% >> THE FOLLOWING PROGRAM IS A
% PBS WISCONSIN ORIGINAL
% PRODUCTION.
% >> I'M FREDERICA FREYBERG.
% TONIGHT ON "HERE AND NOW," THE
% STATE SUPREME COURT NULLIFIES
% "SAFER AT HOME" AND WISCONSIN
% COUNTIES RUSH TO REACT.
% WHERE IS WISCONSIN HEADED?
% WE GET ANSWERS IN OUR WEEKLY
% ONE-ON-ONE ON GOVERNOR TONY
% EVERS AND ALSO REPUBLICAN STATE
% REPRESENTATIVE JIM STEINEKE.
% PLUS, A CHECK-IN WITH DR. NASIA
% SAFDAR AT THE UW DIVISION OF
% INFECTIOUS DISEASE.
% AND WE SHARE THE STORY OF A
% COVID-19 SURVIVOR
% FROM CRAWFORD COUNTY.
% IT'S "HERE & NOW" FOR MAY 15.
% >> FUNDING FOR "HERE & NOW" IS
% PROVIDED BY THE FOCUS FUND FOR
% JOURNALISM AND FRIENDS OF PBS
% WISCONSIN.
% ♪ ♪
% >> THIS WEEK, ON MAJOR SHIFT IN
% WISCONSIN'S FIGHT AGAINST THE
% CORONAVIRUS AS THE EXTENDED
% "SAFER AT HOME" ORDER IS RULED
% ILLEGAL.
% REPUBLICANS SUED OVER WHETHER
% HEALTH SERVICES
% SECRETARY-DESIGNEE ANDREA PALM
% EXCEEDED HER AUTHORITY AND
% VIOLATED STATE LAW BY ORDERING
% AN EMERGENCY EXTENSION UNTIL
% MAY 26.
% FOR THE SECOND TIME IN AS MANY
% MONTHS, THE CONSERVATIVE
% MAJORITY WISCONSIN SUPREME COURT
% HAS DEALT GOVERNOR EVERS AND
% DEMOCRATS A DEFEAT.
% BUSINESSES ACROSS THE STATE ARE
% SWINGING OPEN THEIR DOORS, SOME
% WITHOUT RESTRICTIONS.
% "HERE AND NOW" SENIOR POLITICAL
% REPORTER ZAC SCHULTZ IS HERE TO
% EXPLAIN THE FALLOUT OF THAT
% DECISION.
% AND, ZAC, THANKS VERY MUCH FOR
% BEING HERE.
% >> MY PLEASURE, FRED.
% >> SO THE IMMEDIATE RESULTS OF
% THE SUPREME COURT'S RULING WAS
% THAT EVERYTHING WAS ALLOWED TO
% REOPEN AND ALL AT ONCE AND RIGHT
% AWAY.
% BUT WHILE WAITING FOR THESE NEW
% RULES, IT'S KIND OF EVERY COUNTY
% FOR ITSELF?
% >> THAT'S RIGHT.
% THE DHS AUTHORITY TO EXTEND THE
% "SAFER AT HOME" ORDER IS GONE.
% THE ONLY PORTION OF THAT ORDER
% THAT SURVIVED THE COURT'S RULING
% WAS HER ABILITY TO CUT DOWN
% SCHOOLS.
% THAT SURVIVED IN A FOOTNOTE.
% NOW IT'S UP TO INDIVIDUAL
% COUNTIES.
% THEY HAVE A DIFFERENT PART OF
% THE STATE STATUTES THAT AFFECT
% THEIR AUTHORITY.
% WE'VE ALREADY SEEN FIVE OR SIX
% COUNTIES EXTEND SOME OF THOSE
% RULES.
% >> AS TO NEW STATE
% ADMINISTRATIVE RULES, IT'S THIS
% PROCESS.
% BUT IT BASICALLY FORCES THE
% EVERS' ADMINISTRATION TO WORK
% WITH THE REPUBLICAN LEGISLATIVE
% LEADERS.
% HOW, IN YOUR UNDERSTANDING, ARE
% THOSE NEW RULES EXPECTED TO
% LOOK?
% >> WELL, THEY WON'T LOOK
% ANYTHING LIKE THE "SAFER AT
% HOME" ORDER THAT WE WERE UNDER.
% REPUBLICANS HAVE MADE IT VERY
% CLEAR THEY'RE HAPPY TO SEE THOSE
% ORDERS GONE.
% A COUPLE WEEKS AGO, THEY WERE
% ASKING FOR A REGIONAL APPROACH
% TO REOPENING PARTS OF THE STATE
% THAT HADN'T SEEN IT.
% NOW THEY'RE SAYING EVERYTHING
% WIDE OPEN IS PERFECT.
% THEY EXPECT BUSINESSES TO COMPLY
% WITH RULES ON HOW BEST TO BE
% SAFE AND IT'S UP TO INDIVIDUALS
% AND BUSINESSES TO DO THE BEST
% THING TO KEEP THEMSELVES AND
% THEIR FAMILIES SAFE.
% THE GOVERNOR ISSUED A SCOPE
% STATEMENT.
% IT'S GOING TO BE AT LEAST TEN
% DAYS BEFORE WE SEE THE LANGUAGE
% ON A RULE.
% THEY'LL HAVE TIME TO NEGOTIATE
% IT, BUT IT WILL HAVE TO BE VERY
% BROAD BECAUSE IT WON'T BE NIMBLE
% ENOUGH TO HANDLE A HOT SPOT OR
% FLARE-UP THAT MAY OCCUR.
% >> SUPER QUICKLY, WHAT STOOD OUT
% TO YOU ABOUT THAT SUPREME COURT
% RULING?
% >> IT WAS A 4-3 DECISION.
% THE COURT IS 5-2 CONSERVATIVES
% TO LIBERALS AND BRIAN HAGEDORN
% DISSENTED AS WELL.
% DANIEL KELLY WILL BE LEAVING THE
% COURT IN JULY.
% HE WAS A DECIDING VOTE.
% THE NEW JUSTICE COMING IN COULD
% SIDE WITH THE LIBERALS.
% IF THERE'S A FLARE-UP, WE COULD
% SEE DHS SEE WHERE THE BOUNDARIES
% WERE IN THE POWER.
% WE DON'T DEFINE THE SCOPE OF HER
% AUTHORITY.
% THIS MAY COME BACK UNDER A NEW
% COURT THIS WINTER.
% >> ZAC SCHULTZ, THANKS VERY MUCH
% AND THANK YOU FOR COVERING IT.
% >> THANK YOU.
% >> MANY PLACES ARE BACK TO
% BUSINESS AS USUAL WITHOUT
% RESTRICTIONS.
% THE STATE SUPREME COURT DECISION
% COMES TWO DAYS AFTER A NEW
% DIRECTIVE FROM GOVERNOR TONY
% EVERS TO TURN THE DIAL TO OPEN
% WISCONSIN A BIT MORE.
% UNDER THAT NEW ORDER EARLIER IN
% THE WEEK, SMALL RETAIL
% BUSINESSES COULD REOPEN WITH
% RESTRICTIONS.
% THE ORDER ALLOWED CUSTOMERS TO
% VISIT PLACES LIKE STRIP MALLS
% WITH DOORS THAT ENTER AND EXIT
% DIRECTLY TO THE OUTSIDE,
% ALLOWING FOR NO MORE THAN FIVE
% PATRONS INSIDE AT ONE TIME.
% A PATCHWORK OF COUNTIES AND
% CITIES ACROSS THE STATE ARE
% KEEPING THE "SAFER AT HOME"
% GUIDELINES IN PLACE WHILE OTHERS
% HAVE FULLY REOPENED.
% WE TALK ABOUT THIS WEEK'S
% DEVELOPMENT IN OUR WEEKLY
% ONE-ON-ONE WITH TONY EVERS, WHO
% JOINED US EARLIER.
% AND, GOVERNOR, THANKS VERY MUCH
% FOR DOING SO.
% >> THANKS, FREDERICA.
% >> WE LED INTO THIS TALKING
% ABOUT HOW YOUR PHASED-IN
% APPROACH WAS STARTING THIS WEEK,
% WHEN THE SUPREME COURT SHELVED
% YOUR PLAN.
% WHAT WAS IT LIKE, FIRST, WHEN
% YOU LEARNED OF THE DECISION, AND
% THEN WHEN YOU READ IT?
% >> WELL, IT WAS DISAPPOINTING,
% YOU KNOW.
% I'VE ALWAYS FELT THAT FACTS AND
% THE STATE STATUTES AND
% PRECEDENCE MATTERED.
% IT CERTAINLY DIDN'T IN THIS
% CASE.
% IT WAS JUST A WRONG-HEADED
% DECISION.
% AND SO THE BOTTOM LINE IS THE
% IMPACT HAS BEEN IMMEDIATE.
% THERE IS -- ESSENTIALLY THEY
% FOUND IT TO BE UNCONSTITUTIONAL,
% AND SO WE'VE MOVED INTO THE NEW
% WORLD OF HAVING NO RULE OF THE
% ROAD.
% >> WHAT WAS YOUR REACTION WHEN
% YOU SAW PEOPLE PORING INTO BARS
% IMMEDIATELY FOLLOWING THE
% DECISION?
% >> I KNOW NOT ALL BARS AND ALL
% BUSINESSES ARE THAT WAY, BUT
% CERTAINLY TO HAVE THE TAVERN
% LEAGUE GET OUT IN FRONT OF THIS
% AND THEN HAVING MANY TOO PEOPLE
% TOGETHER IN A SMALL PLACE,
% SHOULDER TO SHOULDER, NO MASKS,
% IT'S INVITING THE VIRUS TO WALK
% ON IN AND BE TRANSMITTED.
% THAT'S THE BOTTOM LINE.
% >> IN THE FACE OF THAT, SEVERAL
% LOCAL OR COUNTY HEALTH
% DEPARTMENTS IMPOSED THEIR OWN
% SAFETY ORDERS IN PLACE OF THE
% STATEWIDE PLAN.
% BUT NOW SOME ARE STARTING TO
% RESCIND THEM, WORRIED ABOUT
% WHETHER OR NOT IN FACT THEY'RE
% LEGAL BECAUSE OF THAT COURT
% RULING.
% WHAT IN YOUR MIND DOES THIS SAY
% ABOUT THIS LOCAL APPROACH?
% >> WELL, THAT'S JUST IT.
% IT CREATES GREAT CONFUSION,
% FIRST OF ALL, AND -- DEPENDING
% ON THE COUNTY YOU LIVE IN, AND
% SO THAT'S THE MAIN CONCERN.
% SOME OF THEM MAY WALK THEM BACK.
% SOME OF THEM WON'T.
% I THINK IT'S LESS AROUND -- LESS
% AROUND THE LEGALITY OF IT.
% I THINK, YOU KNOW, IT'S A
% DIFFERENT SECTION OF THE LAW.
% SO I THINK THEY HAVE THE ABILITY
% TO DO IT.
% BUT THEY WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT
% THEY'RE CONSISTENT WITH THEIR
% NEIGHBORS, AND I GUESS THAT'S A
% RATIONAL THING TO DO.
% BUT AT THE END OF THE DAY,
% HAVING THIS BEING DONE LOCALLY
% CREATES A LOT OF CONFUSION AND,
% FRANKLY, I THINK IT DOESN'T DO
% MUCH FOR PEOPLE'S CONFIDENCE.
% >> YOU'RE NOW MEETING WITH
% SPEAKER VOS, MAJORITY LEADER
% FITZGERALD TO WORK UP
% ADMINISTRATIVE RULES TO MANAGE
% THE PANDEMIC, AND YOUR
% DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH WROTE A
% SCOPE STATEMENT OUTLINING THOSE
% RULES.
% I READ THEM.
% THEY LOOK VERY MUCH LIKE "SAFER
% AT HOME" AND BADGER BOUNCE BACK
% UNDER A DIFFERENT NAME.
% WHY DO YOU THINK THOSE ARE GOING
% TO FLY?
% >> WELL, FIRST OF ALL, A SCOPE
% STATEMENT IS A VERY BROAD
% STATEMENT OF WHAT WE'RE GOING TO
% BE LOOKING AT.
% AND, AS YOU SEE, THERE'S LOTS OF
% "MAYS" IN THAT STATEMENT.
% AND SO, YES, IT GIVES US A
% PARAMETER.
% WHAT MATTERS IS THE RULE ITSELF.
% BUT ALSO, FREDERICA, TO BE
% HONEST WITH YOU, THIS ISN'T
% GOING TO BE ANY GRAND BARGAIN
% AMONG THE DEMOCRATS AND THE
% REPUBLICANS BECAUSE ESSENTIALLY
% WE WERE TOLD BY THE LEADERSHIP
% THAT THEY WEREN'T GOING TO
% ACCEPT ANYTHING THAT CREATES ANY
% NEW RESTRICTIONS OR NEW
% PARAMETERS AROUND WHAT'S
% HAPPENING NOW.
% IN FACT, THEY WERE VERY HAPPY
% WITH WHAT EXISTS.
% >> IN FACT, SHE'S THE CO-CHAIR
% OF THE RULES COMMITTEE THAT MUST
% VOTE ON AND CAN VETO ANY RULES.
% SENATOR NASS SAID I CALL ON
% GOVERNOR EVERS TO END THE SCOPE
% STATEMENT AND END THIS NEEDLESS
% CONFRONTATION.
% WHAT IS YOUR REACTION TO THAT?
% >> I'D SAY WAIT UNTIL YOU SEE
% THE RULE.
% THIS IS A SCOPE STATEMENT,
% SENATOR NASS.
% THIS ISN'T THE RULE.
% THIS ISN'T SOME SORT OF PANACEA.
% WE'VE ALREADY TOLD BY THE
% LEADERSHIP WHAT'S GOING TO COME
% OUT OF THIS IS NOT GOING TO BE
% ANY KIND OF IMPINGEMENT ON WHAT
% HAS ALREADY HAPPENED.
% IN FACT, THEY'RE VERY HAPPY
% ABOUT THAT.
% YOU KNOW, SHORTLY AFTER THE TURN
% OF THE MONTH, MAY 1 OR 2, GET A
% LEADER FROM SPEAKER VOS SAYING
% THEY ARE LOOKING FORWARD TO
% SLOW, DELIBERATE, THOUGHTFUL WAY
% OF OPENING THE ECONOMY, JUST
% LIKE WE ARE.
% BUT INTERVENING HAS BEEN THIS
% SUPREME COURT RACE -- OR NOT
% RACE, BUT THE DECISION.
% SO IT IS WHAT IT IS.
% IT EXISTS, AND WE'RE GOING TO DO
% EVERYTHING WE CAN TO MAKE SURE
% -- WE'RE HOPEFUL PEOPLE WILL
% STILL STAY HOME AND DO THE TESTS
% AND TRACINGS AND ALL THE THINGS
% THAT ARE IMPORTANT.
% >> GOVERNOR TONY EVERS, THANK
% YOU VERY MUCH FOR JOINING US.
% WE WILL BE WATCHING THESE
% DEVELOPMENTS.
% THANK YOU.
% >> THANK YOU, FREDERICA.
% >> REPUBLICANS HAD BEEN PUBLICLY
% PUSHING TO RELAX THE STRICT
% "SAFER AT HOME" ORDER AT THE
% SAME TIME THEY CHALLENGED IT IN
% THE WISCONSIN SUPREME COURT.
% NOW WITH LEGAL BACKING, THE BALL
% IS IN THEIR COURT TO ACT.
% WISCONSIN ASSEMBLY MAJORITY
% LEADER JIM STEINEKE WAS ABLE TO
% JOIN US EARLY THIS AFTERNOON.
% AND, REPRESENTATIVE, THANK YOU
% VERY MUCH AGAIN FOR BEING HERE.
% >> ABSOLUTELY.
% GLAD TO BE HERE.
% >> WELL, SO, AS WE ALL KNOW,
% WISCONSIN IS REOPEN FOR
% BUSINESS.
% WHAT IS YOUR REACTION TO THE
% COURT'S RULING?
% >> WELL, IT'S UNFORTUNATE THAT
% WE GOT TO THIS PLACE.
% WE'VE BEEN TRYING OVER THE LAST
% FEW WEEKS TO ENGAGE WITH THE
% ADMINISTRATION TO SEE IF WE CAN
% COME UP WITH A BIPARTISAN PLAN
% THAT EVERYBODY CAN SUPPORT.
% AS LATE AS 10 OR 12 DAYS AGO
% NOW, WE MET WITH GOVERNOR EVERS
% TO DISCUSS THOSE THINGS WHILE
% THE COURT CASE WAS GOING ON TO
% TRY TO SEE IF THERE WAS SOME
% COMMON GROUND, ASKED FOR
% ADDITIONAL MEETINGS BEYOND THAT
% DAY, AND HE SAID HE DIDN'T WANT
% TO TALK UNTIL AFTER THE SUPREME
% COURT DECISION CAME DOWN, WHICH
% WAS HIS RIGHT.
% BUT THAT'S KIND OF WHY WE'RE
% HERE WHERE WE ARE TODAY WITHOUT
% ANYTHING SUCCEEDING THAT
% ORIGINAL 60-DAY AUTHORITY.
% >> HE HAS DISPUTED THAT IT WAS
% HE WHO SAID HE WANTED TO WAIT,
% BUT LET'S MOVE ALONG, BECAUSE
% THIS IS WHERE WE ARE NOW, AND I
% KNOW THAT LEADERSHIP MET WITH
% THE GOVERNOR THIS WEEK TO TALK
% ABOUT NEW RULES.
% GOING FORWARD, AT THIS MOMENT, I
% SUSPECT THAT YOU WANT TO WORK
% WITH THE GOVERNOR TO FASHION
% THESE RULES.
% >> YEAH.
% AGAIN, WE MET THIS WEEK WITH THE
% GOVERNOR, HAD SOME INITIAL
% DISCUSSIONS ABOUT WHAT OUR
% PRIORITIES WERE, WHAT HIS WERE
% IN ANY NEW RULE.
% HE TOOK SOME INPUT.
% HE'S -- OBVIOUSLY, HE PUT OUT A
% SCOPE STATEMENT FOR THE NEW RULE
% AND NOW THAT IS OPEN FOR PUBLIC
% COMMENT FOR TEN DAYS, AND THEN
% THEY'LL COME BACK TO US WITH
% WHATEVER THEIR PROPOSED RULE IS,
% HOPEFULLY TAKING INTO ACCOUNT
% EVERYBODY'S INPUT.
% >> THE SCOPE STATEMENT LOOKS
% VERY SIMILAR TO THE "SAFER AT
% HOME" AND THE BADGER BOUNCE BACK
% PLAN.
% DO YOU SUPPORT WHAT'S IN THAT
% DOCUMENT?
% >> PARTS.
% I MEAN, I THINK WHAT WE'RE
% SEEING NOW IS THE VAST MAJORITY
% OF THE COUNTRY IS STARTING TO
% REOPEN.
% WE WERE ONE OF ONLY A HANDFUL OF
% STATES THAT HADN'T STARTED TO
% REOPEN YET.
% AND ONE OF OUR FRUSTRATIONS WITH
% WHAT THE GOVERNOR HAS PROPOSED
% IN HIS ORIGINAL "SAFER AT HOME"
% PACKAGE WAS A STATEWIDE ORDER,
% WITH NO ACCOUNTING FOR REGIONAL
% DIFFERENCES.
% AND WHAT WE SEE IN A VAST
% MAJORITY OF COUNTIES IN THE
% STATE IS VERY FEW CASES OF THE
% VIRUS, VERY FEW
% HOSPITALIZATIONS.
% SO WE THINK THAT WE CAN START TO
% OPEN UP IN A VAST MAJORITY OF
% THE STATE.
% >> SO, AS YOU KNOW, THE JOINT
% COMMITTEE ON REVIEW OF
% ADMINISTRATIVE RULES HAS THE
% POWER TO BLOCK THESE NEW RULES
% THAT ARE GOING TO BE DRAFTED.
% SHOULD IT, IN YOUR MIND?
% >> WELL, I THINK WE HAVE TO WAIT
% AND SEE WHAT THE NEW RULES ARE.
% I'D HATE TO PRESUME THAT THE
% GOVERNOR ISN'T GOING TO LISTEN
% TO THE PUBLIC AND ISN'T GOING TO
% LISTEN TO THE LEGISLATURE IN
% CRAFTING THESE NEW RULES.
% SO HOPEFULLY HE'LL DO THAT AND
% GIVE US AN OPPORTUNITY TO ACCEPT
% THE NEW RULES.
% BUT THAT'S YET TO BE SEEN.
% >> SO IN YOUR MIND, DO YOU THINK
% THAT THE COMMITTEE SHOULD KIND
% OF SAVE THESE KINDS OF RULES FOR
% ANY SURGE IN CASES?
% >> WELL, I THINK THAT'S ONE OF
% THE THINGS THAT REPRESENTATIVE
% BALLWEG, WHO IS CO-CHAIR OF THE
% JOINT COMMITTEE AND THE REVIEW
% OF ADMINISTRATIVE RULES, TALKED
% ABOUT, WAS HAVING SOMETHING IN
% PLACE IN CASE WE DO HAVE ANOTHER
% SURGE.
% AS WE'VE SEEN IN WISCONSIN,
% THERE ARE NO HOSPITALS OPERATING
% AT CRISIS LEVEL, SO WE'RE IN A
% REALLY GOOD SPOT.
% THAT'S WHY I THINK YOU'VE SEEN
% MOST OF THE COUNTIES START TO
% OPEN UP.
% SOME COUNTIES ARE CHOOSING TO
% EXTEND THOSE "SAFER AT HOME"
% ORDERS.
% THE GOVERNOR'S ORDER ONLY LASTS
% UNTIL THE 26TH AND EVEN HE SAID
% HE WASN'T GOING TO EXTEND THEM
% BEYOND THAT STATE.
% >> WHAT IS YOUR OPINION OF THOSE
% LOCAL OR COUNTY ORDERS?
% >> WELL, I THINK IT'S WELL
% WITHIN THEIR RIGHTS, AS I SEE
% IT.
% I THINK THEY HAVE TO DO WHAT
% THEY BELIEVE IS CORRECT WITH THE
% SITUATION ON THE GROUND WITHIN
% THEIR OWN COUNTIES.
% I'D MUCH RATHER SEE THAT
% APPROACH THAN A STATEWIDE
% APPROACH, WHERE EVERY AREA IS
% TREATED EXACTLY THE SAME.
% BECAUSE, LIKE I SAID, IN THE
% VAST MAJORITY OF THE STATE THERE
% AREN'T THESE CRISIS LEVELS OF
% THE VIRUS.
% >> WILL YOU BE GOING OUT TO A
% RESTAURANT THIS WEEKEND OR
% ELSEWHERE BECAUSE OF THE RULING
% FROM THE COURT?
% >> WELL, UNFORTUNATELY, I'M IN A
% COUNTY THAT CHOSE TO EXTEND THE
% "SAFER AT HOME" ORDER
% INDEFINITELY, EVEN THOUGH
% OUTAGAMIE COUNTY ONLY HAS 124
% CASES.
% SO I'M KIND OF CONFUSED AS TO
% WHY THIS PARTICULAR COUNTY
% DECIDED TO GO FURTHER THAN EVERY
% OTHER COUNTY -- ALMOST EVERY
% OTHER COUNTY OUT THERE.
% BUT I HAPPEN TO BE IN ONE OF
% THOSE COUNTIES THAT HAS A "SAFER
% AT HOME" EXTENDED AND SURROUNDED
% BY BROWN COUNTY AND WINNEBAGO
% AND CALUMET THAT ALSO HAVE THAT
% ORDER IN PLACE.
% >> ALL RIGHT.
% WE NEED TO LEAVE IT THERE,
% REPRESENTATIVE STEINEKE.
% THANK YOU AGAIN FOR JOINING US.
% >> ABSOLUTELY.
% THANKS FOR HAVING ME.
% >> FOR THE SECOND TIME IN AS
% MANY MONTHS, WISCONSIN VOTERS
% WENT TO THE POLLS DURING THE
% COVID-19 CRISIS.
% THE WISCONSIN NATIONAL GUARD
% ALSO ACTIVATED AGAIN TO HELP
% WORK POLLING PLACES IN TUESDAY'S
% 7TH CONGRESSIONAL DISTRICT
% SPECIAL ELECTION.
% ABOUT 160 GUARD MEMBERS HELPED
% SERVE THE 700 MUNICIPALITIES.
% THEY WORKED IN CIVILIAN CLOTHES,
% PERFORMING THE SAME DUTIES AS
% OTHER POLL WORKERS.
% TOM TIFFANY DEFEATED TRICIA
% ZUNKER IN THE 7TH CONGRESSIONAL
% DISTRICT.
% IT SPANS 26 NORTHERN WISCONSIN
% COUNTIES.
% THE 7TH IS ON THE BALLOT AGAIN
% IN NOVEMBER.
% TIFFANY IS EXPECTED TO BE IN
% WASHINGTON NEXT WEEK, WHERE
% CONGRESS IS LOOKING AT MORE
% MEASURES TO COMBAT COVID-19.
% >> DESPITE THE STATE SUPREME
% COURT RULING, WORK ON THE FRONT
% LINES CONTINUES AND THE NUMBER
% OF PEOPLE ABLE TO GET TESTED FOR
% CORONAVIRUS IS ON THE RISE.
% THE WISCONSIN NATIONAL GUARD NOW
% HAS 25 COLLECTION TEAMS,
% INCLUDING THIS ONE IN GREEN BAY.
% MORE THAN 20 WISCONSIN COUNTIES
% ARE BENEFITING FROM THE
% INCREASED TESTING AT
% COMMUNITY-BASED SITES, WITH
% GUARD MEMBERS COLLECTING NEARLY
% 25,000 SAMPLES.
% BY MIDWEEK AT THE ALLIANT ENERGY
% CENTER IN MADISON, THE NATIONAL
% GUARD HAD TAKEN MORE THAN 1,000
% SAMPLES.
% 1600 TROOPS ARE NOW SERVING IN
% DIRECT SUPPORT OF THE STATE'S
% COVID-19 RESPONSE.
% >> AS WISCONSIN JUMPS FORWARD
% IMMEDIATE REOPENING WITH SOME
% COUNTIES MAINTAINING "SAFER AT
% HOME" RULES, HEALTH CARE WORKERS
% STAY THE COURSE, BRACING FOR
% INCOMING PATIENTS, DEATHS AND
% THE DURESS OF THE FRONT LINE
% CARE.
% WHEN THE PANDEMIC FIRST HIT
% WISCONSIN BACK IN MARCH, WE
% TALKED WITH DR. NASIA SAFDAR
% WITH THE UW DIVISION OF
% INFECTIOUS DISEASE.
% THIS WEEK, WE WANT TO CHECK BACK
% IN WITH HER.
% AND, DR. SAFDAR, THANK YOU FOR
% JOINING US AGAIN.
% >> THANK YOU.
% >> WHAT IS YOUR REACTION TO THE
% COURT RULING THAT IMMEDIATELY
% REOPENED THE STATE?
% >> YOU KNOW, I THINK FROM A
% PUBLIC HEALTH AND INFECTION
% CONTROL STANDPOINT, I THINK WE
% HAVE ALWAYS ADVISED THAT
% REOPENING SHOULD BE A GRADUAL,
% CAREFULLY-MONITORED PROCESS.
% AND SO THIS GOES AGAINST THAT.
% >> AND WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT
% THAT?
% >> I THINK POTENTIALLY THERE ARE
% ACTIVITIES AS PEOPLE CO-MINGLE
% AND GATHER THAT WILL MAKE IT
% CHALLENGING TO MAINTAIN COVID-19
% IN THE WAY THAT WE HAVE BEEN
% ABLE, FORTUNATELY, LOCALLY AND
% IN THE LARGER STATE, BEEN ABLE
% TO DO THUS FAR.
% >> YEAH.
% I WAS GOING TO ASK YOU IF YOU
% BELIEVE THAT THE "SAFER AT HOME"
% ORDER HAD FLATTENED THE CURVE.
% >> I THINK MOST PEOPLE BELIEVE
% THAT TO BE TRUE.
% AND I THINK THE DATA ON MOBILITY
% AND THE EFFECT OF REDUCING
% MOBILITY ON COVID-19 GROWTH RATE
% AND NEW CASES IS PRETTY
% COMPELLING.
% SO I THINK WHEN YOU HAVE
% SOMETHING THAT HAS WORKED
% SUCCESSFULLY, IF YOU DO DECIDE
% TO DEESCALATE IT, IT SHOULD BE
% DONE IN A VERY CAREFUL, GRADUAL
% MANNER.
% >> AND MEANWHILE THIS WILL, AT
% LEAST SO FAR, BE DONE IN KIND OF
% A PATCHWORK MANNER, WITH SOME
% NUMBER OF COUNTIES DECIDING TO
% GO AHEAD AND MAINTAIN THOSE
% ORDERS, WHEREAS OTHERS WILL NOT.
% IF THERE WERE TO BE A SURGE IN
% CASES AS WE REOPEN THE STATE IN
% THIS WAY, ARE HEALTH CARE
% WORKERS WHERE YOU ARE ABLE TO
% MANAGE A JUMP IN CASES?
% >> YOU KNOW, I THINK WE'RE MUCH
% BETTER POSITIONED THAN WE WERE
% IN THE EARLIER STAGES OF THIS
% PANDEMIC IN THIS COUNTRY IN THE
% SENSE THAT WE NOW KNOW A LOT
% MORE ABOUT TRANSMISSION, ABOUT
% ITS IMPACT, THE POPULATIONS AT
% RISK AND ALL THOSE THINGS THAT
% WE REALLY HAD VERY LIMITED
% INFORMATION ABOUT BEFORE.
% HAVING SAID THAT, I THINK WHILE
% WE ARE BETTER PREPARED TO MANAGE
% MORE PATIENTS, WE STILL WANT TO
% AVOID A SURGE THAT WOULD
% OVERWHELM ANYONE OR MORE HEALTH
% SYSTEMS.
% >> IS THE SUPPLY OF THINGS LIKE
% PERSONAL PROTECTIVE EQUIPMENT
% NOW ADEQUATE, I MEAN, FOR RIGHT
% NOW AND GOING FORWARD?
% >> SO IT'S ADEQUATE FOR RIGHT
% NOW.
% I THINK GOING FORWARD AS WELL,
% IN ALL LIKELIHOOD, BUT IT WOULD
% TO SOME EXTENT DEPEND ON HOW
% MANY CASES WE SEE AND HOW SICK
% THOSE INDIVIDUALS ARE AND WHAT
% KIND OF PPE IS REQUIRED.
% I THINK OUR USE OF PPE HAS BEEN
% OPTIMIZED CONSIDERABLY, SO WE
% ARE CONSERVING AND REUSING
% THINGS AND THAT HAS LED TO US
% BEING ABLE TO KEEP OUR PPE
% AROUND LONGER.
% >> YOU'VE SAID THAT THERE ARE
% THINGS YOU HAVE LEARNED ABOUT
% COVID-19, OBVIOUSLY, SINCE THE
% EARLY DAYS.
% WHAT WOULD YOU ESTIMATE IS THE
% MOST IMPORTANT THING THAT YOU'VE
% LEARNED ABOUT THIS VIRUS?
% >> I THINK THE FACT THAT THERE
% IS THIS EASE OF TRANSMISSION
% FROM ASYMPTOMATIC PEOPLE IS
% PROBABLY THE MOST IMPORTANT NEW
% DATA THAT HAS COME FORWARD.
% AND THAT SUGGESTS THAT, YOU
% KNOW, IF ASYMPTOMATIC CARRIAGE
% IS THE MAIN REASON OR ONE OF THE
% MAIN REASONS THAT TRANSMISSION
% IS HAPPENING, THAT'S PRETTY HARD
% TO CONTAIN WITHOUT SOME OF THE
% MORE DRASTIC MEASURES LIKE THE
% "SAFER AT HOME" ORDER.
% >> SO WHAT WOULD BE YOUR MESSAGE
% THEN TO PEOPLE OUT THERE IN THE
% COMMUNITY?
% >> I THINK NOW MORE THAN EVER
% IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT THAT WE
% DON'T GO FROM ZERO TO 100 EVEN
% IF THE "SAFER AT HOME" ORDER HAS
% BEEN LIFTED AT A STATEWIDE
% LEVEL.
% I THINK PEOPLE SHOULD STILL
% THINK TO THEMSELVES DO I REALLY
% NEED TO LEAVE THE HOUSE AND, IF
% I DO, WHAT'S THE ESSENTIAL
% ACTIVITY I MUST PERFORM.
% IT'S GOING TO BE HARD TO KEEP
% PEOPLE AT THE LEVEL WE WERE AT.
% IT TAKES A TOLL ON PEOPLE'S
% PSYCHOLOGICAL AND MENTAL HEALTH.
% BUT WE DON'T WANT TO ENCOURAGE
% LARGE PUBLIC GATHERINGS AND
% TRYING TO GO BACK TO THE WAY WE
% WERE BEFORE COVID HIT.
% >> WHAT ABOUT THINGS LIKE
% SHOPPING OR SOCIALIZING?
% ARE THOSE SAFE, IN YOUR MIND?
% >> I THINK I WOULD CONSIDER
% THOSE RISKIER THAN THE CURRENT
% STATE.
% I WOULD RECOMMEND AVOIDING THEM
% TO THE EXTENT ONE CAN.
% >> HOW IMPORTANT DOES RAMPED-UP
% TESTING CONTINUE TO BE?
% >> I THINK TESTING CAPACITY HAS
% CONSIDERABLY IMPROVED, AND I
% THINK IT'S GOING TO BE REALLY
% IMPORTANT TO DETERMINE THE
% CIRCLE OF INDIVIDUALS WHO MIGHT
% HAVE COME IN CONTACT WITH
% SOMEBODY WHO TESTS POSITIVE FOR
% COVID.
% THAT'S EASIER NOW TO DETERMINE
% AS WE CAN TEST A LARGER SWATH OF
% THE POPULATION THAN WE HAD
% EARLIER.
% >> IS PLASMA FROM RECOVERED
% PATIENTS PROVING A SUCCESSFUL
% TREATMENT?
% >> I THINK IT'S A POTENTIALLY
% PROMISING TREATMENT.
% I DON'T THINK CONCLUSIVELY THAT
% IT IS PROVING TO BE THE CASE.
% WE BELIEVE IT IS.
% CASES SUGGEST IMPROVED OUTCOMES.
% BUT THERE'S VERY LITTLE
% COMPARATIVE DATA.
% SO IS THERE REALLY A COMPELLING
% DIFFERENCE.
% WE'RE AWAITING THAT.
% THERE ARE MULTIPLE STUDIES
% UNDERWAY.
% WE DON'T KNOW THAT YET FOR A
% FACT.
% >> WHAT DO EXPERTS THINK ABOUT
% HOW LONG IT WILL BE BEFORE WE
% SEE A VACCINE?
% >> I THINK SOMETIME NEXT YEAR,
% ASSUMING THAT THE EXISTING
% CANDIDATES THAT ARE IN VARIOUS
% STAGES OF DEVELOPMENT, ONE OR
% MORE OF THEM TURN OUT TO BE
% PROMISING ENOUGH TO MOVE
% FORWARD.
% SO IT'S A VERY ACCELERATED TIME
% FRAME COMPARED TO OTHER VACCINE
% DEVELOPMENTS.
% SO I REMAIN OPTIMISTIC.
% >> DR. NASIA SAFDAR, THANK YOU
% VERY MUCH, AND THANK YOU FOR
% YOUR WORK.
% >> THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
% >> TONIGHT WE SHARE THE STORY OF
% A COVID-19 SURVIVOR, A CRAWFORD
% COUNTY MAN WHO NEVER THOUGHT IT
% WOULD AFFECT HIM.
% HE'S A SKEPTIC NO MORE.
% AS TREVOR KELLER REPORTS, HE'S
% NOW TELLING HIS STORY.
% >> WHEN THE COVID-19 PANDEMIC
% BEGAN, CRAIG BELL WASN'T
% WORRIED.
% >> AND I'LL BE HONEST WITH YOU.
% I THOUGHT THIS THING IS JUST
% GETTING BLOWN OUT OF PROPORTION.
% I'M LIKE EVERYBODY ELSE.
% I THOUGHT, THIS STUFF AIN'T
% COMING HERE.
% >> "HERE" IS EASTMAN, A SMALL
% TOWN OF 400 IN CRAWFORD COUNTY.
% BELL IS A 59-YEAR-OLD MAIL
% CARRIER.
% IN APRIL HE NEARLY BECAME A
% COVID FATALITY.
% >> I WAS GETTING A FEVER AND MY
% HEAD WAS OUT OF SORTS.
% >> IT TOOK TWO TRIPS TO URGENT
% CARE TO GET A COVID TEST, WHICH
% TURNED OUT POSITIVE.
% HE WAS TAKEN TO MAYO CLINIC IN
% LA CROSSE, WHERE HE'D SPEND
% EIGHT DAYS IN A COMA WITH A
% BREATHING TUBE.
% >> HE WAS BREATHING CLOSE TO 40
% TIMES A MINUTE, WHICH IS
% EXHAUSTING.
% >> THEY SAID THIS ISN'T LOOKING
% GOOD AT ALL.
% HE'S BASICALLY -- HE'S READY FOR
% THE -- HE'S READY FOR THE
% GRAVEYARD HERE.
% >> DURING THAT TIME PERIOD, HIS
% KIDNEYS STOPPED WORKING AND WE
% HAD TO START HIM ON DIALYSIS.
% >> BELL'S WIFE JULIE WAS TOLD BY
% DOCTORS TO EXPECT THE WORST, BUT
% SHE WASN'T ALLOWED TO VISIT THE
% HOSPITAL.
% >> IF HE'S GOING TO BE GONE, I'D
% LIKE TO SAY GOODBYE TO HIM.
% AND THEY SAID, WE CAN'T LET YOU
% DO THAT, BUT WE PROMISE THAT
% WE'LL MAKE SURE THAT HE GOES,
% YOU KNOW -- HE WON'T FEEL PAIN
% AND HE'LL GO EASY.
% >> BELL'S CONDITION IMPROVED ON
% DAYS SEVEN AND EIGHT AND HE WAS
% BROUGHT OUT OF THE COMA.
% HE'D SPEND TWO WEEKS IN THE
% HOSPITAL.
% >> THE ODDS WERE STACKED AGAINST
% HIM.
% SO I'M VERY SURPRISED, VERY
% HAPPY THAT WE'VE HAD THE OUTCOME
% THAT WE'VE HAD.
% >> IT'S A BEAUTIFUL DAY IN
% EASTMAN.
% IT'S A GREAT DAY TO BE ALIVE.
% >> BELL STILL GOES TO KIDNEY
% DIALYSIS THREE TIMES A WEEK AND
% DOCTORS HOPE FOR A FULL
% RECOVERY.
% BELL SAYS HE'S FEELING BETTER
% AND THAT PEOPLE SHOULD TAKE THE
% VIRUS SERIOUSLY.
% HIS WIFE DESCRIBED THEIR
% EXPERIENCE AS, QUOTE, "HELL."
% >> I DON'T HAVE ONE WORD TO
% DESCRIBE IT OTHER THAN -- IT'S
% HELL.
% MY WIFE'S GOT IT RIGHT.
% IT'S HELL.
% >> FOR "HERE AND NOW," I'M
% TREVOR KELLER.
% >> HELPING WITH EVERYTHING FROM
% TESTING TO VOTING, THE NATIONAL
% GUARD ALSO TOOK TO THE AIR THIS
% WEEK, WITH F-16 PILOTS FROM THE
% WISCONSIN AIR NATIONAL GUARD
% STAGING FLY-OVERS TUESDAY TO
% HONOR AND SALUTE HEALTH CARE
% WORKERS AND FIRST RESPONDERS.
% BASED OUT OF MADISON, THEY TOOK
% PART IN THE NATIONAL EFFORT,
% FLYING OVER HOSPITALS IN 17
% COMMUNITIES FROM KENOSHA TO
% WAUSAU AND EAU CLAIRE, AND BACK
% AGAIN TO THEIR BASE AT TRUAX
% FIELD.
% THAT'S OUR PROGRAM FOR THIS
% WEEK.
% BE SURE TO JOIN US ONLINE
% THROUGHOUT THE WEEK FOR UPDATES
% ON THE COVID-19 PANDEMIC AT
% PBSWISCONSIN.ORG, AND THEN CLICK
% ON THE "NEWS" TAB.
% ALSO FOR ONGOING IN-DEPTH
% COVERAGE IN WISCONSIN VISIT
% WisContext.
% THIS WEEK, A LOOK AT CONTACT
% TRACING.
% IT'S THE NEXT BIG STEP IN THE
% FIGHT AGAINST COVID-19.
% THAT'S WisContext.
% THANK YOU FOR WATCHING "HERE &
% NOW."
% STAY WELL, WISCONSIN, AND WE
% WILL SEE YOU NEXT WEEK.
% I'M FREDERICA FREYBERG.
% HAVE A GREAT WEEKEND.
% >> FUNDING FOR "HERE AND NOW" IS
% PROVIDED BY THE FOCUS FUND FOR
% JOURNALISM AND FRIENDS OF PBS
WISCONSIN.