% >> Announcer: THE FOLLOWING
% PROGRAM IS A PBS WISCONSIN
% ORIGINAL PRODUCTION.
% >>> NOW WITH ROE V. WADE
% OVERTURNED, ACCESS TO ABORTION
% IN WISCONSIN IS SUSPENDED.
% TONIGHT WE EXPLORE WHAT HAPPENS
% NOW AND THE CONFUSING LEGAL AND
% MEDICAL LANDSCAPE.
% THIS RULING LEAVES IN ITS WAKE.
% IT'S "HERE AND NOW" FOR JULY 1.
% ♪
% >>> TODAY I AM ANNOUNCING THAT
% WE'RE TAKING THIS FIGHT BACK TO
% THE COURTS.
% I'VE AUTHORIZED ATTORNEY GENERAL
% JOSH KAUL TO FILE A LAWSUIT
% TODAY THAT IS A DIRECT CHALLENGE
% OF WISCONSIN'S 1849 CRIMINAL
% ABORTION BAN.
% AN OVERWHELMING MAJORITY OF
% WISCONSINITES SUPPORTED ROW --
% ROE IN MAKING SURE ABORTIONS
% REMAIN SAFE AND LEGAL IN
% WISCONSIN.%>> TO IT THE RAMIF
ICATIONS IN
% WISCONSIN IN THE WAKE OF THE
% U.S. SUPREME COURT DECISION
% OVERTURNING ROE V. WADE.
% BECAUSE THE HIGH COURT SENT IT
% BACK TO THE STATES, WISCONSIN
% NOW REVERTS TO A STATUTE PASSED
% IN 1849 THAT PROHIBITS ABORTION.
% BUT THERE HAVE BEEN ADDITIONAL
% AND CONFLICTING STATE ABORTION
% LAWS PASSED SINCE THEN.
% IN A MOMENT WE'LL HEAR FROM
% ATTORNEY GENERAL JOSH KAUL WHO
% SAYS THE 19th CENTURY BAN ON
% ABORTION IS UNENFORCEABLE
% BECAUSE OF DUELING LAWS ON THE
% BOOKS.
% >>> BUT FIRST NATHAN TAKES US
% THROUGH THE BRO DEPRESSION OF
% ABORTION -- PROGRESSION OF
% ABORTION LAWS IN WISCONSIN.
% >> Reporter: THE 1849 LAW
% PROHIBITS ABORTION OUTRIGHT,
% MAKING IT WHY -- ILLEGAL TO
% PERFORM AN ABORTION AFTER A
% MOTHER FEELS FETAL MOVEMENT,
% UNLESS IT IS TO SAVE THE
% MOTHER'S LIFE.
% UNDER THAT LAW, ANY PERSON WHO
% PERFORMS AN ABORTION COULD BE
% GUILTY OF A FELONY.
% AS THE CHANGES OVER THE YEARS,
% IN 1858 A NEW LAW MADE IT A
% FELONY TO ABORT AT ANY POINT
% AFTER CONCEPTION.
% MORE THAN 100 YEARS AFTER THAT,
% THE U.S. SUPREME COURT RULED IN
% ROE V. WADE.
% THE 1973 CASE HELD THAT THE
% CONSTITUTION PROTECTS A WOMAN'S
% RIGHT TO AN ABORTION PRIOR TO
% THE VIABILITY OF THE FETUS.
% INTERESTEDE ROE THE DECISION TO
% TERMINATE THE PREGNANCY WAS
% SOLELY AT THE DISCRETION OF THE
% WOMAN DURING THE FIRST THREE
% MONTHS.
% WISCONSIN'S POST-ROE LIMITS
% INCLUDED A LAW PROHIBITING
% ABORTIONS OF A 20 WEEKS EXCEPT
% FOR THE LIFE OR HEALTH OF THE
% MOTHER.
% MORE UPDATES TO THE STATUTED
% CONTINUED.
% A SET OF LAWS FROM 2017 PUT
% RESTRICTIONS INCLUDING A WAITING
% PERIOD AND MANDATORY
% ULTRASOUNDS.
% [CHANTING]%>> Reporter: SO WH
EN THE U.S.
% SUPREME COURT STRUCK DOWN
% ROLFED, THE -- ROE V. WADE, THE
% DECISION LEFT THE OLD AND NEW
% LAWS ON ON THE BOOKS IN
% WISCONSIN.%>> HAVING BOTH THE
OLD AND NEW
% LAWS ON THE BOOKS MAKES THE 1849
% LAW UNENFORCEABLE.
% THAT'S ACCORDING TO WISCONSIN
% ATTORNEY GENERAL JOSH KAUL.
% HE'S FILED A LAWSUIT SEEKING TO
% CLARIFY WHETHER THE 173 BAN IS
% STILL IN PLACE.
% JOSH KAUL JOINS US NOW FROM THE
% CAPITOL.
% THANKS VERY MUCH FOR BEING HERE.
% >> THANKS FOR HAVING ME.
% >> WHY ACCORDING TO YOUR LAWSUIT
% WOULD THE 1849 ABORTION BAN BE
% UNENFORCEABLE?%>> WELL, FIRST
I THINK IT'S
% IMPORTANT JUST TO SAY WHERE WE
% ARE, WHICH IS YOU KNOW, WE'RE A
% WEEK AFTER ROE VS. WADE WAS
% OVERRULED AND THE IMPACT IS THAT
% WOMEN IN WISCONSIN TODAY ARE
% LESS FREE, LESS EQUAL, AND LESS
% SAFE THAN THEY WERE JUST A WEEK
% AGO.
% SO WE ARE DOING WHAT WE CAN TO
% WORK TO RESTORE ACCESS TO SAFE
% AND LEGAL ABORTION IN WISCONSIN.
% NOW, OUR SUIT ARGUES THAT THE
% 18 -- MID 1800s BAN DOESN'T
% COME INTO EFFECT EVEN THOUGH
% IT'S STILL ON THE BOOKS FOR A
% COUPLE REASONS.
% THERE WERE A SERIES OF LAWS THAT
% WERE PASSED MUCH MORE RECENTLY
% THAT ARE INCONSISTENT WITH THAT
% 19th CENTURY BAN, SO FOR
% EXAMPLE THE 19th SEN TRAY BAN
% DOESN'T HAVE AN EXCEPTION EVEN
% TO PROTECT THE HEALTH OF THE
% MOTHER.
% BUT THE NEW LEGISLATION DOES.
% AND IT CAN'T BE SIMULTANEOUSLY
% LEGAL AND ILLEGAL FOR A DOCTOR
% TO PERFORM AN ABORTION THAT
% PROTECTS THE HEALTH OF THE
% MOTHER.
% SO TO MAKE SURE THAT OUR
% STATEUTES CONTINUE TO HAVE A
% EFFECT IN MORE RECENT ONES, THE
% OLD ONE CAN'T BE ENFORCED.
% OLD STATUTE HAS GONE INTO DISUSE
% BECAUSE IT WAS RARELY USED
% BEFORE AND IT HASN'T BEEN USED
% IN THE LAST 50 YEARS.
% >> HAS THIS HAPPENED BEFORE
% WHERE AN EARLIER LAW THAT
% REMAINS ON THE BOOKS WAS
% SUPERCEDED BY A LATER ONE?
% >> THERE IS PRESS SENT FOR
% LAWS -- PRECEDENT FOR LAWS TO BE
% IMPLIEDBLY REPEALED.
% IT'S NOT COMPLON.
% BUT THIS IS NOT -- COMMON.
% BUT THAT IS NOT A COMMON
% SITUATION.
% WE'RE IN A SITUATION WHERE THE
% LEGISLATOR ACTED ABORTION WAS
% PROTECTED.
% THAT A RIGHT WAS TAKEN AWAY FROM
% AMERICANS AFTER ALMOST 50 YEARS.
% WE'RE IN UNCHARTED WATERS HERE.
% BUT YOU KNOW, THAT SORTING
% ISSUES OUT SO THEIRS CLARITY --
% SO THERE'S CLARITY AS TO WHAT
% THE LAW IS IS CRITICAL.
% >> EVEN THOUGH THERE ARE
% COMPETING ABORTION LAWS ON THE
% BOOKS, IS IT AS OF TODAY
% ILLEGAL?
% PROVIDERS ARE CERTAINLY
% PRACTICING THAT WAY WITH PLANNED
% PARENTHOOD TURNING AWAY PEOPLE
% IMMEDIATELY FOLLOWING LAST
% FRIDAY'S RULING.
% BUT IS IT IMMEDIATELY ILLEGAL?
% >> WELL, OUR ARGUMENT IS THAT
% IT'S NOT BECAUSE THAT OL STATUTE
% IS NOT IN EFFECT.
% BUT PROVIDERS ARE OF COURSE --
% THEY DON'T WANT TO TAKE A CHANCE
% THAT WHAT THEY'LL BE DOING COULD
% LEAD TO A CRIMINAL PROSECUTION.
% SO THIS SUIT WILL HELP DETERMINE
% EXACTLY WHAT THE STATE OF THE
% LAW IS.
% ONE OF THE REASONS IT'S SO
% IMPORTANT TO GO FORWARD IS THAT
% WISCONSIN PROVIDERS NEED TO HAVE
% CLARITY ABOUT WHAT THE STATE OF
% THE LAW IS.
% THE BEST WAY TO GET THAT CLARITY
% WOULD BE FOR OUR LEGISLATURE TO
% COME INTO SESSION AND ACT
% LEGISLATION AND HOPEFULLY
% PROTECT REPRODUCTIVE FREEDOM.
% BUT HAVING THIS LITIGATION WILL
% HOPEFULLY BEGIN THE PROCESS OF
% PROVIDING CLARITY AS WE TRY TO
% THINK ABOUT WHETHER AND HOW A
% 19th CENTURY LAW THAT WAS IN
% PLACE WOULD APPLY TO 21ST
% CENTURY MEDICINE.
% >> STILL, COULD A D.A. INTENT ON
% PROSECUTING A CASE UNDER THE
% 1849 LAW DO SO NOW?
% >> WELL, MY OFFICE CAN'T STOP
% THEM FROM DOING SO.
% THEY CAN CHOOSE TO USE THEIR
% RESOURCES HOWEVER THEY WANT.
% I WOULD DISCOURAGE THEM FROM
% DOING THAT BECAUSE I'D MUCH
% RATHER SEE THEM USING THEIR
% LIMITED RESOURCES TO PROSECUTE
% SERIOUS OFFENSES LIKE HOMICIDES
% OR SEXUAL ASSAULTS OR DRUG
% TRAFFICKING.%BUT WHETHER THEY
CAN OR NOT WILL
% ULTIMATELY DEPEND ON WHAT
% HAPPENS WITH OUR SUIT, BECAUSE
% IF THE LAW CAN'T BE ENFORCED, IF
% WE RECEIVE THAT RULING IN THE
% SUIT, THEN THERE WOULD BE NO
% BASIS FOR ENFORCEMENT.
% BUT IF THE SUPREME COURT FINDS
% THAT IT CAN BE ENFORCED, THEN
% IT'S UP TO THE D.A.s WHETHER
% THEY PROSECUTE CASES.
% >> WHAT'S YOUR SENSE AS TO HOW
% FAST ANY KIND OF RULING MIGHT BE
% MADE ON THIS?
% >> I THINK IT'S LIKELY TO BE A
% MATTER OF MONTHS.
% YOU KNOW, THIS IS A LEGAL
% DISPUTE FUNDAMENTALLY, NOT A
% DISPUTE ABOUT UNDERLYING FACTS.
% AND SO I THINK A COURT CAN RULE
% RELATIVELY QUICKLY.
% BUT THERE WILL BE BRIEFING.
% THERE WILL BE ARGUMENTS BEFORE
% THE COURT.
% AND THEN AFTER THE CIRCUIT COURT
% RULES, THERE'S LIKELY GOING TO
% BE APPEALS AS WELL.
% SO WE'RE NOT GOING TO HAVE
% CLARITY IMMEDIATELY.
% IT'S GOING TO TAKE A BIT OF
% TIME.%BUT I WANT TO MOVE THR
OUGH THE
% COURT SYSTEM AS QUICKLY AS
% POSSIBLE.%IN THE MEANTIME, I
HAVE CALLED
% AND CONTINUE TO CALL ON THE
% LEGISLATOR TO COME INTO SESSION
% AND HELP PROVIDE SOME CLARITY SO
% DOCTORS AND NURSES AND WOMEN IN
% WISCONSIN HAVE A BETTER
% UNDERSTANDING, A CLEARER PICTURE
% OF WHAT THE LAW IS.
% >> SO WE SHOULD TELL OUR VIEWERS
% THAT WE DID INVITE REPUBLICAN
% LEGISLATIVE LEADERS TO APPEAR
% TONIGHT.%NEITHER OF THEM RESP
ONDED.
% BUT HERE IS WHAT SPEAKER VOSS
% SAID ABOUT YOUR LAWSUIT.
% HE SAID, QUOTE, IT'S SAD THAT
% REVERSE AND KAUL WANT TO BREAK
% THE LAW INSTEAD OF WORK WITH THE
% LEGISLATURE.%I'M CONFIDENT OU
R COURTS WILL
% SEE THROUGH THEIR TACTICS, HE
% SAYS, AND UPHOLD THE LAW.
% WHAT IS YOUR RESPONSE TO SPEAKER
% VOSS' STATEMENT?
% >> WELL, FIRST, PART OF THE
% ISSUE IS WE HAVE INCONSISTENT
% LAWS.
% AND WHICH SETS OF THOSE LAWS
% APPLY IS ONE OF THE THINGS WE
% WANT TOY SOLVE THROUGH THE
% COURTS.%BUT WE ARE HAPPY TO
WORK WITH
% LEGISLATIVE LEADERS.
% YOU KNOW, THE GOVERNOR CALLED
% THE SPECIAL SESSION AND MOST
% REPUBLICAN LAWMAKERS DIDN'T EVEN
% SHOW UP FOR THAT SPECIAL
% SESSION.%THEY GAVELED IN AND
GAVELED OUT
% AND THEN JUST A FEW DAYS LATER,
% WE WERE LEFT IN THIS STATE OF
% LEGAL UNCERTAINTY BECAUSE ROE
% WAS OVERTURNED AND WE STILL
% HAVEN'T HEARD FROM OUR
% LEGISLATORS.%THIS IS A HUGE D
EVELOPMENT IN
% WISCONSIN THAT'S IMPACTING MANY
% PEOPLE'S LIVES.
% AND WISCONSINITES DESERVE TO
% HAVE THEIR LEGISLATORS STEP UP,
% HEAR FROM THEM ON THESE ISSUES,
% DEBATE THESE ISSUES, AND I HOPE
% ACT TO PROTECT ACCESS TO SAFE
% AND LEGAL ABORTION.
% >> SO JUST BRIEFLY, IF YOU
% WORKED WITH THE LEGISLATURE AT
% THIS POINT, EVEN AFTER THAT
% SPECIAL SESSION, WHAT WOULD YOU
% SEEK?
% >> WELL, I WOULD WANT THEM TO
% RESTORE ACCESS TO SAFE AND LEGAL
% ABORTION IN WISCONSIN.
% YOU KNOW, THE SITUATION THAT WE
% HAD IN WISCONSIN PRIOR TO ROE
% BEING OVERTURNED WAS ACTUALLY A
% FAIRLY RESTRICTIVE SET OF RULES.
% A LOT OF THE LAWS THAT ARE IN
% PLACE WERE SIGNED BY GOVERNOR
% WALKER.
% AND RETURNING TO THAT KIND OF
% SITUATION, WHERE WOMEN WHO NEED
% TO OBTAIN ABORTIONS ARE ABLE TO
% GET THEM AND ARE SAFE DOING SO.
% IT'S CRITICAL TO PROTECTING THE
% HEALTH AND SAFETY OF WISCONSIN
% WOMEN.%WE KNOW THAT WHEN ABOR
TION IS
% ILLEGAL, IT DOESN'T STOP
% ABORTION FROM HAPPENING.
% WHAT IT STOPS IS SAFE AND LEGAL
% ABORTION FROM HAPPENS.
% WE'VE -- HAPPENING.
% WE'VE GOT TO GET BACK TO
% PROTECTING PEOPLE'S REPRODUCTIVE
% FREEDOM.
% >> THANKS VERY MUCH.
% >> THANKS FOR HAVING ME.
% >>> SHORTLY AFTER THE HIGH COURT
% OVERTURNED ROE V. WADE, GOVERNOR
% EVERS ANNOUNCED HE WOULD GRANT
% CLEMENCY TO ANYONE CHARGED UNDER
% THE ABORTION BAN AND WOULD NOT
% APITTSBURG STATE PROSECUTORS WHO
% AGREED TO ENFORCE THE LAW.
% OUR NEXT GUEST IS A SITTING
% DISTRICT ATTORNEY.
% WHAT WILL HE DO?
% TIM GRUENKE IS THE D.A. IN
% LA CROSSE COUNTY.
% HE JOINS US NOW AND THANKS VERY
% MUCH FOR BEING HERE.
% >> GLAD TO BE HERE.
% >> SO YOU HAVE SAID THAT YOU
% DON'T AGREE WITH THE OVERTURNING
% OF ROE V. WADE.
% BUT WOULD BE OBLIGED TO
% PROSECUTE ABORTION CASES UNDER
% THE LAW.
% WHY?%>> I THINK THAT IN THE E
XECUTIVE
% BRANCH, OUR FUNCTION IS TO
% ENFORCE THE LAWS.
% AND THERE ARE MANY LAWS THAT THE
% LEGISLATURE PASSES THAT I MIGHT
% HAVE A DISAGREEMENT WITH OR I
% THINK ARE UNWISE OR SOMETIMES
% MIGHT BE ACTUALLY MORE HARMFUL
% THAN GOOD.
% I CAN PRIORITIZE MY CASES.
% I CAN DEEMPHASIZES SOME OF THE
% LOST.%WE COME UP WITH CREATI
VE
% SOLUTIONS LIKE THE DIVERSION
% AGREEMENTS OR ORDINANCE
% VIOLATIONS, BUT I NEVER SET UP
% ANY LAW THAT I WOULD NEVER
% PROSECUTE A LAW.
% I THINK OUR JOB IS TO ENFORCE
% LAWS AS PROSECUTORS.
% SO IF THE LAW WERE PASSED, IF
% THE LAW WERE HELD BY THE COURTS,
% I HAVE TO PROSECUTE IT JUST LIKE
% ANY OTHER CASE.
% I WOULD LOOK AT THE FACTS.
% I WOULD DETERMINE IF IT'S A GOOD
% CASE.%I WOULD DETERMINE IF W
E COULD
% PROVE IT.
% WOULD A JURY CONVICT AND
% QUESTIONS LIKE THAT.
% BUT I WOULD NEVER SAY ABOUT ANY
% CRIME THAT I WOULD NEVER
% PROSECUTE OR THAT I WOULD ALWAYS
% PROSECUTE IT.
% >> WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT
% D.A.s WHO STATE THEY WILL OR
% WILL NOT CHARGE CERTAIN TYPES OF
% CASES LIKE THE DANE COUNTY D.A.
% WHO PLEDGES NOT TO PROSECUTE
% ABORTION CASES?
% >> I UNDERSTAND THE SENTIMENT.
% I ALSO THINK THAT WOMEN SHOULD
% HAVE THE RIGHT TO CONTROL THEIR
% OWN BODIES AND I -- I'M UPSET
% THAT THE ROACHEDZ -- ROE VS.
% WADE WAS OVERTURNED, BUT MY
% PERSONAL FEELINGS JUST DON'T
% PLAY IN IT.
% WHEN THE LEGISLATURE PASS AS
% LAWR THAT'S SUPPOSED TO REFLECT
% THE WILL OF THE PEOPLE N AS THE
% D.A. I'M SUPPOSEES TO REPRESENT
% ALL PEOPLE OF LA CROSSE COUNTY
% AND NOT TAKE MY PERSONAL VIEWS
% IN IT.
% I DON'T AGREE WHEN PROSECUTORS
% WON'T ENFORCE GUN RESTRICTIONS
% BECAUSE THEY'RE SECOND AMENDMENT
% FANS I OR THEY WON'T PROSECUTE
% SEXUAL ASSAULT CASES BECAUSE
% THEY HAVE A DIFFERENT IDEA OF
% THE LAW.
% I DON'T THINK THE D.A. SHOULD BE
% IN THE BUSINESS OF NOT BROTHERS
% CUTING LAWS PASSED BY
% LEGISLATURE.%>> AS A DISTRICT
ATTORNEY WHO
% WOULD HAVE IF DRESS --
% DISCRETION, WOULD YOU
% PRACTICALLY, CHOE, RIGHT NOW
% BE -- THOUGH, RIGHT NOW BE ABLE
% TO TAKE A CASE TO COURT?
% >> PRACICALLY I DON'T KNOW THAT
% IT'S POSSIBLE RIGHT NOW.
% IN WISCONSIN THERE'S TWO
% ABORTION STATUTES THAT SOMEWHAT
% CONFLICT WITH EACH OTHER.
% ONE IN 1849 AND WITHIN IN 1985.
% THEY HAVE DIFFERENT PENALTIES
% AND DIFFERENT EXCEPTIONS.
% THEY HAVE DIFFERENT DEFINITIONS.
% SO AT THIS POINT I'M NOT SURE IF
% LEGISLATURE INTENDS -- WHAT ONE
% THE LEGISLATURE INTEND US TO
% FOLLOW.%SO IT WOULD BE DIFFI
CULT TO GET
% A CASE, FIGURE OUT WHICH LAW
% APPLY, AND PRACTICALLY GO
% FORWARD AND PROSECUTE THAT CASE
% UNTIL THE COURTS MAKE A RULING
% OR IF ATTORNEYS LAWSUIT IS
% SUCCESSFUL OR THE LEGISLATURE
% PASS AS LAW THAT'S CLEARER AND
% REFLECTS THE INTENT OF WISCONSIN
% PEOPLE, I THINK IT WOULD BE HARD
% PRACTICALLY TO ENFORCE THE LAWS
% ON THE BOOKS NOW.
% >> SO YOU WERE WITH JOSH KAUL
% SAYING IT'S UNENFORCEABLE AT
% THIS TIME, IS THAT THE SAME
% THING?%>> I THINK IT'S PRACTI
CALLY
% UN
% ENFORCEABLE.%WHEN THE CASE CO
MES IN IT MAY BE
% DIFFERENT.
% BUT AT THIS . I'M NOT SURE
% HOW -- AT THIS POINT I'M NOT
% SURE HOW DISTRICT ATTORNEYS
% UNDERSTAND WHICH TWO LAWS ARE
% SUPPOSED TO BE ENFORCED WHEN
% THEY'RE PROHIBITING THE SAME
% CONDUCT BUT DIFFERENT
% DEFINITIONS AND PENALTIES AND
% SEEM TO HAVE DIFFERENT INTENT.
% >> IF THE COURTS AS A RESULT OF
% JOSH KAUL'S LAWSUIT UPHOLD
% COMPLETE BANS ON ABORTIONS IN
% WISCONSIN, HOW DO THE CASES COME
% IN FOR CHARGING?
% WHO REFERS THEM?
% WHAT DOES THAT LOOK LIKE?
% >> THERE'S ANOTHER QUESTION THAT
% PRACTICALLY I'M NOT SURE THAT
% THAT WOULD BECOME AN ISSUE
% BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE THE
% ABILITY TO GO INTO DOCTOR'S
% OFFICES, HEALTHCARES IS
% OBVIOUSLY CONFIDENTIAL.
% WE DON'T SEND OVER INVESTIGATORS
% TO HOSPITALS AND EVEN IF WE DID,
% I DON'T THINK THEY'D GAVE US ANY
% INFORMATION.
% SO I'M NOT YEAR ON HOW A CASE
% WOULD EVEN COME TO US.
% AND IF IT DID, I'M NOT SURE WHAT
% INFORMATION WE'D BE ABLE TO
% GATHER AND SO I THINK IT'S
% PRACTICALLY VERY DIFFERENT TO
% ENFORCE THIS -- DIFFICULT TO
% ENFORCE THIS BAN, EVEN THOUGH
% PEOPLE THINK IT'S A CHANGE.
% IT'S NOT SURE MUCH IS GOING TO
% CHANGE IN MOST COUNTIES IN
% WISCONSIN.
% >> SO YOU ARE STANDING BY TO
% FIND SOME CLARITY AROUND THESE
% LAWS.%>> I WOULD URGE THE LE
GISLATURE
% TO DO WHAT I THINK A LOT OF
% PEOPLE WANTED, WHEN ROE VS. WADE
% WAS OVERTURNED, WAS BURN A
% BALLOT TO THE STATES -- RETURN
% THE BALLOTS TO THE STATES.
% AND FIND OUT WHAT WISCONSIN
% REALLY WANTS.
% DO WE WANT EXCEPTIONS, A CERTAIN
% TIME PERIOD, HOW ARE WE DEFINING
% THE -- FINANCIAL HEALTH, HEALTH,
% EMOTIONAL HEALTH.
% THERE'S A LOT OF THINGS THAT
% NEED TO BE FIXED AND I WOULD
% THINK THE LEGISLATURE WANT TO
% WELCOME THAT AND HAVE THAT
% DISCUSSION AND GIVE US SOME
% CLARET ON WHAT IT IS WE'RE
% SUPPOSED TO BE PROSECUTING.
% >> TIM GRUENKE, D.A., THANKS
% VERY MUCH.
% >> THANK YOU.
% >>> WITH THE LAWS IN LIMBO,
% WISCONSIN PHYSICIANS ARE
% CONTENDING WITH WHAT THIS MEANS
% FOR PATIENT CARE.
% MARISA SAT DOWN WITH DR. AMY
% DOMEYER, LEGISLATIVE CHAIR OF
% THE WISCONSIN SECTION OF THE
% AMERICAN COLLEGE OF
% OPINDUSTRIESES AND GIN --
% OBSTETRICIANS AND
% GUANTANAMOCOLOGISTS.
% >> WHAT WAS -- GYNECOLOGISTS.
% >> WHAT WAS YOUR REACTION AND
% YOUR PATIENTS WHEN THIS CAME
% DOWN?%>> THIS IS SOMETHING T
HAT WE AT
% WISCONSIN A.C.O.G. HAVE BEEN
% PREPARING FOR.
% WE'VE BEEN HAVING CONVERSATIONS
% WITHIN OUR STATE AMONGST OTHER
% PHYSICIAN GROUPS TRYING TO
% ANTICIPATE THIS MOMENT AND
% PREPARE THE BEST WE CAN TO TAKE
% THE BEST AND SAFEST CARE OF OUR
% PATIENTS, GIVEN THE CURRENT
% POLITICAL LANDSCAPE OR THE
% CURRENT CHANGE IN WISCONSIN LAW
% REFLECTED BASED ON THE JUDICIAL
% DECISION.%AMERICAN COLLEGE O
F OB GINs
% VIEWS ABORTION, AS ESSENTIALLY
% HEALTHCARE FOR OUR PATIENTS.
% AND SO KNOWING THAT OUR QLEETION
% WHO ARE CARING FOR -- COLLEAGUES
% WHO ARE CARING FOR PATIENTS
% EVERY DAY WHO ARE NEEDING THESE
% SERVICES, IT'S DEVASTATING.
% >> SO NOW THAT THE RIGHT TO
% ACCESS AN ABORTION HAS BEEN
% OVERTURNED, WHERE DOES THAT
% LEAVE PHYSICIANS IN TERMS OF
% PATIENT CARE?
% >> YEAH.
% SO I WOULD SAY, NUMBER ONE,
% WE'RE FOLLOWING VERY CLOSELY THE
% LEGAL LANDSCAPE IN THE STATE OF
% WISCONSIN.%I'M SURE YOU'RE AW
ARE OF THE
% LAWSUIT THAT WAS PLACED
% YESTERDAY BY GOVERNOR EVERS AND
% ATTORNEY GENERAL KAUL.
% SO I THINK ALL OF US ARE
% WATCHING TO SEE HOW THAT MAY
% IMPACT OUR ABILITY TO CARE FOR
% PATIENTS.
% THE CONDITIONS IN THE LAW
% INCLUDE ONE FOR AN EXEMPTION FOR
% THE LIFE OF THE MOTHER.
% AND WHERE THE LIFE OF THE
% PREGNANT PERSON, RATHER.
% AND THE CHALLENGE IS THAT THIS
% LAW, WHICH WAS WRITTEN IN 1849,
% BEFORE ULTRASOUND, BEFORE ANY OF
% THE DIAGNOSTIC TOOLS THAT WE
% HAVE TODAY, DOESN'T GIVE US
% CLARIFICATION OF WHAT THAT
% MEANS.
% AND SO THE CHALLENGE FOR US AS
% PROVIDERS IS TRYING TO INTERPRET
% WHAT THE LIFE OF THE MOTHER
% MEANS.
% HOW SICK DOES A PATIENT HAVE TO
% GET BEFORE I CAN PROVIDE
% SERVICES THAT I KNOW ARE SAFE
% AND EFFECTIVE?
% AND SO I THINK THAT AND WHERE WE
% ARE AT IN TERMS OF OUR STATE
% PROFESSIONAL SOCIETY OF OB/GYNS
% AS TRYING TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO
% BEST PROVIDE THE SAFEST CARE FOR
% OUR PATIENTS, SO THAT WE AREN'T
% WAITING UNTIL A PATIENT CANNOT
% BE PULLED BACK.
% I THINK THERE MAY BE THIS
% MISCONCEPTION THAT, OH, THE LIFE
% OF THE MOTHER.
% WELL, WE CAN JUST DECIDE AT SOME
% POINT THAT SHE'S SICK ENOUGH AND
% THEN PROVIDE TREATMENT AND ALL
% IS WELL.
% PATIENTS THAT ARE ALLOWED TO GET
% SICK ENOUGH ARE IN THE ICU.
% THEY MAY HAVE TO HAVE THEIR
% UTERUS REMOVED FOR LIFESAVING
% CARE.
% SO IT ISN'T SO EASY IN TERMS OF
% MEDICAL DECISION MAKING TO
% PROVIDE A QUICK FIX ONCE A
% PERSON HAS GOTTEN THAT FAR --
% THAT FAR ILL.
% AND PRIOR TO THIS DECISION, IF
% IT GOT TO THAT POINT, IT WAS
% BECAUSE A PATIENT CHOSE TO BE
% THERE.%IT WAS BECAUSE THE PAT
IENT FELT
% STRONG ENOUGH ABOUT THAT
% PREGNANCY AND CONTINUING THAT
% THEY ACCEPTED THE RISK OF SEVERE
% ILLNESS OR POTENTIAL DEATH.
% AND NOW WITH THIS LAW, THAT
% WON'T BE THE CASE.
% >> IF A SITUATION RIGHT NOW
% WITHOUT THE LAW BEING CLEARED
% UP, PRESENTED ITSELF, THAT A
% PREGNANCY WOULD NEED TO BE
% TERMINATED, IS THAT SOMETHING
% THAT PHYSICIANS LIKE YOURSELF
% ARE GOING TO DO IF NEEDED FOR
% THE MOTHER?
% >> YEAH.
% I THINK HONESTLY RIGHT NOW,
% WE'RE STILL SORTING 3 OUT.
% SO THE ANSWER IS I HOPE YES,
% BECAUSE OF THE LIFE OF THE
% MOTHER IS AT RISK.
% I HOPE ANY OB/GYN WOULD
% RECOGNIZE THAT AND QUICKLY REACH
% OUT TO PARTNERS AT OTHER
% HOSPITALS TO GET APPROVAL SO
% THAT THIS CAN MOVE FORWARD SO
% PATIENTS' LIVES ARE SAVED.
% THAT SAID, I WOULD IMAGINE GIVEN
% THE CRIMINAL PENALTIES FOR
% PHYSICIANS THAT ANY DOCTOR IN
% THAT SITUATION WOULD FEEL
% SCARED.%YOU KNOW, IT'S A FEL
ONY
% CONVICTION.%>> I GOT KIDS AT
HOME.
% I'M DOING YOUR PAP SMEERGS.
% I'M NOT -- PAP SMEARS.
% I'M NO A FELON.
% SO THAT'S SCARY.
% >> WHAT THE LAW IS CLEARED UP OR
% ATTEMPTED TO BE CLEARED UP, ARE
% THERE LAWS THAT CAN CAPTURE WHAT
% IT USED TO BE A CONVERSATION
% BETWEEN A PATIENT AND THE
% PHYSICIAN?%>> I THINK IN GENE
RAL, AS
% DOCTORS, AS OB/GYNS, WE ARE VERY
% RESISTANT TO GOVERNMENT
% INTRUSION ON DOCTOR/PATIENT
% RELATIONSHIPS.
% SO LEGISLATING MEDICAL CARE
% PRESENTS A DANGER IN US BEING
% ABLE TO PROVIDE AGAIN, THE BEST
% AND SAFEST CARE FOR OUR
% PATIENTS.%>> WE'RE GOING LEA
VE IT THERE
% FOR TODAY.
% DR. DOMEYER, THANK YOU SO MUCH
% FOR JOINING US.
% >> THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR HAVING
% ME.%>> YOU CAN SEE THE EXTEN
DED
% VERSION OF THAT INTERVIEW ON OUR
% WEB PAGE.
% >>> PLANNED PARENTHOOD OF
% WISCONSIN SUSPENDED ITS ABORTION
% SERVICES IMMEDIATELY UPON THE
% SUPREME COURT DECISION
% OVERTURNING ROE V. WADE.
% THE PROVIDER HAS PATIENT
% NAVIGATORS TO HELP PEOPLE FIND
% OUT-OF-STATE OPTIONS, LIKE THOSE
% ACROSS THE BORDER IN ILLINOIS,
% WHERE ABORTION REMAINS LEGAL.
% WE ECONOMIC IN WITH JULIE UHAL
% OF PRIND OF ILLINOIS WHO
% MANAGE -- PLANNED PARENTHOOD OF
% ILLINOIS WHO MANAGES ITS
% PROGRAM.%THANKS SO MUCH FOR B
EING HERE.
% >> VERY FOR HAVING ME ON TODAY.
% >> WHAT KIND OF INFLUX HAS
% PLANNED PARENTHOOD OF ILLINOIS
% SEEN FROM BOARDING STATES LIKE
% WISCONSIN?
% >> THANKS FOR ASKING THAT.
% WE'RE PREPARING FOR THIS MOMENT
% FOR A REALLY LONG TIME.
% AND PROJECTIONS HAVE SHOWN THAT
% WE'RE ANTICIPATING SEEING UP TO
% 20 TO 30,000 ADDITIONAL PATIENTS
% FROM OTHER STATES.
% IT WILL TAKE A LONG TIME TO SEE
% EXACT NUMBERS AND TRENDS.
% IT'S ONLY BEEN A WEEK.
% FEELS LIKE FIVE YEARS SINCE THE
% DECISION CAME DOWN.
% BUT I CAN SURE THAT OUR CALL
% VOLUME DOUBLED ON FRIDAY AND
% SATURDAY, INCLUDING FROM
% WISCONSIN PATIENTS WHO LIKE YOU
% SAID MAY HAVE BEEN AT THE CLINIC
% FOR AN APPOINTMENT LAST FRIDAY
% AND WERE FORCED TO RESCHEDULE
% THAT AND IT CREATED A LOT OF
% CHAOS AND CONFUSION.
% >> INDEED.
% YOU'RE SECURING ACCESS FOR
% EVERYONE OR SAFE PROGRAM.
% DID YOU STAND THIS UP JUST FOR
% THIS EVENTUALITY OR HAS IT BEEN
% LONG STANDING?
% >> IT WAS FOR THIS EVENTUALITY.
% WE'VE SEEN THE WRITING ON THE
% WALLS FOR YEARS NOW, KNOWING
% THAT YOU KNOW, FAR RIGHT
% CONSERVATIVES HAVE BEEN PLANNING
% TO OVERTURN ABORTION ACCESS IN
% THIS COUNTRY.
% SO THE PROGRAM OFFICIALLY
% STARTED IN 2019.
% >> SO PLANNED PARENTHOOD HAS
% PATIENT NAVIGATORS TO HELP WITH
% OUT-OF-STATE ABORTION CARE.
% HOW DOES THAT WORK EXACTLY?
% >> SO A PATIENT NAVIGATOR IS
% KIND OF LIKE A CASE MANAGER,
% KIND OF LIKE THE TRAVEL AGENT.
% AND THEIR JOB IS SPECIFICALLY TO
% WORK WITH PATIENTS WHO FACE
% LOGISTICAL BARRIERS TO ACCESS
% ABORTION CARE.
% AND AS YOU CAN IMAGINE, THAT'S
% GOING TO BECOME MORE COMPLICATED
% AND DIFFICULT AS THEY'RE FORCED
% TO TRAVEL FURTHER.
% IT GENDS PATIENT BY PATIENT WHAT
% SORT OF ASSISTANCE THEY NEED.
% SOMETIMES IT'S SUBSIDY,
% SOMETIMES IT'S HOTEL, CHILD
% CARE, FOOD VOUCHERS AND GOOD
% VOUCHER.%WE TRY TO ASSIST ANY
OF THOSE
% NEEDS THEY MIGHT BE FACING.
% >> I READ THAT ANTIABORTION
% GROUPS ARE DRAFTING MODEL
% LEGISLATION TO ALLOW PRIVATE
% CITIZENS THE RIGHT TO SUE FOR
% ANYONE TERMINATING A PREGNANCY
% OUT OF STATE.
% WHAT'S YOUR REACTION TO THAT?
% >> I'M DISAPPOINTED BUT NOT
% SURPRISED.%I THINK THAT THEY
HAVE BEEN
% TESTING EVERY OUTLET THEY CAN IN
% ORDER TO CRIMINALIZE FOLKS FOR
% ACCESSING THAT HEALTHCARE THAT
% THEY NEED.
% BUT YOU KNOW, WE'RE NOT GOING TO
% STOP AND WE'RE COMMITTED TO
% HELPING PEOPLE ACCESS THAT CARE
% HOWEVER WE CAN.
% >> HOW IS SAFETY ENSURED FOR
% WOMEN WHO MIGHT TRAVEL FROM
% THEIR HOME STATES FOR AN
% ABORTION PROCEDURE?
% >> SO I JUST WANT TO EMPHASIZE
% THAT ABORTION IS SAFE AND
% EFFECTIVE.%IT IS CERTAINLY SA
FER THAN
% PREGNANCY OR CHILDBIRTH IS.
% THE MEDICATION ABORTION PILL
% SPECIFICALLY HAS A LOWER RATE OF
% ADVERSE SIDE EFFECTS THAN
% TYLENOL DOES.
% ANY SAFETY CONCERNS COME FROM
% THE VERY VULNERABLE SITUATIONS,
% PEOPLE WILL BE PUT IN WHEN
% THEY'RE FACING CRIMINALIZATION
% TO CROSS STATE LINES FOR
% HEALTHCARE, BUT WE TAKE EVERY
% STEP THAT WE CAN IN ORDER TO
% EDUCATE OUR PATIENTS ABOUT THOSE
% RISKS AND MAKE SURE THAT THEIR
% CAN THE SHAFT AND --
% CONFIDENTIALITY AND PRIVACY IS
% PROTECTED.
% >> IF SOMEONE CAME FROM
% WISCONSIN AND HAD THEIR
% PREGNANCY TERMINATED, DO THEY
% STAY IN PLACE FOR A PERIOD OF
% TIME TO BE MONITORED -- YOU'RE
% SAYING IT'S EXTREMELY SAFE,
% RIGHT.%BUT IS THERE KIND OF A
PERIOD OF
% TIME WHERE THEY STAY IN PLACE IN
% ILLINOIS?
% >> DEPENDING ON WHETHER THEY'RE
% SEEKING MEDICATION OR INCLINIC
% ABORTION, YEAH, THEY'LL BE AT
% THE CLINIC TO BE MONITORED FOR
% ANY IMMEDIATE HEALTH CONCERNS
% ASSOCIATED WITH THAT.
% BUT OTHERWISE, OUR -- PERSON
% FOLLOWING THE PROGRAM IS ALWAYS
% REACHABLE BY PHONE OR ONLINE.
% >> IS YOUR CLINIC HIRING PEOPLE
% TO ASSIST WITH THIS INNUX OF
% PATIENTS?%>> I CAN'T SHARE A
NY SPECIFICS
% ABOUT OPERATIONAL, BUT THIS
% RESPONSE TO THIS HEALTH CRISIS
% IS GOING TO BE A MARATHON, NOT A
% SPRINT.%SO WE'RE WORKING REA
LLY CLOSELY
% WITH ALL OF OUR PARTNERS AROUND
% THE MIDWEST REGION TO ENSURE
% THAT PATIENTS HAVE ACCESS TO THE
% CARE THEY NEED NO MEAT WHERE
% THEY'RE COMING FROM -- NO MATTER
% WHERE THEY'RE COMING FROM I AND
% THERE WILL BE MORE.
% >> IS IT ACCURATE THAT THERE'S A
% PLANNED PARENTHOOD JUST ACROSS
% THE BORDER IN SOUTH BELOIT,
% ILLINOIS?%>> I'M NOT FAMILIA
R -- IF THERE
% IS, IT'S NOT A PBIL CLINIC.
% OUR CLINIC CLOSEST TO THE
% WISCONSIN BORDER IS IN WAUKEGAN.
% >> JULIE FROM PLANNED PARENTHOOD
% OF ILLINOIS, THANKS SO MUCH.
% >> THANKS FOR HAVING ME.
% >>> FOR MORE ON THIS AND OTHER
% ISSUES FACING WISCONSIN, VISIT
% OUR WEBSITE AT WPTV.COM.
% -- PBS WISCONSIN.ORG.
% THAT'S OUR PROGRAM FOR NOT.
% HAVE A GOOD HOLIDAY WEEKEND.