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reason for those decisions.
>> All right, Congressman

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Grothman, thanks for your
time today.

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>> Thank you very much.
>> For the opposing

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viewpoint. We are now
joined by Democratic

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Congressman Mark Pocan.
Thanks for being here.

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>> Yeah, thanks for having
me.

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encourage Senate Democrats
this continuing resolution?

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>> I think we need to make
sure that people understand

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what's at stake, and I
think people will by

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November 1st, you have to
will have the rate

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increases for the
Affordable Care Act for

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almost everyone's group
plans. And I think that

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will show what we've been
talking about all along,

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which is 15 million people
are going to ultimately

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lose their health insurance
because of the big ugly law.

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And right now, I had an
employer told me just a

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couple of weeks ago that
their new increase for next

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year insurance is 41%, and
that's because of the

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uncompensated care created
by the Affordable Care Act.

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So I think they just need
to make sure that

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Republicans I know are
getting the calls like we

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are when it comes to this,
and it's going to only

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intensify by November 1st
rates. So, you know, I

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would just say, hold tight,
federal workers who are

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really being heroes in all
this right now, going

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without paychecks,
is about. But we've got to

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make sure that people don't
lose one of the most

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important economic, you
know, legs to a stool that

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they have.
>> So the Trump

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administration doesn't seem
to mind the shutdown.

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They're trying to lay off
thousands of federal

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employees. Trump's building
his white House ballroom

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right now, not worried
about any fiscal situation.

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What is their incentive to
negotiate even after

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November 1st?
think we're going to be

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about two and a half weeks
out from the original seven

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weeks they had. Anyway,
we've kind of got to get

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together and do something
because the time will have

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run out for even their
original kind of arbitrary

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deadline they did without
negotiating to begin with,

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with us. So I think that's
what's going to happen. But,

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you know, as you pointed
out, I mean, Donald Trump,

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you know, he's using this
as an excuse to fire people,

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but he's already fired
200,000 people either

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firings since he's been
president, which he doesn't

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have the authority. There's
been all kinds of lawsuits,

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but this has already been
happening. That's part of

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the problem. If you can't
actually have an agreement

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like we used to in Congress,
and that somehow the

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executive branch is going
to steal the funds that

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we've agreed to in a
bipartisan way, then you

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don't really have an
unfortunately the place

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you know, this is really
right now about protecting

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people's health care. And
by the way, all of us are

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going to pay more for
health care because of that

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law, because of that
uncompensated care. And it

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will help everyone in
having this fight.

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>> So how long can the
government function in

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shutdown mode? At what
point do things just they

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don't they can't function
at all. And they shut down.

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>> Yeah. Places like
Wisconsin. You feel it less,

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right? I think I was doing
a town hall in Derrick Van

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Orden district last week
and I asked about 50 people.

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I said, who's feeling the
impact directly? And one

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person raised their hand
out of 50 people. But

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that's because we're in
Wisconsin. But, you know,

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if you're trying to get
Ahold of Social Security,

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you want to go to a
national park. But now if

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you're eligible for Snap
benefits, right, you're

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going to start feeling it.
So you're going to see more

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of those things now happen.
I just think by the time

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next week I'm going to go
back to Washington, even if

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the House Republicans
aren't, I'm going to show

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up because that's my job to
be there. But at the same

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time, we're going to be at
two and a half weeks out

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from their artificial
deadline anyway, right? So

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at some point we have to
quit holding our breath. If

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you're the House
Republicans, show up in

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Washington and let's
this, let's negotiate the

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farm bill that's two years
overdue. Let's do the Older

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Americans Act
overdue. But let's do

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something. Just simply
taking another week of paid

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vacation doesn't solve
anything.

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House Republicans and
Speaker Mike Johnson

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newly elected Democrat from
Arizona. Do you think that

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is related to this
discharge petition over the

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Epstein files, or is it
simply they're just not in

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session? There's no need to
come back because there's

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the government shutdown.
things. I think they think

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this is leverage to try to
bring us back, to reopen

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the government without
fixing health care. I think

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some of it is about is the
218th signature in Donald

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Trump, for, for whatever
reason, now doesn't want

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the release of the Epstein
files after campaigning on

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releasing them, but I don't.
I've learned I can't

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predict Republicans anymore.
Right? I mean, it's been so,

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you know, the fact that you
just don't even try to come

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to Washington to do your
job to negotiate, whether

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it be the shutdown, health
care, farm bill, anything,

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you just think you don't
have to show up. That's a

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weird dynamic that, you
know, I've been doing this

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for a long time in local,
state and federal

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don't know if I understand
their messaging. I'm not

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sure they do because they
keep changing your

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messaging. We're very clear.
We're fighting for the

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affordability of health
care so that people don't

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lose their health insurance,
and we all don't pay more

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for it. And I think that's
a fight people understand.

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>> So the midterms are
still a year away.

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Historically, there's
little evidence that

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government shutdowns this
far out from an election

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impact the election. Do you
think this time could be

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different?
>> I really don't know

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where this is going to end.
Right. Are they going to

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continue it? And because
again, Donald Trump kind of

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likes parts of this, as you
said. I mean, he's already

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been acting unilaterally.
And unfortunately, the

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Republican majorities in
the House and the Senate

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have allowed him to do that.
Article one of the

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00:05:06,073 --> 00:05:08,141
Constitution gives us the
power of the purse, but

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he's stealing funds that
we've approved. The

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Constitution gives the
Congress only emergency

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but he's getting away with
it. So this is anything but

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normal times, I think. You
know, when you watch the

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East wing of the Capitol
being demolished right now,

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00:05:23,223 --> 00:05:26,059
see what he's doing to
democracy. Right. He's

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literally demolishing the
institutions that we

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00:05:28,495 --> 00:05:32,065
understand fundamentally.
many people last weekend at

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the no rally, 7 million
people speaking out. I just

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think these are times that
are hard for anyone to give

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00:05:38,238 --> 00:05:40,107
you honest predictions.
>> So finally, the consumer

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price index came out today.
It's at 3%. It's an

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increase year over year.
It's tariffs right.

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>> Trump's tariff taxes are
absolutely affecting us.

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We're all paying for that
We're all paying for that