1 00:00:02,369 --> 00:00:06,006 >> The following program is a PBS Wisconsin Original 2 00:00:06,073 --> 00:00:08,408 production. >> That's why we need a 3 00:00:08,475 --> 00:00:10,577 governor who's going to stand up, someone who's 4 00:00:10,644 --> 00:00:12,813 going to bring folks from all political factions to 5 00:00:12,880 --> 00:00:15,582 the table. >> The test is always 6 00:00:15,649 --> 00:00:18,352 what's best for Wisconsin. And that's what I'm going 7 00:00:18,418 --> 00:00:21,221 to do as governor. >> The candidates for 8 00:00:21,288 --> 00:00:24,992 governor share their positions on the big issues 9 00:00:25,058 --> 00:00:29,129 facing voters and fueled by global events. The price of 10 00:00:29,196 --> 00:00:33,867 gas rises again. I'm Frederica Freyberg. Tonight 11 00:00:33,934 --> 00:00:38,172 on "Here& Now". Tom Tiffany and David Crowley in 12 00:00:38,238 --> 00:00:41,108 extended interviews on their bid to be the next 13 00:00:41,175 --> 00:00:44,111 governor and how the transportation industry is 14 00:00:44,178 --> 00:00:47,514 handling record high diesel costs. 15 00:00:50,017 --> 00:00:52,653 September 18th. >> Funding for "Here& Now" 16 00:00:52,719 --> 00:00:55,622 is provided by the Focus Fund for Journalism and 17 00:00:55,689 --> 00:01:00,827 Friends of PBS Wisconsin. >> Republican candidate for 18 00:01:07,734 --> 00:01:11,405 governor Tom Tiffany, continues his campaign 19 00:01:11,471 --> 00:01:15,342 after he survived with only stitches. A crashed water 20 00:01:15,409 --> 00:01:17,845 landing into Lake Wausau. When the private plane. He 21 00:01:17,911 --> 00:01:22,149 was a passenger in lost power last Saturday. The 22 00:01:22,216 --> 00:01:26,153 FAA is investigating. Senior political reporter 23 00:01:26,220 --> 00:01:29,223 Zac Schultz. Tonight brings you interviews with both 24 00:01:29,289 --> 00:01:31,892 candidates running for governor, starting with 25 00:01:31,959 --> 00:01:34,695 current seventh District Congressman Tiffany. The 26 00:01:34,761 --> 00:01:38,765 interview was conducted days before the crash. 27 00:01:38,832 --> 00:01:41,835 >> Congresswoman Tiffany, >> Good to join you, Zac. 28 00:01:41,902 --> 00:01:43,871 >> So immediately after the primary, a lot of the 29 00:01:43,937 --> 00:01:46,707 attention on the race seemed to be focused on 30 00:01:46,773 --> 00:01:48,876 data centers. But in the last few weeks, it seems 31 00:01:48,942 --> 00:01:50,944 like it's shifted to traditional topics of taxes 32 00:01:51,011 --> 00:01:53,780 and spending and crime. Do you think that will be the 33 00:01:53,847 --> 00:01:56,149 standard issue that this election is decided on? 34 00:01:56,216 --> 00:01:58,585 >> Yeah, I think it's those quality of life issues. I 35 00:01:58,652 --> 00:02:00,554 mean, when we talk about all the time is 36 00:02:00,621 --> 00:02:03,090 affordability, sense. And that's the 37 00:02:03,156 --> 00:02:05,092 message that we're delivering out there. But 38 00:02:05,158 --> 00:02:08,529 it is very much economic. It's kitchen table issues. 39 00:02:08,595 --> 00:02:10,664 I mean, people see their budgets. They're they're 40 00:02:10,731 --> 00:02:13,700 really stretched thin at this point. And that's 41 00:02:13,767 --> 00:02:16,570 their concern. And I hear it from all the people that 42 00:02:16,637 --> 00:02:19,740 are out knocking doors for us. They're like, it's 43 00:02:19,806 --> 00:02:21,642 economic kitchen table issues. What people are 44 00:02:21,708 --> 00:02:23,644 talking about. >> Now there's two 45 00:02:23,710 --> 00:02:25,579 different definitions of affordability that the 46 00:02:25,646 --> 00:02:28,248 parties have. Obviously, you're talking about taxing 47 00:02:28,315 --> 00:02:31,351 and spending and the budget and Democrats are talking 48 00:02:31,418 --> 00:02:35,355 about national tariffs and rising prices or gas prices. 49 00:02:35,422 --> 00:02:37,691 Which do you think impacts people more? 50 00:02:37,758 --> 00:02:40,694 >> Well, I think they both do. And, you know, gas 51 00:02:40,761 --> 00:02:43,263 prices are too high. And, you know, those are largely 52 00:02:43,330 --> 00:02:45,866 set on world markets. The thing that I've been 53 00:02:45,933 --> 00:02:48,569 focused on is what can I do as governor? Because you 54 00:02:48,635 --> 00:02:51,705 can flail on issues that you don't have a impact on. 55 00:02:51,772 --> 00:02:54,508 I think it's very important to have a governor that is 56 00:02:54,575 --> 00:02:57,444 going to be focused on the issues that you can help 57 00:02:57,511 --> 00:02:59,580 people out with. And so if we're going to put more 58 00:02:59,646 --> 00:03:01,648 money in people's pockets, that's why I've been 59 00:03:01,715 --> 00:03:04,484 talking about let's reduce taxes and the 400 year 60 00:03:04,551 --> 00:03:06,687 property tax increase, the $3 billion budget surplus 61 00:03:06,753 --> 00:03:09,823 that we have, we should return every penny of it to 62 00:03:09,890 --> 00:03:11,992 the taxpayers so they have more money in their pockets. 63 00:03:12,059 --> 00:03:14,862 We're going to do a 10% income tax cut for those 64 00:03:14,928 --> 00:03:18,799 making $150,000 and less, and no taxes on tips and 65 00:03:18,866 --> 00:03:20,667 overtime, just like we did federally. 66 00:03:20,734 --> 00:03:23,103 >> Earlier this year. You had a tweet where you're in 67 00:03:23,170 --> 00:03:25,239 front of the gas station, pumps and promises made, 68 00:03:25,305 --> 00:03:27,174 promises kept. Obviously, prices have gone up 69 00:03:27,241 --> 00:03:29,142 significantly since then. Do you regret that tweet or 70 00:03:29,209 --> 00:03:33,013 is it just outside of your ability to control? 71 00:03:33,080 --> 00:03:35,282 of our control. And you know, at that time, boy, 72 00:03:35,349 --> 00:03:38,151 what was it like 235 or something like that. So gas 73 00:03:38,218 --> 00:03:41,154 prices had gone down. They went up as a result of the 74 00:03:41,221 --> 00:03:46,126 instability in the Middle East and Iran. And with the 75 00:03:46,193 --> 00:03:47,794 Revolutionary Guard plinking a ship every now 76 00:03:47,861 --> 00:03:50,731 and then in the Straits of Hormuz to keep gas prices 77 00:03:50,797 --> 00:03:55,769 up. And so it's really important that we have more 78 00:03:55,836 --> 00:03:57,804 energy that is being produced. And that's the 79 00:03:57,871 --> 00:04:00,641 thing that I've been focused on, both state and 80 00:04:00,707 --> 00:04:03,043 federally, is we have to be energy independent here in 81 00:04:03,110 --> 00:04:05,746 America. So what can a governor do? A governor can 82 00:04:05,812 --> 00:04:09,516 deal with the energy issue in regards to our utilities. 83 00:04:09,583 --> 00:04:13,554 We've seen over $2 billion of increases in utility 84 00:04:13,620 --> 00:04:15,756 rates here over the last eight years. The Public 85 00:04:15,822 --> 00:04:17,791 Service Commission here in Wisconsin has just acted as 86 00:04:17,858 --> 00:04:20,661 a rubber stamp for the utility rate increases. I 87 00:04:20,727 --> 00:04:24,765 will not do that, and we can help make life more 88 00:04:24,831 --> 00:04:28,001 affordable for Wisconsinites by not 89 00:04:28,068 --> 00:04:31,505 raising those utility rates and getting back to keeping 90 00:04:31,572 --> 00:04:33,707 our base load sources of power. And I think it's 91 00:04:33,774 --> 00:04:36,243 time to embrace the new nuclear technologies. 92 00:04:36,310 --> 00:04:38,745 >> Democrats would point to your role in Congress as 93 00:04:38,812 --> 00:04:41,215 oversight, oversight, and control of the budget over 94 00:04:41,281 --> 00:04:44,051 Donald Trump and tariffs and, you know, initiating 95 00:04:44,117 --> 00:04:47,120 the war in Iran. What do you have to say to respond 96 00:04:47,187 --> 00:04:49,923 about your role in Congress in that in that area? 97 00:04:49,990 --> 00:04:53,227 >> Yeah. So, you know, if you take a look at the bill 98 00:04:53,293 --> 00:04:56,663 that we passed last year, no taxes on tips and 99 00:04:56,730 --> 00:04:59,633 overtime, as well as Social Security taxes, we 100 00:04:59,700 --> 00:05:02,469 eliminated them for almost everyone that's on Social 101 00:05:02,536 --> 00:05:05,405 Security. We've put more money into people's pockets. 102 00:05:05,472 --> 00:05:08,976 I would also say that by securing the border, 103 00:05:09,042 --> 00:05:11,845 hopefully we're going to see the price of housing 104 00:05:11,912 --> 00:05:14,548 come down in some places. Because remember when 10 105 00:05:14,615 --> 00:05:17,651 million people came in over the four years of President 106 00:05:17,718 --> 00:05:21,221 Biden that that drove up the cost of housing because 107 00:05:21,288 --> 00:05:25,559 they had to live somewhere. So those things are really 108 00:05:25,626 --> 00:05:28,962 important that that we deal with them. But I'm focused 109 00:05:29,029 --> 00:05:32,432 now on what I can do as governor, and that is 110 00:05:32,499 --> 00:05:35,235 reducing costs for Wisconsinites. 111 00:05:35,302 --> 00:05:37,104 >> One of the issues your campaign has brought up 112 00:05:37,171 --> 00:05:39,206 about David Crawley's record as Milwaukee County 113 00:05:39,273 --> 00:05:42,409 executive has to do with crime, but crime statistics 114 00:05:42,476 --> 00:05:45,712 nationwide and Wisconsin are down. Is Milwaukee 115 00:05:45,779 --> 00:05:47,881 County a much different place than it was when, say, 116 00:05:47,948 --> 00:05:50,050 Scott Walker was county executive? 117 00:05:50,117 --> 00:05:52,319 >> So you look at the last year and a half, violent 118 00:05:52,386 --> 00:05:54,521 crime has went down significantly here in 119 00:05:54,588 --> 00:05:57,224 America. I mean, I think about Washington, DC, 120 00:05:57,291 --> 00:06:00,627 having spent some time out there serving in Congress. 121 00:06:00,694 --> 00:06:04,431 The streets are much safer. And that's because of the 122 00:06:04,498 --> 00:06:06,533 actions that have been taken by the administration 123 00:06:06,600 --> 00:06:09,269 to make sure that they're safe. And to me, it sends a 124 00:06:09,336 --> 00:06:13,373 clear message we've accepted crime here in 125 00:06:13,440 --> 00:06:16,610 America and in Wisconsin over the last few decades, 126 00:06:16,677 --> 00:06:20,013 I believe. And we don't need to accept these high 127 00:06:20,080 --> 00:06:22,516 crime levels as we're seeing them come down now. 128 00:06:22,583 --> 00:06:24,718 And that's what I'll do as governor. We're not going 129 00:06:24,785 --> 00:06:27,554 to accept crime. We're not going to take the side like 130 00:06:27,621 --> 00:06:30,657 David Crowley. My opponent does, of the perpetrators 131 00:06:30,724 --> 00:06:33,760 of crime. We're going to look out for the victims of 132 00:06:33,827 --> 00:06:36,663 crime. Let's make sure that we have safe streets in 133 00:06:36,730 --> 00:06:39,032 Wisconsin. That means prosecutors need to 134 00:06:39,099 --> 00:06:41,902 prosecute. And that means no sanctuary cities. We 135 00:06:41,969 --> 00:06:44,671 need to make sure that Wisconsin is a safe place 136 00:06:44,738 --> 00:06:47,241 for people to live. >> How much responsibility 137 00:06:47,307 --> 00:06:49,576 should the chief executive, either a county or a state, 138 00:06:49,643 --> 00:06:53,413 take when it comes to individual actions 139 00:06:53,480 --> 00:06:56,383 committed by individuals? >> Well, if you listen to 140 00:06:56,450 --> 00:07:00,220 Judge Borowski last week in Milwaukee County, he talked 141 00:07:00,287 --> 00:07:04,224 about how it's preposterous that this happened, that a 142 00:07:04,291 --> 00:07:06,994 violent criminal was able to reach out to his victim 143 00:07:07,060 --> 00:07:11,064 and communicate with him 1500 times via the tablet 144 00:07:11,131 --> 00:07:14,668 he was given by Milwaukee County that was signed off 145 00:07:14,735 --> 00:07:18,839 in 2022 by David Crowley that they get a free tablet. 146 00:07:18,906 --> 00:07:23,744 He renewed that once again in 2025, including after 147 00:07:23,810 --> 00:07:26,780 what we found out in May of this year, that there were 148 00:07:26,847 --> 00:07:30,551 violent criminals reaching out to their victims and 149 00:07:30,617 --> 00:07:33,654 messaging them 1500 times, that should have been the 150 00:07:33,720 --> 00:07:36,390 warning signal to the county executive. We got to 151 00:07:36,456 --> 00:07:38,825 take another look at that. What happens in the 152 00:07:38,892 --> 00:07:41,695 meantime? Now we find out a triple murderer is trying 153 00:07:41,762 --> 00:07:46,633 to intimidate witnesses. So a county executive or the 154 00:07:46,700 --> 00:07:49,102 governor has a great deal to do with safety. And I 155 00:07:49,169 --> 00:07:52,039 think the big thing that the governor can do in 156 00:07:52,105 --> 00:07:54,575 Wisconsin is set the message that we're going to 157 00:07:54,641 --> 00:07:56,844 back up law enforcement. We're going to support them. 158 00:07:56,910 --> 00:07:58,979 We're going to make sure that we have safe streets 159 00:07:59,046 --> 00:08:01,048 here in Wisconsin. >> Would you invite Donald 160 00:08:01,114 --> 00:08:03,050 Trump to campaign in Wisconsin? Do you think you 161 00:08:03,116 --> 00:08:05,686 need him to burst, boost turnout in some of those 162 00:08:05,752 --> 00:08:08,889 areas? going to decide where he's 163 00:08:08,956 --> 00:08:11,825 going to campaign here in 2026. In the balance of the 164 00:08:11,892 --> 00:08:14,127 election, we just go out and do our job every day. 165 00:08:14,194 --> 00:08:16,964 I've got a full schedule that's been set in place. 166 00:08:17,030 --> 00:08:20,033 We're meeting every person that we can in the state of 167 00:08:20,100 --> 00:08:23,337 Wisconsin, and we're talking about the issues 168 00:08:23,403 --> 00:08:26,673 because, I mean, it's much like my opponent. You hear 169 00:08:26,740 --> 00:08:29,142 him talk when he talks about Tom Tiffany. All he 170 00:08:29,209 --> 00:08:33,080 talks about is Tom, Tiffany and Donald Trump. And he's 171 00:08:33,146 --> 00:08:36,650 not talking about what do Wisconsinites want? So he 172 00:08:36,717 --> 00:08:40,187 can rail against Donald Trump? I'm fighting for 173 00:08:40,254 --> 00:08:43,257 Wisconsin, and that's what I will do. As governor. 174 00:08:43,323 --> 00:08:45,959 We're going to make sure we do the things that are best 175 00:08:46,026 --> 00:08:48,128 for the state of Wisconsin. And I've always went about 176 00:08:48,195 --> 00:08:50,931 my business that way, whether I was in the state 177 00:08:50,998 --> 00:08:54,301 legislature or now in Congress. The test is 178 00:08:54,368 --> 00:08:57,671 always what's best for Wisconsin, and that's what 179 00:08:57,738 --> 00:09:00,307 I'm going to do as governor. >> The United States Postal 180 00:09:00,374 --> 00:09:02,943 Service has absentee balloting rules that are 181 00:09:03,010 --> 00:09:05,078 currently in court and looks like they're heading 182 00:09:05,145 --> 00:09:07,281 for the U.S. Supreme Court. Would you support those 183 00:09:07,347 --> 00:09:09,583 changes going in place even as absentee ballots are 184 00:09:09,650 --> 00:09:12,419 already being sent out in Wisconsin? 185 00:09:12,486 --> 00:09:16,123 be up to the courts. It is in the courts at this point, 186 00:09:16,190 --> 00:09:18,192 and they're going to decide what role is going to be 187 00:09:18,258 --> 00:09:21,261 able to be played there. All I know is I have 188 00:09:21,328 --> 00:09:23,864 confidence in clerks across the state of Wisconsin. 189 00:09:23,931 --> 00:09:26,466 There's hundreds of them, and I've worked with them 190 00:09:26,533 --> 00:09:29,036 in northern Wisconsin. Regardless of what rules 191 00:09:29,102 --> 00:09:32,606 are put before them, they always go out and do their 192 00:09:32,673 --> 00:09:36,410 job and I appreciate the work that they do. 193 00:09:36,476 --> 00:09:38,512 >> Do you have complete confidence that our 194 00:09:38,579 --> 00:09:40,848 elections in Wisconsin are free and fair and 195 00:09:40,914 --> 00:09:42,883 legitimate? >> I believe that our 196 00:09:42,950 --> 00:09:46,119 elections are going to be done in that fashion. I 197 00:09:46,186 --> 00:09:48,355 mean, it should be easy to vote, but hard to cheat. 198 00:09:48,422 --> 00:09:51,091 Now, there's been a couple instances. You look at 199 00:09:51,158 --> 00:09:53,327 Madison, they had the city of Madison had to fire 200 00:09:53,393 --> 00:09:56,029 their clerk two years ago because she failed to count 201 00:09:56,096 --> 00:09:58,165 197 ballots. Green Bay has had a problem. Two 202 00:09:58,232 --> 00:10:00,267 elections in a row with their clerk. I mean, we 203 00:10:00,334 --> 00:10:04,204 have to be vigilant also, but I just know the 204 00:10:04,271 --> 00:10:07,207 hundreds of clerks across the state of Wisconsin. 205 00:10:07,274 --> 00:10:10,644 They do the very best job that they can. 206 00:10:10,711 --> 00:10:14,581 >> Congressman Tiffany, >> Good to join you. Zac. 207 00:10:14,648 --> 00:10:16,650 >> Both candidates for governor were interviewed 208 00:10:16,717 --> 00:10:19,987 just before the U.S. Supreme Court blocked the 209 00:10:20,053 --> 00:10:23,123 Trump administration's mail in ballot plan. Here's 210 00:10:23,190 --> 00:10:25,559 Zach's interview with Democratic candidate 211 00:10:25,626 --> 00:10:28,462 Milwaukee County Executive David Crowley. 212 00:10:28,529 --> 00:10:30,364 >> David Crowley, thanks for your time. 213 00:10:30,430 --> 00:10:32,332 >> Thank you for having me. Glad to be here. 214 00:10:32,399 --> 00:10:35,202 >> So immediately after the primary, it seemed like a 215 00:10:35,269 --> 00:10:37,271 lot of the commercials, the attack ads against you were 216 00:10:37,337 --> 00:10:39,806 going to focus on data centers. But recently 217 00:10:39,873 --> 00:10:42,609 there's been a shift to affordability or taxes or 218 00:10:42,676 --> 00:10:44,878 crime. Do you think that's going to be the new 219 00:10:44,945 --> 00:10:47,080 standard line that this campaign is going to be 220 00:10:47,147 --> 00:10:49,383 waged on? >> Affordability? Is the 221 00:10:49,449 --> 00:10:51,451 number one issue that you hear. No matter where 222 00:10:51,518 --> 00:10:53,086 you're going, whether you're talking housing, 223 00:10:53,153 --> 00:10:55,956 whether you're talking childcare, health care, you 224 00:10:56,023 --> 00:10:57,791 name it, families are getting squeezed in every 225 00:10:57,858 --> 00:11:00,661 single direction. And the problem is that even if 226 00:11:00,727 --> 00:11:02,796 they are making more money, they're getting less 227 00:11:02,863 --> 00:11:06,533 because so much is so much more expensive nowadays. 228 00:11:06,600 --> 00:11:09,603 And so our plan is the Badger plan to make sure 229 00:11:09,670 --> 00:11:11,939 that we can lower costs for our working families and 230 00:11:12,005 --> 00:11:14,775 give them better access to childcare and health care, 231 00:11:14,842 --> 00:11:17,144 which is a stark contrast when it comes down to 232 00:11:17,211 --> 00:11:19,780 Congressman Tom Tiffany, who is voted for the 233 00:11:19,847 --> 00:11:22,883 Canadian terrorists that are ravaging communities. 234 00:11:22,950 --> 00:11:25,619 Our farmers and manufacturers all across 235 00:11:25,686 --> 00:11:27,421 Wisconsin. >> So when you see Tom, 236 00:11:27,487 --> 00:11:29,957 Tiffany and his allies going after you. 237 00:11:30,023 --> 00:11:33,126 >> On crime or kids running around at the state fair, 238 00:11:33,193 --> 00:11:35,462 is that just the same old, same old, or what's your 239 00:11:35,529 --> 00:11:37,664 reaction to that? >> Well, I don't trust Tom 240 00:11:37,731 --> 00:11:40,334 Tiffany when it comes down to public safety. I mean, 241 00:11:40,400 --> 00:11:42,703 we're talking about against releasing the 242 00:11:42,769 --> 00:11:45,739 Epstein files, who voted six times to defund police 243 00:11:45,806 --> 00:11:48,942 here in the state of Wisconsin and quite frankly, 244 00:11:49,009 --> 00:11:51,912 he praised the January 6th ers when they were being 245 00:11:51,979 --> 00:11:55,048 pardoned, with some of them actually being charged with 246 00:11:55,115 --> 00:11:57,451 child molestation and things of that nature. You 247 00:11:57,518 --> 00:12:00,354 know, when it comes down to my the way that I govern, 248 00:12:00,420 --> 00:12:02,556 this is about making sure that we're protecting 249 00:12:02,623 --> 00:12:04,825 everybody throughout the state of Wisconsin. And 250 00:12:04,892 --> 00:12:07,394 I've done it as a county executive. We've increased 251 00:12:07,461 --> 00:12:10,764 costs for our public safety, for our courts, and to make 252 00:12:10,831 --> 00:12:12,432 sure we're investing upstream to stop crime from 253 00:12:12,499 --> 00:12:14,401 occurring in the first place. 254 00:12:14,468 --> 00:12:17,004 >> Republicans have made a history of attacking 255 00:12:17,070 --> 00:12:19,606 Milwaukee in elections when it's necessary. It's 256 00:12:19,673 --> 00:12:21,975 interesting to contrast you with the last governor from 257 00:12:22,042 --> 00:12:23,877 Milwaukee County, Scott Walker. How would you 258 00:12:23,944 --> 00:12:26,146 compare and contrast your record with his as county 259 00:12:26,213 --> 00:12:28,482 exec and what you might do as governor? 260 00:12:28,549 --> 00:12:30,717 >> Well, you know, they know me as the recycle man 261 00:12:30,784 --> 00:12:32,819 back home because we've picked up every single 262 00:12:32,886 --> 00:12:35,222 candidate they've kicked down the road for so long. 263 00:12:35,289 --> 00:12:37,758 And quite frankly, I've had to work with the 264 00:12:37,824 --> 00:12:40,127 Republicans and Democrats in the state legislature to, 265 00:12:40,194 --> 00:12:43,330 to clean up Scott Walker's mess. And, you know, I want 266 00:12:43,397 --> 00:12:46,333 to make sure that we can do the exact same thing. When 267 00:12:46,400 --> 00:12:48,402 I become governor of this great state. We're stealing 268 00:12:48,468 --> 00:12:50,771 dignity and respect to our teachers who work in our 269 00:12:50,838 --> 00:12:53,140 public schools each and every single day, making 270 00:12:53,207 --> 00:12:55,742 sure we're investing in childcare to make sure our 271 00:12:55,809 --> 00:12:58,045 children are getting a better foundation of 272 00:12:58,111 --> 00:13:00,881 learning before they enter into our public school 273 00:13:00,948 --> 00:13:03,283 system, and just making sure that we can coalesce, 274 00:13:03,350 --> 00:13:06,053 bring people to the table. When it comes down to the 275 00:13:06,119 --> 00:13:08,655 policies that we need here in the state of Wisconsin. 276 00:13:08,722 --> 00:13:10,657 >> When it comes to the topic of affordability, 277 00:13:10,724 --> 00:13:12,426 there's different definitions of what's 278 00:13:12,492 --> 00:13:15,262 affordability when between Republicans and Democrats, 279 00:13:15,329 --> 00:13:17,264 Republicans like Tom Tiffany want to talk about 280 00:13:17,331 --> 00:13:20,000 property taxes or income taxes. Democrats are 281 00:13:20,067 --> 00:13:23,203 talking more about spending and tariff impacted 282 00:13:23,270 --> 00:13:25,639 consumer pricing. Which do you think voters will 283 00:13:25,706 --> 00:13:28,275 relate to more? >> Look, I'm a husband and 284 00:13:28,342 --> 00:13:30,677 a father raising three amazing girls, and I grew 285 00:13:30,744 --> 00:13:33,213 up in a working class household. So I know 286 00:13:33,280 --> 00:13:35,115 exactly what working families are going through 287 00:13:35,182 --> 00:13:38,051 right now, struggling to keep a roof over their head 288 00:13:38,118 --> 00:13:40,487 because their property taxes or the rents continue 289 00:13:40,554 --> 00:13:43,690 to rise. We've seen many people lose their health 290 00:13:43,757 --> 00:13:46,360 care, mostly because, you know, Congressman Tom 291 00:13:46,426 --> 00:13:49,463 Tiffany voted for the big ugly bill, which cut $1 292 00:13:49,530 --> 00:13:52,165 trillion from Medicaid, Medicare and reduced 293 00:13:52,232 --> 00:13:54,234 subsidies for the Affordable Care Act. 294 00:13:54,301 --> 00:13:56,603 >> In January of this year. Tom Tiffany stood in front 295 00:13:56,670 --> 00:14:00,741 of a gas station and had a tweet about how low gas 296 00:14:00,807 --> 00:14:03,844 prices were. How does that tweet hold up today and how 297 00:14:03,911 --> 00:14:06,313 does that impact this race? >> Well, I think that that 298 00:14:06,380 --> 00:14:08,949 that treat didn't get didn't age very well 299 00:14:09,016 --> 00:14:11,351 because we are now seeing some of the largest 300 00:14:11,418 --> 00:14:15,088 increases in, in gas today. And that's why I have a 301 00:14:15,155 --> 00:14:18,192 plan to actually eliminate the minimum markup law that 302 00:14:18,258 --> 00:14:22,029 we have on gas, which is increasing the prices for 303 00:14:22,095 --> 00:14:24,131 consumers each and every single day. And the thing 304 00:14:24,198 --> 00:14:27,201 about this, this gas tax is that it's not supporting, 305 00:14:27,267 --> 00:14:29,770 you know, our small businesses or filling the 306 00:14:29,837 --> 00:14:32,339 potholes. This is just guaranteed profit for big 307 00:14:32,406 --> 00:14:35,242 oil. And I know it's a popular thing because even 308 00:14:35,309 --> 00:14:37,778 Congressman Tom Tiffany stole my idea. And this is 309 00:14:37,845 --> 00:14:40,214 leading people to think that it is his look. At the 310 00:14:40,280 --> 00:14:43,283 end of the day, we have to make sure that we're 311 00:14:43,350 --> 00:14:45,519 lowering our costs. And if Tom Tiffany wants to stand 312 00:14:45,586 --> 00:14:48,355 up, he needs to stand up to Donald Trump again. This is 313 00:14:48,422 --> 00:14:51,225 largely a result due to the war in Iran. And Tom 314 00:14:51,291 --> 00:14:53,694 Tiffany has voted to protect this war, protect 315 00:14:53,760 --> 00:14:56,330 those terrorists, and we need him to to act. We need 316 00:14:56,396 --> 00:14:59,099 him to answer as to why he isn't fighting for 317 00:14:59,166 --> 00:15:01,101 Wisconsinites. >> One of the attacks that 318 00:15:01,168 --> 00:15:03,637 Tiffany campaign is using now has to do with tablets 319 00:15:03,704 --> 00:15:06,106 being given to inmates in Milwaukee County. Explain 320 00:15:06,173 --> 00:15:11,178 that program and why you authorized its use again. 321 00:15:11,245 --> 00:15:13,547 >> Well, this is a program that we implemented not too 322 00:15:13,614 --> 00:15:16,149 long ago, and this is something that we take 323 00:15:16,216 --> 00:15:18,118 seriously. And we've been working with our sheriff's 324 00:15:18,185 --> 00:15:20,521 department as well. But, you know, utilizing these 325 00:15:20,587 --> 00:15:23,056 tablets is actually a best practice. They're used in 326 00:15:23,123 --> 00:15:26,193 48 out of 50 states. And you know what's unfortunate 327 00:15:26,260 --> 00:15:28,428 and what Tom Tiffany omitted is that the fact 328 00:15:28,495 --> 00:15:32,833 that he actually voted for these types of iPads here 329 00:15:32,900 --> 00:15:34,935 in the Department of Correction during the Scott 330 00:15:35,002 --> 00:15:36,703 Walker era. He also admitted about the fact 331 00:15:36,770 --> 00:15:39,173 that Donald Trump and his administration are 332 00:15:39,239 --> 00:15:42,276 utilizing this same exact program. And they just 333 00:15:42,342 --> 00:15:45,512 started it this year. Right. And so we know that we need 334 00:15:45,579 --> 00:15:48,282 to have the processes and the procedures in place. 335 00:15:48,348 --> 00:15:50,651 But, you know, Congressman Tom Tiffany, he wants to 336 00:15:50,717 --> 00:15:53,053 continue to divide and distract when it comes down 337 00:15:53,120 --> 00:15:55,822 to public safety. You can't trust them on it because he 338 00:15:55,889 --> 00:15:58,125 he's not willing to give you all the information. 339 00:15:58,192 --> 00:16:00,127 >> We're still waiting to hear what the U.S. Supreme 340 00:16:00,194 --> 00:16:02,896 Court will do with the Postal Service rules that 341 00:16:02,963 --> 00:16:04,932 have been proposed by the Trump administration. But 342 00:16:04,998 --> 00:16:07,634 what impact would that have on Wisconsin if those went 343 00:16:07,701 --> 00:16:11,205 through? And what advice would you give to absentee 344 00:16:11,271 --> 00:16:13,006 voters about how they should handle their ballot 345 00:16:13,073 --> 00:16:15,375 this fall? >> Look, it is unfortunate 346 00:16:15,442 --> 00:16:17,811 seeing what Donald Trump is doing when it comes down to 347 00:16:17,878 --> 00:16:20,547 to mail in voting here in the state of Wisconsin, we 348 00:16:20,614 --> 00:16:23,483 have had the same laws on the books for decades, 349 00:16:23,550 --> 00:16:26,453 which have allowed people to cast their ballot by 350 00:16:26,520 --> 00:16:29,056 mail or to do it in person, and we're going to continue 351 00:16:29,122 --> 00:16:32,059 to follow Wisconsin laws. But I want to encourage 352 00:16:32,125 --> 00:16:34,728 everybody. 1 if you're going to mail in your 353 00:16:34,795 --> 00:16:37,664 ballot, do it early, do it quickly, and do it as soon 354 00:16:37,731 --> 00:16:39,867 as possible. And if you feel like you're getting 355 00:16:39,933 --> 00:16:42,035 close to that deadline, go visit your municipal clerk 356 00:16:42,102 --> 00:16:45,906 and drop that. Drop your ballot off at your at your 357 00:16:45,973 --> 00:16:48,842 clerk to make sure that your voice is being heard. 358 00:16:48,909 --> 00:16:52,145 And as the governor, it is our job to make sure that 359 00:16:52,212 --> 00:16:55,182 we are protecting democracy, protecting people's ability 360 00:16:55,249 --> 00:16:59,119 to cast their ballot and to, to, to instill dignity. 361 00:16:59,186 --> 00:17:02,689 Right? We have free and fair elections here in the 362 00:17:02,756 --> 00:17:05,292 state of Wisconsin, and I'm always going to sing and 363 00:17:05,359 --> 00:17:07,861 yell at the mountaintops about how I believe in our 364 00:17:07,928 --> 00:17:10,063 election system, but you're not going to get that with 365 00:17:10,130 --> 00:17:12,399 Congressman Tom Tiffany. I mean, we're talking about 366 00:17:12,466 --> 00:17:15,435 someone who voted against certifying the 2020 367 00:17:15,502 --> 00:17:18,272 election for Wisconsin voters, someone who's not 368 00:17:18,338 --> 00:17:21,308 willing to stand up and say Donald Trump actually lost 369 00:17:21,375 --> 00:17:24,711 the 2020 election, and he's not willing to stand up and 370 00:17:24,778 --> 00:17:27,915 say how these laws, these policies that Donald Trump 371 00:17:27,981 --> 00:17:30,350 is putting, putting in place, how they're going to 372 00:17:30,417 --> 00:17:33,020 hurt many of our rural communities. And quite 373 00:17:33,086 --> 00:17:35,122 frankly, they're going to hurt not just Democrats, 374 00:17:35,189 --> 00:17:37,524 Republicans, independents everywhere across this 375 00:17:37,591 --> 00:17:41,695 state, but our administration. We're going 376 00:17:41,762 --> 00:17:44,398 behalf of our communities to make sure that they can 377 00:17:44,464 --> 00:17:46,500 cast their ballot, no matter where they are in 378 00:17:46,567 --> 00:17:49,837 Wisconsin. Tom Tiffany, he did not 379 00:17:49,903 --> 00:17:52,139 want to say the word Trump. And throughout our entire 380 00:17:52,206 --> 00:17:54,808 interview, when asked about that, he didn't want to use 381 00:17:54,875 --> 00:17:56,810 the president's name. We've looked at his website. He 382 00:17:56,877 --> 00:17:58,946 stripped pretty much all mentions of the president 383 00:17:59,012 --> 00:18:01,582 away from him. What does that say? Why? Why would he 384 00:18:01,648 --> 00:18:03,884 be doing that? >> I think he wants to run 385 00:18:03,951 --> 00:18:05,886 away. You know, you know, Congressman Tom Tiffany, 386 00:18:05,953 --> 00:18:07,955 he's been the Maga extremist and wants to run 387 00:18:08,021 --> 00:18:11,191 away from the fact that he has been lockstep with 388 00:18:11,258 --> 00:18:14,127 Trump for the past decade. He has been one of the most 389 00:18:14,194 --> 00:18:16,363 conservative members that we've had here in the state 390 00:18:16,430 --> 00:18:19,099 of Wisconsin, being a part of the Freedom Caucus, but 391 00:18:19,166 --> 00:18:22,269 also not fighting on behalf of Wisconsinites. 392 00:18:22,336 --> 00:18:25,272 Congressman Tom Tiffany cannot and will not defend 393 00:18:25,339 --> 00:18:28,775 his own actions nor defend why he's protected this 394 00:18:28,842 --> 00:18:30,944 president. And that's why we need a governor who's 395 00:18:31,011 --> 00:18:33,647 going to stand up, someone who's going to bring folks 396 00:18:33,714 --> 00:18:36,717 from all political factions to the table to make sure 397 00:18:36,783 --> 00:18:39,786 that they can live healthy lives, productive lives, 398 00:18:39,853 --> 00:18:42,923 and put more money and save more money in their pockets 399 00:18:42,990 --> 00:18:45,392 as we move forward. And that's what you're going to 400 00:18:45,459 --> 00:18:47,294 get in the next governor. When I'm elected on 401 00:18:47,361 --> 00:18:50,264 November 3rd. thanks for your time. 402 00:18:50,330 --> 00:18:52,666 >> Thank you. Thank you for having me. 403 00:18:52,733 --> 00:18:56,136 >> Filling up the gas tank in your car is increasingly 404 00:18:56,203 --> 00:18:59,373 costly, but if you drive a truck, diesel fuel prices 405 00:18:59,439 --> 00:19:03,043 have spiked sharply due to supply disruptions because 406 00:19:03,110 --> 00:19:07,614 of the war in Iran, and are now at a record high above 407 00:19:07,681 --> 00:19:11,318 $6 a gallon for all. The semis crisscrossing the 408 00:19:11,385 --> 00:19:14,221 state, carrying the goods and products we consume, 409 00:19:14,288 --> 00:19:17,991 sell and supply. The cost of diesel is a blow to 410 00:19:18,058 --> 00:19:21,728 transport companies and likely to show up 411 00:19:21,795 --> 00:19:24,498 downstream in the cost of things. We're joined now by 412 00:19:24,565 --> 00:19:27,568 Dan Johnson, president of the Wisconsin Motor 413 00:19:27,634 --> 00:19:29,536 Carriers Association, and thanks very much for being 414 00:19:29,603 --> 00:19:31,738 here. >> Thank you for having me. 415 00:19:31,805 --> 00:19:34,408 >> So what kind of a shock are these diesel prices 416 00:19:34,474 --> 00:19:36,844 right now? like anybody else, we're 417 00:19:36,910 --> 00:19:39,713 seeing the spike and it is a great concern to the 418 00:19:39,780 --> 00:19:42,382 trucking industry. It's not that we haven't been 419 00:19:42,449 --> 00:19:44,484 through this before, but this is clearly the highest 420 00:19:44,551 --> 00:19:47,654 that it's been in record. So it's something that our 421 00:19:47,721 --> 00:19:51,258 trucking companies, they're dealing with, they have to 422 00:19:51,325 --> 00:19:54,094 absorb those costs in some fashion. They're trying to 423 00:19:54,161 --> 00:19:56,463 mitigate as best as they possibly can. But yeah, it 424 00:19:56,530 --> 00:19:58,699 is a cause for concern right now with those 425 00:19:58,765 --> 00:20:00,767 trucking companies. >> What concerns do you 426 00:20:00,834 --> 00:20:03,904 have that those prices will just keep breaking records? 427 00:20:03,971 --> 00:20:06,306 >> Well, everybody has that concern. I mean, we like to 428 00:20:06,373 --> 00:20:09,943 see things level off and hopefully dial back quite a 429 00:20:10,010 --> 00:20:12,813 bit. But you know, who knows. I mean they just 430 00:20:12,880 --> 00:20:15,382 have to plan and prepare. One thing with the trucking 431 00:20:15,449 --> 00:20:18,585 industry is they're very resilient. We've seen price 432 00:20:18,652 --> 00:20:22,155 spikes like this before back in 2022, when it got 433 00:20:22,222 --> 00:20:27,628 near $6 per gallon for for diesel, they adjusted. They 434 00:20:27,694 --> 00:20:29,696 overcame. Some of them did have to step out of the 435 00:20:29,763 --> 00:20:31,598 industry because they couldn't handle the 436 00:20:31,665 --> 00:20:34,067 expenses. And then there was a shift within the 437 00:20:34,134 --> 00:20:36,970 trucking industry, and the prices came back down. But 438 00:20:37,037 --> 00:20:40,274 now we're we're back to another unfortunate record 439 00:20:40,340 --> 00:20:43,110 high. And they're dealing with it as best as they can 440 00:20:43,177 --> 00:20:45,245 right now. >> Just for a sense of 441 00:20:45,312 --> 00:20:48,515 understanding. What does it cost now to fill up the 442 00:20:48,582 --> 00:20:51,385 tanks on a on a truck like this? 443 00:20:52,252 --> 00:20:55,689 they did a study. The average cost per mile for a 444 00:20:55,756 --> 00:20:58,325 truck. And we're talking about also the fuel and the 445 00:20:58,392 --> 00:21:02,529 other expenses. It's about $2.32 per mile that it 446 00:21:02,596 --> 00:21:05,365 costs them to, to run a truck down the road. So 447 00:21:05,432 --> 00:21:09,369 anytime you add that when you add another dollar to 448 00:21:09,436 --> 00:21:12,206 diesel prices, that's going to add another $0.14 per 449 00:21:12,272 --> 00:21:15,475 mile to that, to that truck cost. So you expand that 450 00:21:15,542 --> 00:21:18,612 out over thousands of miles. And we're talking about 451 00:21:18,679 --> 00:21:20,647 hundreds of thousands of dollars that it's going to 452 00:21:20,714 --> 00:21:23,584 cost per truck to run them either in the state or 453 00:21:23,650 --> 00:21:26,019 across the country. >> So who bears the cost at 454 00:21:26,086 --> 00:21:28,355 the start? >> Well, the trucking 455 00:21:28,422 --> 00:21:32,059 company does they bear that cost. Now, they do have 456 00:21:32,125 --> 00:21:35,596 some some agreements in place, perhaps with their 457 00:21:35,662 --> 00:21:38,498 fuel distributors for discounts. But our smaller 458 00:21:38,565 --> 00:21:41,368 fleets and the private carriers are probably at a 459 00:21:41,435 --> 00:21:44,338 disadvantage because they to do that. And they're 460 00:21:44,404 --> 00:21:47,207 probably going to be paying the retail cost for diesel 461 00:21:47,274 --> 00:21:49,843 prices. >> How might we see the 462 00:21:49,910 --> 00:21:53,547 downstream costs be affecting everything? 463 00:21:53,614 --> 00:21:56,483 >> There's certainly the potential for consumers to 464 00:21:56,550 --> 00:22:00,153 see increased costs for groceries and other items, 465 00:22:00,220 --> 00:22:03,824 other necessities that they need. But, you know, it's 466 00:22:03,891 --> 00:22:06,193 going to be up to the trucking company, the 467 00:22:06,260 --> 00:22:08,829 wholesaler, the distributor and the retailer to make 468 00:22:08,896 --> 00:22:11,565 decisions of their own, how much they potentially pass 469 00:22:11,632 --> 00:22:14,134 along to the consumer. >> So I read on your 470 00:22:14,201 --> 00:22:18,005 website that 95% of manufactured tonnage is 471 00:22:18,071 --> 00:22:20,974 transported by trucks in Wisconsin. Are some 472 00:22:21,041 --> 00:22:24,144 customers pulling back on orders or production 473 00:22:24,211 --> 00:22:26,813 because of the cost? >> Now, it's very possible. 474 00:22:26,880 --> 00:22:30,217 We haven't really seen any kind of hard data right now. 475 00:22:30,284 --> 00:22:33,053 The economy is moving at a pretty good pace. So 476 00:22:33,120 --> 00:22:35,889 there's a lot of things that are that have already 477 00:22:35,956 --> 00:22:40,294 been set in motion. As I mentioned previously, you 478 00:22:40,360 --> 00:22:42,262 know, the trucking companies, they don't have 479 00:22:42,329 --> 00:22:45,866 the opportunity to stop. They have to keep moving 480 00:22:45,933 --> 00:22:48,035 the freight. They have to keep moving the product to 481 00:22:48,101 --> 00:22:50,804 market. So if there are orders in, they have to 482 00:22:50,871 --> 00:22:53,674 keep moving that along the supply chain and get it to 483 00:22:53,740 --> 00:22:56,743 its final destination. about this right now, the 484 00:22:56,810 --> 00:23:00,280 cost of gasoline and the cost of of diesel, how does 485 00:23:00,347 --> 00:23:03,417 it kind of highlight the work that members of your 486 00:23:03,483 --> 00:23:06,019 association do every day? And we might take for 487 00:23:06,086 --> 00:23:07,788 granted? >> Well, absolutely. We 488 00:23:07,855 --> 00:23:10,924 have 3.5 million drivers out there crisscrossing the 489 00:23:10,991 --> 00:23:12,426 nation, and they're bringing us everything. 490 00:23:12,492 --> 00:23:14,595 Everything that you own, everything that you have at 491 00:23:14,661 --> 00:23:17,164 one point in time was delivered by a truck, and 492 00:23:17,231 --> 00:23:20,200 there's a man or a woman behind that wheel who is 493 00:23:20,267 --> 00:23:23,637 delivering those items from the producer to market. Or 494 00:23:23,704 --> 00:23:25,706 here in Wisconsin, we're a big agriculture community. 495 00:23:25,772 --> 00:23:29,510 From the farmer to the consumer. And what they do 496 00:23:29,576 --> 00:23:32,513 every single day in all sorts of conditions, 497 00:23:32,579 --> 00:23:35,382 whether it's weather, bad traffic, distracted drivers, 498 00:23:35,449 --> 00:23:37,618 construction zones, everything that they have 499 00:23:37,684 --> 00:23:40,220 to deal with every single day puts more pressure on 500 00:23:40,287 --> 00:23:42,923 the work that they do. And we absolutely do take it 501 00:23:42,990 --> 00:23:45,826 for granted. Unfortunately. And people really should 502 00:23:45,893 --> 00:23:47,828 take time to appreciate what truck drivers are 503 00:23:47,895 --> 00:23:50,230 doing out there to keep the economy moving, even in 504 00:23:50,297 --> 00:23:52,299 light of rising diesel prices. 505 00:23:52,366 --> 00:23:54,334 >> All right, Dan Johnson, thanks very much. 506 00:23:54,401 --> 00:23:57,037 >> Thank you so much. Appreciate it. 507 00:23:57,104 --> 00:24:00,007 >> In other news, the Wisconsin Supreme Court 508 00:24:00,073 --> 00:24:03,911 heard arguments this week on two high profile cases 509 00:24:03,977 --> 00:24:07,714 seeking new congressional voting maps in Wisconsin 510 00:24:07,781 --> 00:24:11,084 before the 2028 elections. The court is considering 511 00:24:11,151 --> 00:24:14,755 whether to allow the cases to proceed after lower 512 00:24:14,821 --> 00:24:18,659 court panels dismissed them this summer on procedural 513 00:24:18,725 --> 00:24:22,062 grounds. Both lawsuits claim gerrymandering of the 514 00:24:22,129 --> 00:24:24,498 districts opposing attorneys represent 515 00:24:24,565 --> 00:24:26,967 Republican congressional members and the legislature, 516 00:24:27,034 --> 00:24:29,837 which passed the maps in 2011. 517 00:24:31,038 --> 00:24:35,542 >> The legislature that PAP that passed those original 518 00:24:35,609 --> 00:24:39,746 maps wasn't any old legislature, right. The 519 00:24:41,114 --> 00:24:44,218 legislature that passed that maps. They came from 520 00:24:44,284 --> 00:24:49,289 districts that many people claimed are the were the 521 00:24:49,356 --> 00:24:53,861 most gerrymandered in the entire country. They were, 522 00:24:53,927 --> 00:24:57,164 as some say, a prime example of representatives 523 00:24:57,231 --> 00:24:59,900 choosing their voters rather than the other way 524 00:24:59,967 --> 00:25:02,736 around, rather than voters choosing their 525 00:25:02,803 --> 00:25:06,039 representatives. And if I'm understanding your argument 526 00:25:06,106 --> 00:25:08,775 that under these change, which you're ardently 527 00:25:08,842 --> 00:25:13,680 defending, those maps, the baked in ones from the 2011 528 00:25:13,747 --> 00:25:18,519 legislature would go forward into perpetuity 529 00:25:18,585 --> 00:25:22,322 indefinitely. And I don't understand how that is not 530 00:25:22,389 --> 00:25:24,024 unconstitutional. >> Whether we agree with it 531 00:25:24,091 --> 00:25:27,661 or not, the US Constitution assigns redistricting 532 00:25:27,728 --> 00:25:31,098 authority to the legislature because 250 533 00:25:31,164 --> 00:25:35,068 years ago, when we declared revolution, we said the 534 00:25:35,135 --> 00:25:37,571 people decide through their elected representatives. 535 00:25:37,638 --> 00:25:40,741 And there are two solutions for that, either of which 536 00:25:40,807 --> 00:25:43,810 plaintiffs could pursue. First, they could lobby 537 00:25:43,877 --> 00:25:46,947 Congress because, of course, Congress likewise has power 538 00:25:47,014 --> 00:25:50,484 under the elections clause to stop what some have said 539 00:25:50,551 --> 00:25:54,955 should not have happened in 2011, or, like Florida, 540 00:25:55,022 --> 00:25:58,225 like New York, like Ohio. Plaintiffs could do the 541 00:25:58,292 --> 00:26:01,295 hard work of, of, of creating a constitutional 542 00:26:01,361 --> 00:26:03,864 amendment and saying any politics and redistricting 543 00:26:03,931 --> 00:26:07,234 is forbidden. >> For more on this and 544 00:26:07,301 --> 00:26:10,037 other issues facing Wisconsin, visit our 545 00:26:10,103 --> 00:26:13,106 website at pbs wisconsin.org and then 546 00:26:13,173 --> 00:26:15,943 click on the news tab. That's our program for 547 00:26:16,009 --> 00:26:18,345 tonight. I'm Frederica Freyberg. Have a good 548 00:26:18,412 --> 00:26:20,080 weekend. [MUSIC] 549 00:26:31,158 --> 00:26:35,829 >> Funding for "Here& Now" is provided by the Focus 550 00:26:44,938 --> 00:26:49,610 Fund for Journalism and friends of PBS Wisconsin.