% CANVASSERS POUND THE PAVEMENT,
% PLANNING A WEEKEND BLITZ TO
% PROMOTE THEIR CANDIDATES.
% WISCONSIN'S NEXT SUPREME COURT
% JUSTICE AHEAD OF TUESDAY'S
% ELECTION.
% IT WILL DETERMINE THE FUTURE
% DIRECTION OF THE COURT IN THE
% MOST EXPENSIVE JUDICIAL RACE IN
% U.S. HISTORY.
% I'M FREDERICA FREYBERG, TONIGHT
% ON "HERE AND NOW", WE SPEAK WITH
% BOTH CAMPAIGNS FOR THE HIGH
% COURT.
% PLUS A LAW PROFESSOR BRINGS
% CONTEXT IS TO THE CONSTITUTIONAL
% AMENDMENT QUESTIONS ALSO ON THE
% BALLOT.
% IT'S "HERE AND NOW," FOR MARCH
% 31.
% >> FUNDING FOR "HERE AND NOW" IS
% PROVIDED BY THE FOCUS FUND FOR
% JOURNALISM AND FRIENDS OF PBS
% WISCONSIN.
% >> THERE ARE JUST DAYS BEFORE
% THE STATEWIDE SPRING ELECTION
% THIS TUESDAY, APRIL 4.
% AS PART OF OUR "HERE AND NOW"
% 2020 ELECTION COVERAGE, WE HEAR
% FROM BOTH CAMPAIGNS ONE LAST
% TIME, MAKING THEIR FINAL APPEALS
% TO VOTERS.
% UP FIRST, CANDIDATE DANIEL
% KELLY, WHO PREVIOUSLY SERVED ON
% THE WISCONSIN SUPREME COURT.
% KELLY WAS APPOINTED BY
% REPUBLICAN GOVERNOR SCOTT WALKER
% IN 2016.
% HE RAN FOR RE-ELECTION IN 2020
% AND LOST, BUT SAYS HE IS RUNNING
% AGAIN AS A CONSTITUTIONAL
% CONSERVATIVE.%DANIEL KELLY,
THANK YOU FOR
% BEING WIT US.%>> IT IS A PLE
ASURE.
% THANKS SO MUCH.
% >> I WANTED TO ASK YOU, FIRST,
% WHAT ARE THE STAKES IN THIS
% ELECTION?%>> WELL, I THINK I
T'S THE
% DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE RULE OF
% LAW AND THE RULE OF JANET.
% SHE'S MADE IT ABUNDANTLY CLEAR
% THAT, IF ELECTED, SHE INTENDS TO
% PLACE HERSELF ABOVE THE LAW.
% SHE'S MADE IT PUBLIC THAT SHE
% SUBSCRIBES TO THE PHILOSOPHY OF
% LIVING CONSTITUTIONALISM.
% THE IDEA BEHIND THAT IS THAT THE
% COURTS HAVE THE POWER TO AMEND
% WHAT THE STATUTES AND THE
% CONSTITUTIONS SAY AND THAT'S
% CERTAINLY NOT THE WAY THAT OUR
% FORM OF GOVERNMENT IS SET UP.
% THOSE CHANGES HAPPEN THROUGH THE
% CONVERSATIONS OF THE PEOPLE OF
% WISCONSIN, WITH THEIR
% LEGISLATURES.% OUR JOB IS R
EALLY VERY HUMBLE.
% OUR RESPONSIBILITY IS SIMPLY TO
% USE THE EXISTING LAW TO DECIDE
% THE CASES THAT COME BEFORE US,
% AND THAT'S IT.
% AND PEOPLE OF WISCONSIN HAVE
% TOLD US THAT THEY'RE NOT REALLY
% INTERESTED IN WHAT WE THINK
% ABOUT THE LAWS, WHETHER THEY'RE
% GOOD OR USEFUL.
% THEY SAY RESERVE THOSE
% CONVERSATIONS FOR THE
% LEGISLATURE.
% SO THE QUESTION IS, ARE WE GOING
% TO CONTINUE WITH OUR 175-YEAR
% TRADITION WITH OUR WISCONSIN
% CONSTITUTION, OR ARE WE GOING TO
% TRADE THAT IN FOR SOMEONE WHO
% BELIEVES THAT SHE CAN BE ABOVE
% THE LAW.
% >> YOUR CHALLENGER CALLS YOU A
% THREAT TO DEMOCRACY FOR HAVING,
% QUOTE, EXTENSIVE CONVERSATIONS
% WITH THE HEAD OF THE STATE
% REPUBLICAN PARTY AND OTHERS
% ABOUT THE FALSE ELECTOR SCHEME.
% WHEN SHE SAID THAT IN THE
% DEBATE, YOU CALLED HER A LIAR.
% >> YES.
% >> AND YET THE TRANSCRIPT OF THE
% ANDREW DEPOSITION QUOTES HIM AS
% SEEING ABOUT YOURSELF AND
% ANOTHER G.O.P. LAWYER, QUOTE, HE
% AND I AND ANOTHER LAWYER,
% MR. KELLY, HAD SOME PRETTY
% EXTENSIVE CONVERSATIONS.
% SO HOW IS WHAT SHE SAID A LIE?
% >> BECAUSE AS YOU PROPERLY KNOW,
% HE'S REFERRING TO MULTIPLE
% ATTORNEYS, SO IF YOU GO ONTO THE
% TRANSCRIPT, HE SAYS THAT HE HAD
% ONE CONVERSATION WITH ME, SO THE
% EXTENSIVE CONVERSATIONS WERE
% OBVIOUSLY WITH THE OTHER LAWYER.
% SO IF SHE HAD BEEN CAREFUL WITH
% HER HOMEWORK, SHE WOULD HAVE
% BEEN ABLE TO AVOID THAT.
% NOW, HERE'S THE THING.
% I THINK SHE KNOWS, AND I THINK
% SHE JUST INTENDED TO LIE BECAUSE
% SHE WANTS TO MAKE IT LOOK BAD.
% SO WHAT THE CONGRESSIONAL
% TESTIMONY SHOWS IS THAT I HAD
% ONE CONVERSATION WITH A CLIENT
% ABOUT THIS SUBJECT.
% HE ASKED IF I WAS IN THE LOOP ON
% THAT QUESTION.
% I SAID I WASN'T BECAUSE I WASN'T
% AND THAT WAS IT.
% >> THAT WAS THE END OF YOUR
% INVOLVEMENT?%>> THAT WAS THE
END OF MY
% INVOLVEMENT.
% >> YOUR ATTACK ADS AGAINST YOUR
% OPPONENT HAVE FOCUSED ON HER
% SENTENCING DECISIONS AS A JUDGE
% IN CRIMINAL CASES.
% WHY, WHEN THE SUPREME COURT
% DOESN'T SENTENCE DEFENDANTS, IS
% THIS RELEVANT?
% >> IT'S AROUND THAT HAMILTON
% SAID 235 YEARS AGO WHEN HE WAS
% WRITING ABOUT THE WAY OUR
% CONSTITUTION WORKS, HE SAID
% COURTS NEITHER HAVE THE POWER,
% THE PURSE NOR THE SWORD, BUT
% MERELY JUDGMENT.
% AND SO WE LOOK AT JURIS
% JUDGMENTS TO FIND OUT HOW THEY
% ACTUALLY USE THEIR AUTHORITY.
% ONE OF THE AREAS WHERE, IF
% YOU'RE A CIRCUIT COURT JUDGE,
% ONE OF THE AREAS WHERE YOUR
% JUDGMENT BECOMES MOST APPARENT
% IS IN CRIMINAL SENTENCING, AND
% SO WE GO THERE BECAUSE THAT'S
% WHERE TRIAL JUDGES HAVE THE
% GREATEST DISCRETION.
% SO YOU CAN REALLY GET A GLIMPSE
% INTO THEIR MIND BY LOOKING AT
% THEIR JUDGMENTS AND HOW THEY
% SENTENCE.% SO WE LOOK AT TH
AT AND WHAT WE
% FIND THERE IS REALLY PRETTY
% CHILLING.
% >> SHE SAYS YOU'RE CHERRY
% PICKING THOSE CASES.
% >> THEY KEEP COMING OUT DAY
% AFTER DAY AFTER DAY AND THAT
% LIST IS GETTING VERY LONG.
% I DON'T KNOW WHEN CHERRY PICKING
% STOPS BUT A PATTERN STARTS, BUT
% I THINK WE'RE BOTH INTO A
% PATTERN.
% >> YOU BOTH DECIDED TO FOLLOW
% THE LAW.
% ENDORSEMENT FROM ANTI-ABORTION
% GROUPS AND FORMER LEGAL WORK FOR
% THEM NOT HINDER YOUR
% IMPARTIALITY AND YET JANET
% PROTASIEWICZ IS MAKING HER VIEW
% SUPPORTING ABORTION RIGHTS WOULD
% HINDER HER ABILITY?
% >> HERE'S THE DIFFERENCE.
% YOU HAVE TO BE AN ATTORNEY TO BE
% ON THE SUPREME COURT.
% MY WORK AS AN ATTORNEY HAS
% REPRESENTED PEOPLE ALL ACROSS
% THE POLITICAL SPECTRUM WITH ALL
% KINDS OF DIFFERENT INTERESTS AND
% SO WHEN I HAVE CONVERSATIONS
% WITH INDIVIDUALS WHO ARE
% THINKING ABOUT ENDORSING ME, THE
% CONVERSATIONS ARE THE SAME
% REGARDLESS OF WHAT I TALK TO.
% IT IS THE SAME CONVERSATION
% EVERYWHERE, AND IT IS THIS.
% I UNDERSTAND THAT WHILE THE
% COURT IS SIMPLY TO APPLY THE
% EXISTING LAW WITHOUT REFERENCE
% TO OTHER POLITICAL OPINIONS, OUR
% POLITICAL VIEWS.
% IN ORDER TO DO THAT, TO
% EFFECTUATE THAT, TO LIVE IT OUT
% ON THE BENCH, YOU HAVE TO HAVE A
% SYSTEM FOR DOING IT.
% AND SO HERE'S MY SYSTEM.
% SO I START WITH THE LAW.
% IN ANY CASE I ANALYZE OR ANY
% OPINION THAT I WRITE, I START
% WITH THE LAW APPLICABLE TO THAT
% CASE, WHETHER IT'S A
% CONSTITUTIONAL POSITION,
% STATUTE, REGULATION, COMMON-LAW,
% WHATEVER IT MIGHT BE, AND I USE
% RIGOROUS LOGIC TO MOVE FROM
% THOSE PROPOSITIONS ALL THE WAY
% DOWN TO THE CONCLUSION, AND WHEN
% YOU'RE DONE, YOU SHOULD BE ABLE
% TO SEE AN UNBROKEN CHAIN OF
% LOGIC BETWEEN THE CONCLUSION AND
% THE PREMISES, AND THAT'S YOUR
% GUARANTEE THE CONCLUSION IS
% COMMANDED BY LAW HAS NOT BEEN
% AFFECTED BY PERSONAL POLITICS.
% >> SOME STATES ARE SAYING
% PARENTS CAN BE INVESTIGATED FOR
% CHILD ABUSE IF THEY HELP THEIR
% TRANSGENDER CHILD TRANSITION.
% IN THE UPPER, WOULD SUCH A
% POLICY BE LEGAL PHENOMENON ACTED
% IN WISCONSIN?
% >> THAT'S A GREAT QUESTION.
% WE START WITH OHIO YOU DESCRIBED
% IT.%THE POLICY.
% IN THE COURT, WE DON'T DETERMINE
% WHETHER POLICIES ARE GOOD OR BAD
% OR WARRANTED OR NOT.
% >> LEGAL?
% >> WE QUESTION -- WE EXAMINE
% WHETHER THEY'RE LEGAL.
% NOW, WHETHER IT'S LEGAL WILL
% DEPEND ENTIRELY ON THE LANGUAGE
% OF THE STATUTE.
% SO OUR JOB, WHEN CHALLENGES COME
% TO US ON STATUTES, WE LOOK
% CAREFULLY AT THE WORDS OF THE
% STATUTE, WE COMPARE THAT TO THE
% CONSTITUTION, AND IF IT'S
% CONSISTENT WITH THE PROVISIONS
% OF THE CONSTITUTION, WE APPLY
% THAT.% AND IF IT'S NOT, WE
PREFER THE
% CONSTITUTION OVER THE STATUTE.
% SO THE ANSWER TO THE QUESTION
% IS, WE HAVE TO SEE THE STATUTE.
% >> ONSLAUGHT OF ATTACK ADS IN
% THIS RACE.
% WHAT IS THE ONE THING THAT YOU
% WOULD LIKE TO REFUTE?
% >> ALL OF IT.
% I MEAN, HONESTLY.
% THIS IS JUST A PATTERN OF LYING.
% MY OPPONENT IS A SERIAL LIAR.
% EVERY SINGLE TIME SHE PUTS OUT
% AN AD ABOUT ME, IT'S JUST A LIE.
% AND WHAT I MEAN BY THAT IT'S NOT
% TAKING OUT OF CONTEXT, IT'S NOT
% SPINNING.
% IT'S JUST A LIE.
% SHE IS MAKING THINGS UP.
% SO THERE'S NOT ENOUGH TIME IN
% THE AFTERNOON TO REFUTE ALL OF
% THAT.
% WHAT WE CAN DO IS THIS.
% ON MY CAMPAIGN WEBSITE, JUSTICE
% DANIEL KELLY DOT-COM, THAT'S
% JUSTICE DANIEL KELLY DOT-COM, AT
% THE TOP, THERE'S A FACT CHECK
% TAB AND WE'RE COMPILING ALL OF
% MMY OPPONENT'S LIES AND TELLING
% THE TRUTH ABOUT EACH ONE OF
% THEM.%I THINK THIS IS IMPORT
ANT
% BECAUSE, ONE, I THINK IT IS
% REALLY BAD CHARACTER TO BE A
% SERIAL LIAR RUNNING FOR THE
% SUPREME COURT OF WISCONSIN, BUT
% I FIND THIS PERSONALLY TERRIBLY,
% TERRIBLY OFFENSIVE.
% MAYBE I SHOULD HAVE A THICKER
% SKIN, BUT I DON'T.
% THAT'S PARTLY BECAUSE OF HOW I
% WAS RAISED, THAT YOU DON'T LIE.
% AND ALSO BECAUSE OF THIS: WHEN I
% WAS GROWING UP, OUR FAMILY
% DIDN'T HAVE A LOT.
% I HAD THREE BROTHERS AND THREE
% SISTERS AND MY MOM AND DAD HAD
% TO STRETCH EVERY DOLLAR PRETTY
% FAR TO GET FROM MONTH TO MONTH.
% I STILL REMEMBER WHEN I WAS A
% TEENAGER, MY DAD SAID, DAN, WHEN
% I'M DONE WITH THIS LIFE, I'M NOT
% GOING TO HAVE A LOT TO LEAVE
% YOU, BUT I'LL MAKE YOU THIS
% PROMISE.%I WILL LEAVE YOU A G
OOD NAME.
% NOW, WHEN I GRADUATED LAW SCHOOL
% A YEAR LATER, HIS COMMENTS CAME
% TO PASS, AND HE DIDN'T HAVE MUCH
% TO LEAVE ME.
% A COUPLE OF CUFFLINKS AND A
% BROKEN POCKET WATCH.
% BUT HE LEFT ME A GOOD NAME, AND
% I HAVE TREASURED THAT MY WHOLE
% LIFE.
% IT'S BEEN MY GOAL TO HAND DOWN
% THAT GOOD NAME TO MY CHILDREN
% AND NOW I'VE GOT A SERIAL LIAR
% LIKE JANET PROTASIEWICZ OUT%
THERE TRYING TO TRASH MY
% FATHER'S LEGACY.
% I THINK THAT IS JUST
% INEXCUSABLE.
% >> DANIEL KELLY, THANKS VERY
% MUCH.%>> THANK YOU, EVERYONE
.
% APPRECIATE IT.
% >> WE WERE TO TURN TO LIBERAL
% CANDIDATE AND MILWAUKEE COUNTY
% CIRCUIT COURT JUDGE JANET
% PROTASIEWICZ NOW.
% HOWEVER, SHE ASKED JUSTICE JILL
% KUROWSKI TO APPEAR IN HER PLACE
% DUE TO ILLNESS.
% JUSTICE KUROWSKI RAN AND WON
% AFTER DEFEATING DANIEL KELLY IN
% 2020.%SHE JOINS US NOW.
% THANK YOU FOR BEING WITH US.
% >> I'M HAPPY TO BE HERE.
% THANK YOU FOR LETTING ME
% PINCH-HIT THIS MORNING.
% >> IT DOES SEEM IRREGULAR, BUT
% WITH SITTING SUPREME COURT
% JUSTICE STANDING IN FOR A
% CANDIDATE, BUT HOW DOES THIS
% SPEAK TO THE HIGH STAKES IN THIS
% ELECTION?
% >> I THINK EVERYTHING THAT
% WISCONSINITES CARE ABOUT IS ON
% THE LINE IN THIS ELECTION, FROM
% ABORTION RIGHTS TO THE 2024
% ELECTION TO DEMOCRACY ITSELF,
% ALL OF THOSE THINGS ARE GOING TO
% BE ON THE BALLOT ON APRIL 4th
% AND CERTAINLY ANYONE WHO HAS
% BEEN IN WISCONSIN FOR 20 SECONDS
% CAN'T ESCAPE THE FACT THAT THIS
% ELECTION IS HAPPENING, THAT
% WISCONSINITES AND VOTERS ARE
% PAYING ATTENTION, AND THAT THE
% WHOLE NATION IS WATCHING TO SEE
% HOW THIS ELECTION TURNS OUT.
% >> JANET PROTASIEWICZ CALLS
% DANIEL KELLY A TRUE THREAT TO
% DEMOCRACY, POINTING TO HIS WORK
% AS AN ATTORNEY FOR THE
% REPUBLICANS HATCHING THE
% FRAUDULENT ELECTOR SCHEME
% FOLLOWING THE 2020 ELECTION.
% COULDN'T IT BE SAID THAT HE WAS
% JUST DOIN DOING HIS JOB?
% >> I THINK DANIEL KELLY IS A
% TRUE THREAT TO DEMOCRACY.
% HE IS CORRUPT AND HE IS EXTREME
% AND WE HAVE MANY, MANY EXAMPLES
% OF THAT.
% I STARTED TO LAY THAT CASE OUT
% IN 2020 AND JANET PROTASIEWICZ
% HAS CONTINUED TO MAKE THAT CASE
% NOW IN 2023.
% IF YOU JUST LOOK AT THE
% DECISIONS THAT HE RENDERED WHEN
% HE WAS ON THE SUPREME COURT, I
% HAVE NEVER SEEN A JUDGE FIRST
% DECIDE WHAT THE OUTCOME OF A
% CASE IS GOING TO BE, THE OUTCOME
% THAT HE WANTS, AND THEN WORK
% BACKWARDS MORE THAN DAN KELLY.
% YOU HAVE THE EXAMPLE OF THE ZIG
% CASE WHERE HE RECUSED HIMSELF
% AND THEN RECEIVED $20,000 IN
% UNRECUSED HIMSELF.
% I DIDN'T EVEN KNOW UNRECUSING
% YOURSELF WAS A THING WHEN
% SOMEONE FIRST ASKED ME ABOUT IT.
% IT'S AN OXYMORON.
% IT CAN'T BE.
% THESE CAN'T STILL, THREE YEARS
% LATER, YOU CAN'T EXPLAIN THE
% CONSISTENCY OF HIS RULINGS,
% WHERE HE ALWAYS RULED IN FAVOR
% OF THE RIGHT WING SPECIAL
% INTERESTS WHEN HE WAS ON THE
% COURT.
% HE'S BEEN CAMPAIGNING WITH
% INSURRECTIONISTS, WITH
% ANTI-SEMITES, WITH ANTI-ELECTION
% DENIERS, AND JUST THIS WEEK, HE
% AND HIS CRONIES PUT AN AD UP
% ABOUT A CASE WHERE THEY ENDED
% UP -- IT'S HARD TON EVEN FIND
% THE WORDS FOR WHAT THEY DID TO
% THIS POOR VICTIM.
% THEY HARASSED HER, THEY
% REVICTIMIZED HER, THEY MADE HER
% RELIVE THIS HORRIBLE, HORRIBLE
% SEXUAL ASSAULT.
% SHE DIDN'T WANT ANY PART OF THIS
% CAMPAIGN, AND IF THAT IS NOT
% ACTING IN AN EXTREME AND CORRUPT
% MANNER, I DON'T KNOW WHAT IS.
% >> THE KELLY CAMPAIGN ATTACKS
% WITH SLOGANS LIKE "NO JAIL
% JANET" FOR SENTENCING DECISIONS,
% WHAT'S YOUR RESPONSE TO THOSE
% ATTACKS AND HER BEING CALLED A
% SERIAL LIAR BY THE CONSERVATIVE
% OPPONENT?
% >> THOSE ARE BASELESS LIES.
% THEY ARE MEANT TO DISTRACT FROM
% THE FACT THAT DAN KELLY LOST IN
% 2020 AND HE'S VERY LIKELY TO
% LOSE IN 2023.
% COMPARE THEIR RECORDS.
% JUDGE JANET PROTASIEWICZ WAS IN
% THE DISTRICT ATTORNEY'S OFFICE
% IN MILWAUKEE FOR 25 YEARS.
% SHE STOOD UP FOR THE PEOPLE OF
% MILWAUKEE.%SHE PROTECTED THEI
R RIGHTS.
% SHE PROTECTED VICTIMS.
% SHE HELD DEFENDANTS ACCOUNTABLE.
% SHE MADE SURE THAT DEFENDANTS'
% RIGHTS WERE NOT VIOLATED, AND
% THEN SHE'S BEEN SERVING ON THE
% CIRCUIT COURT IN MILWAUKEE
% COUNTY FOR ALMOST A DECADE.
% COMPARE THAT TO THE CAREER OF
% DAN KELLY.
% DAN KELLY HAS NEVER SENTENCED A
% SINGLE PERSON.
% JANET PROTASIEWICZ HAS SENTENCED
% THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS OF
% PEOPLE.%THEY CHERRY PICK A C
OUPLE OF
% CASES, THEY DON'T FULLY DISCLOSE
% WHAT THE FACTS ARE OF THOSE
% CASES, AND THEN THEY THROW UP
% THESE T.V. ADS WITH ALL THE
% OUTSIDE MONEY THAT'S COMING FROM
% THE RIGHT WING SPECIAL INTERESTS
% BECAUSE THEY WANT TO KEEP DAN
% KELLY ON THE COURT BECAUSE THEY
% KNOW DAN KELLY WILL CARRY THEIR
% WATER AND HE WILL NOT SPILL A
% DROP OF IT.
% >> JANET PROTASIEWICZ HAS BEEN
% PLAYING ON HER VIEWS SUPPORTING
% ABORTION RIGHTS AND THAT
% WISCONSIN'S LEGISLATIVE MAPS ARE
% RIGGED.%WHY WOULD OPENLY STA
TED PERSONAL
% VIEWS NOT HINDER IMPARTIALITY AS
% A JUSTICE BUT DANIEL KELLY'S
% ENDORSEMENTS BY ANTI-ABORTION
% GROUPS, FOR EXAMPLE, WOULD?
% >> WELL, LOOK.
% I THINK THERE'S -- I THINK DAN
% KELLY IS TALKING OUT OF BOTH
% SIDES OF HIS MOUTH.
% RIGHT?
% WHAT JANET PROTASIEWICZ HAS DONE
% IS SHE HAS SAID, I'M GOING TO
% TELL YOU WHAT MY VALUES ARE.
% DAN KELLY HAS BEEN SAYING, OH,
% I'M NOT GOING TO BE, YOU KNOW,
% OVERTLY TELL YOU WHAT MY VALUES
% ARE.
% VOTERS IN WISCONSIN ARE
% INTELLIGENT.%THEY ARE SOPHIST
ICATED AND
% THEY'RE NOT GOING TO BE FOOLED
% BY THAT AD.
% JUST LOOK AT DAN KELLY'S WORDS
% AND HIS ACTIONS.
% WE CAN LOOK IN HIS WRITINGS TO
% SEE HOW HE FEELS ABOUT ABORTION.
% YOU CAN LOOK AT THE RIGHT TO
% LIFE WHO HAS ENDORSED HIM AND IN
% ORDER FOR HIM TO GET THAT
% ENDORSEMENT, HE HAD TO PLEDGE TO
% BE ANTI-ENDORSEMENT.
% WHEN IT COMES TO THE MAPS, THE
% MAPS ARE RIGGED.
% I WROTE IN THE DESCENT THAT THE
% MAPS, I DIDN'T USE THE WORD,
% RIGGED, BUT IF YOU READ THE
% DISSENT, YOU WILL SEE THOSE MAPS
% ARE RIGGED.
% YOU CAN'T BE IN THIS STATE AND
% NOT REALIZE THAT.
% JANET PROTASIEWICZ IS SAYING THE
% QUIET PART OUT LOUD, DAN KELLY
% IS TRYING TO REMAIN KELLY, BUT
% LOOK AT HIS WORDS AND HIS
% ACTIONS.% THERE IS NO DOUBT
IN ANYBODY'S
% MIND THAT IF DAN KELLY HAS THE
% CHANCE TO RULE ON AN ABORTION
% CASE, HOW HE WILL RULE ON THAT
% CASE, AND IT'S HARD FOR ME TO
% BELIEVE THAT ANY PREGNANT PERSON
% IN THIS STATE WOULD WANT DAN
% KELLY MAKING SUCH AN IMPORTANT
% MEDICAL DECISION ON THEIR
% BEHALF.
% >> FOR HIS PART, KELLY STATES
% THAT HE PRACTICES THE RULE OF
% LAW AND HIS OPPONENT, WHAT HE
% CALLS THE RULE OF JANET,
% INTENDING, HE SAYS, TO PLACE
% HERSELF ABOVE THE LAW.
% WHAT ABOUT THAT?
% >> JANET PROTASIEWICZ HAS TALKED
% SEVERAL TIMES, I'VE HEARD HER
% TALK ABOUT TIMES WHERE SHE HAS
% FOLLOWED THE LAW AND SHE HASN'T
% WANTED TO.
% SHE TALKS ABOUT WHEN SHE'S HAD
% TO SENTENCE PEOPLE AND WHEN
% SHE'S RECEIVED SENTENCING
% RECOMMENDATIONS FROM THE STATE
% AND SHE'S RECEIVED SENTENCINGS
% RECOMMENDATIONS FROM THE DEFENSE
% AND SHE HAS TO, IN THE END, CHEW
% WHAT THE RIGHT SENTENCE IS
% CHOOSE WHAT THE RIGHT SENTENCE
% IS.
% DAN KELLY, ON THE OTHER HAND, HE
% CANNOT PROVE, HE CANNOT SHOW YOU
% ONE TIME WHEN HE SAT ON THE
% SUPREME COURT WHEN HE DID NOT
% RULE IN FAVOR OF THE RIGHT WING
% SPECIAL INTERESTS.
% SO I THINK WE REALLY HAVE TO
% QUESTION HERE WHO IS FOLLOWING
% THE RULE OF LAW.
% IT'S CLEAR IT IS NOT DAN KELLY.
% IT MOST DEFINITELY IS JUDGE
% JANET PROTASIEWICZ.
% >> AS TO RECUSAL RULES, DOES
% JANET PROTASIEWICZ HOLD THE
% INDIVIDUAL JUSTICES ALONE SHOULD
% GET TO DECIDE WHEN TO RECUSE OR
% STEP ASIDE FROM A CASE BECAUSE
% OF A CONFLICT OF INTEREST?
% WITH ALL THE MONEY IN THIS RACE,
% IT SEEMS THAT THERE COULD BE A
% LOT OF CONFLICT.
% >> SURE.
% LET'S LOOK AT THE RECUSAL LAW.
% THEY WERE SUPPOSED TO HAVE A
% HEARING ON THE RECUSAL LAW BACK
% IN 2016 OR 2017 WHEN DAN KELLY
% WAS ON THE COURT.
% THEY WOULDN'T EVEN ALLOW A
% HEARING.
% DAN KELLY VOTED AGAINST THE
% SUPREME COURT GETTING THE
% INFORMATION IT NEEDED IN ORDER
% TO CRAFT A RECUSAL RULE THAT
% WOULD BE FAIR TO VOTERS, THAT
% WOULD BE FAIR TO DONORS, THAT
% WOULD BE FAIR TO CANDIDATES,
% THAT WOULD BE FAIR TO JUSTICES.
% IN THIS RACE, JANET PROTASIEWICZ
% HAS SAID, I RECEIVED MILLIONS OF
% DOLLARS FROM DEMOCRATIC PARTY OF
% WISCONSIN, SO IF THEY ARE A
% PARTY IN A LAWSUIT, I WILL
% RECUSE MYSELF.
% DAN KELLY HAS MADE NO SUCH
% PROMISE, EVEN THOUGH HE HAS
% RECEIVED, I THINK AS OF
% YESTERDAY, IT WAS EITHER 5.1 OR
% 5.8 MILLION DOLLARS FROM
% WISCONSIN MANUFACTURERS AND
% COMMERCE.
% >> WE HAVE JUST 15 SECONDS LEFT.
% FINAL PITCH IN THIS RACE.
% >> THIS IS PROBABLY THE MOST
% SIGNIFICANT SUPREME COURT%EL
ECTION IN OUR LIFETIME.
% PLEASE GO AND VOTE ON APRIL
% 4th FOR YOUR SEAT ON THE
% WISCONSIN SUPREME COURT.
% THANK YOU.
% >> JUSTICE JILL KUROWSKI, THANKS
% VERY MUCH FOR PINCH-HITTING.
% >> MY PLEASURE.
% THANK YOU.
% >> DISABILITY RIGHTS ADVOCATES
% ARE REITERATING CONCERNS THIS
% WEEK ABOUT ASSISTANCE IS FOR
% VOTERS WITH DISABILITIES AND
% RETURNING AN ABSENTEE BALLOT.
% DISABILITY RIGHTS WISCONSIN SAYS
% ROUGHLY A DOZEN PEOPLE HAVE
% SOUGHT THEIR HELP AFTER HAVING
% DIFFICULTY WITH AN ASSISTER
% RETURNING THEIR BALLOT.
% ADDITIONALLY, SOME CLERKS HAVE
% STATED IN POASKTS THAT THE
% POLLING PLACE ON THEIR WEBSITE
% OR FROM BALLOT ENCLOSURES THAT
% ONLY THE VOTER CAN TURN IN AN
% ABSENTEE BALLOT AND THEY DON'T
% LIST EXCEPTIONS FOR VOTERS WITH
% DISABILITIES.%BOTH FEDERAL A
ND STATE LAW
% PROTECT PEOPLE WITH DISABILITIES
% TO HAVE ACCOMMODATIONS TO VOTE
% AND, LAST YEAR, A FEDERAL COURT
% RULING CLARIFIED THIS INCLUDES
% BALLOT RETURN ASSISTANCE.
% FOR QUESTIONS, VOTERS CAN CALL
% THEIR LOCAL CLERK OR THE
% DISABILITY RIGHTS WISCONSIN
% VOTER HOTLINE AT 1-844-347-8683.
% IN ADDITION TO THE NAMES OF THE
% CANDIDATES FOR STATE SUPREME
% COURT, WISCONSIN VOTERS WILL SEE
% SOMETHING ELSE ON THEIR BALLOT
% TUESDAY.
% WHO QUESTIONS ASKING VOTERS TO
% AMEND THE STATE'S CONSTITUTION.
% BOTH OF THESE QUESTIONS HAVE TO
% DO WITH THE STATE'S CASH BAIL
% SYSTEM.
% QUESTION ONE READS, CONDITIONS
% OF RELEASE BEFORE CONVICTION.
% SHALL THE CONSTITUTION BE
% AMENDED TO ALLOW A COURT TO
% IMPOSE ON AN ACCUSED PERSON
% BEING RELEASED BEFORE CONVICTION
% CONDITIONS THAT ARE DESIGNED TO
% PROTECT THE COMMUNITY FROM
% SERIOUS HARM.
% AND QUESTION TWO READS, CASH
% BAIL BEFORE CONVICTION.
% SHALL THE CONSTITUTION BE
% AMENDED TO ALLOW A COURT TO
% IMPOSE CASH BAIL ON A PERSON
% ACCUSED OF A VIOLENT CRIME BASED
% ON THE TOTALITY OF THE
% CIRCUMSTANCES INCLUDING THE
% ACCUSED PREVIOUS CONVICTIONS FOR
% A VIOLENT CRIME, THE PROBABILITY
% THAT THE ACCUSED WILL FAIL TO
% APPEAR, THE NEED TO PROTECT THE
% COMMUNITY FROM SERIOUS HARM AND
% PREVENT WITNESS INTIMIDATION AND
% POTENTIALLY AFFIRMATIVE
% DEFENSES.
% THAT'S A LOT OF WORDS AND
% PROVING CONFUSING TO EVEN THE
% HIGHEST INFORMATION VOTERS.
% HERE FOR HELP YOU TO BE LAW
% SCHOOL PROFESSOR CECELIA
% KLINGELE.%THANK YOU FOR BEIN
G WITH US.% >> MY PLEASURE.
% >> IT WOULD ALLOW JUDGES TO
% IMPOSE CONDITIONS OF RELEASE.
% WHAT ARE SOME EXAMPLES OF THAT?
% >> JUDGES ALREADY CAN IMPOSE
% CONDITIONS OF RELEASE IN MOST
% CASES AND THOSE CONDITIONS CAN
% BE THINGS LIKE CURFEWS, THEY CAN
% BE REQUIREMENTS EVEN IN SOME
% CASES THAT PEOPLE SUBJECT
% THEMSELVES TO ELECTRONIC
% MONITORING.%IT CAN BE RESTRI
CTIONS ON THE
% CONSUMPTION OF ALCOHOL.
% A BROAD ARRAY OF CONDITIONS
% REALLY LIMITED TO THE JUDGE'S
% DISCRETION, BUT CURRENTLY THEY
% HAVE TO BE CONDITIONS THAT ARE
% TIED CLOSELY TO THE RISK THAT
% SOMEONE WILL CAUSE SERIOUS
% BODILY HARM TO SOMEONE WILL
% INTIMIDATE WITNESSES OR WILL NOT
% SHOW UP IN COURT.
% >> AND SO, AGAIN, THIS IS
% DIFFERENT HOW?
% >> FROM WHAT'S BEING PROPOSED.
% SO THE PROPOSAL WOULD BROADEN
% THE CIRCUMSTANCES IN WHICH
% JUDGES WERE ABLE TO IMPOSE
% CONDITIONS OF PEOPLE.
% DURING THAT TIME BETWEEN WHEN
% THEY ARE CHARGED WITH A CRIME
% AND WHEN THEY'RE CONVICTED OF A
% CRIME.%THIS IS REALLY IMPORTA
NT THAT WE
% KEEP REMEMBERING THAT DURING
% THAT TIME, UNDER OUR LAW, PEOPLE
% ARE PRESUMED INNOCENT.
% AND SO THE LAW IS REALLY
% NERVOUS, APPROPRIATELY, BUT
% IMPOSING RESTRICTIONS THAT COULD
% FEEL PUNITIVE ON PEOPLE WHO
% HAVEN'T YET BEEN CONVICTED OF
% DOING ANYTHING WRONG.
% AND SO WHAT THE LAW CHANGE WOULD
% DO IS ENABLE JUDGES TO IMPOSE
% CONDITIONS IN A BROADER ARRAY OF
% CIRCUMSTANCES, INCLUDING NOT
% JUST WHEN SOMEONE POSES A RISK
% OF SERIOUS BODILY HARM, BUT OF
% SERIOUS HARM WHICH THE
% LEGISLATURE HAS SEPARATELY
% DEFINED IN STATUTES THAT
% RECENTLY PASSED AND WOULD TAKE
% EFFECT FOR THIS AMENDMENT TO BE
% APPROVED.%THAT WOULD EFFECTI
VELY COVER ANY
% SITUATION WHERE ANYONE CAUSED
% ANY KIND OF HARM TO PROPERTY, TO
% A PERSON, OR EVEN TO THE
% EMOTIONAL WELL-BEING OF ANOTHER.
% >> AND THAT IS BROAD.
% LET'S LOOK AT THE SECOND
% QUESTION.
% IT'S ABOUT SETTING CASH BAIL
% BASED ON THINGS LIKE PAST
% CRIMINAL HISTORY, PROTECTING THE
% COMMUNITY FROM SERIOUS HARM AND
% AFFIRMATIVE DEFENSES.
% NOW, AFFIRMATIVE DEFENSES, WHAT
% IS THAT?
% >> SO AN AFFIRMATIVE DEFENSE IS
% A LEGAL TERM THAT WE USE TO
% DESCRIBE WHEN SOMEONE ENGAGES IN
% CONDUCT THAT, UNDER THE LAW,
% WOULD ORDINARILY BE ILLEGAL, BUT
% THE PERSON IS ABLE TO CLAIM AND
% PROVE THAT THE CIRCUMSTANCES
% WERE SUCH THAT IT WASN'T ILLEGAL
% IN THAT PARTICULAR INSTANCE.
% THE BEST EXAMPLE OF THIS IS
% SELF-DEFENSE.% SO ORDINARIL
Y YOU DON'T GET TO
% HIT SOMEONE OR HURT SOMEONE, BUT
% IF YOU'RE ACTING IN
% SELF-DEFENSE, THEN IT'S NOT
% ILLEGAL.
% >> DOES THIS SEEM REASONABLE OR
% UNREASONABLE TO CONSIDER THINGS
% LIKE PAST CONVICTIONS?
% >> WELL, I THINK WE HAVE TO SORT
% OF STOP AND ASK WHAT IT IS THAT
% WE'RE DOING.
% SO, AGAIN, UNDER EXISTING LAW,
% JUDGES ALREADY CAN IMPOSE
% CONDITIONS ON PEOPLE THAT ARE
% DESIGNED TO ADVANCE LEGITIMATE
% CONSIDERATIONS.
% THE QUESTION NOW IN QUESTION TWO
% IS WHEN WE GET TO ASK PEOPLE TO
% PAY MONEY TO POST CASH BOND IN
% ORDER TO BE ABLE TO SECURE
% RELEASE.
% >> WHAT ARE THE CONSEQUENCES OF
% THESE IF THEY PASS FOR COURTS?
% >> SO THE BIGGEST CHANGE HAS TO
% DO WITH CASH BOND.
% UNDER OUR CURRENT LAW, YOU ARE
% ONLY ALLOWED AS A COURT TO ASK
% SOMEONE TO POST MONEY TO BE
% RELEASED DURING THAT PERIOD
% BEFORE CONVICTION.
% IF YOU HAVE CONCERNS IF THE
% PERSON ISN'T GOING TO SHOW UP TO
% COURT, THE IDEA IS WE'RE ASKING
% YOU TO PAY MONEY AS AN INCENTIVE
% BECAUSE YOU FORFEIT IT IF YOU
% DON'T SHOW UP.
% NOW, UNDER THE CHANGE, WE WOULD
% BE ABLE TO ASK YOU TO GIVE MONEY
% IN A MUCH BROADER ARRAY OF
% SITUATIONS WHERE WE ACTUALLY
% DON'T HAVE NECESSARILY A CONCERN
% THAT YOU'RE NOT GOING TO SHOW UP
% IN COURT BUT WE'RE JUST -- WE
% DON'T LIKE THE KIND OF CRIME
% THAT YOU ARE ALLEGED TO HAVE
% COMMITTED.
% THAT'S A VERY DIFFERENT WAY TO
% USE CASH THAN WE HAVE BEEN USING
% IT IN THE PAST.
% >> DOES IT SEEM AS THOUGH CASH
% BAILS WILL GO HIGHER AND PEOPLE
% WILL SIT IN JAIL LONGER?
% >> THAT IS CERTAINLY A
% POSSIBILITY.
% EVEN MORE IMPORTANTLY, IT'S
% LIKELY TO BE IMPOSED MORE
% FREQUENTLY.%AND THE REASON W
HY THAT MIGHT BE
% A PROBLEM FOR US IS THAT UNDER
% THE LAW, YOU'RE NOT SUPPOSED TO
% USE CASH TO KEEP PEOPLE
% DETAINED.%CASH BOND IS ALWAY
S SUPPOSED TO
% BE JUST A WAY OF MAKING SURE
% PEOPLE ARE COMPLYING WITH THE
% RULES TO DECIDE IF THEY ACTUALLY
% ARE GUILTY OR NOT.
% THE IDEA ISN'T IF YOU HAVE
% MONEY, YOU GET TO BE OUT PENDING
% RELEASE AND IF YOU DON'T HAVE
% MONEY, YOU'RE STUCK, AND SO WE
% SHOULD SET HIGH BONDS THAT
% PEOPLE CAN'T MEET.
% IN FACT, UNDER EXISTING LAW,
% U.S. AND STATE LAW, YOU HAVE TO
% SET REASONABLE BONDS IN AMOUNTS
% THAT PEOPLE ARE EXPECTED TO BE
% ABLE TO PAY, PEOPLE ARE SUPPOSED
% TO BE OUT PENDING RELEASE, AND
% WE USE CONDITIONS TO KEEP
% EVERYONE SAFE, NOT MONEY, WHICH
% HAS DISPARATE EFFECTS ON
% DIFFERENT PEOPLE.
% >> WITH LESS THAN HALF A MINUTE
% LEFT, WHAT IS YOUR GUIDANCE TO
% VOTERS WHEN THEY LOOK AT THESE.
% >> SPEND TIME THINKING ABOUT
% WHAT GOOD IS BEING DONE BY
% IMPOSING CASH IN MORE CASES.
% IT'S IMPORTANT TO REMEMBER WE
% ALREADY HAVE A STATUTE IN THE
% STATE THAT ALLOWS PEOPLE
% CONVICTED OF CERTAIN CRIMES OF
% VIOLENCE TO BE ABLE TO BE
% DETAINED WITHOUT RELEASE UNDER
% ANY CIRCUMSTANCES WHEN WE HAVE
% SERIOUS ENOUGH SAFETY
% CONVERSATIONS.%>> ALL RIGHT.
% PROFESSOR, THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
% WE APPRECIATE IT.
% >> MY PLEASURE.
% THANK YOU.
% >> WISCONSIN VOTERS WILL SEE ONE
% MORE QUESTION ON THE BALLOT, BUT
% IT WILL HAVE NO POLICY EFFECT AS
% IT IS A NON-BINDING REFERENDUM.
% T READS SHALL ABLE-BODIED
% CHILDLESS ADULTS BE REQUIRED TO
% LOOK FOR WORK IN ORDER TO
% RECEIVE TAXPAYER FUNDED WELFARE
% BENEFITS.
% REPUBLICANS SAY THEY ADDED THIS
% QUESTION TO THE BALLOT AS A WAY
% OF GAGING PUBLIC OPINION ABOUT
% THE ISSUE, WHILE CANDIDATES SAY
% BECAUSE THERE ARE ALREADY WORK
% OR TRAINING REQUIREMENTS FOR
% BENEFITS, IT IS INTENDED TO
% BOOST TURN-OUT AMONG
% CONSERVATIVE VOTERS IN THE STATE
% SUPREME COURT RACE.
% YOU CAN LEARN MORE ABOUT THE
% CANDIDATES AND ISSUES AS WELL AS
% FOLLOW ELECTION NIGHT RESULTS BY
% VISITING WISCONSIN VOTE DOT-ORG.
% >>> FOR MORE ON THIS AND OTHER
% ISSUES FACING WISCONSIN, VISIT
% OUR WEBSITE AT PBS WISCONSIN
% DOT-ORG AND THEN CLICK ON THE
% NEWS TAB.
% THAT'S OUR PROGRAM FOR TONIGHT.
% I'M FREDERICA FREYBERG.
% HAVE A GOOD WEEKEND.
% (CLOSED CAPTIONING BY RIVERSIDE
% CAPTIONING COMPANY)
% FUNDING IS PROVIDED BY THE FOCUS
% FUND FOR JOURNALISM AND FRIENDS
% OF PBS WISCONSIN.