1 00:00:01,101 --> 00:00:03,837 Democratic Socialists pick up three big victories in 2 00:00:03,904 --> 00:00:06,540 this week's New York City primaries. Could that 3 00:00:06,607 --> 00:00:09,309 momentum carry all the way to Wisconsin? And the field 4 00:00:09,376 --> 00:00:12,145 of Democrats running for governor here finally 5 00:00:12,212 --> 00:00:16,283 shrinks. What is the signal about the race? This is 6 00:00:16,350 --> 00:00:19,019 inside Wisconsin politics. 7 00:00:20,654 --> 00:00:23,824 I'm Shawn Johnson here with Anya van Wagtendonk and 8 00:00:23,891 --> 00:00:25,359 Rich Kremer in Eau Claire. Hey, gang. 9 00:00:25,425 --> 00:00:28,395 >> Hey, Shawn. >> So our show this week 10 00:00:28,462 --> 00:00:30,631 needs a little bit of setup. We are, of course, focused 11 00:00:30,697 --> 00:00:33,934 on primaries in Wisconsin, but we are looking for 12 00:00:34,001 --> 00:00:36,637 clues this week from primaries that happen in 13 00:00:36,703 --> 00:00:39,339 New York. So, Anya, what did happen there? 14 00:00:39,406 --> 00:00:41,575 >> Yeah, there were a number of congressional 15 00:00:41,642 --> 00:00:44,144 primaries, including three candidates who received the 16 00:00:44,211 --> 00:00:47,047 backing of Mayor Zoran Mamdani, himself a 17 00:00:47,114 --> 00:00:49,283 socialist. Two of those candidates also received 18 00:00:49,349 --> 00:00:51,151 endorsements from the Democratic Socialists of 19 00:00:51,218 --> 00:00:53,153 America, which is a group that he's also affiliated 20 00:00:53,220 --> 00:00:56,123 with. And all three of those candidates won, in 21 00:00:56,190 --> 00:00:58,792 one case, kicking out an incumbent. Some of them 22 00:00:58,859 --> 00:01:00,827 were, you know, political outsiders. So this was 23 00:01:00,894 --> 00:01:04,064 really, in some ways an upset and a little bit of a 24 00:01:04,131 --> 00:01:06,967 validation for Mamdani. This kind of further left 25 00:01:07,034 --> 00:01:10,838 mayor for the power that he shows in this significant 26 00:01:10,904 --> 00:01:13,774 blue area. And so a lot of people, as you say, are 27 00:01:13,841 --> 00:01:16,677 kind of looking at that as as a tea leaves for what 28 00:01:16,743 --> 00:01:18,779 that says about the Democratic primary right 29 00:01:18,846 --> 00:01:21,348 now and what voters want in their blue candidates. 30 00:01:21,415 --> 00:01:24,418 >> And I think that you would see states or people 31 00:01:24,484 --> 00:01:26,920 in any state where Democrats have a plausible 32 00:01:26,987 --> 00:01:30,324 shot at winning, asking these same questions. So 33 00:01:30,390 --> 00:01:32,793 why are we asking it here, though, or what's kind of 34 00:01:32,860 --> 00:01:35,162 our thread where it feels like, hey, this could 35 00:01:35,229 --> 00:01:37,564 really be significant this year, right? 36 00:01:37,631 --> 00:01:39,566 many differences between New York City and the state 37 00:01:39,633 --> 00:01:42,503 of Wisconsin, but one of the things that there is 38 00:01:42,569 --> 00:01:44,605 kind of commonality here is that we have this crowded 39 00:01:44,671 --> 00:01:46,373 Democratic race for governor, as we've 40 00:01:46,440 --> 00:01:49,309 mentioned, and and one candidate from there, 41 00:01:49,376 --> 00:01:52,079 Francesca Hong is sort of in that same vein as 42 00:01:52,145 --> 00:01:54,648 Mamdani. And these kind of she identifies as a 43 00:01:54,715 --> 00:01:56,450 socialist, as a democratic socialist. She's part of 44 00:01:56,517 --> 00:01:59,720 that caucus in the legislature. And so when we 45 00:01:59,786 --> 00:02:02,289 kind of look at who is going to stand out among 46 00:02:02,356 --> 00:02:06,260 this field of now six Democratic candidates, we 47 00:02:06,326 --> 00:02:08,695 wonder kind of to what extent these victories for 48 00:02:08,762 --> 00:02:11,698 these further left candidates means that Fran 49 00:02:11,765 --> 00:02:13,734 Hong will stand out among Democrats. And then what 50 00:02:13,800 --> 00:02:16,370 does that mean in a more general election, where, 51 00:02:16,436 --> 00:02:19,106 again, a Wisconsin general election is very different 52 00:02:19,173 --> 00:02:22,075 than a New York City primary election? 53 00:02:22,142 --> 00:02:24,411 >> So we're going to get back to the primary for 54 00:02:24,478 --> 00:02:27,214 governor here in just a minute. But, Rich, this was 55 00:02:27,281 --> 00:02:31,218 a congressional primary in New York or congressional 56 00:02:31,285 --> 00:02:35,389 primaries, rather. I wonder how we're seeing this play 57 00:02:35,455 --> 00:02:38,559 out, if at all, in Democratic primaries here 58 00:02:38,625 --> 00:02:42,429 in Wisconsin. For Congress, you are covering one in the 59 00:02:42,496 --> 00:02:44,498 third Congressional District in western 60 00:02:44,565 --> 00:02:46,366 Wisconsin. You just covered a forum there where there 61 00:02:46,433 --> 00:02:50,037 is a Democratic primary. Do you see any parallels there 62 00:02:50,103 --> 00:02:52,906 or is it a different ballgame? 63 00:02:53,740 --> 00:02:55,976 >> It feels like a different ballgame. I mean, 64 00:02:56,043 --> 00:02:59,980 for one, there aren't any DSA candidates in the race 65 00:03:00,047 --> 00:03:03,250 for the third Congressional District. But, you know, 66 00:03:03,317 --> 00:03:07,721 there are some similarities in one way. So we've got 67 00:03:07,788 --> 00:03:11,091 two candidates and one seems to be trying to 68 00:03:11,158 --> 00:03:15,596 portray herself as the the more progressive of the two. 69 00:03:15,662 --> 00:03:20,067 And one is trying to or is acting like she's the more 70 00:03:20,133 --> 00:03:23,303 moderate candidate. So these two people are Emily 71 00:03:23,370 --> 00:03:25,606 Berge. She's the former City Council president of 72 00:03:25,672 --> 00:03:29,109 Eau Claire, has been on the City Council for a long 73 00:03:29,176 --> 00:03:32,045 time. She's the one that during the forum that was 74 00:03:32,112 --> 00:03:36,450 last week in Platteville, was was offering up some 75 00:03:36,517 --> 00:03:40,120 more of what you would expect progressive 76 00:03:40,187 --> 00:03:45,058 candidates to say. For example, Berge called for 77 00:03:45,125 --> 00:03:47,461 Medicare for all, which is universal health care, 78 00:03:47,528 --> 00:03:51,765 essentially. And she said that she would she vowed to 79 00:03:51,832 --> 00:03:54,701 impeach President Donald Trump if she were elected 80 00:03:54,768 --> 00:03:58,639 or support the impeachment. The other candidate is 81 00:03:58,705 --> 00:04:01,241 Rebecca Cooke, who has. This is her third run, 82 00:04:01,308 --> 00:04:05,078 essentially for the third Congressional District. And 83 00:04:05,145 --> 00:04:10,350 she was more reserved in answering those questions. 84 00:04:10,417 --> 00:04:14,154 For example, on Medicare for all, she said. She said 85 00:04:14,221 --> 00:04:18,025 she'd love to sign up for all of these aspirational 86 00:04:18,091 --> 00:04:22,262 goals, but she said that it's more likely that if 87 00:04:22,329 --> 00:04:24,398 Democrats win the House majority back, they would 88 00:04:24,464 --> 00:04:28,802 go more towards expanding tax credits for the 89 00:04:28,869 --> 00:04:33,207 Affordable Care Act that were passed by Democrats 90 00:04:33,273 --> 00:04:37,344 during the earlier years of the Covid pandemic. And she 91 00:04:37,411 --> 00:04:39,680 said so that would be the immediate first step. And 92 00:04:39,746 --> 00:04:42,649 on impeachment, she said, well, the devil is in the 93 00:04:42,716 --> 00:04:45,352 details of what that resolution would look like. 94 00:04:45,419 --> 00:04:48,755 So those were two of the differences that I noticed 95 00:04:48,822 --> 00:04:52,693 right away. And then another difference that 96 00:04:52,759 --> 00:04:57,564 predates the debate by many months. The House Democrats 97 00:04:57,631 --> 00:05:01,869 national campaign arm essentially endorsed 98 00:05:03,136 --> 00:05:07,007 Rebecca Cooke like months ago, and they've offered 99 00:05:07,074 --> 00:05:10,744 her support, they've offered her staff training, 100 00:05:10,811 --> 00:05:14,515 etc. and Berge has since said and said during the 101 00:05:14,581 --> 00:05:17,384 forum that, you know, it shouldn't be national 102 00:05:17,451 --> 00:05:20,420 Democrats picking who represents the people of 103 00:05:20,487 --> 00:05:22,723 the third district. It should be voters themselves. 104 00:05:22,789 --> 00:05:26,793 So that's one way that it stood out from what 105 00:05:27,528 --> 00:05:31,932 happened in New York. But there's still kind of two 106 00:05:31,999 --> 00:05:34,401 candidates trying to pick their lanes, and it feels 107 00:05:34,468 --> 00:05:36,970 like one is going more of the progressive lane, and 108 00:05:37,037 --> 00:05:40,040 the other is trying to go a little bit more moderate. 109 00:05:40,107 --> 00:05:42,242 >> I think that I think that push pull between 110 00:05:42,309 --> 00:05:45,212 national Democrats and these more kind of we know 111 00:05:45,279 --> 00:05:49,116 our community. We are kind of of. The progressive wing 112 00:05:49,183 --> 00:05:51,852 was also on display in New York, right. A number of 113 00:05:51,919 --> 00:05:54,955 the candidates who who were defeated were backed by 114 00:05:55,022 --> 00:05:57,491 these national Democratic groups that Rick was just 115 00:05:57,558 --> 00:05:59,493 talking about. And so again, while we're trying to see 116 00:05:59,560 --> 00:06:01,762 how are Democrats feeling, how are they kind of 117 00:06:01,828 --> 00:06:04,464 leaning going into what they are hoping broadly to 118 00:06:04,531 --> 00:06:07,301 be a wave election? Like, who are they putting their 119 00:06:07,367 --> 00:06:10,037 money behind as the people who can deliver that? And 120 00:06:10,103 --> 00:06:13,006 so in New York, part of the answer was people whose 121 00:06:13,073 --> 00:06:15,475 policies do fall a little bit to the left. It'll be 122 00:06:15,542 --> 00:06:17,477 really interesting to see in the governor's race and 123 00:06:17,544 --> 00:06:19,546 in some of these competitive congressional 124 00:06:19,613 --> 00:06:21,348 races here in Wisconsin. What do Wisconsin Democrats, 125 00:06:21,415 --> 00:06:23,250 where do they put their money behind? 126 00:06:23,317 --> 00:06:25,552 >> I guess the thing that strikes me is that the 127 00:06:25,619 --> 00:06:28,322 thing that's missing in Wisconsin is that you don't 128 00:06:28,388 --> 00:06:31,992 have a massively powerful endorsement, it seems, as 129 00:06:32,059 --> 00:06:35,963 they did in New York from Mayor Rahm, who came in and 130 00:06:36,029 --> 00:06:38,765 said, this is what it means to be a Democrat right now. 131 00:06:38,832 --> 00:06:40,834 This is my slate. Essentially, these are my 132 00:06:40,901 --> 00:06:43,270 people, and it seems to have worked. Is there 133 00:06:43,337 --> 00:06:46,006 anything like that in, let's say, the third 134 00:06:46,073 --> 00:06:48,909 Congressional District for Emily Berge? Is there 135 00:06:48,976 --> 00:06:51,478 somebody like that coming in and saying, this is the 136 00:06:51,545 --> 00:06:55,549 progressive choice? >> Not that I know of, not 137 00:06:55,616 --> 00:06:58,519 that I know of. Meanwhile, Cooke has gotten all kinds 138 00:06:58,585 --> 00:07:01,889 of endorsements from sitting members of Congress, 139 00:07:01,955 --> 00:07:06,593 the Senate, etc. and also the backing of the National 140 00:07:06,660 --> 00:07:09,429 Party and a whole number of third party groups as well. 141 00:07:09,496 --> 00:07:14,101 So I'm not aware of any big endorsements, actually, 142 00:07:14,168 --> 00:07:16,870 endorsements that Berge has been promoting have been 143 00:07:16,937 --> 00:07:19,907 from essentially local government, city council, 144 00:07:19,973 --> 00:07:22,743 county board, school boards, etc. 145 00:07:22,809 --> 00:07:26,413 >> So I guess I'm wondering if, you know that person 146 00:07:26,480 --> 00:07:30,284 who could move the field like that even exists in 147 00:07:30,350 --> 00:07:32,452 Wisconsin for Wisconsin Democrats, I mean, the 148 00:07:32,519 --> 00:07:36,423 state party is staying out of this race, the race for 149 00:07:36,490 --> 00:07:40,060 governor. You know, they they have massive financial 150 00:07:40,127 --> 00:07:43,030 resources and could tip the field potentially if they 151 00:07:43,096 --> 00:07:45,032 wanted to. They're definitely not going there. 152 00:07:45,098 --> 00:07:48,635 We have a Democratic governor who has some power. 153 00:07:48,702 --> 00:07:52,272 He's not being vocal with his endorsements. Is there 154 00:07:52,339 --> 00:07:55,976 is this power vacuum sort of leaving us up in the air 155 00:07:56,043 --> 00:07:58,846 about what's going to happen? 156 00:07:59,213 --> 00:08:01,415 this a little bit in the context of Republicans, 157 00:08:01,481 --> 00:08:03,817 because there is such a clear leader of the party 158 00:08:03,884 --> 00:08:06,854 in in President Donald Trump. And so Democrats 159 00:08:06,920 --> 00:08:09,056 don't quite have that for many reasons, including 160 00:08:09,122 --> 00:08:11,158 that they don't hold these majorities in Washington. 161 00:08:11,225 --> 00:08:13,493 They don't hold the white House. But I think also, 162 00:08:13,560 --> 00:08:17,030 this really is a little bit of like an existential, 163 00:08:17,097 --> 00:08:19,233 exploratory time for Democrats, both here in 164 00:08:19,299 --> 00:08:21,401 Wisconsin, where they are facing, you know, the best 165 00:08:21,468 --> 00:08:24,304 odds that they've had in a long time of getting some 166 00:08:24,371 --> 00:08:26,473 real legislative power. But then nationally, seeing, 167 00:08:26,540 --> 00:08:28,542 you know, there were other primaries that took place 168 00:08:28,609 --> 00:08:30,744 on Tuesday as well outside of New York, where more 169 00:08:30,811 --> 00:08:34,014 moderate Democrats won. One issue that was really 170 00:08:34,081 --> 00:08:36,650 prevalent in a lot of these races was Israel and the 171 00:08:36,717 --> 00:08:38,886 war in Gaza, and how that is playing out, how that's 172 00:08:38,952 --> 00:08:41,555 kind of dividing up the Democratic Party. We've 173 00:08:41,622 --> 00:08:43,690 seen that a little bit in like Milwaukee politics, 174 00:08:43,757 --> 00:08:46,193 where that's played a real issue. I don't know to what 175 00:08:46,260 --> 00:08:48,462 extent that will be important statewide. And so 176 00:08:48,529 --> 00:08:50,864 that could be one place where Wisconsin's politics 177 00:08:50,931 --> 00:08:54,134 obviously, of course, our our naturally very 5050 178 00:08:54,201 --> 00:08:56,436 purple stance could look really different than some 179 00:08:56,503 --> 00:08:59,106 of these places where Democrats feel a little bit 180 00:08:59,173 --> 00:09:02,042 safer. Like we know we're going to get one of our 181 00:09:02,109 --> 00:09:04,178 guys in. So let's try to really move the needle on 182 00:09:04,244 --> 00:09:07,114 what that looks like. >> So I got to say, as 183 00:09:07,181 --> 00:09:09,116 somebody who's covered Wisconsin politics for a 184 00:09:09,183 --> 00:09:11,919 while now, it's still a little bit jarring to me to 185 00:09:11,985 --> 00:09:15,022 see people just socialists. For example, I 186 00:09:15,088 --> 00:09:18,225 think five years ago I wasn't seeing that. But I 187 00:09:18,292 --> 00:09:20,627 remember Ana one of the first stories you did when 188 00:09:20,694 --> 00:09:22,696 you came to Wisconsin Public Radio, was about 189 00:09:22,763 --> 00:09:25,132 this socialist caucus in the Wisconsin legislature, 190 00:09:25,199 --> 00:09:29,002 where, you know, for years it was Republicans who were 191 00:09:29,069 --> 00:09:31,205 calling Democrats socialists, and they were 192 00:09:31,271 --> 00:09:33,473 like, no, no, no, no, no, no, we're not. We're just 193 00:09:33,540 --> 00:09:35,342 we're Democrats. And now Democrats are saying, yeah, 194 00:09:35,409 --> 00:09:37,444 we are. That's who we represent. That's our 195 00:09:37,511 --> 00:09:39,646 values. >> Yeah. And like you say, 196 00:09:39,713 --> 00:09:42,983 I was, I think truly a week into my time here in 2023, 197 00:09:43,050 --> 00:09:45,819 it was a new legislative session. And these two 198 00:09:45,886 --> 00:09:48,222 Assembly members from Milwaukee, they, you know, 199 00:09:48,288 --> 00:09:51,358 they caucus with the Democrats, but they 200 00:09:51,425 --> 00:09:54,595 socialist caucus. That going to get the number 201 00:09:54,661 --> 00:09:57,331 wrong, but it's something like 7 or 8 people. And so 202 00:09:57,397 --> 00:10:00,267 it's not small. And you're right that there are 203 00:10:00,334 --> 00:10:02,336 especially Republican members who will sometimes 204 00:10:02,402 --> 00:10:04,972 be so outraged at this idea that there are people who 205 00:10:05,038 --> 00:10:06,507 are identifying as socialists. But then you 206 00:10:06,573 --> 00:10:09,376 also, you know, when I go again to a Francesca Hong 207 00:10:09,443 --> 00:10:12,279 rally, that's something that people see as a as a 208 00:10:12,346 --> 00:10:14,481 reason that they support her. And so it is one of 209 00:10:14,548 --> 00:10:17,351 those things that, yeah, the term can either be an 210 00:10:17,417 --> 00:10:19,453 insult or it can be an endorsement, depending on 211 00:10:19,520 --> 00:10:21,555 who's leveling it. >> Her basic message seems 212 00:10:21,622 --> 00:10:25,125 to be, these are dire times. We need a new kind of 213 00:10:25,192 --> 00:10:29,530 politics. Which I do think that Republicans have a 214 00:10:29,596 --> 00:10:32,399 different take when it comes to this stuff, though, 215 00:10:32,466 --> 00:10:36,069 as they as you've as you've seen them react to the 216 00:10:36,136 --> 00:10:39,006 results in New York City and what's going on here in 217 00:10:39,072 --> 00:10:42,543 Wisconsin, how do they feel about it? 218 00:10:43,410 --> 00:10:46,914 >> Well, based on what I've seen from, I guess, some of 219 00:10:46,980 --> 00:10:50,384 the talking heads on social media, I could sum it up as 220 00:10:50,450 --> 00:10:52,986 this all Democrats are socialists. That's what 221 00:10:53,053 --> 00:10:56,890 Republicans are trying to pitch right now to voters. 222 00:10:56,957 --> 00:10:59,193 Obviously, we know that that there's all kinds of 223 00:10:59,259 --> 00:11:01,862 degrees to being a Republican, you know, 224 00:11:01,929 --> 00:11:04,398 conservative, liberal, etc. I mean, just a million 225 00:11:04,464 --> 00:11:10,103 different stripes out there. But Republicans are excited 226 00:11:10,170 --> 00:11:14,842 about Hong maybe being the nominee in Wisconsin, 227 00:11:14,908 --> 00:11:17,311 because they think that that'll give them the best 228 00:11:17,377 --> 00:11:20,113 shot at making sure that Tom Tiffany wins. And in 229 00:11:20,180 --> 00:11:23,450 fact, they have been pointing to this one one 230 00:11:23,517 --> 00:11:27,421 poll that came out weeks and weeks ago, maybe longer, 231 00:11:27,487 --> 00:11:30,624 that showed head to head matchups with all of the 232 00:11:30,691 --> 00:11:32,893 Democratic candidates at the time. There were the 233 00:11:32,960 --> 00:11:36,163 seven major candidates, and literally the only one in 234 00:11:36,230 --> 00:11:41,068 that poll that lost to or that that Tiffany wouldn't 235 00:11:41,134 --> 00:11:45,506 have lost to. Again, it's all theoretical, and it 236 00:11:45,572 --> 00:11:48,275 only, I guess, represents what people who took the 237 00:11:48,342 --> 00:11:51,144 survey felt on that day. But it was Francesca Hong. 238 00:11:51,211 --> 00:11:54,815 And so not only are they literally talking about, 239 00:11:54,882 --> 00:11:58,752 well, we hope that this is the nominee. They're also 240 00:11:58,819 --> 00:12:02,389 some. Some Republicans are saying, hey, why don't you 241 00:12:02,456 --> 00:12:05,559 go out and meddle in that primary vote for Hong, you 242 00:12:05,626 --> 00:12:08,428 know, cross over because the other primaries on the 243 00:12:08,495 --> 00:12:11,832 GOP side aren't as big of a deal. I literally saw a 244 00:12:11,899 --> 00:12:14,902 post last night saying the race for governor is the 245 00:12:14,968 --> 00:12:19,206 whole game. So Republicans go cross over, vote for 246 00:12:19,273 --> 00:12:22,809 Hong. That'll make it easier for Tiffany in the 247 00:12:22,876 --> 00:12:27,447 general. So yeah, they politics. Sometimes when 248 00:12:28,248 --> 00:12:30,217 you're attacking opponents, you like to paint with a 249 00:12:30,284 --> 00:12:34,054 broad brush. So they're seeing this rise up of some 250 00:12:34,121 --> 00:12:37,491 of these democratic socialist candidates around 251 00:12:37,558 --> 00:12:40,961 America. And they're saying, well, look, this is 252 00:12:41,028 --> 00:12:43,564 Democrats in disarray. This is proof that the party has 253 00:12:43,630 --> 00:12:46,233 moved to the left. ET cetera. ET cetera. 254 00:12:46,300 --> 00:12:48,769 >> I wish we had more polling right now in this 255 00:12:48,836 --> 00:12:51,338 race. You look back at the most recent public poll, 256 00:12:51,405 --> 00:12:54,842 and it's like in March in terms of Marquette polls, 257 00:12:54,908 --> 00:12:57,344 for example. I have a feeling, though, that you 258 00:12:57,411 --> 00:13:00,180 might have a lot of people saying, I haven't heard 259 00:13:00,247 --> 00:13:02,316 enough about the candidates and I haven't made up my 260 00:13:02,382 --> 00:13:05,085 mind. It's June, leave me alone. But let's talk about 261 00:13:05,152 --> 00:13:07,487 the field. We had a seven candidate Democratic 262 00:13:07,554 --> 00:13:11,358 primary this week shrink to a six candidate primary. 263 00:13:11,425 --> 00:13:13,193 Can we still use the word crowded when we're talking 264 00:13:13,260 --> 00:13:15,429 about that? It's big anyway for a primary field. 265 00:13:15,495 --> 00:13:17,197 >> Pretty crowded, I would say. 266 00:13:17,264 --> 00:13:19,867 >> Missy Hughes dropped out. The former CEO of the 267 00:13:19,933 --> 00:13:22,870 state's economic development agency, she 268 00:13:22,936 --> 00:13:25,873 immediately endorsed Lieutenant Governor Sarah 269 00:13:25,939 --> 00:13:28,242 Rodriguez. This is just an open question. How big a 270 00:13:28,308 --> 00:13:30,477 deal was this? >> Well, you know, we've 271 00:13:30,544 --> 00:13:33,113 been talking for weeks about are we going to see 272 00:13:33,180 --> 00:13:36,016 any drop outs before August? And so this was the first 273 00:13:36,083 --> 00:13:38,151 one. It was definitely a bit of breaking news. And I 274 00:13:38,218 --> 00:13:40,954 think one of the things that we've been talking 275 00:13:41,021 --> 00:13:43,056 about so much is this idea of lanes and how these 276 00:13:43,123 --> 00:13:45,158 candidates can kind of stand out and make 277 00:13:45,225 --> 00:13:47,194 themselves seem, you know, picking me would be 278 00:13:47,261 --> 00:13:49,930 different than picking anyone else. And so I think 279 00:13:49,997 --> 00:13:52,065 in her statement and then in interview, she gave 280 00:13:52,132 --> 00:13:54,701 after Missy Hughes kind of she spoke about the ways 281 00:13:54,768 --> 00:13:57,171 that Democrats are going to hurt each other if they are 282 00:13:57,237 --> 00:14:00,741 trying to if they are taking up space that could 283 00:14:00,807 --> 00:14:03,010 be taken up by somebody else. So she said she hopes 284 00:14:03,076 --> 00:14:05,913 to see other people drop out. And so I think that is 285 00:14:05,979 --> 00:14:08,949 a little bit of a nod to the fact that they need 286 00:14:09,016 --> 00:14:11,818 that wall. Democrats are trying to figure out who 287 00:14:11,885 --> 00:14:13,954 they are trying to be, what they're trying to represent, 288 00:14:14,021 --> 00:14:16,823 and how do I beat Tom Tiffany or other people who 289 00:14:16,890 --> 00:14:19,026 are picked by Donald Trump? What does that look like 290 00:14:19,092 --> 00:14:21,895 for the Democrats? And so I think this was a signal 291 00:14:21,962 --> 00:14:24,798 that one person at least made that calculus of what 292 00:14:24,865 --> 00:14:27,501 was good for the party, and then how to kind of throw 293 00:14:27,568 --> 00:14:29,870 her power and her weight behind that. 294 00:14:29,937 --> 00:14:33,841 >> Well, I would say that it's not that big of a deal. 295 00:14:33,907 --> 00:14:36,743 It doesn't seem like that big of a deal to me, 296 00:14:36,810 --> 00:14:40,681 because Hughes wasn't know, running for office 297 00:14:40,747 --> 00:14:42,449 even, you know, running a primary, it's very 298 00:14:42,516 --> 00:14:45,752 expensive. So I have no idea why she decided to 299 00:14:45,819 --> 00:14:49,256 step down or out of the race. But, you know, the 300 00:14:49,323 --> 00:14:53,327 endorsement of is is something. But again, 301 00:14:53,827 --> 00:14:57,631 there's still six people in the race. And I'll just say 302 00:14:57,698 --> 00:15:00,901 that that Hughes dropping out. You know, she was 303 00:15:00,968 --> 00:15:04,638 essentially a pro-business, kind of a Democrat. Talked 304 00:15:04,705 --> 00:15:08,509 a lot about how, you know, if you improve the economy, 305 00:15:08,575 --> 00:15:11,011 you can improve people's lives with these other 306 00:15:11,078 --> 00:15:16,216 programs and etc. But the Republicans have said, well, 307 00:15:16,884 --> 00:15:19,152 look, if more proof they're pushing the moderates out. 308 00:15:19,219 --> 00:15:23,223 So it's it's all a word game, I guess. But big 309 00:15:24,858 --> 00:15:27,160 picture, I'm not sure it makes a huge deal. 310 00:15:27,227 --> 00:15:29,530 >> Yeah. You know, she's the kind of candidate who 311 00:15:29,596 --> 00:15:31,899 you could imagine in a Democratic year. Like we 312 00:15:31,965 --> 00:15:35,369 could be headed toward in, you know, the Trump midterm 313 00:15:35,435 --> 00:15:38,639 if she was the general election candidate. You 314 00:15:38,705 --> 00:15:40,674 know, you could imagine someone like Missy Hughes 315 00:15:40,741 --> 00:15:42,543 winning and becoming governor, but in a 316 00:15:42,609 --> 00:15:45,245 Democratic primary, pitching that business 317 00:15:45,312 --> 00:15:47,881 message, especially at this moment in time, it seemed 318 00:15:47,948 --> 00:15:50,884 like a hard sell. She also did kind of go for that 319 00:15:50,951 --> 00:15:54,054 moderate lane a little bit there a month or so ago, 320 00:15:54,121 --> 00:15:56,523 when she was the only one who came out really in 321 00:15:56,590 --> 00:15:59,593 support of that field surplus deal that was 322 00:15:59,660 --> 00:16:03,564 negotiated by Tony Evers and Robin Vos, among other 323 00:16:03,630 --> 00:16:06,033 Republicans in the legislature. 324 00:16:06,099 --> 00:16:08,068 >> The other thing that made her unique is that she 325 00:16:08,135 --> 00:16:10,070 comes from western Wisconsin. That's right. 326 00:16:10,137 --> 00:16:12,172 >> She's the only. >> One, right? This sort of 327 00:16:12,239 --> 00:16:14,141 bastion of democratic politics that has moved 328 00:16:14,208 --> 00:16:16,443 very far away from that. Every other candidate is 329 00:16:16,510 --> 00:16:19,012 Milwaukee or Madison. And so it's also, I think, a 330 00:16:19,079 --> 00:16:22,015 little bit of a signifier that she was not able to 331 00:16:22,082 --> 00:16:24,718 make much of a splash, even with that more rural, 332 00:16:24,785 --> 00:16:27,721 farmer focused western Wisconsin background. That, 333 00:16:27,788 --> 00:16:30,190 again, as we look at where is the party going, that it 334 00:16:30,257 --> 00:16:32,693 seems to be going towards the major bases of 335 00:16:32,759 --> 00:16:35,095 Milwaukee County, Dane County. 336 00:16:35,162 --> 00:16:38,098 >> Okay, another open question here, I guess. Is 337 00:16:38,165 --> 00:16:41,034 there any connection, do you think, to the Francesca 338 00:16:41,101 --> 00:16:45,339 Hong story that we've been talking about and Missy 339 00:16:45,405 --> 00:16:47,441 Hughes endorsing someone like Sarah Rodriguez, is 340 00:16:47,508 --> 00:16:51,011 she making a bet that, look, this candidate's politics 341 00:16:51,078 --> 00:16:53,747 kind of aligns with mine. We got to we got to unite 342 00:16:53,814 --> 00:16:57,117 and stop the candidates from the left. 343 00:16:57,184 --> 00:16:59,586 >> I mean, I don't know what's in her heart and I 344 00:16:59,653 --> 00:17:01,722 would never guess. But again, from this idea of 345 00:17:01,788 --> 00:17:04,625 not wanting to kind of crowd out people who are 346 00:17:04,691 --> 00:17:06,693 similar to you, who have similar politics, who you 347 00:17:06,760 --> 00:17:09,530 think could do a good and effective job in making 348 00:17:09,596 --> 00:17:11,832 those politics a reality. If you have one quite 349 00:17:11,899 --> 00:17:14,067 popular candidate who is Francesca Hong again, 350 00:17:14,134 --> 00:17:17,037 polling shows her towards the top, and then you have 351 00:17:17,104 --> 00:17:19,106 a number of people kind of further towards the center, 352 00:17:19,173 --> 00:17:21,341 all fighting amongst themselves, right? Missy 353 00:17:21,408 --> 00:17:23,644 Hughes voters and young voters were probably never 354 00:17:23,710 --> 00:17:25,812 going to, you know, nobody's vacillating 355 00:17:25,879 --> 00:17:28,749 between those two candidates. And so that's 356 00:17:28,815 --> 00:17:30,951 maybe a way of trying to bring some more strength 357 00:17:31,018 --> 00:17:34,154 into the not democratic socialist wing of the 358 00:17:34,221 --> 00:17:36,256 Democratic Party, going into what's expected to 359 00:17:36,323 --> 00:17:38,926 just be an incredibly tight general election. 360 00:17:38,992 --> 00:17:42,162 >> She did say something in her press conference where 361 00:17:42,229 --> 00:17:46,133 she endorsed endorsed Sara Rodriguez. She can't come 362 00:17:46,200 --> 00:17:48,235 kind of the moderate candidate. I support her. 363 00:17:48,302 --> 00:17:51,271 But she she said, we don't need we got a lot of good 364 00:17:51,338 --> 00:17:53,473 things going on in this state. We don't need to 365 00:17:53,540 --> 00:17:57,144 tear it all down. So that to me is a signal that she 366 00:17:57,211 --> 00:17:59,279 supports the kind of politics which is similar 367 00:17:59,346 --> 00:18:01,381 to what we've got already in Wisconsin, including the 368 00:18:01,448 --> 00:18:04,418 Evers administration, which she and Sara Rodriguez have 369 00:18:04,484 --> 00:18:06,286 served under. That's all the time 370 00:18:06,353 --> 00:18:08,055 we have for today. Thanks for joining us. Our 371 00:18:08,121 --> 00:18:10,490 colleague Zac Schultz will will be back in 372 00:18:10,557 --> 00:18:13,660 a couple of weeks. This has been inside Wisconsin 373 00:18:13,727 --> 00:18:16,697 politics. Be sure to follow us on PBS wisconsin.org. 374 00:18:16,763 --> 00:18:18,498 WPR.org, YouTube, or wherever you get your 375 00:18:18,565 --> 00:18:20,234 podcasts.