1 00:00:01,468 --> 00:00:03,637 >> Democrats running for governor have less than two 2 00:00:03,704 --> 00:00:06,206 months to stand out in a crowded field. How'd they 3 00:00:06,273 --> 00:00:08,775 do that at the state party convention? And we run 4 00:00:08,842 --> 00:00:11,245 through developments and lawsuits involving voter 5 00:00:11,311 --> 00:00:14,615 rolls, legislative maps, and false electors. This is 6 00:00:14,681 --> 00:00:17,351 inside Wisconsin politics. 7 00:00:19,987 --> 00:00:23,156 I'm Shawn Johnson here with Anya van Wagtendonk and 8 00:00:23,223 --> 00:00:24,892 Rich Kremer in Eau Claire. Hey, gang. 9 00:00:24,958 --> 00:00:27,427 >> Hey, Shawn. >> So I think it's fair to 10 00:00:27,494 --> 00:00:30,597 say that this primary campaign is not going to be 11 00:00:30,664 --> 00:00:34,535 won or lost based on what happened in the room at the 12 00:00:34,601 --> 00:00:37,070 state party convention over the weekend. But you did 13 00:00:37,137 --> 00:00:39,540 have all seven candidates there. They were under the 14 00:00:39,606 --> 00:00:41,942 same set of rules. Speaking to the same group of 15 00:00:42,009 --> 00:00:45,646 Democratic activists. What was it like? 16 00:00:45,712 --> 00:00:48,615 >> Yeah. You know, I say this with all due respect. 17 00:00:48,682 --> 00:00:51,351 Normal people do not attend state party conventions, 18 00:00:51,418 --> 00:00:53,720 right? These are like the most die hard Democrats, 19 00:00:53,787 --> 00:00:55,789 the most die hard Republicans who go to that 20 00:00:55,856 --> 00:00:58,192 convention. And so these are the people who are like 21 00:00:58,258 --> 00:01:00,527 the most energized about their party and are going 22 00:01:00,594 --> 00:01:04,698 to be the ones to hopefully, you know, bring in their 23 00:01:04,765 --> 00:01:07,601 fellow, but like less excited Democrats. And so I 24 00:01:07,668 --> 00:01:09,837 think that was kind of the vibe of the speeches that 25 00:01:09,903 --> 00:01:12,539 you were getting from the gubernatorial candidates, 26 00:01:12,606 --> 00:01:14,808 which is that they were trying to appeal to this 27 00:01:14,875 --> 00:01:18,111 base, right? The most kind of committed Democrats 28 00:01:18,178 --> 00:01:21,081 possible, and also make the case not only that they 29 00:01:21,148 --> 00:01:23,851 should stand out in this seven person primary going 30 00:01:23,917 --> 00:01:27,020 into August, but that they are also most sort of best 31 00:01:27,087 --> 00:01:29,156 positioned to beat Tom Tiffany in November. And so 32 00:01:29,223 --> 00:01:31,391 those are kind of two different arguments that 33 00:01:31,458 --> 00:01:34,294 you need to be making, the one that makes you most 34 00:01:34,361 --> 00:01:36,363 appealing to Democrats, and then the one that makes you 35 00:01:36,430 --> 00:01:40,200 most appealing to kind of your average wisconsinite. 36 00:01:40,267 --> 00:01:43,003 lot of kind of threading of that needle while also 37 00:01:43,070 --> 00:01:45,172 trying to get excitement. So it was, it was 38 00:01:45,239 --> 00:01:47,941 definitely a little bit of a dance going on. But that 39 00:01:48,008 --> 00:01:50,043 I think was kind of the overarching theme. 40 00:01:50,110 --> 00:01:52,179 >> What common threads stood out to you? I mean, 41 00:01:52,246 --> 00:01:55,415 like, what was a theme that stood out in all the 42 00:01:55,482 --> 00:01:58,719 speeches, or at least most of them? 43 00:01:59,620 --> 00:02:01,688 the Tom Tiffany theme and also by extension, Donald 44 00:02:01,755 --> 00:02:04,525 Trump, right? A lot of trying to tie the two of 45 00:02:04,591 --> 00:02:06,593 those together. But then affordability was kind of 46 00:02:06,660 --> 00:02:09,596 the the word of the day. The theme of the convention 47 00:02:09,663 --> 00:02:12,799 was Reclaiming the American dream. And, and each of the 48 00:02:12,866 --> 00:02:16,370 candidates talked in either broader or more specific 49 00:02:16,436 --> 00:02:19,106 terms, sort of depending on the candidate about what 50 00:02:19,173 --> 00:02:21,842 they would do to basically put more money in people's 51 00:02:21,909 --> 00:02:24,344 pockets, lower prices, make things more affordable in 52 00:02:24,411 --> 00:02:27,648 Wisconsin. and I were not at this 53 00:02:27,714 --> 00:02:30,150 convention, although we had a chance to listen to these 54 00:02:30,217 --> 00:02:33,554 speeches later. What stood out to you? 55 00:02:33,620 --> 00:02:36,456 >> Well, Ana already mentioned it. There was a 56 00:02:36,523 --> 00:02:39,526 lot of talk about Donald Trump and the chaos in 57 00:02:39,593 --> 00:02:41,895 Washington from his administration. That's 58 00:02:41,962 --> 00:02:45,132 according to these Democratic candidates. And 59 00:02:45,199 --> 00:02:48,802 it's pretty obvious why they would focus on the 60 00:02:48,869 --> 00:02:52,573 president and his, you know, popularity rating is pretty 61 00:02:52,639 --> 00:02:56,944 low in polling. So it seems like there's they're hoping 62 00:02:57,010 --> 00:03:00,113 that Trump will be a liability for Tom Tiffany 63 00:03:00,180 --> 00:03:03,550 as they as they move forward in this campaign. 64 00:03:03,617 --> 00:03:06,453 And also there, there there's only one Republican 65 00:03:06,520 --> 00:03:08,822 in the race. So they're able to focus their attacks 66 00:03:08,889 --> 00:03:12,526 on one person. Meanwhile, you know, Tom Tiffany 67 00:03:12,593 --> 00:03:15,429 doesn't have to worry about trying to stand out among 68 00:03:15,495 --> 00:03:19,700 Republican competitors in his primary or in a primary. 69 00:03:19,766 --> 00:03:22,302 So that's what stuck out. But there was some other 70 00:03:22,369 --> 00:03:25,639 things that stood out in terms of like the closest 71 00:03:25,706 --> 00:03:29,676 thing to criticizing other Democrats seemed to come 72 00:03:29,743 --> 00:03:33,380 from state Senator Kelda Roys, and she just 73 00:03:33,447 --> 00:03:37,317 basically said the party cannot afford to to pick a 74 00:03:37,384 --> 00:03:41,054 nominee that would put a Democratic trifecta. That 75 00:03:41,121 --> 00:03:43,857 is the state Senate, state Assembly and the governor's 76 00:03:43,924 --> 00:03:48,262 office in jeopardy. So no names were named, but 77 00:03:49,263 --> 00:03:53,433 people might be able to infer who or how many, you 78 00:03:53,500 --> 00:03:56,103 know, people she might have been talking about. And of 79 00:03:56,170 --> 00:03:58,572 course, there was a number of like, pretty bold 80 00:03:58,639 --> 00:04:00,741 promises from some of these candidates as well. 81 00:04:00,807 --> 00:04:04,411 >> Yeah. That did that criticism did jump out to 82 00:04:04,478 --> 00:04:07,014 me. There was another one, I think you could argue 83 00:04:07,080 --> 00:04:10,517 from Francesca Hong saying that when you go out on the 84 00:04:10,584 --> 00:04:14,621 campaign trail, people can detect BS. We're not going 85 00:04:14,688 --> 00:04:17,558 to say the word because family show here, guys. But 86 00:04:17,624 --> 00:04:21,328 she was essentially, without naming names, 87 00:04:21,395 --> 00:04:24,898 saying the other candidates aren't as authentic as me 88 00:04:24,965 --> 00:04:27,401 as the way that I heard it. I'll tell you one other 89 00:04:27,467 --> 00:04:30,571 thing that kind of stood out to me, at least upon 90 00:04:30,637 --> 00:04:33,540 first review of the speeches, I want to think 91 00:04:33,607 --> 00:04:37,010 in these felt like general election speeches a little 92 00:04:37,077 --> 00:04:40,314 bit. I mean, this is a primary where they're 93 00:04:40,380 --> 00:04:43,116 almost going to have to some of them are going to 94 00:04:43,183 --> 00:04:45,419 have to get negative if they want to climb the 95 00:04:45,485 --> 00:04:48,522 ladder and be the party's candidate. And, you know, 96 00:04:48,589 --> 00:04:51,225 even the the, you know, criticisms we just 97 00:04:51,291 --> 00:04:54,661 mentioned, Rich weren't exactly super negative. And 98 00:04:54,728 --> 00:04:57,931 the messages I could absolutely imagine them in 99 00:04:57,998 --> 00:05:00,567 a in a general election campaign against Tom 100 00:05:00,634 --> 00:05:03,770 Tiffany. But they are Ana. They're trying to win this 101 00:05:03,837 --> 00:05:06,874 Democratic primary among a smaller group of voters 102 00:05:06,940 --> 00:05:09,076 right now. >> Right. But it is this 103 00:05:09,142 --> 00:05:11,345 balancing act where, as Rich said, right, they are 104 00:05:11,411 --> 00:05:13,981 going for a trifecta. And that was another big theme 105 00:05:14,047 --> 00:05:16,149 of the weekend, is this idea that Democrats really 106 00:05:16,216 --> 00:05:18,485 think that they could take over all three chambers of 107 00:05:18,552 --> 00:05:21,054 government. And so they need to try to distinguish 108 00:05:21,121 --> 00:05:23,156 themselves. And most of them don't have that kind 109 00:05:23,223 --> 00:05:24,958 of, you know, statewide visibility. So they are 110 00:05:25,025 --> 00:05:27,828 still trying to get just like baseline name 111 00:05:27,895 --> 00:05:29,696 recognition, which is important for a primary, 112 00:05:29,763 --> 00:05:32,633 but then also not do anything to harm other 113 00:05:32,699 --> 00:05:35,669 Democrats because, you know, if you have sort of a 1 in 114 00:05:35,736 --> 00:05:38,405 7 chance, and I know that's not exactly how statistics 115 00:05:38,472 --> 00:05:40,941 work, but something like that. And so you don't move 116 00:05:41,008 --> 00:05:43,110 forward, you don't want to have weakened your party. 117 00:05:43,177 --> 00:05:45,913 You don't want to be giving Tom Tiffany sort of free 118 00:05:45,979 --> 00:05:47,948 fodder for your opponent opponents. And so I think 119 00:05:48,015 --> 00:05:50,884 that we will see a little bit more maybe of those 120 00:05:50,951 --> 00:05:53,253 veiled attacks, but in a way that's more aimed at 121 00:05:53,320 --> 00:05:57,057 sort of holding themselves up rather than necessarily 122 00:05:57,124 --> 00:05:59,693 going negative at this point. Because Tom Tiffany 123 00:05:59,760 --> 00:06:02,596 as, as Rich mentioned, is sort of in a field by 124 00:06:02,663 --> 00:06:05,365 himself. He technically has an opponent, but more or 125 00:06:05,432 --> 00:06:07,467 less he's the presumptive nominee. And so he's not 126 00:06:07,534 --> 00:06:10,404 going to get weakened in a primary. So they need to be 127 00:06:10,470 --> 00:06:12,639 very careful themselves. >> It can work against you 128 00:06:12,706 --> 00:06:14,608 in a primary, particularly a Democratic primary, to go 129 00:06:14,675 --> 00:06:17,411 negative, where you have voters who have kind of 130 00:06:17,477 --> 00:06:20,914 that same idea that like, look, the goal is November. 131 00:06:20,981 --> 00:06:24,818 Stop fighting and show us how you're different. Rich, 132 00:06:24,885 --> 00:06:26,587 anything that jump out at you there. And what Annie 133 00:06:26,653 --> 00:06:30,123 was just mentioning. >> Well, I wanted to, to 134 00:06:30,190 --> 00:06:34,862 kind of go back to when, when she mentioned the, you 135 00:06:35,629 --> 00:06:38,165 know, the slights and the, the, the electability and 136 00:06:38,232 --> 00:06:41,301 all that stuff. One of the candidates, you know, early 137 00:06:41,368 --> 00:06:44,037 on, even before he announced Mandela Barnes, 138 00:06:44,104 --> 00:06:48,108 former lieutenant governor, former state representative, 139 00:06:48,175 --> 00:06:52,646 he during his speech, he I let me go back before he 140 00:06:54,014 --> 00:06:57,117 got on the race, some Democrats were publicly 141 00:06:57,184 --> 00:07:00,320 saying, well, he lost in 2022. You know, we don't 142 00:07:00,387 --> 00:07:03,323 need that again. But during his speech, I he brought 143 00:07:03,390 --> 00:07:06,126 that up and he said, well, that's why I'm more 144 00:07:06,193 --> 00:07:08,662 experienced. I've been through this came within 145 00:07:08,729 --> 00:07:12,299 one point percentage point of Ron Johnson in 2022. 146 00:07:12,366 --> 00:07:14,401 That's why I have the experience. That and the 147 00:07:14,468 --> 00:07:18,572 other resume stuff that he's got. So I just wanted 148 00:07:18,639 --> 00:07:21,775 to mention. lot of conversation about 149 00:07:21,842 --> 00:07:24,178 electability, which again, I think speaks to trying to 150 00:07:24,244 --> 00:07:26,813 signal that they could beat Tom Tiffany in the fall. 151 00:07:26,880 --> 00:07:29,983 And so you had, for example, Fran Hong pointed to the 152 00:07:30,050 --> 00:07:33,187 fact that she's, if not the most far left candidate, 153 00:07:33,253 --> 00:07:36,089 certainly among them. And the fact that some people 154 00:07:36,156 --> 00:07:38,358 have have brought that up as a liability against her, 155 00:07:38,425 --> 00:07:41,028 as passionate as her supporters are, her 156 00:07:41,094 --> 00:07:42,863 opponents are sort of equally passionate. And she 157 00:07:42,930 --> 00:07:46,633 talked about, well, legacy of Wisconsin 158 00:07:46,700 --> 00:07:49,002 progressives who were elected. So rather than 159 00:07:49,069 --> 00:07:51,071 that being a liability for me, that actually makes me 160 00:07:51,138 --> 00:07:53,607 more electable because people are excited about 161 00:07:53,674 --> 00:07:57,311 someone who doesn't bring BS. And David Crowley as 162 00:07:57,377 --> 00:08:00,214 well. He pointed to the fact that there has never 163 00:08:00,280 --> 00:08:03,884 been a Black candidate who has won statewide office, 164 00:08:03,951 --> 00:08:06,220 and he says that everywhere he goes, people ask him, 165 00:08:06,286 --> 00:08:08,856 can a Black man become governor in Wisconsin? And 166 00:08:08,922 --> 00:08:11,325 he said, well, I can for the following reasons. And 167 00:08:11,391 --> 00:08:14,094 so he named that sort of elephant in the room as a 168 00:08:14,161 --> 00:08:16,530 way of also drawing attention to his record. 169 00:08:16,597 --> 00:08:19,266 And so, again, just kind of the way that the candidates 170 00:08:19,333 --> 00:08:21,134 are trying to distinguish themselves, not just on 171 00:08:21,201 --> 00:08:23,270 their own terms, but also for what they can deliver 172 00:08:23,337 --> 00:08:26,673 in November. >> And there was a straw 173 00:08:27,207 --> 00:08:29,710 poll at this convention. Ana. And I feel like, you 174 00:08:29,776 --> 00:08:32,012 know, it's it's kind of fun to talk about, but we 175 00:08:32,079 --> 00:08:34,214 should say a thousand grains of salt here for 176 00:08:34,281 --> 00:08:37,017 this poll, because this is not a scientific poll. The 177 00:08:37,084 --> 00:08:39,386 margin of error would be, look, I'm not qualified to 178 00:08:39,453 --> 00:08:41,455 calculate it very high. >> Charles Franklin would 179 00:08:41,522 --> 00:08:44,424 have a lot to say about this one. 180 00:08:45,058 --> 00:08:47,160 attention to straw polls would be my guess. But you 181 00:08:47,227 --> 00:08:49,963 had all these Democrats in the room, and if they 182 00:08:50,030 --> 00:08:52,032 wanted to, they could go to the booth run by 183 00:08:52,099 --> 00:08:53,967 WisPolitics, which does these at all the 184 00:08:54,034 --> 00:08:56,103 conventions. And and you could vote for your 185 00:08:56,170 --> 00:08:59,506 candidate of choice among the primary field. And how 186 00:08:59,573 --> 00:09:02,809 did that resolve? >> Yeah. Really interesting. 187 00:09:02,876 --> 00:09:04,978 Lieutenant Governor Sarah Rodriguez came out first. 188 00:09:05,045 --> 00:09:08,215 And again, if Fran Hong is sort of further to the left, 189 00:09:08,282 --> 00:09:11,084 she's a little bit further to the center. But then 190 00:09:11,151 --> 00:09:13,921 Fran Hong was number two. And so you kind of have a 191 00:09:13,987 --> 00:09:16,290 little bit of the polls of what the party is 192 00:09:16,356 --> 00:09:18,292 presenting right now, one who might be doing better 193 00:09:18,358 --> 00:09:21,128 in a in a primary race. Again, given just sort of 194 00:09:21,195 --> 00:09:23,096 the excitement that's around her, that's Fran 195 00:09:23,163 --> 00:09:25,265 Hong, and then one who perhaps could appeal to a 196 00:09:25,332 --> 00:09:27,634 broader audience that is Sara Rodriguez, who comes 197 00:09:27,701 --> 00:09:30,170 from a more of a business background. She was a 198 00:09:30,237 --> 00:09:32,439 health care executive and a nurse. She won. She flipped 199 00:09:32,506 --> 00:09:35,142 a Republican seat when she ran for the assembly in the 200 00:09:35,209 --> 00:09:37,845 Waukesha in the Waukesha suburbs. And so you have 201 00:09:37,911 --> 00:09:40,214 these two different models, and it kind of looked like 202 00:09:40,280 --> 00:09:43,884 Democrats a little bit split among them. 203 00:09:43,951 --> 00:09:46,854 >> So I want to throw some caution at the poll here 204 00:09:46,920 --> 00:09:49,223 that the straw poll, I was just looking back at the 205 00:09:49,289 --> 00:09:52,426 2018 straw poll, when you had even more candidates 206 00:09:52,492 --> 00:09:54,528 running for governor, kind of depending on when you 207 00:09:54,595 --> 00:09:57,698 mentioned them. You probably have are aware of 208 00:09:57,764 --> 00:10:01,201 this by now or have heard it or seen it recently. But 209 00:10:01,268 --> 00:10:04,638 that year, Kelda Roys won the straw poll. She went on 210 00:10:04,705 --> 00:10:06,440 to finish third in the primary, a distant third, 211 00:10:06,507 --> 00:10:09,776 but she won it overwhelmingly at 212 00:10:09,843 --> 00:10:13,380 convention. Do you do you happen to know where Tony 213 00:10:13,447 --> 00:10:16,617 Evers placed in that straw poll? This is the beginning 214 00:10:16,683 --> 00:10:19,520 of our quiz section here, guys. So Tony Evers placed 215 00:10:19,586 --> 00:10:23,290 third. He had he had 91 votes compared to Kelda 216 00:10:23,357 --> 00:10:27,928 Roys 184. That year right behind him were Andy and 217 00:10:29,630 --> 00:10:32,566 Dana Wachs. They have something in common. They 218 00:10:32,633 --> 00:10:35,469 both dropped out of the race by the end of June 219 00:10:35,536 --> 00:10:37,571 that year. So the convention was in June 2nd, 220 00:10:37,638 --> 00:10:40,407 I think, and they were dropped out by the 21st and 221 00:10:40,474 --> 00:10:42,109 22nd. So. >> Right. So again, 222 00:10:42,176 --> 00:10:44,711 appealing to quote unquote normal people versus 223 00:10:44,778 --> 00:10:48,348 appealing to the most kind of revved up Democrats who 224 00:10:48,415 --> 00:10:50,417 follow every kind of twist and turn about that. So it 225 00:10:50,484 --> 00:10:52,319 doesn't necessarily translate to what a general 226 00:10:52,386 --> 00:10:54,655 voter or general audience is interested in. 227 00:10:54,721 --> 00:10:58,025 >> Sure. And there's also a certain amount of 228 00:10:58,091 --> 00:11:00,294 campaigning you can do in the room at these things. 229 00:11:00,360 --> 00:11:05,232 You can say, hey, get over to that desk that's run by 230 00:11:05,299 --> 00:11:06,934 WisPolitics, and I think you should really vote for 231 00:11:07,000 --> 00:11:09,436 us. >> Bring your people. 232 00:11:09,503 --> 00:11:12,339 Absolutely. And I'm sure some of that went on at 233 00:11:12,406 --> 00:11:15,943 this convention. So, okay, I did want to play a little 234 00:11:16,009 --> 00:11:19,179 game with with you two since we have you here, 235 00:11:19,246 --> 00:11:22,449 would that be okay? >> All right. Sure. Ready? 236 00:11:22,516 --> 00:11:24,585 >> You have no choice, right? We're recording a 237 00:11:24,651 --> 00:11:27,888 live show here. So I was just looking back through 238 00:11:27,955 --> 00:11:31,425 these speeches and through the benefit of being able 239 00:11:31,491 --> 00:11:34,361 to look at the transcript and the number of times 240 00:11:34,428 --> 00:11:37,965 that certain words were mentioned in these things, 241 00:11:38,031 --> 00:11:42,769 you can see kind of who hit themes really hard. So the 242 00:11:42,836 --> 00:11:46,640 first one I looked for was Trump, who said Trump the 243 00:11:46,707 --> 00:11:49,176 most. Anybody want to hazard a guess? Rich, you 244 00:11:49,243 --> 00:11:52,713 go first. >> I'm gonna say Rodriguez. 245 00:11:55,883 --> 00:11:58,085 >> I think it might have been Joel Brennan. 246 00:11:58,151 --> 00:12:01,755 >> All right, all right, Rich, you win buddy. You 247 00:12:01,822 --> 00:12:05,459 got Sara Rodriguez and Mandela Barnes were right 248 00:12:05,526 --> 00:12:08,729 Mentioned him six times. Joel Brennan after them. 249 00:12:08,795 --> 00:12:10,697 And then everybody mentioned Trump at least 250 00:12:10,764 --> 00:12:14,635 once. But Rodriguez and Barnes kind of hitting to 251 00:12:14,701 --> 00:12:17,871 my ear similar themes in those messages too. Like 252 00:12:17,938 --> 00:12:20,440 they sounded like maybe they were running a little 253 00:12:20,507 --> 00:12:24,745 bit of a November campaign or a safer message in their 254 00:12:24,811 --> 00:12:29,116 speeches. Okay, how about Tiffany? And to be clear, 255 00:12:29,183 --> 00:12:32,386 nobody mentioned the the Truman Capote book that was 256 00:12:32,452 --> 00:12:34,688 adapted into a movie and later, you know, celebrated 257 00:12:34,755 --> 00:12:37,791 in a song. Who mentioned Tiffany, Tom, Tiffany the 258 00:12:37,858 --> 00:12:40,761 most? >> Gosh, I'm just stuck on 259 00:12:42,496 --> 00:12:44,831 that dad joke now. >> I was I'm proud of that 260 00:12:44,898 --> 00:12:46,567 one. >> You know. 261 00:12:47,234 --> 00:12:49,536 >> That song, by the way, in my head all the time. 262 00:12:49,603 --> 00:12:52,739 And I hated it when it came out. But the beauty of 263 00:12:52,806 --> 00:12:56,243 nostalgia Roe v. Wade. >> I'm gonna vote Roys well 264 00:12:56,310 --> 00:12:58,045 for this. >> There you go. There you 265 00:12:58,111 --> 00:13:00,781 go. >> We got you. Kelda Roys. 266 00:13:01,515 --> 00:13:06,286 How about you? Who mentioned Tiffany the most? 267 00:13:06,353 --> 00:13:08,555 >> Missy Hughes. >> All right. Good. Good 268 00:13:08,622 --> 00:13:11,859 guesses everybody. Sara Rodriguez was tops and 269 00:13:11,925 --> 00:13:15,229 Tiffany mentions followed by Joel Brennan Mandela 270 00:13:15,295 --> 00:13:17,231 Barnes and Kelda. Roys mentioned. And once David 271 00:13:17,297 --> 00:13:19,399 Crowley, Missy Hughes and Francesca Hong didn't even 272 00:13:19,466 --> 00:13:22,169 mention Tom Tiffany. >> In this thing, was I 273 00:13:22,236 --> 00:13:25,472 there at all? It was kind of interesting. 274 00:13:25,539 --> 00:13:28,308 it's the kind of thing you assume that you heard a 275 00:13:28,375 --> 00:13:31,245 bunch of people say, and then you go back and look 276 00:13:31,311 --> 00:13:33,480 and realize, well, they didn't actually mention 277 00:13:33,547 --> 00:13:35,549 predict whoever wins this primary, though, will 278 00:13:35,616 --> 00:13:38,519 mention him a lot in TV ads between now and November. 279 00:13:38,585 --> 00:13:40,554 Okay, how about this? We've got we've got a Democratic 280 00:13:40,621 --> 00:13:43,457 governor right now, and a lot of these people have 281 00:13:43,524 --> 00:13:46,059 worked with or for this Democratic governor. Who do 282 00:13:46,126 --> 00:13:48,862 you think might have mentioned Evers a few times? 283 00:13:48,929 --> 00:13:52,165 Rich, what do you think? >> I would say it'd 284 00:13:52,232 --> 00:13:55,002 have to be someone that worked within the 285 00:13:55,068 --> 00:13:58,438 administration or alongside him. So that narrows it 286 00:13:58,505 --> 00:14:02,376 down to four people, I would say. Brennan. 287 00:14:02,442 --> 00:14:05,078 >> Yeah. Okay. Anya. >> I think it was also 288 00:14:05,145 --> 00:14:07,614 Brennan. He also made a point of saying fix the 289 00:14:07,681 --> 00:14:09,950 darn roads. And so he seemed to be really tying 290 00:14:10,017 --> 00:14:12,386 himself. Yeah, yeah. Evers. >> It was. Mandela Barnes 291 00:14:12,452 --> 00:14:13,921 Tony Evers, former lieutenant governor, 292 00:14:13,987 --> 00:14:16,390 followed by Joel Brennan, his former secretary, 293 00:14:16,456 --> 00:14:18,692 followed by Sara Rodriguez, his current lieutenant 294 00:14:18,759 --> 00:14:23,030 governor, and Missy Hughes, his former WEAC CEO. No 295 00:14:23,096 --> 00:14:25,165 mention of Tony Evers by Francesca Hong Kelda Roys 296 00:14:25,232 --> 00:14:27,601 or David Crowley. >> So no big surprise. 297 00:14:27,668 --> 00:14:29,603 >> Tony was back there taking notes like, I see 298 00:14:29,670 --> 00:14:32,472 you, I see you. Okay, one more, one more, I promise. 299 00:14:32,539 --> 00:14:35,375 And this is a little different. You got a chance 300 00:14:35,442 --> 00:14:36,944 at this convention to differentiate yourself. One 301 00:14:37,010 --> 00:14:39,880 way is you can just tell these delegates I'm 302 00:14:39,947 --> 00:14:44,084 different. Who said only candidate? As in I'm the 303 00:14:44,151 --> 00:14:45,953 only candidate. >> Oh, I know this one. 304 00:14:46,019 --> 00:14:49,156 >> Okay. the only candidate who 305 00:14:49,223 --> 00:14:50,924 proposes a moratorium on data centers. 306 00:14:50,991 --> 00:14:55,162 >> And free childcare. And you are correct, Anya. She 307 00:14:55,229 --> 00:14:59,466 mentioned it four times. This was interesting to me. 308 00:14:59,533 --> 00:15:02,669 Rich Kelda Roys was there. She mentioned it a couple 309 00:15:02,736 --> 00:15:06,139 times. Her message was, I'm the only candidate who's 310 00:15:06,206 --> 00:15:08,775 been a legislator. I got I got bills, as was basically 311 00:15:08,842 --> 00:15:11,078 what she was saying. And then David Crowley, the 312 00:15:11,144 --> 00:15:13,380 only candidate who has executive experience and 313 00:15:13,447 --> 00:15:16,984 nobody else used that turn of phrase, big grain of 314 00:15:17,050 --> 00:15:19,753 salt for that one too, which is very unscientific, 315 00:15:19,820 --> 00:15:22,089 but I find it fun to run through that stuff 316 00:15:22,155 --> 00:15:23,490 through that stuff unscientific. 317 00:15:23,557 --> 00:15:26,860 >> But you probably made a spreadsheet. 318 00:15:26,927 --> 00:15:29,663 You're darn right. Yeah, I made it a lot easier for me 319 00:15:29,730 --> 00:15:32,633 to list those things real quick. So we want to move 320 00:15:32,699 --> 00:15:35,669 on real quick to some legal developments this week, a 321 00:15:35,736 --> 00:15:38,605 few small legal developments in big cases. 322 00:15:38,672 --> 00:15:41,542 Rich. First, let's start with there was this 323 00:15:41,608 --> 00:15:45,179 decision by the state Supreme Court to hear an 324 00:15:45,245 --> 00:15:47,614 appeal in a redistricting case, congressional 325 00:15:47,681 --> 00:15:51,285 redistricting case? Is this a big deal or an 326 00:15:51,351 --> 00:15:55,622 incremental step? >> It's pretty incremental. 327 00:15:55,689 --> 00:15:58,192 So these are about the congressional maps. There's 328 00:15:58,258 --> 00:16:01,428 two of them that have been two of these appeals of 329 00:16:01,495 --> 00:16:05,799 these cases challenging the congressional map as 330 00:16:05,866 --> 00:16:09,002 gerrymandered for various reasons, various types of 331 00:16:09,069 --> 00:16:11,872 gerrymandering. And it sounds exciting that it's 332 00:16:11,939 --> 00:16:14,208 made it to the Supreme Court, but all they're 333 00:16:14,274 --> 00:16:17,377 doing in both situations is they will be deciding 334 00:16:17,444 --> 00:16:20,881 whether or not these three judge panels they appointed 335 00:16:20,948 --> 00:16:24,284 were correct in how they dismissed these challenges. 336 00:16:24,351 --> 00:16:27,487 And those panels essentially said they 337 00:16:27,554 --> 00:16:29,890 dismissed them because they don't have the authority to 338 00:16:29,957 --> 00:16:33,160 overturn the maps, which were put in place by the 339 00:16:33,227 --> 00:16:36,163 Supreme Court. And a lower court cannot overrule a 340 00:16:36,230 --> 00:16:40,067 higher court like that. So what I've been told is that 341 00:16:40,133 --> 00:16:43,303 that probably means these will go back through the 342 00:16:43,370 --> 00:16:45,472 court system, back to the lower courts and work their 343 00:16:45,539 --> 00:16:48,308 way up. But the Supreme Court justices will have to 344 00:16:48,375 --> 00:16:50,711 decide whether or not these gerrymandering claims can 345 00:16:50,777 --> 00:16:55,215 even move forward. So that's a big question. But 346 00:16:55,282 --> 00:16:57,918 in short, it doesn't mean there's likely doesn't mean 347 00:16:57,985 --> 00:17:00,587 that there's going to be any new map before the 2026 348 00:17:00,654 --> 00:17:02,256 election. There's just not enough time. 349 00:17:02,322 --> 00:17:04,825 >> Okay. And lightning round here, you had a case 350 00:17:04,892 --> 00:17:08,729 you covered on voter rolls. What happened there? 351 00:17:08,795 --> 00:17:10,264 >> So the federal government, the Department 352 00:17:10,330 --> 00:17:13,400 of Justice, wants to get unredacted voter 353 00:17:13,467 --> 00:17:17,638 registration information from Wisconsin. And that 354 00:17:17,704 --> 00:17:19,907 includes, you know, driver's license numbers 355 00:17:19,973 --> 00:17:23,944 and Social Security numbers, the last four digits. The 356 00:17:24,011 --> 00:17:27,014 Elections Commission hasn't provided that they've given 357 00:17:27,080 --> 00:17:29,983 a different list that's publicly available. But 358 00:17:30,050 --> 00:17:32,853 essentially, the case was dismissed last month in 359 00:17:32,920 --> 00:17:35,856 federal court. It's being appealed. The DOJ is 360 00:17:35,923 --> 00:17:41,528 appealing it to the Seventh Circuit. But again, it will 361 00:17:41,595 --> 00:17:44,198 take a while. And there's been other examples of this 362 00:17:44,264 --> 00:17:46,633 around the nation where the DOJ has been losing these 363 00:17:46,700 --> 00:17:48,569 cases. >> One of those will have 364 00:17:48,635 --> 00:17:51,371 to keep an eye on and then Ana the false electors case 365 00:17:51,438 --> 00:17:53,740 in Wisconsin. What happened there? 366 00:17:53,807 --> 00:17:58,011 >> They pleaded not guilty to 11 counts of felony 367 00:17:58,078 --> 00:18:00,681 forgery, including Wisconsin's own Jim Troupis. 368 00:18:00,747 --> 00:18:02,916 Well, he's also trying to get the case moved out of 369 00:18:02,983 --> 00:18:05,352 Dane County Circuit Court. And so that case continues 370 00:18:05,419 --> 00:18:06,920 to unfold. >> All right. Thank you 371 00:18:06,987 --> 00:18:09,690 both for keeping an eye on those. That's all the time 372 00:18:09,756 --> 00:18:11,892 we have for today. Thanks for joining us. Our 373 00:18:11,959 --> 00:18:14,761 colleague Zac Schultz will be back in a few weeks. 374 00:18:14,828 --> 00:18:16,730 This has been inside Wisconsin politics. Be sure 375 00:18:16,797 --> 00:18:19,566 to follow us on PBS, wisconsin.org, WPR.org, 376 00:18:19,633 --> 00:18:23,770 YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts.