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make that true.
>> Reporting from Madison.

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I'm Zac Schultz for Here
and Now.

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>> On this week's Inside
Wisconsin Politics, we hear

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Zac Schultz, along with
Wypr political reporter

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Shawn Johnson, rich Kremer
and Anya van Wagtendonk dig

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into why there are so many
Democratic primary

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candidates in the midterm
elections, what party

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support for a particular
candidate does or doesn't

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say about the campaigns and
examples of such races.

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Seizing grassroots efforts,
won for governor and won

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for the third Congressional
District.

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>> In the very recent past,
you had Democrats and

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liberals very wary about
jumping into primaries.

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What's changed? Zac?
>> I think the biggest

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thing that's changed is the
Democrats see more

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opportunity to win some of
these over the past 16

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years, basically in the
Scott Walker era. On when

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the maps didn't favor
Wisconsin and perhaps the

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political climate didn't
favor candidates statewide,

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there was a concern that a
primary just took up too

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many resources that were
limited, mainly money and

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time, and the threat that
if they went negative

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against each other, it
really hurt their

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opportunity to win
statewide. Since Democrats

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have gotten on a roll in 1
a lot of these races for

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governor, AG, state Supreme
Court, and they've got

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better maps, they see more
opportunity. And so there's

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more options for people to
get in, because the primary

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doesn't look quite as
devastating.

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>> Since I'm naming stuff
today, this is the don't

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tell me what to do primary,
an important distinction in

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Democratic primaries. We've
got a couple examples here

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today. Let's start with one
in the third Congressional

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District. Rich, I've heard
a lot about this district

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because it's our most
competitive congressional

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district. Derrick Van Orden
is the Republican incumbent.

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I've heard a lot about
Rebecca Cooke, the

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Democratic challenger who
has outraised him recently

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and seems to be getting a
lot of attention. There is

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a primary there who's
running.

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>> So the primary is
between Cooke, who's an Eau

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Claire Democrat raised on a
dairy farm in the county

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and, you know, has done
some political consulting

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work, fundraising work for
Democrats in years past.

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But now she's Bakke. She's
really portraying herself

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as kind of of the district,
you know, born and bred

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Wisconsin, etc. Republicans
are trying to, you know,

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focus the attention on her
consulting work, etc. The

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other Democrat is longtime
Eau Claire City Council

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member, former council
president, until just

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recently, Emily Berge of
Eau Claire. And she she's

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portraying herself as the
grassroots choice in this

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race. And national
Democrats came in and

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started sending resources,
staff, etc. back in

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February to Cooke's
campaign. And Berge said,

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well, that's pretty dirty.
You know, she essentially

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said D.C. shouldn't be
deciding who is the

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Democrat to face Van Orden.
It should be the people of

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Eau Claire. And just
anecdotally, when I'm

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walking through the city, I
don't see a lot of Cooke

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signs. In fact, I don't
remember seeing any. But I

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see a whole bunch of Berge
signs. So this being one of

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the more, if not the most
populous areas in the third

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district, maybe that makes
a difference. But in terms

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of resources, Cooke is way,
way, way ahead of Berge in

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all the fundraising reports
that I've seen.

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>> Zac, do you get the
sense that this is, you

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know, a competitive primary
here?

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>> It could be it really
depends on how much the

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primary voters pay
attention. And that's

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always the issue in some of
these primaries is name

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recognition makes a big
deal. That's why the

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National Party comes in and
puts resources behind Cooke.

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It's not necessarily that
they like her more. It's

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they think she has the
better chance to win in the

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fall and get her moving.
Now. It's the old mentality

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we talked about at the
beginning of the show of

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why didn't Democrats do
primaries in the past? It

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takes resources, it can get
ugly, it can get negative.

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It could hurt the candidate.
Going into the fall. I ran

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into Berge when she was
campaigning with Francesca

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Hong for governor in La
Crosse. They were doing an

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event at the same bookstore.
And it's not a coincidence

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that while we were talking
to them, they were talking

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about going and seeing them
at the next stop. And there

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there is a kind of thematic
fit with that campaign of

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more grassroots, more from
the bottom up and running

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against party types who
tell us who our candidates

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should be. Parties like to
dictate sometimes who the

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candidate can be so they
can focus resources.

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Sometimes that does run up
against a wall, which is

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why your title for this
Don't Tell Me What to Do,

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does fit, because there are
candidates who are going to

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say no. Let the people
decide. People have to pay

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attention, though.
there are plenty of

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examples in the recent past,
particularly among

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Republicans, where you come
out of a battle tested

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primary and you are wounded.
And it did not help them

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very much in the general
election. I think in 2018,

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Tony Evers came out of a
battle tested primary and

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was a little bit out of
money. So there is a risk

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to it, but it does also get
attention, I guess is the

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thing that it does for sure.
>> I think another piece of

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this too, is that it's very
easy to kind of present a

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unified front as a party
when you're in the minority,

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because it doesn't really
matter, right? You don't

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have power. And so we might
know that kind of behind

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the scenes, the further
left Democrats and the more

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centrist Democrats don't
then they all come forward

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and kind of vote in
alignment. And so now what

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we're seeing, because
there's a little bit more

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of a sense that perhaps
they could actually win

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things and gain power.
There's also, I think, a

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little bit of a fight for
what will the Democratic

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Party in Wisconsin look
like, vote like, will they

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be further left? Will it be
more of a Hong kind of