President Trump's action in this case on childhood
vaccinations. Parents may be wondering what's happening
after every member of the Advisory Committee on
Immunization Practices was fired by DHHS Secretary
Robert F Kennedy Jr. The new committee, chosen by
Kennedy, who is a vaccine skeptic, met this week and
announced a review of immunization schedules and
had some other changes. The advisory committee makes
recommendations to the CDC on which immunization should
be given and whether they are covered by insurance.
Amid this upset to established vaccine
guidance, a new project has taken shape at the
University of Minnesota Center for Infectious
Disease Research and Policy. It's called the Vaccine
Integrity Project. Doctor Michael Osterholm is
director of the center. He joins us now. And thanks
very much for being here. >> Thank you for having me.
>> So were there changes made this week regarding
immunizations that raise alarm bells for physicians
and others? >> Well, in fact, there were
several things that happened at this two day meeting. One
is, is that we were able to count over 50 different
instances where mis or disinformation were shared,
things that just simply weren't true. And so that
leaves people often confused as to wait a minute, now
what? What is the truth about this? In addition to
that, they took certain actions and as a, for
example, they voted on removing thimerosal from
influenza vaccine. Well, let me just back up. Thimerosal
is a type of preservative. It's ethyl mercury, not
methylmercury, which is the methyl is the dangerous
type. Ethyl is not. And what it is used in multi-dose
vials so that as a vial might be used over a day to
day and a half. Contamination doesn't grow
in it. After having inserted the first needle into it.
When in fact you look at overall use of thimerosal,
less than 6% of all influenza vaccine doses have
that. And as I pointed out over the last 30 years,
there's been ample, ample evidence showing there is no
safety issue with thimerosal. But this has
been a very favorite target of the secretary over the
years. He's actually written about it. And so they voted
to take thimerosal out of the last remaining doses of
influenza vaccine, leaving people with the sense that
somehow they improved the safety of the vaccine. They
did not. They did nothing. But this will be heralded
again as an example of the administration basically
protecting you as a citizen, when in fact there is no
truth to that at all. So this is the challenge we
have right now is just about mis and disinformation and
really making changes for with vaccines that actually
improve our health versus do not.
>> Is there a reason for people to be skeptical of
vaccines? >> Absolutely not. Vaccines
today are the safest they've ever been. If you look at
the number of vaccine doses we have, yes, there are more
of them. But because we've improved vaccines over the
years, the actual amount that we call antigens, you
get when you get vaccinated is much lower now than it
was in the 1970s. So even people who have alleged that
somehow kids are getting vaccinated a lot more today,
and therefore there could be problems with that. It's
actually not true. It's actually today we're at some
of the lowest numbers of antigens being used in all
the vaccines, and at the same time, providing this
incredible protection against these. Oftentimes
life threatening infections. >> What does your vaccine
integrity project set out to do?
>> Well, first of all, we want to make certain that
there is a source of information that's reliable,
that's scientifically sound, and that people can count
on. Right now. You can't count on the CDC data or
information to be factually correct. There are many very
talented, dedicated public health workers at CDC who do
an incredible job, but they're not allowed to be
part of this process. And in that regard, that's a huge
challenge, because it means that others who have much
less experience are going to be making the kinds of
presentations that then the ACIp will vote on. At this
point, all I can say is, is that when you look at the
overall body of science and vaccinations, today, there's
never been a time where you've had more vaccines
protect more lives against serious illness,
hospitalizations and deaths versus the very minuscule
risk of an adverse event from a vaccine. And so what
we're here to do is help with is to provide a very
detailed scientific review of the vaccines with the
latest, most current information so that when the
societies make their recommendations are based on
the most current science. And that's what we're doing
now, that will help everyone. Because again, all
of the different uses of these vaccines from all
these different professional societies is obviously
critical to overall better health. And by having this
information, we're hopeful that payers will in fact
agree that they can't support the ACIp
recommendations. That may be compromised, but they can
accept a body of science that has very openly and
with full disclosure, demonstrated just how
important these vaccines can be.
>> What does all this disruption do in areas where
uptake of vaccines is already low? I mean, is
confidence in vaccines further eroded?
>> That's the real problem we have today is confidence
in vaccines, because people are getting so many
different messages about vaccines depending on who it
is that's delivering them. As I mentioned earlier, over
50 mistakes or misinformation were shared
at the ACIp meeting, which, I mean, you go there to find
the truth, to find the scientific message that is
factually based. If you have this kind of situation where
you can't count on it, you don't know it. But the
public hears that this came from the centers for Disease
Control and Prevention. You're led to believe that,
oh, this must be true. And so this creates a really
significant challenge for us is to get the kind of
information to the public that they can trust and that
they can understand how we came about getting this
information. >> Because right now,
measles is a real and growing threat. How much
does that concern you? >> Oh, measles concerns me a
great deal. I mean, when you look at what's happened in
this country where we're reported cases, we believe
there's more than that. But look at Canada, where now
they have over 3800 reported cases of measles. Remember,
Canada only has 40 million people compared to our 330
million people. And so you can see that that's just on
our doorstep. And they have the same problems with
vaccine hesitancy and people not willing to get
vaccinated. And so over time, I'm afraid that it's
going to take us a really, really unfortunate course of
severe illness, hospitalizations and deaths
to help people understand just how powerful these
vaccines have been. >> Doctor Michael Osterholm,