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The following program is a
PBS Wisconsin original

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production.
>> Wisconsin Governor Tony

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Evers here.
incumbent calls it quits for

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the next round, leaving a
long list of governor

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wannabes on both sides.
While in Washington, summer

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recess starts early.
[MUSIC]

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I'm Frederica Freyberg.
Tonight on "Here& Now", a

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wide open race for Wisconsin
governor. Republican U.S.

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Representative Bryan Steil
on federal budgets. We

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continue our series
uncovered, looking at

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pharmacy decline and an old
bridge in western Wisconsin

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will soon be closed and
replaced. How many other

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bridges in the state need
work? It's "Here& Now" for

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July 25th.
>> Funding for "Here& Now"

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is provided by the Focus
Fund for Journalism and

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Friends of PBS Wisconsin.
>> Big news in state

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politics. Wisconsin Governor
Tony Evers announced this

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week he will not run for
reelection to a third term.

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His announcement means
Wisconsin will see the first

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open race for governor in 16
years. A crowded field of

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Democrats are expected to
vie in a primary next

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August. Likewise, several
Republicans have either

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declared or expressed
interest in running for

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governor. The election is
November 3rd, 2026. Head

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spinning feints and fights
in Washington this week, and

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the Republican House speaker
cut short the legislative

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session as some
congressional members

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demanded votes on releasing
the Jeffrey Epstein files.

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Our next guest was among
those who got an early

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recess Wisconsin first
Representative Bryan Steil

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joins us. And thanks very
much for being here.

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>> Thanks for having me on.
>> So first off, what is

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your reaction to Toni? Evers
not running for a third term?

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>> I think what you're going
to see is a large number of

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Democrats get in the race
and run to the left, but

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what we have to do is get
our state back on track, not

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measuring things like
education by just how much

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money we're spending, but on
how well we're doing,

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whether or not students are
being taught how to learn,

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not what to know, whether or
not we're getting the

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spending. And in Wisconsin,
under control and money back

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to hard paying taxpayers, I
think you're gonna have a

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robust debate. I think at
the end of the day, we have

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a great opportunity to have
a conservative governor once

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again.
candidate at this point?

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>> No, I'm not running. I'm
going to be running for

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reelection to the House of
Representatives. We'll watch

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the Republican field play
out. But I think we have a

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large number of great,
strong candidates who will

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in one of them will
ultimately be successful.

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session was cut short, as we
said by the speaker,

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attributed to what the Wall
Street Journal called,

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quote, furor over
disclosures from the Epstein

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investigation. What's your
reaction to the distraction

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that the whole Jeffrey
Epstein file is causing.

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>> The broader media
landscape loves to talk

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about Epstein. They don't
want to talk about the

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president's success of
securing the border, about

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the positive impacts of the
tax package that was just

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passed. I think it's a lot
to do about nothing. I think

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I lean on the side of more.
Disclosure is always a good

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thing. The sunlight is the
best disinfectant. And I

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think actually we should
just move forward with this,

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disclose what's legally
permissible. It's obviously

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under a court seal. It's not
under the direct control of

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Congress. And then get
really back and try to draw

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the attention of the media,
who loves to be distracted

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by this. Back to the most
important issues of the day.

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>> Now, a new Marquette Law
School national poll shows

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that 41% of respondents
support the reconciliation

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bill that President Trump
signed into law, while 59%

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oppose it. Of course, with
sharp, partisan divides, why

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did you vote in favor?
>> Look at the underlying

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provisions inside the bill.
Let's talk about what we got

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done. Almost every single
thing is not popular. Once

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the American people
understand what's in the

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bill. This is about doubling
down and making sure that

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the border is secure. Wildly
popular. The president's

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moves to do that and then
building to make sure that's

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permanent a good thing.
Investing in the military at

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a period of time of
dangerous global

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instability, making sure the
2017 tax cuts are permanent,

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to build on the economic
growth that we saw leading

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into the pandemic, and then
doubling down on that, in

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particular for seniors,
those working overtime or

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those who are earning tips.
And then finally getting

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spending under control. And
this is where the

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demagoguery has been
probably the most

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challenging. Putting in
place work requirements for

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able bodied, childless
adults is an 8020 issue in

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the state of Wisconsin, as
indicated by the not so long

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ago referendum. That's what
this bill does. It actually

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secures the program for
those it was designed for

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permanently disabled adults,
children, pregnant women.

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And it simply says if you're
an able bodied, childless

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we're asking you to be
looking for work,

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volunteering or working a
minimum of 20 hours a week.

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And so the provisions of the
bill, as American people

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learn more and more about
them, I think will only

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become more popular because
to get this country back on

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track.
>> So the Congressional

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Budget Office did estimate
that this law will cut

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federal spending on Medicaid
and Chip benefits by $1

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trillion, due in part, the
CBO says, to at least 10.5

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million being eliminated
from the program.

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>> But let's dive into those
numbers, right, because the

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numbers to try to scare
people in the state of

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Wisconsin. Wisconsin has had
work requirements for many

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of our welfare programs, in
particular Snap benefits

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since the 1990s, when
Governor Tommy Thompson put

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them in place in Medicaid.
We don't have the exact work

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requirements that the
federal government has or

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that this law passes. What
this law does is simply say,

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if you're an able bodied,
childless adult, we want you

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to be looking for work,
going to school,

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volunteering, or working 20
hours a week. This is an 80

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over 20 common sense issue.
If you say if you dig

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further into that, who is
the CBO examining the

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positive view that as those
people find themselves, find

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themselves with an
opportunity to get a job, to

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volunteer, that we won't see
folks losing their, their

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their health benefits, what
we'll see is people getting

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into a good or a better
paying job with the ultimate

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goal of many of these able
bodied, childless adults

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getting into the workforce
and receiving their health

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care from from their
employer. Like many

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hardworking, hardworking
families in the state of

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Wisconsin do.
>> What about changes to the

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Affordable Care Act that I
understand, and according to

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Congresswoman Moore, will
raise premiums and also

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impose other restrictions,
restrictions potentially

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causing people to lose their
coverage.

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>> Give me give me the
details on that. I think

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what what you're taking
there is national analysis

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on the state of Wisconsin
that doesn't apply.

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Wisconsin didn't expand
Medicaid. And so some of the

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reforms are made in other
states apply differently.

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dangerous about the
demagoguery that some

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individuals want to engage
in. They want to take a

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national narrative and apply
it to Wisconsin. Wisconsin,

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I think very thoughtfully,
did not expand Medicaid

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further into the able
bodied, childless working

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age population. And so,
again, of the 1.2 million

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individuals in the state of
Wisconsin who currently are

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on Medicaid, Tony Evers
appointee noted that there's

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about 163,000 of them that
are that are of the

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demographic that we should
look at, able bodied,

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childless adults. Well over
half of those are already

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already working 20 hours a
week, going to school,

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volunteering, 63,000 are not
or are not documenting it.

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And so this is about making
sure that we're

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strengthening the program
for those that it's designed

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for no changes. And in fact,
in my opinion, strengthening

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Wisconsin after the passage
of the state budget will

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actually receive about $1
billion a year more in

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federal money. We have a
whole debate about that, but

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more money is coming in. And
so the left is trying really

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hard to demagogue on this
issue. As the facts got out,

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you saw a quick pivot into
Epstein, which was the lead

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question of your interview.
So what we need to do is to

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dive in, get the information
out to the American people

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about how we're
strengthening the program.

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And I think as the American
people learn more and more

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about this, it's only going
to be more popular. Again,

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the work requirements in the
state of Wisconsin had a

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referendum 8020, popular.
>> As to the recent

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Rescissions package that
stripped appropriation

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funding from USAID and the
Corporation for Public

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Broadcasting. Do you expect
and support additional

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Rescissions as a way to cut
costs going forward?

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>> Washington has a massive
spending power. We're

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spending almost $2 trillion
a year more than we're

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taking in in the debt as
well over $30 trillion. I

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think we need to go through
the federal budget with a

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fine tooth comb to remove
waste, fraud and abuse, look

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at programs that could find
either other sources of

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funding or aren't necessary.
And so I think it's

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appropriate to make sure
that we're combing through

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the federal budget, looking
for ways to save taxpayer

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dollars. And again, in a
period of time where every

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extra dollar we spend is
effectively a dollar

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borrowed from China, I think
it's absolutely appropriate

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to dig through the federal
budget and look for ways to

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save funds for hard working
families.

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>> U.S. Representative Bryan
Steil, thanks very much.

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>> Thank you.
>> On health care, we

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continue our coverage of
prescription drug prices,

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which continue to climb for
patients and pharmacies,

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while coverage of them
continues to plummet. In RX,

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uncovered "Here& Now",
producer Marissa Wojcik

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examines the complex systems
driving these trends. This

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week, we look at the impact
on pharmacies, both big and

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especially small, and why
their disappearance is

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hurting patients.
>> We have been in business

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for over 70 years.
>> The local drugstore was

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once upon a time a staple in
communities across the

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country.
every month and it's scary,

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and we think about how how
long can we last?

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>> Today, whether it's the
local drugstore or a chain

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pharmacy, the brick and
mortar presence is dying.

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>> The feasibility of having
an independent pharmacy is

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becoming very challenging.
>> Nicole Schreiner is the

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new CEO of Streu's Pharmacy
in Green Bay and president

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elect on the board of the
Pharmacy Society of

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Wisconsin.
>> We get up in the morning

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because we want to truly
help serve our patients.

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>> Alongside her commitment
to the mission, she takes on

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her new dual roles in one of
the most challenging times

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for pharmacies. From 2010 to
2021, 30% of drugstores in

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the US closed. Last year
alone, 2300 pharmacies

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closed, half of them being
independent or mid-sized

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businesses.
issue for patients. We

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oftentimes talk about in
rural areas. You know,

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patients having to travel,
you know, perhaps 20 miles

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to a find a pharmacy that
would be able to provide

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their medications. And but
we're having that even in

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urban city areas.
>> For some, a visit to the

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pharmacy is a quick step.
Picking up 1 or 2

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prescriptions. But for many
patients, it's much more

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than that.
>> Your pharmacist a lot of

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times will be a critical
component of your medical

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care team.
>> Senate President Mary

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Felzkowski authored
legislation trying to help

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local pharmacies keep their
doors open.

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>> We saw our small,
independent pharmacy

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starting to go out of
business in rural Wisconsin.

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When it may take months for
a patient to get a clinic

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visit. Pharmacists say they
bridge that gap. Available

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for anyone to walk in and
ask questions at any time.

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And prevention leads to
healthcare savings.

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>> For patients with asthma.
We did a study with the

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00:12:14,902 --> 00:12:17,004
Pharmacy Society of
Wisconsin and showed that

233
00:12:17,070 --> 00:12:20,841
when they sat down with a
pharmacist on two 30 minute

234
00:12:20,908 --> 00:12:23,310
interventions, that they
reduced the number of ER

235
00:12:23,377 --> 00:12:26,146
visits, the number of
hospitalizations. These

236
00:12:26,213 --> 00:12:28,148
things are making a
difference in overall

237
00:12:28,215 --> 00:12:30,617
reducing health care dollars
spent.

238
00:12:30,684 --> 00:12:33,921
>> Like with most retail
stores, it'd be reasonable

239
00:12:33,987 --> 00:12:36,190
to assume that internet
sales are putting pharmacies

240
00:12:36,256 --> 00:12:39,593
out of business. And while
mail order and online

241
00:12:39,660 --> 00:12:43,397
retailer giants like Amazon
do compete with on site

242
00:12:43,463 --> 00:12:46,900
service advocates, diagnose
a much deeper and chronic

243
00:12:46,967 --> 00:12:50,070
issue.
>> PBMs pharmacy benefit

244
00:12:50,137 --> 00:12:52,906
managers have been around
for a very long time.

245
00:12:52,973 --> 00:12:57,611
>> Pharmacy benefit managers
or PBMs act as middlemen

246
00:12:57,678 --> 00:13:02,049
between drug manufacturers,
wholesalers, providers,

247
00:13:02,115 --> 00:13:05,219
insurance companies and
pharmacies.

248
00:13:05,285 --> 00:13:08,188
>> And they've monopolized
and they've gotten in

249
00:13:08,255 --> 00:13:11,258
between prescribers and the
delivery of drugs, driving

250
00:13:11,325 --> 00:13:14,261
up the cost of drugs instead
of lowering them.

251
00:13:14,328 --> 00:13:17,965
>> The three largest PBM
companies accounted for 80%

252
00:13:18,031 --> 00:13:21,001
of prescription claims last
year.

253
00:13:21,068 --> 00:13:23,403
>> They'll claim that they
negotiate with drug

254
00:13:23,470 --> 00:13:26,440
manufacturers and
prescription drug costs.

255
00:13:26,507 --> 00:13:29,276
However, despite these
claims, PBMs regularly

256
00:13:29,343 --> 00:13:31,545
inflate what patients pay
and force pharmacies to

257
00:13:31,612 --> 00:13:35,148
operate a loss.
>> It's become very

258
00:13:35,215 --> 00:13:38,619
powerful, and independent
pharmacies like myself have

259
00:13:38,685 --> 00:13:43,290
no negotiating power
anymore. With these PBMs.

260
00:13:43,357 --> 00:13:46,960
>> The impact of PBMs that
PBMs are having on rural

261
00:13:47,027 --> 00:13:50,764
pharmacy is staggering.
>> The legislation takes aim

262
00:13:50,831 --> 00:13:54,101
at a number of their
practices, including not

263
00:13:54,168 --> 00:13:57,504
allowing patients to fill
prescriptions at certain

264
00:13:57,571 --> 00:14:00,340
pharmacies.
>> PBMs dictate where

265
00:14:00,407 --> 00:14:03,911
prescriptions can be filled.
>> Punitive audits against

266
00:14:03,977 --> 00:14:06,446
pharmacists who inform
patients of lower cost

267
00:14:06,513 --> 00:14:08,615
options.
>> What to charge a patient.

268
00:14:08,682 --> 00:14:11,285
>> And perhaps the biggest
of all for pharmacies.

269
00:14:11,351 --> 00:14:14,354
>> What they will reimburse
a pharmacy.

270
00:14:14,421 --> 00:14:17,324
>> Reimbursing the price of
medications below cost.

271
00:14:17,391 --> 00:14:20,060
>> And when they'll pay the
pharmacy.

272
00:14:20,127 --> 00:14:23,130
>> Forcing them to take
losses. At a Senate health

273
00:14:23,197 --> 00:14:26,066
committee hearing, numerous
local pharmacies attested to

274
00:14:26,133 --> 00:14:28,769
this issue.
>> My pharmacy is currently

275
00:14:28,836 --> 00:14:33,040
operating in the red right
now solely due to PBM

276
00:14:33,106 --> 00:14:36,310
reimbursement rate margins
estimated to PBMs have

277
00:14:36,376 --> 00:14:40,781
increased by 46%, and during
the same time, margins to

278
00:14:40,848 --> 00:14:43,650
pharmacies have decreased by
47%.

279
00:14:43,717 --> 00:14:47,120
>> The contracts have become
basically take it or leave

280
00:14:47,187 --> 00:14:51,191
it. They've continued to
erode year after year after

281
00:14:51,258 --> 00:14:55,195
year, and it's estimated
that independent pharmacies,

282
00:14:55,262 --> 00:14:57,731
depending on your particular
location in the country, can

283
00:14:57,798 --> 00:15:00,634
have anywhere from 20 to 40%
of their claims are actually

284
00:15:00,701 --> 00:15:03,203
reimbursed below cost.
>> But not all health

285
00:15:03,270 --> 00:15:06,173
industry experts agree.
>> We believe all these

286
00:15:06,240 --> 00:15:07,841
provisions will be
associated with increased

287
00:15:07,908 --> 00:15:11,512
costs to health plans and
sponsors.

288
00:15:11,578 --> 00:15:14,448
the bill, such as health
insurers, say it will

289
00:15:14,515 --> 00:15:17,885
increase prices for health
plans. Employers and

290
00:15:17,951 --> 00:15:21,321
patients. The exorbitant
cost of drugs, they say,

291
00:15:21,388 --> 00:15:24,258
begins with the drug
manufacturers.

292
00:15:24,324 --> 00:15:26,760
>> Instead of taking away
the few tools that health

293
00:15:26,827 --> 00:15:29,630
plans and employers use to
address ever increasing drug

294
00:15:29,696 --> 00:15:31,732
prices, the legislature
should focus on fixing the

295
00:15:31,798 --> 00:15:34,801
market distortion caused by
drug manufacturer pricing

296
00:15:34,868 --> 00:15:37,905
schemes.
hard on showing them through

297
00:15:37,971 --> 00:15:41,208
data from other states that
have allowed that have the

298
00:15:41,275 --> 00:15:43,977
same legislation, where it's
actually lowered the cost of

299
00:15:44,044 --> 00:15:46,780
health care.
>> Whatever the cause, the

300
00:15:46,847 --> 00:15:50,150
impact on the patient is
real, like the ability to

301
00:15:50,217 --> 00:15:54,922
obtain diabetes medications.
>> GLP ones, those. Some

302
00:15:54,988 --> 00:15:56,890
pharmacies are just choosing
not to carry them because

303
00:15:56,957 --> 00:15:58,892
they get reimbursed below
their cost.

304
00:15:58,959 --> 00:16:02,362
>> Or having your insurance
accepted.

305
00:16:02,429 --> 00:16:05,232
choosing not to carry
particular plans because of

306
00:16:05,299 --> 00:16:08,602
the poor reimbursement.
>> Every day in my pharmacy,

307
00:16:08,669 --> 00:16:12,539
I witness patients facing
exorbitant co-pays,

308
00:16:12,606 --> 00:16:16,677
sometimes exceeding $500 for
medications they cannot

309
00:16:16,743 --> 00:16:19,980
afford. These patients are
confused. They're

310
00:16:20,047 --> 00:16:21,782
overwhelmed, and they're
forced into impossible

311
00:16:21,849 --> 00:16:24,017
decisions about their
health.

312
00:16:24,084 --> 00:16:26,920
>> For a patient having to
fill prescriptions at

313
00:16:26,987 --> 00:16:29,957
multiple pharmacies, the
consequences can cost them

314
00:16:30,023 --> 00:16:32,926
their lives.
>> Recently, when

315
00:16:33,427 --> 00:16:36,029
learned that they had a
duplicate prescription that

316
00:16:36,096 --> 00:16:38,732
was at another pharmacy from
a different doctor. If they

317
00:16:38,799 --> 00:16:41,401
had gone home and taken
both, they would have needed

318
00:16:41,468 --> 00:16:43,804
emergency care and it could
have been fatal.

319
00:16:43,871 --> 00:16:46,974
>> From the extremes of the
pandemic to the work they do

320
00:16:47,040 --> 00:16:50,177
every day, independent
pharmacists say their

321
00:16:50,244 --> 00:16:52,379
commitment is to their
community.

322
00:16:52,446 --> 00:16:54,915
>> What happens if PBMs
continue to drive us out of

323
00:16:54,982 --> 00:16:58,552
business? Who will step up
during this crisis? Who's

324
00:16:58,619 --> 00:17:01,054
going to be doing seven day
a week testing? Who's going

325
00:17:01,121 --> 00:17:03,957
to deliver meds late at
night for a hospice patient

326
00:17:04,024 --> 00:17:07,995
who's going to get a call at
2 a.m? I just got that last

327
00:17:08,061 --> 00:17:09,997
week. It won't be a mail
order pharmacy in another

328
00:17:10,063 --> 00:17:12,966
state that's doing that.
>> Being able to provide

329
00:17:13,033 --> 00:17:16,537
that service to patients and
to be part of making sure

330
00:17:16,603 --> 00:17:19,740
that they are taken care of,
is really what we want to

331
00:17:19,806 --> 00:17:22,342
ultimately do.
>> Reporting from green Bay,

332
00:17:22,409 --> 00:17:25,646
I'm Marisa Wojcik for "Here&
Now".

333
00:17:26,613 --> 00:17:29,616
>> In other news. Imagine
you're running late for

334
00:17:29,683 --> 00:17:33,086
work, but you have to take a
water taxi or ferry over the

335
00:17:33,153 --> 00:17:36,423
river instead of driving
over a bridge. That's what

336
00:17:36,490 --> 00:17:39,159
will confront people in
western Wisconsin when the

337
00:17:39,226 --> 00:17:42,796
bridge over the Mississippi
River that connects De Soto

338
00:17:42,863 --> 00:17:47,100
to Lansing, Iowa, is removed
this fall and replaced in

339
00:17:47,167 --> 00:17:50,737
2027. As Erika Ayisi
reports, the Lansing bridge,

340
00:17:50,804 --> 00:17:53,607
also named the Black Hawk
Bridge in Crawford County,

341
00:17:53,674 --> 00:17:56,977
has been under repair while
still in use, but soon it

342
00:17:57,044 --> 00:18:00,848
will close altogether for
replacement.

343
00:18:04,151 --> 00:18:06,720
>> Closure, demolition and
rebuilding are the new plans

344
00:18:06,787 --> 00:18:11,024
for the Black Hawk Bridge.
>> The initial plan for the

345
00:18:11,091 --> 00:18:15,262
new bridge was that the old
Black Hawk Bridge would

346
00:18:15,329 --> 00:18:19,032
remain open until the new
bridge was completed.

347
00:18:19,099 --> 00:18:22,202
>> But that plan has
changed. The village of De

348
00:18:22,269 --> 00:18:24,905
Soto President Timothy
Gillespie says the

349
00:18:24,972 --> 00:18:27,774
announcement of the upcoming
bridge demolition has

350
00:18:27,841 --> 00:18:30,344
residents worried about
crossing the Mississippi

351
00:18:30,410 --> 00:18:33,747
River into Lansing, Iowa.
>> Unfortunately, the Black

352
00:18:33,814 --> 00:18:38,852
Hawk Bridge will have to be
closed in October, and so

353
00:18:38,919 --> 00:18:43,390
it'll be about two years
before the new bridge is

354
00:18:43,457 --> 00:18:45,692
ready.
>> The new bridge is being

355
00:18:45,759 --> 00:18:48,495
constructed along the
existing bridge. According

356
00:18:48,562 --> 00:18:51,532
to the Iowa and Wisconsin
Departments of

357
00:18:51,598 --> 00:18:53,767
Transportation, the east
side of the existing bridge

358
00:18:53,834 --> 00:18:56,904
is posing a risk to the new
bridge's completion.

359
00:18:56,970 --> 00:19:00,207
>> And they said it's
becoming a safety issue. And

360
00:19:00,274 --> 00:19:03,076
they have to continue to
drive the pilings down. And

361
00:19:03,143 --> 00:19:06,547
so it's going to weaken.
They think the existing

362
00:19:06,613 --> 00:19:09,583
bridge. And that'll become a
safety issue a hazard.

363
00:19:09,650 --> 00:19:12,386
>> The livelihood of local
businesses on both sides of

364
00:19:12,452 --> 00:19:15,489
the river are at stake.
>> There's just going to

365
00:19:15,556 --> 00:19:18,358
have a very negative effect
on a lot of businesses, not

366
00:19:18,425 --> 00:19:21,094
only in De Soto, but
certainly in Lansing,

367
00:19:21,161 --> 00:19:24,998
Ferryville, Genoa, Harpers
Ferry, New Alvin, Iowa. All

368
00:19:25,065 --> 00:19:27,067
of those communities are
going to be affected by

369
00:19:27,134 --> 00:19:29,369
this.
>> The bridge has been

370
00:19:29,436 --> 00:19:32,039
closed temporarily, briefly
in the past. How were

371
00:19:32,105 --> 00:19:34,374
passengers impacted during
those times?

372
00:19:34,441 --> 00:19:37,244
>> Well, they had a people
ferry that they started and

373
00:19:37,311 --> 00:19:40,614
that was working pretty
well. It you know, it's

374
00:19:40,681 --> 00:19:44,718
still pretty difficult for
people to use a people ferry

375
00:19:44,785 --> 00:19:48,055
to, to, to get to work.
>> A people ferry and car

376
00:19:48,121 --> 00:19:51,358
ferry like this one could
help business owners like

377
00:19:51,425 --> 00:19:55,996
Erwin Buckmaster sustain his
Lansing restaurant with

378
00:19:56,063 --> 00:19:58,765
Wisconsin customers.
and more people would want

379
00:19:58,832 --> 00:20:01,969
to be involved and indulge
in that car ferry, as

380
00:20:02,035 --> 00:20:04,238
opposed to just shuttling,
busing and getting trucked

381
00:20:04,304 --> 00:20:06,640
across the river.
>> Transportation officials

382
00:20:06,707 --> 00:20:10,177
are exploring a car ferry
service, but Gillespie says

383
00:20:10,244 --> 00:20:13,547
it will not meet the daily
demand of cars crossing the

384
00:20:13,614 --> 00:20:16,850
bridge.
able to bring 1214 cars at a

385
00:20:18,752 --> 00:20:20,888
time over, and that's
certainly not going to take

386
00:20:20,954 --> 00:20:24,057
the place of the traffic
that was on the Black Hawk

387
00:20:24,124 --> 00:20:26,593
Bridge.
>> Justin Shepherd of Shep's

388
00:20:26,660 --> 00:20:29,596
Riverside Bar and Grill says
customers need multiple

389
00:20:29,663 --> 00:20:33,100
crossing plans for
businesses to stay afloat,

390
00:20:33,166 --> 00:20:36,270
especially through winter.
>> As far as business goes,

391
00:20:36,336 --> 00:20:38,839
you know they'll run a
shuttle hopefully until the

392
00:20:38,906 --> 00:20:41,141
ice comes through and then
after the ice is in, you

393
00:20:41,208 --> 00:20:44,611
know, we don't really know
how that's going to work

394
00:20:44,678 --> 00:20:46,647
because they don't have a
plan for in place for that

395
00:20:46,713 --> 00:20:49,383
either.
closest bridge is U.S.

396
00:20:49,449 --> 00:20:52,119
Highway 18, connecting
McGregor, Iowa, to Prairie

397
00:20:52,186 --> 00:20:55,923
du Chien, about 45 minutes
away from the Lansing De

398
00:20:55,989 --> 00:20:58,959
Soto Bridge crossing.
>> And there's also a

399
00:20:59,026 --> 00:21:03,197
medical clinic over in
Lansing. And so if we can't

400
00:21:03,263 --> 00:21:05,999
get over there, then the
people are going to have to

401
00:21:06,066 --> 00:21:10,204
go to Prairie du Chien or La
Crosse, which is 30 miles in

402
00:21:10,270 --> 00:21:14,708
either direction.
the new bridge's signature

403
00:21:14,775 --> 00:21:19,246
singing sound, wider width
and indigenous name

404
00:21:20,881 --> 00:21:25,085
reference to Chief Black
Hawk will remain the same as

405
00:21:25,152 --> 00:21:27,554
Gillespie and other area
village presidents seek

406
00:21:27,621 --> 00:21:29,990
government aid.
>> Going to be looking for

407
00:21:30,057 --> 00:21:32,192
some kind of a federal or
state aid to help support

408
00:21:32,259 --> 00:21:36,630
the loss of revenue that's
going to occur. So hopefully

409
00:21:36,697 --> 00:21:39,333
we can get some some
assistance.

410
00:21:39,399 --> 00:21:42,469
>> Reporting from De Soto
I'm Erica Ayisi for here.

411
00:21:42,536 --> 00:21:45,539
And now.
>> That bridge opened in

412
00:21:47,174 --> 00:21:50,811
1931. How aged are other
bridge crossings in

413
00:21:50,878 --> 00:21:53,547
Wisconsin? According to the
National Bridge Inventory,

414
00:21:53,614 --> 00:21:56,517
of the more than 14,000
bridges in this state,

415
00:21:56,583 --> 00:22:00,254
nearly a thousand are
classified as what they call

416
00:22:00,320 --> 00:22:03,824
structurally deficient. We
turn to Wisconsin Dot Bureau

417
00:22:03,891 --> 00:22:07,761
of Structures Director Josh
Dietsche for more. And

418
00:22:07,828 --> 00:22:10,831
thanks very much for being
here.

419
00:22:11,431 --> 00:22:14,768
to join.
a bridge to be structurally

420
00:22:16,503 --> 00:22:18,505
deficient?
>> So it's a term that

421
00:22:18,572 --> 00:22:21,141
probably sounds a little
scarier than it is really.

422
00:22:21,208 --> 00:22:24,711
It just means that there is
something, some kind of

423
00:22:24,778 --> 00:22:26,847
deterioration that's been
noted with the bridge. We

424
00:22:26,914 --> 00:22:29,416
always try to stress that.
That doesn't mean it's

425
00:22:29,483 --> 00:22:32,286
unsafe. If there's a bridge
open in the state, open to

426
00:22:32,352 --> 00:22:35,155
travel on. You can feel safe
traveling across it.

427
00:22:35,222 --> 00:22:37,758
>> So does Wisconsin have a
lot of older bridges, like

428
00:22:37,824 --> 00:22:40,827
the one like the Lansing
Bridge?

429
00:22:41,361 --> 00:22:43,864
>> Not many that are quite
as old as.

430
00:22:43,931 --> 00:22:47,167
>> The.
average age of the bridge is

431
00:22:51,438 --> 00:22:54,675
about 42 years old. So yeah,
something as old as the

432
00:22:54,741 --> 00:22:57,444
Lansing is a little bit
atypical.

433
00:22:57,511 --> 00:23:01,181
>> In Wisconsin. What
specific bridges need

434
00:23:01,248 --> 00:23:05,385
immediate repair or removal?
Are there any?

435
00:23:06,854 --> 00:23:08,989
>> Again, I would stress
that if it's open, it's

436
00:23:09,056 --> 00:23:12,025
safe. So we always have a
program where we're going in

437
00:23:12,092 --> 00:23:13,961
and rehabilitating or
replacing bridges. So you

438
00:23:14,027 --> 00:23:17,164
mentioned that there's over
14,000 bridges in the state.

439
00:23:17,231 --> 00:23:20,400
About 2% of those are
classified as being in poor

440
00:23:20,467 --> 00:23:23,437
condition. Kind of at a high
level. We as we inspect

441
00:23:23,504 --> 00:23:26,573
bridges, they get rated as
either good, fair or poor.

442
00:23:26,640 --> 00:23:29,142
And so again, with about 2%
of those bridges in poor

443
00:23:29,209 --> 00:23:31,678
condition, those are the
ones that we're focusing on.

444
00:23:31,745 --> 00:23:33,146
Again, not because they're
unsafe, not because you

445
00:23:33,213 --> 00:23:35,249
shouldn't be traveling over
them, but just because

446
00:23:35,315 --> 00:23:37,951
they're going to need some
work to keep them in

447
00:23:38,018 --> 00:23:40,854
service. In the near future.
So those are the ones that

448
00:23:40,921 --> 00:23:43,123
we've got in the program
that are in the planning

449
00:23:43,190 --> 00:23:45,058
stages for, you know, again,
getting some kind of

450
00:23:45,125 --> 00:23:46,894
rehabilitation or
potentially being replaced.

451
00:23:46,960 --> 00:23:49,763
>> How heavy of a lift is it
to inspect all of these?

452
00:23:49,830 --> 00:23:53,867
More than 14,000 bridges
across the state of

453
00:23:53,934 --> 00:23:56,937
Wisconsin?
are surprised when we talk

454
00:23:57,004 --> 00:24:00,073
about it that we do have
that many bridges in the

455
00:24:00,140 --> 00:24:02,576
state. You know, about the
big ones that you travel

456
00:24:02,643 --> 00:24:05,045
over. But there's so many
that are over just small

457
00:24:05,112 --> 00:24:07,047
creeks or small rivers that
you probably don't even

458
00:24:07,114 --> 00:24:09,983
realize where you're going
over a bridge. So yeah, of

459
00:24:10,050 --> 00:24:11,919
those 14,000, about 5000, a
little over 5000 are owned

460
00:24:11,985 --> 00:24:14,588
by the state, and the
remainder then are owned by

461
00:24:14,655 --> 00:24:16,123
local municipalities,
cities, villages, towns, and

462
00:24:16,190 --> 00:24:19,159
so on and so forth. So the
state bridges are inspected

463
00:24:19,226 --> 00:24:22,229
by mostly by state forces,
although we do use

464
00:24:22,296 --> 00:24:24,798
consultant engineers as
well. And the same thing on

465
00:24:24,865 --> 00:24:27,568
the local side, the local
side, they do have some

466
00:24:27,634 --> 00:24:30,504
local staff that will
inspect bridges, but they

467
00:24:30,571 --> 00:24:33,273
lean heavily on consultant
engineers as well. So when

468
00:24:33,340 --> 00:24:35,843
the bridges are in good
condition, basically new,

469
00:24:35,909 --> 00:24:39,046
they can be inspected on as
much as a four year cycle.

470
00:24:39,112 --> 00:24:41,215
But for the most part,
bridges are required to be

471
00:24:41,281 --> 00:24:43,917
inspected on a two year
cycle or as they get in that

472
00:24:43,984 --> 00:24:46,887
worst condition, into poor
condition on a on an annual

473
00:24:46,954 --> 00:24:49,223
basis. So yeah, it's a heavy
lift depending on the size

474
00:24:49,289 --> 00:24:52,759
of the bridge, it the larger
bridges may take up to a

475
00:24:52,826 --> 00:24:55,529
week to inspect some of the
larger bridges. Like you

476
00:24:55,596 --> 00:24:58,232
referenced the Lansing
Bridge or some of our more

477
00:24:58,298 --> 00:25:01,168
signature bridges. Others,
you know, it can be done in

478
00:25:01,235 --> 00:25:04,271
a morning or an afternoon.
But yes, it's definitely a

479
00:25:04,338 --> 00:25:06,306
pretty big effort.
>> We took a look at the

480
00:25:06,373 --> 00:25:11,144
work that's happening on
that bridge from De Soto to

481
00:25:11,211 --> 00:25:14,648
Lansing, and it made me
wonder, how tricky is it to

482
00:25:14,715 --> 00:25:18,719
repair bridges while they're
still in use?

483
00:25:19,386 --> 00:25:22,322
>> Yeah, it depends on the
situation. You know,

484
00:25:22,389 --> 00:25:25,092
obviously the traffic is a
big thing that plays into

485
00:25:25,158 --> 00:25:27,928
that, plays into that on.
You know, if you're trying

486
00:25:27,995 --> 00:25:30,864
to repair a bridge on the
interstate, there's going to

487
00:25:30,931 --> 00:25:33,233
be lane closures. There's a
there's a large bridge over

488
00:25:33,300 --> 00:25:35,302
the Wisconsin River just
north of Portage that's

489
00:25:35,369 --> 00:25:37,738
being replaced right now. If
you've driven through that

490
00:25:37,804 --> 00:25:40,307
area. And in that case,
you'll see lane closures or

491
00:25:40,374 --> 00:25:42,809
lane shifts. So it's
definitely possible. But

492
00:25:42,876 --> 00:25:45,379
yeah, it does present some
complications for sure. But

493
00:25:45,445 --> 00:25:49,216
again, we make we make sure
to do it in a way that is

494
00:25:49,283 --> 00:25:52,186
safe for sure. And as we try
to minimize the disruption

495
00:25:52,252 --> 00:25:54,721
to the traveling public as
much as we can.

496
00:25:54,788 --> 00:25:57,457
>> All right. Well, we are
all glad to know that the

497
00:25:57,524 --> 00:26:01,328
bridges are safe. John
Dietsche, thank you so much.

498
00:26:01,395 --> 00:26:04,965
>> No problem.
and other issues facing

499
00:26:05,966 --> 00:26:08,569
Wisconsin, visit our website
at PBS Wisconsin. Org and

500
00:26:08,635 --> 00:26:11,772
then click on the news tab.
That's our program for

501
00:26:11,839 --> 00:26:13,740
tonight. I'm Frederica
Freyberg. Have a good-

502
00:26:13,807 --> 00:26:15,475
[MUSIC]
weekend.

503
00:26:44,638 --> 00:26:46,139
>> Funding for "Here& Now"
is provided by the Focus

504
00:26:46,206 --> 00:26:48,642
is provided by the Focus
Fund for Journalism and

505
00:26:48,709 --> 00:26:53,614
Friends of PBS Wisconsin.
Friends of PBS Wisconsin.