

115
00:03:40,470 --> 00:03:41,949
tight controls and regulations and

116
00:03:41,950 --> 00:03:43,149
this kind of thing.

117
00:03:43,150 --> 00:03:44,229
But the other kind of interesting

118
00:03:44,230 --> 00:03:46,209
piece of how Tom Tiffany is handling

119
00:03:46,210 --> 00:03:48,329
this, so I went yesterday to an

120
00:03:48,330 --> 00:03:49,869
endorsement announcement for these

121
00:03:49,870 --> 00:03:51,149
environmental groups that are now

122
00:03:51,150 --> 00:03:52,429
backing David Crowley.

123
00:03:52,430 --> 00:03:53,469
And of course, environmental

124
00:03:53,470 --> 00:03:55,009
concerns are very tied up in

125
00:03:55,010 --> 00:03:56,749
people's concerns over data centers.

126
00:03:56,750 --> 00:03:58,809
And part of the way that Tom Tiffany

127
00:03:58,810 --> 00:04:00,989
is now framing it is that

128
00:04:00,990 --> 00:04:02,389
data centers are taking away

129
00:04:02,390 --> 00:04:04,489
farmland, and also because

130
00:04:04,490 --> 00:04:07,129
there's a push from Democrats to

131
00:04:07,130 --> 00:04:08,989
have sustainable energy be

132
00:04:08,990 --> 00:04:10,569
sort of the backbone of data

133
00:04:10,570 --> 00:04:12,209
centers. He's also now kind of using

134
00:04:12,210 --> 00:04:13,689
it as a one, two, three punch of

135
00:04:13,690 --> 00:04:14,969
they're trying to take farmland, not

136
00:04:14,970 --> 00:04:16,088
just to create data centers, but

137
00:04:16,089 --> 00:04:17,849
also to create wind farms and solar

138
00:04:17,850 --> 00:04:19,489
farms. And so he can kind of package

139
00:04:19,490 --> 00:04:20,669
it together and all these things

140
00:04:20,670 --> 00:04:21,869
that will speak to Republican

141
00:04:21,870 --> 00:04:22,789
voters.

142
00:04:22,790 --> 00:04:24,609
Democrats obviously like solar,

143
00:04:24,610 --> 00:04:25,969
like wind farms, and so they'll have

144
00:04:25,970 --> 00:04:27,049
more of their work cut out for them

145
00:04:27,050 --> 00:04:28,879
to kind of distinguish those issues.

146
00:04:28,880 --> 00:04:30,979
Yeah, Zach, I was just seeing some

147
00:04:30,980 --> 00:04:32,699
social media appearances from Tom

148
00:04:32,700 --> 00:04:34,739
Tiffany. He was at an event, and

149
00:04:34,740 --> 00:04:36,439
he's kind of framing it as data

150
00:04:36,440 --> 00:04:38,519
centers versus farmland.

151
00:04:38,520 --> 00:04:40,239
It's maybe like a pretty transparent

152
00:04:40,240 --> 00:04:41,619
appeal to rural voters in that

153
00:04:41,620 --> 00:04:41,909
instance.

154
00:04:41,910 --> 00:04:43,789
It's doing so many things at

155
00:04:43,790 --> 00:04:44,989
the same time because it is about

156
00:04:44,990 --> 00:04:46,869
his base and rural farmland one

157
00:04:46,870 --> 00:04:48,489
of his earliest ads months ago

158
00:04:48,490 --> 00:04:50,589
Talked about I'll prevent foreign

159
00:04:50,590 --> 00:04:52,269
countries from coming in and buying

160
00:04:52,270 --> 00:04:54,109
up our farmland which is an issue

161
00:04:54,110 --> 00:04:55,729
that does concern people that are

162
00:04:55,730 --> 00:04:57,369
worried about the rising cost of

163
00:04:57,370 --> 00:04:59,349
just trying to rent out a field to

164
00:04:59,350 --> 00:05:00,889
Put crops in the ground as we've

165
00:05:00,890 --> 00:05:02,089
seen with all the international

166
00:05:02,090 --> 00:05:03,609
tariffs affecting soybean and corn

167
00:05:03,610 --> 00:05:05,569
farmers They're looking for someone

168
00:05:05,570 --> 00:05:07,209
to blame and if they're some of the

169
00:05:07,210 --> 00:05:09,149
cognitive dissonance with them is

170
00:05:09,150 --> 00:05:10,149
They don't want to blame Donald

171
00:05:10,150 --> 00:05:11,149
Trump. I've interviewed them and

172
00:05:11,150 --> 00:05:12,509
they don't really want to blame him

173
00:05:12,510 --> 00:05:13,649
and his decision.

174
00:05:13,650 --> 00:05:15,129
So if they, Tom Tiffany says, well,

175
00:05:15,130 --> 00:05:16,129
it's not his fault.

176
00:05:16,130 --> 00:05:17,149
It's over here.

177
00:05:17,150 --> 00:05:18,469
This is who you blame for your

178
00:05:18,470 --> 00:05:19,809
rising costs. Well, they're more

179
00:05:19,810 --> 00:05:21,129
than happy to follow along if

180
00:05:21,130 --> 00:05:23,029
they're in that inclination

181
00:05:23,030 --> 00:05:24,109
to begin with.

182
00:05:24,110 --> 00:05:25,569
So it's definitely a way to do that.

183
00:05:25,570 --> 00:05:26,969
But what's another element that's

184
00:05:26,970 --> 00:05:28,809
fascinating is he's really trying

185
00:05:28,810 --> 00:05:30,769
to split off those

186
00:05:30,770 --> 00:05:32,769
Hong voters from David Crowley

187
00:05:32,770 --> 00:05:34,889
and split the left because we've

188
00:05:34,890 --> 00:05:36,799
seen elections where the far left

189
00:05:36,800 --> 00:05:39,019
and progressive left have sat out,

190
00:05:39,020 --> 00:05:40,339
maybe not in huge numbers, but

191
00:05:40,340 --> 00:05:41,659
enough numbers where potentially it

192
00:05:41,660 --> 00:05:43,059
does swing an election.

193
00:05:43,060 --> 00:05:44,299
We saw that with Hillary Clinton, we

194
00:05:44,300 --> 00:05:46,139
saw that Kamala Harris, and

195
00:05:46,140 --> 00:05:47,439
they're trying to repeat that

196
00:05:47,440 --> 00:05:48,519
pattern at David Crowley.

197
00:05:48,520 --> 00:05:50,679
If they can paint him as more

198
00:05:50,680 --> 00:05:52,759
moderate, more corporate, and less

199
00:05:52,760 --> 00:05:54,679
true far left,

200
00:05:54,680 --> 00:05:56,179
then some of those voters may go

201
00:05:56,180 --> 00:05:57,339
third party or just set out

202
00:05:57,340 --> 00:05:58,519
together. And that's one of the

203
00:05:58,520 --> 00:05:59,959
concerns is he has to watch his

204
00:05:59,960 --> 00:06:01,759
flank, even though he won by being

205
00:06:01,760 --> 00:06:02,519
in the center.

206
00:06:02,520 --> 00:06:03,839
That's definitely an open question

207
00:06:03,840 --> 00:06:05,919
for me, especially because you

208
00:06:05,920 --> 00:06:06,979
at least get the impression that a

209
00:06:06,980 --> 00:06:09,139
lot of Hong voters are maybe

210
00:06:09,140 --> 00:06:11,179
not a politics first

211
00:06:11,180 --> 00:06:12,239
kind of voter.

212
00:06:12,240 --> 00:06:13,859
You know, they came to her because

213
00:06:13,860 --> 00:06:15,899
she spoke to them in different ways,

214
00:06:15,900 --> 00:06:18,199
more of a movement candidate.

215
00:06:18,200 --> 00:06:20,079
She would not want to identify with

216
00:06:20,080 --> 00:06:21,599
Donald Trump, but a movement

217
00:06:21,600 --> 00:06:22,639
candidate in that way.

218
00:06:22,640 --> 00:06:24,579
You get different people into the

219
00:06:24,580 --> 00:06:26,239
political arena.

220
00:06:26,240 --> 00:06:27,779
And you know, one question that I

221
00:06:27,780 --> 00:06:29,099
think some of them had during the

222
00:06:29,100 --> 00:06:31,059
primary was, Why don't more

223
00:06:31,060 --> 00:06:33,039
Democrats just say what

224
00:06:33,040 --> 00:06:34,139
Francesca Hong is saying.

225
00:06:34,140 --> 00:06:35,279
We're gonna have a moratorium on

226
00:06:35,280 --> 00:06:36,619
data centers. I like the sounds of

227
00:06:36,620 --> 00:06:38,299
that. Why wouldn't David Crowley

228
00:06:38,300 --> 00:06:40,399
just say, hey, let's

229
00:06:40,400 --> 00:06:41,799
put the brakes on these and this

230
00:06:41,800 --> 00:06:43,399
data center issue is all taken care

231
00:06:43,400 --> 00:06:44,979
of for me politically?

232
00:06:44,980 --> 00:06:46,819
Well, politically speaking,

233
00:06:46,820 --> 00:06:48,259
data centers are not popular.

234
00:06:48,260 --> 00:06:49,479
The vast majority of voters,

235
00:06:49,480 --> 00:06:51,019
Democrats and Republicans, don't

236
00:06:51,020 --> 00:06:52,139
support data centers, or they

237
00:06:52,140 --> 00:06:53,199
certainly don't support them sort of

238
00:06:53,200 --> 00:06:54,799
coming into their own communities.

239
00:06:54,800 --> 00:06:56,539
But there is a real kind of question

240
00:06:56,540 --> 00:06:58,199
around the types of jobs that they

241
00:06:58,200 --> 00:06:59,519
can bring in, the kind of economic

242
00:06:59,520 --> 00:07:01,699
development possibilities there.

243
00:07:01,700 --> 00:07:03,559
And so I think like as a politician,

244
00:07:03,560 --> 00:07:05,439
you don't necessarily want to

245
00:07:05,440 --> 00:07:07,279
say, you know, categorically, I

246
00:07:07,280 --> 00:07:08,719
will not support a thing that could

247
00:07:08,720 --> 00:07:10,399
be a driver of economic growth,

248
00:07:10,400 --> 00:07:11,799
especially in some of these kind of

249
00:07:11,800 --> 00:07:13,679
hard places in Wisconsin that are

250
00:07:13,680 --> 00:07:15,819
kind of hurting for economic

251
00:07:15,820 --> 00:07:16,939
opportunities.

252
00:07:16,940 --> 00:07:18,079
You know, another piece of this too

253
00:07:18,080 --> 00:07:20,559
is that a lot of the

254
00:07:20,560 --> 00:07:22,379
data center, a lot of the

255
00:07:22,380 --> 00:07:24,199
unions that back David Crowley

256
00:07:24,200 --> 00:07:26,299
are involved in data center

257
00:07:26,300 --> 00:07:27,559
construction. And so one of the

258
00:07:27,560 --> 00:07:29,259
things that he has said is that, you

259
00:07:29,260 --> 00:07:30,899
know, again, if a local community

260
00:07:30,900 --> 00:07:32,339
wants a data center one of things

261
00:07:32,340 --> 00:07:33,359
that you would want to see is that

262
00:07:33,360 --> 00:07:35,039
it has to be union built.

263
00:07:35,040 --> 00:07:37,059
That gets you union support.

264
00:07:37,060 --> 00:07:38,859
And unions are a pretty big part of

265
00:07:38,860 --> 00:07:40,499
how the democratic party defines

266
00:07:40,500 --> 00:07:41,939
itself as being about party of the

267
00:07:41,940 --> 00:07:43,419
unions, and unions are a pretty big

268
00:07:43,420 --> 00:07:44,839
part of how Republicans have started

269
00:07:44,840 --> 00:07:46,519
to kind of make huge inroads with

270
00:07:46,520 --> 00:07:47,329
working people.

271
00:07:47,330 --> 00:07:48,810
So the union question, I think, is

272
00:07:48,811 --> 00:07:50,669
an untapped and unanswered

273
00:07:50,670 --> 00:07:51,349
one so far.

274
00:07:51,350 --> 00:07:52,869
And it seems like he's also raised

275
00:07:52,870 --> 00:07:54,509
sort of just the practical arguments

276
00:07:54,510 --> 00:07:56,269
during the primary campaign that,

277
00:07:56,270 --> 00:07:58,189
look, putting a moratorium on

278
00:07:58,190 --> 00:07:59,849
these things is not going to change

279
00:07:59,850 --> 00:08:01,089
the ones that are already in the

280
00:08:01,090 --> 00:08:02,889
works, that there's a lot of data

281
00:08:02,890 --> 00:08:05,009
centers that are happening or

282
00:08:05,010 --> 00:08:06,969
in development now that a moratorium

283
00:08:06,970 --> 00:08:08,129
just won't solve.

284
00:08:08,130 --> 00:08:10,089
So, how are

285
00:08:10,090 --> 00:08:12,049
we seeing David Crowley and

286
00:08:12,050 --> 00:08:13,630
his allies, I guess you'd say?

287
00:08:14,770 --> 00:08:16,549
Go after Tom Tiffany in this early

288
00:08:16,550 --> 00:08:18,569
stage, or how is he presenting

289
00:08:18,570 --> 00:08:20,429
himself as a candidate for governor

290
00:08:20,430 --> 00:08:21,889
on TV airwaves?

291
00:08:21,890 --> 00:08:23,749
Well, Tom Tiffany is splitting the

292
00:08:23,750 --> 00:08:25,309
baby. He's doing a little bit of

293
00:08:25,310 --> 00:08:27,149
both. He's still continuing his I'm

294
00:08:27,150 --> 00:08:28,989
in every man who thinks of

295
00:08:28,990 --> 00:08:30,949
your rural farmland and your local

296
00:08:30,950 --> 00:08:32,249
schools. He's Still running some of

297
00:08:32,250 --> 00:08:34,149
those positive ads to try and

298
00:08:34,150 --> 00:08:35,629
define himself. That was one of his

299
00:08:35,630 --> 00:08:36,949
goals. And one of the freedoms he

300
00:08:36,950 --> 00:08:38,749
had of not having a primary is he

301
00:08:38,750 --> 00:08:40,349
could spend millions of dollars

302
00:08:40,350 --> 00:08:42,349
trying to create a brand for himself

303
00:08:42,350 --> 00:08:43,548
as a Wisconsin guy.

304
00:08:43,549 --> 00:08:45,549
Because his brand as a

305
00:08:45,550 --> 00:08:47,629
DC congressman is

306
00:08:47,630 --> 00:08:49,369
frankly toxic in the national

307
00:08:49,370 --> 00:08:51,089
political environment No one wants

308
00:08:51,090 --> 00:08:52,819
to say I'm deeply connected to

309
00:08:52,820 --> 00:08:55,039
Donald Trump in Washington DC.

310
00:08:55,040 --> 00:08:56,439
No one from either party really

311
00:08:56,440 --> 00:08:58,019
likes that at this very moment.

312
00:08:58,020 --> 00:08:59,959
So he has to build a brand of being

313
00:08:59,960 --> 00:09:01,379
from Wisconsin and he's got enough

314
00:09:01,380 --> 00:09:02,999
roots to be able to do it and he has

315
00:09:03,000 --> 00:09:04,059
got the support to do it and the

316
00:09:04,060 --> 00:09:05,019
money to do.

317
00:09:05,020 --> 00:09:06,199
And at the same time he's starting

318
00:09:06,200 --> 00:09:07,639
to run his negative ads going after

319
00:09:07,640 --> 00:09:09,419
David Crowley in all these areas.

320
00:09:09,420 --> 00:09:11,439
Crowley on the flip side and his

321
00:09:11,440 --> 00:09:12,379
allies we've seen from the

322
00:09:12,380 --> 00:09:14,439
Democratic Governors Association are

323
00:09:14,440 --> 00:09:16,059
doing everything we expected to have

324
00:09:16,060 --> 00:09:17,739
happen, which is linking Tiffany to

325
00:09:17,740 --> 00:09:19,789
Trump. And international and

326
00:09:19,790 --> 00:09:21,669
national politics, because that is

327
00:09:21,670 --> 00:09:23,489
their route right now, is to try

328
00:09:23,490 --> 00:09:25,229
and connect those dots for voters

329
00:09:25,230 --> 00:09:27,069
who may not understand that, because

330
00:09:27,070 --> 00:09:28,869
that's not a winning formula for Tom

331
00:09:28,870 --> 00:09:30,209
Tiffany going into the fall.

332
00:09:30,210 --> 00:09:31,389
Voters are thinking of those two

333
00:09:31,390 --> 00:09:32,119
together.

334
00:09:32,120 --> 00:09:34,059
And we are now seeing,

335
00:09:34,060 --> 00:09:35,779
it was more than a week after the

336
00:09:35,780 --> 00:09:37,199
primary, David Crowley running his

337
00:09:37,200 --> 00:09:38,639
first ad where it's kind of

338
00:09:38,640 --> 00:09:39,779
biographical. The Democratic

339
00:09:39,780 --> 00:09:41,699
Governors Association ads were

340
00:09:41,700 --> 00:09:43,539
out right away after the primarily

341
00:09:43,540 --> 00:09:45,439
and kind of seem to fill

342
00:09:45,440 --> 00:09:47,259
that crucial period when

343
00:09:47,260 --> 00:09:48,639
you wanna be grabbing people's

344
00:09:48,640 --> 00:09:49,640
attention.

345
00:09:50,520 --> 00:09:52,639
What does it take for one side to

346
00:09:52,640 --> 00:09:54,719
win this

347
00:09:54,720 --> 00:09:56,719
definition war, Anya and

348
00:09:56,720 --> 00:09:57,759
Zach? I mean, it's kinda an open

349
00:09:57,760 --> 00:09:59,659
question, but

350
00:09:59,660 --> 00:10:01,439
maybe it's a simple answer.

351
00:10:01,440 --> 00:10:02,959
I actually, well I think it's sort

352
00:10:02,960 --> 00:10:04,659
of a simple answer in that the

353
00:10:04,660 --> 00:10:06,359
question is like nobody knows.

354
00:10:06,360 --> 00:10:08,639
Sure. Every sort of, you know,

355
00:10:08,640 --> 00:10:09,819
political advertising expert I've

356
00:10:09,820 --> 00:10:11,999
ever spoken to has said, you know,

357
00:10:12,000 --> 00:10:13,339
Nobody knows why people choose

358
00:10:13,340 --> 00:10:14,739
Colgate over Crest or Crest over

359
00:10:14,740 --> 00:10:16,299
Colgate, but people spend billions

360
00:10:16,300 --> 00:10:17,519
of dollars to make sure that you

361
00:10:17,520 --> 00:10:18,399
pick one of those.

362
00:10:18,400 --> 00:10:19,639
And it's sort of the same with when

363
00:10:19,640 --> 00:10:20,439
you're voting.

364
00:10:20,440 --> 00:10:21,739
And so, I think, you know, we're

365
00:10:21,740 --> 00:10:23,199
seeing the negative ads, we're see

366
00:10:23,200 --> 00:10:24,119
the positive ads.

367
00:10:24,120 --> 00:10:25,699
Like, we've seen just kind of a lot

368
00:10:25,700 --> 00:10:27,199
of different types of messaging get

369
00:10:27,200 --> 00:10:28,539
thrown out there, because what

370
00:10:28,540 --> 00:10:30,999
resonates with, like, a young,

371
00:10:31,000 --> 00:10:32,919
annoyed, you know Hong

372
00:10:32,920 --> 00:10:34,659
voter who isn't quite sure about

373
00:10:34,660 --> 00:10:36,099
Crowley, isn't going to be the same

374
00:10:36,100 --> 00:10:37,299
thing that resonates, it's just sort

375
00:10:37,300 --> 00:10:39,179
of like your moderate person

376
00:10:39,180 --> 00:10:40,219
who hasn't really been paying

377
00:10:40,220 --> 00:10:41,359
attention, maybe didn't vote in the

378
00:10:41,360 --> 00:10:42,519
primary, but is going to vote in the

379
00:10:42,520 --> 00:10:44,359
general. And in any election

380
00:10:44,360 --> 00:10:45,979
where the difference might be 20,000

381
00:10:45,980 --> 00:10:47,179
votes, as we often see in these

382
00:10:47,180 --> 00:10:48,599
general elections, you kind of need

383
00:10:48,600 --> 00:10:49,879
to get a little bit of each of those

384
00:10:49,880 --> 00:10:50,839
types of people.

385
00:10:50,840 --> 00:10:52,539
So Sean we've seen throughout

386
00:10:52,540 --> 00:10:53,959
history that there's a phrase that

387
00:10:53,960 --> 00:10:55,719
this time of year it talks about you

388
00:10:55,720 --> 00:10:57,119
you can't win the election though

389
00:10:57,120 --> 00:10:58,699
but you can lose it.

390
00:10:58,700 --> 00:11:00,639
So in your mind what is the losing

391
00:11:00,640 --> 00:11:01,879
move from either one of these

392
00:11:01,880 --> 00:11:03,199
candidates and what could they do to

393
00:11:03,200 --> 00:11:04,739
really put themselves in a hole

394
00:11:04,740 --> 00:11:06,188
going into the fall?

395
00:11:06,189 --> 00:11:08,209
You know one way to do it would just

396
00:11:08,210 --> 00:11:10,389
be to disappear You know if

397
00:11:10,390 --> 00:11:12,249
if David Crowley had had

398
00:11:12,250 --> 00:11:14,229
no money or his allies had

399
00:11:14,230 --> 00:11:15,989
had No money and just been off the

400
00:11:15,990 --> 00:11:17,349
air for a couple weeks.

401
00:11:17,350 --> 00:11:19,349
That's dangerous territory You

402
00:11:19,350 --> 00:11:20,569
know when you don't have somebody to

403
00:11:20,570 --> 00:11:22,409
answer the the Tiffany

404
00:11:22,410 --> 00:11:24,309
attacks You get in real

405
00:11:24,310 --> 00:11:26,589
trouble that way And so I think that

406
00:11:26,590 --> 00:11:27,949
the one thing you do is just you

407
00:11:27,950 --> 00:11:29,649
just keep hitting those ads But the

408
00:11:29,650 --> 00:11:31,249
Colgate and Crest ads is on you

409
00:11:31,250 --> 00:11:33,269
would as she would characterize

410
00:11:33,270 --> 00:11:35,129
them So that's one thing that we've

411
00:11:35,130 --> 00:11:36,049
seen from them.

412
00:11:36,050 --> 00:11:37,509
I think for Tiffany, it's also

413
00:11:37,510 --> 00:11:38,809
though, kind of a critical period,

414
00:11:40,149 --> 00:11:41,929
because when the thought was this

415
00:11:41,930 --> 00:11:43,669
was gonna be a Tiffany versus Hong

416
00:11:43,670 --> 00:11:45,789
race, which was conventional

417
00:11:45,790 --> 00:11:47,549
wisdom, you know, a couple of weeks

418
00:11:47,550 --> 00:11:48,550
ago.

419
00:11:49,010 --> 00:11:50,349
You had Republican donors around the

420
00:11:50,350 --> 00:11:52,289
country saying, sign me up,

421
00:11:52,290 --> 00:11:54,069
I want to put money into that race,

422
00:11:54,070 --> 00:11:55,429
I wanna fight back democratic

423
00:11:55,430 --> 00:11:57,329
socialism, and I want

424
00:11:57,330 --> 00:11:59,249
a potential win in a swing state in

425
00:11:59,250 --> 00:12:00,549
a year when Republicans could have

426
00:12:00,550 --> 00:12:02,909
losses all over the place.

427
00:12:02,910 --> 00:12:04,749
I think the conventional

428
00:12:04,750 --> 00:12:06,669
wisdom right now is still that this

429
00:12:06,670 --> 00:12:07,629
is Wisconsin.

430
00:12:07,630 --> 00:12:08,829
Everything's 50-50 here.

431
00:12:08,830 --> 00:12:09,929
It's a race for governor.

432
00:12:09,930 --> 00:12:11,849
And so yeah, it's winnable for

433
00:12:11,850 --> 00:12:13,729
Tom Tiffany, but he needs to

434
00:12:13,730 --> 00:12:15,709
maintain that perception that

435
00:12:15,710 --> 00:12:17,549
he can win this race.

436
00:12:17,550 --> 00:12:18,849
Because once that perception goes

437
00:12:18,850 --> 00:12:20,229
away, the money's going to go with

438
00:12:20,230 --> 00:12:21,230
it.

439
00:12:22,110 --> 00:12:24,669
I got a more important question.

440
00:12:24,670 --> 00:12:26,529
What do we think about the way

441
00:12:26,530 --> 00:12:27,869
these ads look?

442
00:12:27,870 --> 00:12:29,709
How are the candidates portrayed in

443
00:12:29,710 --> 00:12:31,249
them? When they talk about data

444
00:12:31,250 --> 00:12:33,119
center David Crowley.

445
00:12:33,120 --> 00:12:34,979
You know, the visuals

446
00:12:34,980 --> 00:12:36,789
are very striking in that ad.

447
00:12:36,790 --> 00:12:37,969
Yeah, and I mean, especially

448
00:12:37,970 --> 00:12:39,549
compared to, again, those sort of

449
00:12:39,550 --> 00:12:41,189
pro-Tom Tiffany ads, which are all

450
00:12:41,190 --> 00:12:43,409
like sunshine and backyards

451
00:12:43,410 --> 00:12:44,729
and pancakes.

452
00:12:44,730 --> 00:12:46,369
And his latest kind of, you know,

453
00:12:46,370 --> 00:12:48,369
defining himself ad is him saying.

454
00:12:48,370 --> 00:12:49,849
Like I'll teach your kids to read

455
00:12:49,850 --> 00:12:51,349
and I'll put money in your pocket

456
00:12:51,350 --> 00:12:53,369
and a third promise that was quite

457
00:12:53,370 --> 00:12:54,609
piffy and I am not remembering right

458
00:12:54,610 --> 00:12:56,549
now as compared to the kind of doom

459
00:12:56,550 --> 00:12:58,289
and gloom of this person's going to

460
00:12:58,290 --> 00:12:59,649
come in and build data centers and

461
00:12:59,650 --> 00:13:00,669
steal your farm.

462
00:13:00,670 --> 00:13:02,389
And so it really is like these tonal

463
00:13:02,390 --> 00:13:03,889
differences. And as you kind of go

464
00:13:03,890 --> 00:13:05,309
between them, it really isn't even

465
00:13:05,310 --> 00:13:06,929
just a color difference of sort of

466
00:13:06,930 --> 00:13:09,339
black and white versus technicolor.

467
00:13:09,340 --> 00:13:10,859
Yeah, I mean, the Crowley thing

468
00:13:10,860 --> 00:13:12,799
reminds me, okay, Anya,

469
00:13:12,800 --> 00:13:14,419
this is a very old reference, but

470
00:13:14,420 --> 00:13:16,359
Max Headroom, the

471
00:13:16,360 --> 00:13:18,619
kind of apocalyptic,

472
00:13:18,620 --> 00:13:20,599
doom and gloom vision

473
00:13:20,600 --> 00:13:22,479
of the 1980s of our

474
00:13:22,480 --> 00:13:23,579
future.

475
00:13:23,580 --> 00:13:25,399
They got kind of this

476
00:13:25,400 --> 00:13:27,479
like kind of digital

477
00:13:27,480 --> 00:13:29,319
background and then there's

478
00:13:29,320 --> 00:13:31,179
David Crowley talking up on

479
00:13:31,180 --> 00:13:32,499
stage. He was at a journal sentinel

480
00:13:32,500 --> 00:13:34,099
forum. They obviously doctored the

481
00:13:34,100 --> 00:13:35,299
background to make it look a little

482
00:13:35,300 --> 00:13:36,259
techno.

483
00:13:36,260 --> 00:13:37,779
Um, Zach, you remember that

484
00:13:37,780 --> 00:13:39,079
obviously you had the same exact

485
00:13:39,080 --> 00:13:40,049
thought when you watched that.

486
00:13:40,050 --> 00:13:42,629
I think of Max Hedrum all the time.

487
00:13:42,630 --> 00:13:44,029
He would be a podcaster today.

488
00:13:44,030 --> 00:13:45,369
He wouldn't be a television anchor.

489
00:13:45,370 --> 00:13:47,169
I think he was new mediums going

490
00:13:47,170 --> 00:13:47,949
forward.

491
00:13:47,950 --> 00:13:49,789
We just hadn't figured

492
00:13:49,790 --> 00:13:51,329
out where his role was in the world

493
00:13:51,330 --> 00:13:51,330
yet.

494
00:13:51,331 --> 00:13:52,699
Yeah, that's a Google reference for

495
00:13:52,700 --> 00:13:53,339
all the kids.

496
00:13:53,340 --> 00:13:54,399
Google it.

497
00:13:54,400 --> 00:13:55,109
Max Edmonds.

498
00:13:55,110 --> 00:13:56,410
I will also Google that.

499
00:13:57,610 --> 00:14:00,369
Old man memories here.

500
00:14:00,370 --> 00:14:01,609
The Democratic ads attacking

501
00:14:01,610 --> 00:14:03,949
Crowley, though, to me,

502
00:14:03,950 --> 00:14:05,529
it's funny they have to portray the

503
00:14:05,530 --> 00:14:07,169
Tom Tiffany that you know.

504
00:14:08,410 --> 00:14:10,049
The ads attacking Tiffany, if I

505
00:14:10,050 --> 00:14:11,289
mis-said that.

506
00:14:11,290 --> 00:14:12,749
They have to betray the Tom Tiffani

507
00:14:12,750 --> 00:14:14,129
that you know, and so the Tom

508
00:14:14,130 --> 00:14:15,469
TIffani that they put up on the

509
00:14:15,470 --> 00:14:17,389
screen is the Tom tiffani

510
00:14:17,390 --> 00:14:19,769
from these ads where he's like, I'm

511
00:14:19,770 --> 00:14:21,229
Mr. Wisconsin and I'm having

512
00:14:21,230 --> 00:14:22,230
pancakes

513
00:14:23,490 --> 00:14:25,349
and tending a dam, you name

514
00:14:25,350 --> 00:14:26,350
it.

515
00:14:27,120 --> 00:14:28,779
One of them, they do have his bolo

516
00:14:28,780 --> 00:14:30,159
tie look, which is interesting

517
00:14:30,160 --> 00:14:32,099
because he brought that out early in

518
00:14:32,100 --> 00:14:33,999
the campaign to get a little

519
00:14:34,000 --> 00:14:35,639
of the rural roots element, but then

520
00:14:35,640 --> 00:14:37,439
he went away from it as his ads got

521
00:14:37,440 --> 00:14:38,899
more polished. But one of those

522
00:14:38,900 --> 00:14:41,099
attack ads has Tom in

523
00:14:41,100 --> 00:14:42,959
the bolo camp tie,

524
00:14:42,960 --> 00:14:44,199
which has an interesting look

525
00:14:44,200 --> 00:14:45,839
because what is it trying to say?

526
00:14:45,840 --> 00:14:47,159
Is that a Wisconsin look?

527
00:14:47,160 --> 00:14:48,019
Is that rural look?

528
00:14:48,020 --> 00:14:49,999
Is that rustic look?

529
00:14:50,000 --> 00:14:51,479
And it's just when they pick those

530
00:14:51,480 --> 00:14:52,879
things, it's fun to pick them apart.

531
00:14:52,880 --> 00:14:53,879
If you're really bored and you like

532
00:14:53,880 --> 00:14:55,579
to watch campaign commercials, which

533
00:14:55,580 --> 00:14:56,719
who doesn't? Come on.

534
00:14:56,720 --> 00:14:58,279
Then I think that is one thing to

535
00:14:58,280 --> 00:15:00,499
decide is how do they decide what

536
00:15:00,500 --> 00:15:02,159
makes this candidate look most

537
00:15:02,160 --> 00:15:04,079
ridiculous and not appealing to

538
00:15:04,080 --> 00:15:05,879
the average voter versus how do they

539
00:15:05,880 --> 00:15:07,119
portray themselves what kind of

540
00:15:07,120 --> 00:15:08,219
lighting and how are they dressed

541
00:15:08,220 --> 00:15:09,839
and I think Tiffany's wearing a

542
00:15:09,840 --> 00:15:11,359
Carhartt jacket and one of them he's

543
00:15:11,360 --> 00:15:12,399
of course he's got his rural

544
00:15:12,400 --> 00:15:13,459
connections

545
00:15:13,460 --> 00:15:14,439
Well, and I think that actually
raises

546
00:15:14,440 --> 00:15:16,159
an interesting point, which is that

547
00:15:16,160 --> 00:15:17,699
normal people don't watch these

548
00:15:17,700 --> 00:15:18,659
political ads.

549
00:15:18,660 --> 00:15:20,099
And actually what happens is like

550
00:15:20,100 --> 00:15:21,659
one pops up and people change the

551
00:15:21,660 --> 00:15:23,319
channel or they try to get out of

552
00:15:23,320 --> 00:15:24,699
that YouTube page or whatever.

553
00:15:24,700 --> 00:15:26,699
And so you need kind of all of those

554
00:15:26,700 --> 00:15:28,379
frames, all of images to say

555
00:15:28,380 --> 00:15:29,659
something. So another thing that you

556
00:15:29,660 --> 00:15:31,019
see a lot in these Tom Tiffany

557
00:15:31,020 --> 00:15:32,919
attack ads is him next to Donald

558
00:15:32,920 --> 00:15:34,799
Trump, because like that's the only

559
00:15:34,800 --> 00:15:36,219
thing that you see for one split

560
00:15:36,220 --> 00:15:37,719
second. It's putting those two

561
00:15:37,720 --> 00:15:38,939
people together in your mind and

562
00:15:38,940 --> 00:15:40,579
that is a win for Democrats.

563
00:15:40,580 --> 00:15:42,199
Yeah, yeah, that's unmistakable.

564
00:15:42,200 --> 00:15:44,179
They always try to try the extreme,

565
00:15:44,180 --> 00:15:46,219
um, MAGA, Tom Tiffany, Donald

566
00:15:46,220 --> 00:15:47,859
Trump, uh, those, that like

567
00:15:47,860 --> 00:15:49,679
low-hanging fruit for Democrats this

568
00:15:49,680 --> 00:15:51,199
time. And as clever as the data

569
00:15:51,200 --> 00:15:53,259
center ads are for Tom Tiffany

570
00:15:53,260 --> 00:15:55,139
it might be the Democrats just

571
00:15:55,140 --> 00:15:57,219
need to hit those go-to points over

572
00:15:57,220 --> 00:15:58,659
and over again in this midterm

573
00:15:58,660 --> 00:15:59,389
election.

574
00:15:59,390 --> 00:16:00,989
I have another follow-up question

575
00:16:00,990 --> 00:16:02,589
for both of you, and that is, how

576
00:16:02,590 --> 00:16:04,429
long will Francesca Hong continue

577
00:16:04,430 --> 00:16:05,929
to define this election when she's

578
00:16:05,930 --> 00:16:06,829
not in it?

579
00:16:06,830 --> 00:16:08,209
She set the standard in the

580
00:16:08,210 --> 00:16:09,009
Democratic primary.

581
00:16:09,010 --> 00:16:10,709
She was the conversation, and now

582
00:16:10,710 --> 00:16:12,549
it's her position on data centers

583
00:16:12,550 --> 00:16:14,829
that is still defining this race.

584
00:16:14,830 --> 00:16:16,649
So how much longer will we see her

585
00:16:16,650 --> 00:16:18,339
loom over all this?

586
00:16:18,340 --> 00:16:20,319
Well, and I

587
00:16:20,320 --> 00:16:22,139
think probably till November,

588
00:16:22,140 --> 00:16:23,339
she's out there campaigning for

589
00:16:23,340 --> 00:16:24,699
David Crowley now, right?

590
00:16:24,700 --> 00:16:25,959
I mean, she's not just being a

591
00:16:25,960 --> 00:16:26,779
silent partner here.

592
00:16:26,780 --> 00:16:28,959
She's out they're saying, I

593
00:16:28,960 --> 00:16:30,339
support David Crowly.

594
00:16:30,340 --> 00:16:31,499
You should too.

595
00:16:31,500 --> 00:16:33,499
And some of her supporters don't

596
00:16:33,500 --> 00:16:34,939
actually care for that either.

597
00:16:34,940 --> 00:16:36,379
They're kind of going along

598
00:16:36,380 --> 00:16:38,239
reluctantly or not at all.

599
00:16:38,240 --> 00:16:39,559
So I mean I think it's going to be

600
00:16:39,560 --> 00:16:40,419
something that's going to be going

601
00:16:40,420 --> 00:16:41,019
on for a while.

602
00:16:41,020 --> 00:16:42,719
Yeah, and I think the Democrats kind

603
00:16:42,720 --> 00:16:44,719
of don't win if she does not like

604
00:16:44,720 --> 00:16:46,059
fully kind of throw her weight

605
00:16:46,060 --> 00:16:47,919
behind this because If you lose by

606
00:16:47,920 --> 00:16:50,139
if you lose the nomination by 3,500

607
00:16:50,140 --> 00:16:52,259
votes as she did like that is not a

608
00:16:52,260 --> 00:16:54,319
clear and decisive mandate for David

609
00:16:54,320 --> 00:16:56,099
Crowley and particularly on this

610
00:16:56,100 --> 00:16:57,459
issue of data centers which I think

611
00:16:57,460 --> 00:16:58,859
there is no question that she

612
00:16:58,860 --> 00:17:00,829
defined that question that a huge

613
00:17:00,830 --> 00:17:02,709
part of why she did kind of

614
00:17:02,710 --> 00:17:04,368
stand out was because she took the

615
00:17:04,369 --> 00:17:06,409
most standout stance on that

616
00:17:06,410 --> 00:17:08,229
issue. So if she wants

617
00:17:08,230 --> 00:17:10,049
to kind of if Democrats want

618
00:17:10,050 --> 00:17:11,909
her voters to come along, it's

619
00:17:11,910 --> 00:17:13,309
going to need to both revolve around

620
00:17:13,310 --> 00:17:15,509
sort of that issue and also have her

621
00:17:15,510 --> 00:17:17,328
as the movement candidate, not just

622
00:17:17,329 --> 00:17:18,348
kind of the issues that she stood

623
00:17:18,349 --> 00:17:20,088
behind, but her as this very

624
00:17:20,089 --> 00:17:22,068
compelling figure to the 300

625
00:17:22,069 --> 00:17:23,309
some odd thousand people who voted

626
00:17:23,310 --> 00:17:25,289
for her to kind of get on board and

627
00:17:25,290 --> 00:17:27,068
certainly not stay home on election

628
00:17:27,069 --> 00:17:27,209
day.

629
00:17:27,210 --> 00:17:28,289
Well, and I think you have to

630
00:17:28,290 --> 00:17:29,989
remember that those voters that did

631
00:17:29,990 --> 00:17:31,469
stay with her did that in the face

632
00:17:31,470 --> 00:17:32,929
of all the pressure in the world

633
00:17:32,930 --> 00:17:34,689
from ads, their own party members, a

634
00:17:34,690 --> 00:17:35,749
lot of their neighbors saying, are

635
00:17:35,750 --> 00:17:37,209
you sure about this vote?

636
00:17:37,210 --> 00:17:38,109
And they stuck with her.

637
00:17:38,110 --> 00:17:39,989
So they weren't casual Hong

638
00:17:39,990 --> 00:17:40,969
voters.

639
00:17:40,970 --> 00:17:42,849
So where she goes through

640
00:17:42,850 --> 00:17:44,289
the fall could decide, well, how

641
00:17:44,290 --> 00:17:46,289
many of those do tag along with

642
00:17:46,290 --> 00:17:47,289
her and say, all right, believe in

643
00:17:47,290 --> 00:17:48,429
the mission. But she said from the

644
00:17:48,430 --> 00:17:50,029
beginning, she was on board to

645
00:17:50,030 --> 00:17:51,319
defeat Tom Tiffany.

646
00:17:51,320 --> 00:17:52,999
And she will need to be a crucial

647
00:17:53,000 --> 00:17:54,319
player in this all the way through,

648
00:17:54,320 --> 00:17:56,199
which is fascinating to see

649
00:17:56,200 --> 00:17:57,719
how much impact she's had in this

650
00:17:57,720 --> 00:17:58,699
whole process.

651
00:17:58,700 --> 00:18:00,239
I'll tell you one other wild card

652
00:18:00,240 --> 00:18:02,359
that we don't know right now as

653
00:18:02,360 --> 00:18:03,739
we speak here today.

654
00:18:03,740 --> 00:18:05,199
We have the ads. We've seen them.

655
00:18:05,200 --> 00:18:06,579
We have what they say they're going

656
00:18:06,580 --> 00:18:08,119
to do in terms of how big the reach

657
00:18:08,120 --> 00:18:10,499
of the ads is are.

658
00:18:10,500 --> 00:18:12,439
We don't how much they're gonna

659
00:18:12,440 --> 00:18:14,639
spend on these ads.

660
00:18:14,640 --> 00:18:16,779
And sometimes just repetition and

661
00:18:16,780 --> 00:18:18,619
bombarding the state with money

662
00:18:18,620 --> 00:18:20,639
is what you need in

663
00:18:20,640 --> 00:18:22,279
an election like this one for

664
00:18:22,280 --> 00:18:23,280
governor.

665
00:18:23,699 --> 00:18:25,319
I think that will be a clue that

666
00:18:25,320 --> 00:18:27,119
we'll see over the coming weeks.

667
00:18:27,120 --> 00:18:28,479
Who's really putting money in this

668
00:18:28,480 --> 00:18:29,519
race and who's not.

669
00:18:30,660 --> 00:18:31,539
That's all the time we have for

670
00:18:31,540 --> 00:18:34,539
today. Our colleague Rich Kramer.

671
00:18:35,940 --> 00:18:37,239
That's the time that we have today.

672
00:18:37,240 --> 00:18:38,379
Our colleague, Rich Kramer, will be

673
00:18:38,380 --> 00:18:39,459
back next week.

674
00:18:39,460 --> 00:18:41,059
This has been Inside Wisconsin

675
00:18:41,060 --> 00:18:41,859
Politics.

676
00:18:41,860 --> 00:18:42,759
Be sure to follow us on

677
00:18:42,760 --> 00:18:45,219
PBSWisconsin.org, WPR.org

678
00:18:45,220 --> 00:18:47,139
YouTube, or wherever you get your

679
00:18:47,140 --> 00:18:48,140
podcasts.