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Sara Rodriguez
fires her campaign manager

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for what she calls serious
mismanagement. And suddenly

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the Democratic primary for
governor is all shaken up.

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We look at how the race
changed overnight and who's

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raising money in the home
stretch. This is inside

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Wisconsin politics.

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I'm
Shawn Johnson here with Zac

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Schultz and Rich Kremer in
Eau Claire. Hey, guys.

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Hello. So before we get
Hello. So before we get

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started with our discussion
here, let's play a clip

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from Sarah Rodriguez from a
press conference this week

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that we definitely did not
see coming last week. This

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was a press conference that
she held on Monday, the day

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after she told us that she
had fired her campaign

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manager. This was over.
Campaign finance reports

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that she said, showed that
she had hundreds of

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thousands of dollars less
than she had expected. She

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said she noticed these when
she was getting ready for

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her TV ad buy to start
playing on the air. It

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never played. Turns out she
didn't have the money. She

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was asked how she let this
happen. And here's what

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Sarah Rodriguez had to say.
>> What I will say is this

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is that I met regularly
with my campaign manager

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about how the campaign was
going and based on the

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information that I received
and the information that

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our partners received, it
looked accurate. I trusted

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her to do the job that I
had hired to to do that she

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had done for her entire
career. And I regret

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placing my trust in that
individual.

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>> And Sara Rodriguez went
on to say that it was her

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campaign manager who had
approved a press release

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promising a $1 million ad
buy. That $1 million ad buy

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is not going to happen. She
just doesn't have the money

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for it. She did announce a
new ad buy. It will be

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smaller. We don't know how
much smaller because she

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has substantially less
money. My question to both

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of you is, as we look at
this race, to me, it feels

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like it completely changed
the fundamentals of this

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race. Zac, is that the
impression you get? And my

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next question is why?
>> Absolutely. This has

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changed everything. Just a
week ago, we were talking

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about the momentum Sara
Rodriguez had with multiple

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candidates dropping out,
endorsing her. Could she

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coalesce as the main rival,
the centrist moderate

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candidate in this race that
a lot of Democrats were

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looking at? And that seems
to be out the door. I was

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on the road this week,
following up with the other

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four Democratic candidates
in this primary, and so I

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had the ability to be in a
lot of areas of the state

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where there were a lot of
Democrats who are still

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processing this. This was
rank and file voters. These

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were county members. These
were some elected officials.

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So they the whole strata of
people. And for most of

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them, it was, how does this
happen? And the number one

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rule of any campaign is you.
You demonstrate your

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ability to be an executive
by how well you run your

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campaign in the first place,
and you often don't get

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credit for it, but you
definitely get penalized

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when things go awry. And
when you're missing this

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much money and you are this
far out of the loop, the

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number one question from
everyone is how did this

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happen? So there are people
that are reconsidering

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whether they think she has
enough votes to win a

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primary, and if she's the
best candidate to take on

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Tom Tiffany in the fall
from the Democratic

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perspective, and it kind of
has a dual firing squad

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purpose for her, and one in
that there are people that

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support her still, but are
more worried about whether

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others still support her.
So they fear backing a

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candidate that's not going
to win in the primary. So

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they're having to
reconsider. Well, should I

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go for my next favorite
candidate? Even though I

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still like Sara Rodriguez?
Should I switch to a Joel

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Brennan or a Kelda Roys or
a Mandela Barnes or

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Francesca Hong? The other
candidates in this race who

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are looking to take
advantage of this

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opportunity and pick up
some of those soft Sara

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Rodriguez supporters?
>> Yeah. I mean, when a big

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part of your pitch to
voters is that you are the

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candidate who can win,
you're making that

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electability pitch as you
hit the home stretch here.

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Anything that kind of calls
that into question hits you

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harder than you might hit.
If you were just a

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candidate who was kind of
an issue candidate, or a

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candidate who had really
solidified one section of

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the party. Rich, what's
your read on this? Why was

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this so big, seemingly, and
affect not only Sarah

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Rodriguez's campaign, but
everybody else's?

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>> Well, what we saw was it
was a Democratic primary

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that was starting to get a
little heated in terms of

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attacks toward between the
candidates, but it was very

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muted. And then it got a
little hotter. But this

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just kind of, you know,
scattered blood in the

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water. And Democrats like
Mandela, Barnes, Joel

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Brennan, Kelda, Roys,
Francesca Hong, all of them

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really just went on the
attack. Some of them got

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very vicious about, you
know, asking questions. Why?

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How could this happen? Just
trying to keep it in the

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news cycle. Some accused
her of just, you know, bad

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campaign management or
worse. It was really

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remarkable, some of these
statements that we've

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gotten, some of the
comments that they've made

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to reporters or in other
forums, it. So that to me

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is how it shook up the race.
Meanwhile, Republican

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Congressman Tom Tiffany,
who's essentially unopposed,

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he's making a lot of hay of
this as well.

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>> So I guess I'm wondering
right now as we record this

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on a Thursday, is this
something where Sarah

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Rodriguez can kind of pull
out of this tailspin, you

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know, where people like us
watch this and think, hey,

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that's a big deal. But
voters out there look at it

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and say, you know, I'm
actually not so worried by

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that.
>> There's a legitimate

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question there because
there's one tendency to

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think that, oh, well, this
can evaporate all of our

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support. I was at Pharm
Tech Days in Stratford on

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Tuesday, and I ran into a
gentleman who said that his

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wife had already cast her
absentee ballot ballots are

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already out and coming back
for Sara Rodriguez. And I

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asked him, well, does this
change your perception of

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whether that's a vote that
you would have wanted to

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make? Again, he said,
absolutely not. My number

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one concern is whether this
means she'll have enough

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money to do what she needs
to do to beat Tom Tiffany

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and win. So this didn't
change that particular

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voter's perspective. Last
night I was in Ozaukee

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County, which is part of
the old Wow County. It's

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one of those classic cherry
red Republican areas that

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is shifting more and more
blue, lighter red every

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time. And they had a packed
room and they had a straw

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poll. All the members got a
straw as they walked in the

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door, and they had the
glasses in the back of the

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room. So the old fashioned,
you see how your neighbor

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votes. Sara Rodriguez won
the straw poll in Ozaukee

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County. That was on a night
where Francesca Hong was

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the speaker. She was in the
room walking by the jars of

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straw. She came in second,
but Sara Rodriguez still

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won in. Some of the same
rhetoric came from the

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voters I talked to there.
And these are core

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Democratic county members.
They're proud to pay their

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dues and get their straw to
put in the basket for for

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Sara Rodriguez saying, well,
my number one concern is

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whether she'll have enough
money. And the campaign

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finance reports weren't
fully out at that time. And

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right now, it does not look
good for her being able to

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get her message out at all.
So that double whammy of

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it's the negative news
cycles and she can't get

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her own message through
really does call into

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question what happens over
the next week, especially

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as we know the Marquette
poll is in the field or

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about to be in the field,
which will really inform

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and persuade a lot of
voters who are going to

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play follow the leader who
is the most electable, who

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has momentum. And if she
had it before and she's

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lost it now, can she regain
it?

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looking to regain it. I
mean, it's not something

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where she just folded after
this press conference, she

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made a point of saying,
this campaign is moving

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forward, which I got to
admit, when I walked into

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that press conference, I
was not expecting that

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level of severity. And so
when she brought that up, I

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thought, oh, what is going
on here? But like, she, it

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seems like she's trying to
kind of prime the pump, you

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know, make sure that that
nothing, nothing to see

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here, folks. We're running
a campaign. We're winning

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straw polls. We have an ad
up in the air. Look at the

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ad. I look good in this ad.
It's you can imagine me in

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a general election. We're
writing the ship on these

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fundraising numbers. Rich.
Like, what's the problem

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with that? I guess why
might that not work?

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>> Well, righting the ship
with a month or so to go

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until the primary, right?
When candidates are

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generally trying to put as
much money into getting

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their name out as possible,
that's the problem. So her

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campaign and Sara Rodriguez,
they both seem pretty

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committed to staying in
this. And they've raised a

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lot of money. You know,
they've been doing a lot of

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campaigning. They've been
extent over the years. So

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there's people who have
already committed to her

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candidacy. I honestly have
no idea what will happen

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next. I have seen
speculation, speculation

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online that, well, if she
can clear the primary, the

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democratic money will come.
No big deal. But it's just

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maybe the worst timing for
this sort of news to come

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out from your campaign if
you're trying to win a

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nomination.
>> Yeah, I mean, it does

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strike me that it is kind
of a multiplier effect with

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the problems she faces. She
could make a bigger case

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about why she's the
candidate, you know, drive

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the message with these TV
ads. The problem is she

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just can't afford them.
Like the money is a serious

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problem for her in terms of
being able to, to hit home

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that message. And that
could compound, you know,

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will donors continue to
give her money? She says

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they are since Monday,
Monday that they've gotten

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more money. But I think we
have to see those reports

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before we can just kind of
take their word for it at

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this point in the cycle.
>> Well, one of the things

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that's interesting is we've
gotten all the emails.

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Every one of the other
candidates says that this

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benefits them. Yeah. And
they're all trying to

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reframe this as now it's a
two person primary and it's

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not the same two people in
every given case. It's not

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even a clear frontrunner of
who each one of them thinks

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is the other major
candidate that's out there.

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But Joel Brennan says this
absolutely revitalizes his

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his odds of winning, that
people are now looking for

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a backup centrist, moderate
with executive experience.

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And talking about his
experience with the DOA

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Kelda Roys was saying, this
absolutely gives people a

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chance to look at her
candidacy again and gives

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her momentum. Mandela
Barnes said the same thing,

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and Francesca Hong just
calmly just says, I've got

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a grassroots campaign that
keeps growing and more and

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more people see why. She's
a favorite for a lot of

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them. But the question for
you is, do you see any one

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of them that can actually
claim to be able to take

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the most advantage from
this?

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open discussion here, and
especially with the

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fundraising numbers that
we're going to get into, it

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does seem like when you
mentioned the two candidate

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race saw that term a couple
times in their statements

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today. It is it is somebody
plus Francesca Hong. You

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know, like they have sort
of conceded that she has

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the left wing of this
primary and that with Sarah

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Rodriguez stumbling, I
Mandela Barnes and the

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person who can occupy that
other lane or Joel Brennan

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or, you know, Kelda Roys,
they all seem to think that

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they are in that non
Francesca Hong lane. Rich.

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What kind of clues did we
get from the fundraising

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numbers today? Everybody
had to report their numbers.

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Sara Rodriguez all the
candidates for governor,

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Republican candidate for
governor. What did we learn

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in terms of how much they
raised in the first half of

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this year?
>> Yeah. So this is the

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period between January 1st
and June 30th. I've got my

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cheat sheet here. The two
top fundraisers were

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Mandela Barnes and
Francesca Hong. So Barnes

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00:11:56,216 --> 00:12:00,220
raised around $840,000 in
that period. Hong raised

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00:12:00,287 --> 00:12:04,224
around $709,000 in that
period, but the others

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weren't too far behind. So
Joel Brennan brought in

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00:12:07,828 --> 00:12:12,833
around $666,000. Rodriguez
raised around $562,000,

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00:12:16,203 --> 00:12:19,706
with a big asterisk there.
Not with the report, but

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because of outstanding
debts and other things. And

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Kelda Ruiz raised around
$527,000. So that's them's

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the numbers.
>> Okay, so a delayed

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answer to your question, I
think they would look at

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that and Mandela Barnes
would say, in fact, I'm the

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candidate who can benefit
from this. And and, you

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know, I'm the one who goes
against Francesca Hong.

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Kelda. Roys. And Joel
Brennan would say, actually

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our reports are pretty good
and we didn't lose the 2022

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Senate race. So, you know,
pick us, pick us. So how

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about cash on hand? You
know, this money raised is

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nice, but it is July and
you need money to get to

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this August primary.
>> Yeah. The one I want to

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get out of the way right
away is Sara Rodriguez

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campaign said it had around
$35,000 in cash on hand at

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the end of June. That is a
big problem. And also, just

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to note, their campaign
reported around 150 000 or

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00:13:19,166 --> 00:13:23,070
so in outstanding debt. So
that would, you know,

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theoretically go against
whatever money she raises.

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00:13:25,739 --> 00:13:30,244
But I'm no expert with that.
So Francesca Hong in terms

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of cash on hand, $411,000
Kelda Roys around $406,000.

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And Joel Brennan had around
$360,000. One thing that

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was interesting to me is
that, you know, Democratic

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Milwaukee County Executive
David Crowley, he dropped

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00:13:45,993 --> 00:13:50,197
out of the race last week,
and he still had more cash

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on hand than Mandela Barnes
Crowley had $315,000.

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Barnes ended the June with
$204,000. So pretty

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00:14:00,140 --> 00:14:02,676
interesting numbers.
>> Zac, as you hear the

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cash numbers, what do you
think their interpretation

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of those would be? I mean,
do you hear a clear

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frontrunner just in terms
of how much money they have

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in the bank?
>> It's how much money they

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have in the bank, and how
much is already committed

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to ads going out the door,
and whether that's enough

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00:14:18,592 --> 00:14:21,128
to actually change the
position that they're in. I

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00:14:21,195 --> 00:14:23,130
asked Francesca Hong about
this last night. I said,

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what should viewers or
voters take from these

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00:14:25,265 --> 00:14:27,568
campaign reports? How
should they parse these

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00:14:27,634 --> 00:14:29,703
numbers? And she said, the
thing to look at, of course,

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favoring her campaign,
she's going to favor her

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campaign is that it should
be how many voters have

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given, how much have they
given? And she claims she

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00:14:38,512 --> 00:14:40,981
has the most support from
Wisconsin, that she has the

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00:14:41,048 --> 00:14:43,650
broadest support from new
people coming into this

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00:14:43,717 --> 00:14:45,886
electoral politics, and
that some of the other

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00:14:45,953 --> 00:14:48,088
comparisons are some of
these other candidates are

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00:14:48,155 --> 00:14:51,692
more reliable, relying on
$20,000 max donors that are

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00:14:51,758 --> 00:14:54,194
tapped out, that can't give
any more money. But I think

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the bigger question going
forward is how any of them

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compared to Tom, Tiffany
and Rich, I'm sure you've

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got the numbers on him. And
those are really striking

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00:15:01,435 --> 00:15:04,738
in comparison to what we
>> Yeah, to say the least,

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I'll just toss both the the
raised and the cash on hand.

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So during the first six
months of this year, Tom

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00:15:11,912 --> 00:15:17,217
Tiffany raised $8.7 million.
I mean, that's light years

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00:15:17,284 --> 00:15:20,587
beyond what all the other
dem or what all the Dems in

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the race have raised of the
money that Tom Tiffany reported

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00:15:25,759 --> 00:15:29,396
raising, 6 million of that
came from transfers. And at

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00:15:29,463 --> 00:15:32,933
the same time, GOP
Mega-donors Dick and

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00:15:33,000 --> 00:15:36,136
Elizabeth Uihlein and Diane
Hendricks gave about $6

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00:15:36,203 --> 00:15:39,373
million to the Wisconsin
GOP. So they're they're

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00:15:39,439 --> 00:15:43,744
able to do those unlimited
transfers. But Tom Tiffany,

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00:15:43,810 --> 00:15:48,348
he spent a ton and he has
six. He's got more money on

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hand right now than all of
the other Dems combined,

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00:15:51,985 --> 00:15:54,454
per the math I did.
>> You know, just when you

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look at the Democratic
fundraising as a whole,

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those are not huge numbers
in Wisconsin. It kind of

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00:16:01,261 --> 00:16:03,897
struck me this whole
campaign that if one of

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00:16:03,964 --> 00:16:07,100
these candidates had a big
donor on their side who was

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00:16:07,167 --> 00:16:10,037
willing to throw some money
into a PAC and run some ads

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00:16:10,103 --> 00:16:14,308
on their behalf, that could
seal the deal. And lo and

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00:16:14,374 --> 00:16:18,846
behold, somebody is running
a big $2 million ad for or

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00:16:18,912 --> 00:16:21,815
against one of the
candidates. It's targeting

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00:16:21,882 --> 00:16:24,718
Francesca Hong basically
calling her super liberal,

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00:16:24,785 --> 00:16:27,955
too liberal for Wisconsin.
But that is running ahead

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00:16:28,021 --> 00:16:30,757
of Democratic primary in
Democratic markets of

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Milwaukee and Madison by a
Republican group. Zac,

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00:16:34,228 --> 00:16:36,530
what's going on there?
>> Well, this similar group

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that's been playing in a
lot of these Democratic

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00:16:38,765 --> 00:16:41,668
primaries, trying to get a
more liberal socialist,

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00:16:41,735 --> 00:16:43,837
progressive type candidate
on the ballot that they

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00:16:43,904 --> 00:16:46,006
think will be easier to
defeat in November. It's a

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00:16:46,073 --> 00:16:48,842
playbook that they've seen
work in a couple of races

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and fail in a few others.
Francesca Hong talked about

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00:16:51,445 --> 00:16:53,780
that. She said she's more
than happy to have them

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00:16:53,847 --> 00:16:55,849
advertise for her. She
thinks she's still the best

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00:16:55,916 --> 00:16:58,485
candidate to win in the
fall. Obviously, the other

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00:16:58,552 --> 00:17:01,088
Democrats are are ringing
alarm bells about that,

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00:17:01,154 --> 00:17:03,557
saying, if this is who Tom
Tiffany wants to face, then

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00:17:03,624 --> 00:17:05,792
Democrat Democratic voters
should be thinking twice

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00:17:05,859 --> 00:17:08,629
about that. But I think the
last thing that we should

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00:17:08,695 --> 00:17:10,831
be talking about here is
the Democratic primary last

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00:17:10,898 --> 00:17:13,634
year said they were going
to raise money for the

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00:17:13,700 --> 00:17:16,236
contenders. Whoever came
through would have one of

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00:17:16,303 --> 00:17:18,472
those big lump transfers.
And what really stood out

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00:17:18,539 --> 00:17:21,708
in this, they've only got a
couple million dollars. So

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00:17:21,775 --> 00:17:24,912
they have not they're not
sitting on 6 or 10 million

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00:17:24,978 --> 00:17:28,282
waiting to dump into
whoever wins this.

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00:17:28,348 --> 00:17:30,651
the juggernaut. And now all
suddenly the state GOP has

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00:17:30,717 --> 00:17:33,187
united its mega-donors and
they're sitting on a lot of

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00:17:33,253 --> 00:17:35,455
cash.
>> Yeah. So this will be a

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00:17:35,522 --> 00:17:37,558
wide open race. Whoever
comes through this primary,

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00:17:37,624 --> 00:17:40,160
there will be a lot of
ground need to be caught up

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00:17:40,227 --> 00:17:42,396
to to raise funds for the
fall.

348
00:17:42,462 --> 00:17:44,731
>> And I understand why
they did it, why they kind

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00:17:44,798 --> 00:17:47,501
of held their money through
this period. But you got to

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00:17:47,568 --> 00:17:49,570
wonder if in the future
somebody will question why

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00:17:49,636 --> 00:17:51,839
they didn't attack Tom
Tiffany while he ran

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00:17:51,905 --> 00:17:54,441
millions of dollars worth
of ads over the course of

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00:17:54,508 --> 00:17:56,610
this summer? It's an open
question. I mean, we'll

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00:17:56,677 --> 00:17:59,513
definitely watch it and may
have the answer in a few

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months. That's all the time
we have for today. Thanks

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00:18:01,582 --> 00:18:03,817
for joining us. Our
colleague Anya van

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00:18:03,884 --> 00:18:07,688
Wagtendonk. We'll be back
next week. This has been

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00:18:07,754 --> 00:18:11,425
inside Wisconsin politics.
wisconsin.org. WPR.org,

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00:18:11,491 --> 00:18:15,629
YouTube, or wherever you
get your podcasts.